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Vive la République! - An Interactive French AAR

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Serpent said:
Did you not say that our government lied to the people and the only reason we fought was for material gain?
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We fought because war was declared on us. What I've said is that the reason behind the whole war is material gain. Indeed the Central Powers were the ones who declared the war, but our own government and the Entente as a whole was not happy at all with the amazing growth Germany was experiencing, and sooner or later war would come. And if the government is not lying when it says this war was our battle for liberty, with France spearheading the forces of freedom against evil german imperialism, they are at the very least being cynical. For the people of France is only free to starve and suffer, and when it comes to imperialism, France is also quite experienced in the matter.
 
gll25 said:
What I've said is that the reason behind the whole war is material gain.
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It's all about materialism then? Just like marxist philosophy.

Material factors matter and they will continue to matter. Should we not ensure that we have what we need, will others not seek to do the same? Do we not have a responsibility to ensure the material security of our country? Will not the leaders of Germany again seek material gain? And if we give them the power to do so by force will they not do so? Are you willing to gamble our nations future that they will not?

You are right, in part. Germans are not inherently different from Frenchmen in any morally significant way. And yet, does it matter? History is what it is and there is little room for idealistic notions in our materialistic world. Could we really have acted differently in 1914? You seem to say that we couldn't. Yet you voted for a party that promised to stab our defending armies in the back with a general strike at the onset of war. Fortunately the SFIO broke its promise to the electorate, but maybe the next broken promise will be less fortunate for France. Can we really trust a party that has proven so unreliable?
 
gll25 said:
Section Française de l'Internationale Ouvrière

I would also like to make a request to my socialist friends: let's not fracture the left vote, as this would only weaken us and open the path for right-wing radicalism.
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Then vote for the only true left which is the radical one.
 
Serpent said:
It's all about materialism then? Just like marxist philosophy.

Material factors matter and they will continue to matter. Should we not ensure that we have what we need, will others not seek to do the same? Do we not have a responsibility to ensure the material security of our country? Will not the leaders of Germany again seek material gain? And if we give them the power to do so by force will they not do so? Are you willing to gamble our nations future that they will not?

You are right, in part. Germans are not inherently different from Frenchmen in any morally significant way. And yet, does it matter? History is what it is and there is little room for idealistic notions in our materialistic world. Could we really have acted differently in 1914? You seem to say that we couldn't. Yet you voted for a party that promised to stab our defending armies in the back with a general strike at the onset of war. Fortunately the SFIO broke its promise to the electorate, but maybe the next broken promise will be less fortunate for France. Can we really trust a party that has proven so unreliable?
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If you had at least taken your time to take a look at my peace proposal, you would easily see that France would be, in that situation, the major power of Europe, with a strong alliance of grateful countries. Still, it wouldn't humiliate and sverely impoverish the defeated countries, creating better odds for peace.

It is important to note that the election took place before the events triggered the Great War, and indeed I voted for the SFIO and supported their efforts to topple the establishment through a strike, because other socialist parties all over Europe had the same intention. Unfortunately the massive ultranationalist and revanchist state propaganda fooled the people and the socialist combined effort proved fruitless. But you're indeed somewhat right about the SFIO: they indeed lost my trust. I have the feeling that if the SFIO is more willing to work in coalition with the centre capitalist parties instead of the more radical left, and that I despise. I'm changing my vote right away.
 
As I said earlier, any SFIO member who supported the war is a disgrace. Unfortunately it turned out to be most of the party. Therefore, I am casting my vote for the Radical Left. All power to the worker's councils!
 
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gll25 said:
Indeed. I withdraw my vote to the SFIO. I will instead vote Radical Gauche!
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Together we shall bring the peace and prosperity to all the workers of France and the World.

[video=youtube;HYWaEqch2X8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYWaEqch2X8[/video]
 
gll25 said:
If you had at least taken your time to take a look at my peace proposal, you would easily see that France would be, in that situation, the major power of Europe, with a strong alliance of grateful countries. Still, it wouldn't humiliate and sverely impoverish the defeated countries, creating better odds for peace.
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(ooc: Sorry, I forgot about that. Got too cought up in the rhetoric.)

Your proposal indeed had some good points, but not ones I would expect from a radical leftist. Annexing Wallonia, splitting Germany along religious lines, granting Romania ethnic Hungarian lands, but giving the Sudetenland to the German states, letting the Serbs annex Bulgaria, giving the Turkish capital to the Greeks, setting up a multiethnic multireligious state in the Caucasus and rewarding neutral Netherlands and Sweden with lands taken from our allies... Just doesn't seem much in line with the anti-war pro-revolution political programme of the Radical Gauche or with SFIOs passive isolationism. Your plan looks more like the work of Action Francaise, but I'm sure you despise their domestic policies as much as I do. You know, there's always room for you in the National Block, we already support a wide range of views but stand united in our defense of democracy. :)
 
Serpent said:
(ooc: Sorry, I forgot about that. Got too cought up in the rhetoric.)

Your proposal indeed had some good points, but not ones I would expect from a radical leftist. Annexing Wallonia, splitting Germany along religious lines, granting Romania ethnic Hungarian lands, but giving the Sudetenland to the German states, letting the Serbs annex Bulgaria, giving the Turkish capital to the Greeks, setting up a multiethnic multireligious state in the Caucasus and rewarding neutral Netherlands and Sweden with lands taken from our allies... Just doesn't seem much in line with the anti-war pro-revolution political programme of the Radical Gauche or with SFIOs passive isolationism. Your plan looks more like the work of Action Francaise, but I'm sure you despise their domestic policies as much as I do. You know, there's always room for you in the National Block. :)
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I'll have to politely decline your invitation, even though I share your despise for the AF retrograde policies. I drew that map because I am a realist, and decided to prepare a plan that could possibly be followed by a majority of our national assembly, leaving France in a strong position while not antagonizing too much the defeated countries. The proposal for Belgium and Finland was quite wrong, and I'm really glad no one gave their support to that madness. My ideas on foreign policy indeed are not common for a socialist, but the main reason Gauche Radicale now has my vote is because of their support for the worker's council system.

(ooc: No need to be sorry. Just change your vote to Gauche Radicale and we'll call it even :p)
 
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It hurt me, but ... I vote National Block. AF's plans would be better, but we must make concessions, and unite against communism. BUT if AF receive more votes, I will change my mind. Maybe we can make a political alliance ?
Also, I propose some adjustments to NB's plan : Make an independant Bavaria, or merge it with Austria.
 
Kotor was actually slightly off in his earlier poll - NB had one more vote and Radical Left one less at the time, Here is the current poll:

Total Vote: 19 (vote at laste election was 29, I hope to see an increased turnout so I'd expect us to have just over 30 votes in all, just a prediction though)

National Block: 9
Radical Left: 7
Action Francaise: 2
SFIO: 1

Well, the big two from the last election have seen their vote collapse - the SFIO losing out to the revolutionaries due to a lack of radicalism and AF losing out to the Republican centrists due to too much. I also imagine the grouping of the centrist Republican parties under a single banner is doing them a lot of favours.

edit: altered to include above vote.
 
It's clear we must stop the Leftists - National Bloc!
 
viola said:
sfio!
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I plead you to change your vote for teh Radicals as majority of the former supporters have moved to the true leftist party. SFIO is history and as a nice former party it deserves to die with dignity thus it shouldn't suffer the agony of being artificially kept alive.
 
Since socialists, communists and radicals are now waving the same banner, I propose to unite centrist and right-winged parties in order to counter the threat of left-winged radicalism. It is clear that other parties are marginalised - if you don't want the socialists to come to power, vote for the National Bloc!
 
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