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That could have gone better, but no point in dwelling on the mistakes of the past. Now we need to withdraw our armies from peripheral areas like Italy and the Balkans and strike an overwhelming blow at the centre of the German line, trapping their armies in Belgium. The war will be decided on the western front, all other fronts are merely distractions.
We need to assure the new republican Russian government of our full support, provided they continue Russias contribution to the war they led us into. We must also appeal to Britain to end their phony war and send us more men, or they can not expect to have any say when the peace is negotiated. And, most importantly, on the home-front we must all stand together in common love for our great nation and work ever harder for our victory.
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Tommy, what are the parties official war goals provided we win a total victory with minimal foreign support? (Britain and the USA are unlikely to contribute much and the war is winnable by France alone) Are they all going to settle for the historical Versailles peace treaty? The French historically wanted to force a far harsher peace on Germany but were sidelined by Wilson and the Brits who wanted to maintain the balance of power, but that is only because France needed their support to continue the war and the Germans were still in a position to refuse. If France had been strong enough at the end of the war it would have been able to make peace on its own terms. And in the game that is likely to be the case, so the peace treaty should pretty much be decided by the will of the French people as expressed by their political parties. Or perhaps we could hold a referendum on the terms of the peace?
We need to assure the new republican Russian government of our full support, provided they continue Russias contribution to the war they led us into. We must also appeal to Britain to end their phony war and send us more men, or they can not expect to have any say when the peace is negotiated. And, most importantly, on the home-front we must all stand together in common love for our great nation and work ever harder for our victory.
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Tommy, what are the parties official war goals provided we win a total victory with minimal foreign support? (Britain and the USA are unlikely to contribute much and the war is winnable by France alone) Are they all going to settle for the historical Versailles peace treaty? The French historically wanted to force a far harsher peace on Germany but were sidelined by Wilson and the Brits who wanted to maintain the balance of power, but that is only because France needed their support to continue the war and the Germans were still in a position to refuse. If France had been strong enough at the end of the war it would have been able to make peace on its own terms. And in the game that is likely to be the case, so the peace treaty should pretty much be decided by the will of the French people as expressed by their political parties. Or perhaps we could hold a referendum on the terms of the peace?
That's a bold claim considering the SFIO got more votes then the PRD.Cybvep said:
@Serpent: I've decided that after the war we will have another election where the various parties can put forth thir visions of the post war world. Obvs the game is not hugely flexibile, but I'm happy to change things up so we can have an ahistorical peace settlement.
Nice avatar change btw
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I can't remeber who asked but I'm playing the AAR mod.
I'm writing the second war update at the moment (having a break and a bout half way through) I've accomodated the persistence of anti-war sentiment amongst some posters as it fits in extremely well with in game events.
By th day's end the update will be up.
Nice avatar change btw
.I can't remeber who asked but I'm playing the AAR mod.
I'm writing the second war update at the moment (having a break and a bout half way through) I've accomodated the persistence of anti-war sentiment amongst some posters as it fits in extremely well with in game events.
By th day's end the update will be up.
La Grande Guerre – Part 2
January 10th 1916 - September 18th 1918
January 10th 1916 - September 18th 1918
The start of 1916 was a time of triumph for the Entente. From January, seeking to prove itself to the populace and to its allies, the young Russian Republic launched into the Brusilov Offensive that saw Riga, Minsk and Lvov all reclaimed, crushing German dreams of bullying the unstable regime into an early surrender. Meanwhile, on February 15th Greece, and on the 23rd Portugal, entered the war against Germany and her allies. In spite of all the good news Serbian resistance was rapidly fall apart in the face of a Bulgarian advance on it Eastern flank and renewed Austrian pressure from the North and West. In order to relieve their allies the French and Italians launched an assault on the Austrian port of Trieste whilst the French soldiers who had just knocked the Turks out of the war moved over into Greece from where they began an invasion of South-Eastern Bulgaria.
Sadly for France and her allies the hopes that the defeat of Turkey mark the beginning of a swift conclusion to the war were not to be fulfilled. After initial successes the Brusilov Offensive ground to a halt in mid March, around the same time the attack on Trieste was finally abandoned after much loss of life. Even in Bulgaria things did not go the Entente's way. Using the mountainous terrain to their advantage the badly outnumbered Bulgarian defenders limited the French advance to crawl – keeping up the pressure against the Serbs.
French high command sought to restore the initiative through two bold offensive actions. Firstly a naval invasion was launched in the Adriatic – landing in Western Croatia the troops found themselves deep behind enemy lines and moved to capture Zagreb, Ljubljana, the Pola peninsula and the port of Split by the Summer. On the Western Front a new largescale offensive was launched with the primary attack landing on Mons and secondary offensives taking place at Strasbourg and along the Belgian coastline. As ever on the Western Front the Spring offensive resulted in appalling loss of life on both sides – again the new style of industrialised warfare proving itself more destructive than anything ever seen before. Yet, although facing defeat again at Strasbourg, the offensive left the French in control of both Mons and Bruges. Emboldened from this noticeable success and the victories the previous year, French high command readied itself for the largest French offensive of the entire war – believing that the German army in the West was ready to be beaten.
In the Southern Theatre of war the Adriatic landings reached their most advanced in mid summer with much of Bosnia under occupation Hungary under threat. However defeats at Pola, Bjelovar and Banja Luka had put the French and their Belgian allies on the defensive. Following the capture of Belgrade Serbia fell on May 9th, but Austrian ambitions to advance Southwards through Montenegro and Albania were stunted by Commonwealth and Greek troops whilst slightly to the East the Franco-Greek advance into Bulgarian territory continued at an agonising pace. But with the war clearly turning against the Central Powers in the Balkans, Romania threw their lot in with the Entente in early September – proceeding to invade Transylvania and Northern Bulgaria.
With the German advancing again in the East and progress stalling in the South there was pressure on French high command to follow on from their victories earlier in the year by scoring powerful blow against the German war machine in the West. The French would not disappoint their allies as on July 25th, the Rhine Directive commenced. This ambitious ventures had three main goals – the first goal was to force the Germans from Belgium, the second to secure Alsace-Lorraine and the final goal to capture everything West of the Rhine. The poor performance of the Germans in Belgium earlier in the year made this seem more than possible. High Command intended to pour unlimited material resources into the offensive and were willing to accept any casualties so long as progress Eastward continued to be made. It was believed that under the pressure of such an attack the Germans could not hope to hold. The tricolour would be flying over Berlin by Christmas.
As ever in the Great War, the optimism of the Generals was misplaced. Although great breakthroughs were initially achieved – Brussels falling on the 13th of August and Antwerp a week later – the Germans were able to regroup and put up an almighty resistance. The Battle of Arlon in particular, lasting from the start of the offensive until late October, epitomised the Rhine Directive. It was an organised slaughter on a never seen before scale. France suffered more losses during the three month offensive than in the entire war up to that point. From July 25th until operations ceased on November 5th some 900,000 men were killed or injured on both sides, the narrow majority of whom were Frenchmen.
Militarily the Rhine Directive was a notable success. Despite failing to gain either Alsace-Lorraine or advance into Germany itself Belgium was liberated and after being pinned against the Dutch border an entire German army (some 11 divisions) was captured. It would now surely only be a matter of time before the Kaiser's ability to resist would finally give in. The threat to France itself was over.
On the home front the Rhine Directive changed everything. Prior to the offensive anti-war demonstrators and pacifists were regarded as traitors and cowards who disrespected those laying down their on the front. They were spat at and even assaulted upon the street. By early 1917 their support, primarily based among working class and peasant families, was booming. The watershed moment came on November 16th when 30,000 wounded veterans marched through Paris explicitly demanding an end to the war. This was the first large scale act of civil disobedience since the Union Sacree of 1914, rather than denounce it the veterans enjoyed widespread support. In a desperate although failed attempt to placate the simmering left Driant (a major proponent of the Rhine Directive) was sacked and replaced by the Radical Clemenceau, the move did not succeed. Events in Russia only further emboldened the anti-war movement.
In the high Summer the Provisional Government, facing a collapse in its popularity, attempted to appeal to the left by inviting the left winger Kerensky to lead the government. Yet after Kerensky's regime proved itself to be even more incompetent and less popular than the conservatives who preceded him it was clear the Provisional Government was not long for this world. The only question was whether it would be the right or the left that brought it down. The botched attempted at a coup by Kornilov in August all but answered this question. With their leaders like Lenin and Trotsky returning from exile abroad and others like Stalin being released from Tsarist prison camps in Siberia the popularity of the Bolsheviks had exploded. Being the only group to refuse any cooperation with the Provisional Government, dealing exclusively within the working class Soviets, the Party became the dominant political force amongst the urban proletariat and started to build a base of support amongst the peasantry. They promised peace when the Provisional Government had involved Russia in some of its most costly (and now failed) offensives, it promised bread through a restoration of the economy, it promised the land reform that the peasants had expected would come with the Christmas Revolution over Tsarism and it promised working class power. As the Provisional Government saw the country spiral out of control through December the expertly planned seizure of power by the Bolsheviks on December 16th marked the end of the Russian Republic and the birth of a new world. For the first time since the Paris Commune of 1871 the working class had seized power in its own right. The world would never be the same again.
In France the Revolution had a tremendous impact. High command and the united national government were terrified – both at the prospects of the Revolutionary infection spreading and at the chance that the Russians would make peace, making the gains of the Rhine Directive essentially worthless. Meanwhile a growing group amongst radical workers and intellectuals called for solidarity with the Russian Revolution. Following a botched offensive on the Western Front in January (launched in hopes of making as much ground as possible before the Russian ceasefire) a group of radicals formed the Union of French Bolsheviks. Committed to ending the war in through social revolution. The Union later came out in its first public demo on May Day – the demo was attacked by the French police and many leaders and participants incarcerated. The Union would hold out in Parisian working class districts throughout the period of repression.
Back on the field of battle, just as the government's iron grip on the home front was under threat for the first time, definite progress was being made against the Central Powers. It was notable that on the Eastern Front the Germans rebuffed Bolshevik proposals for negotiations and launched renewed attacks. Surprisingly, fighting as they were to protect their Revolution, the Russian army did not only defeat these offensives but made moderate gains – most notably the reclamation of Kiev which had been lost in the chaotic last days of the Kerensky regime. To the South Bulgaria was knocked out of the war in November 1916 following the occupation of Sofia and a general advance in the Balkans began with impressively few Entente casualties. The Habsburg Empire was already on the brink of collapse, scarcely able to maintain order in the provinces (especially in Slavic areas), and was suffering from mutinies in the army.
After the capture of Sarajevo on March 11th, Belgrade was liberated on the 21st and over the course of the following month the Austro-Hungarian and German army slowly engaged in a fighting withdrawal from Serbia. Sensing blood on June 15th a final offensive against the Habsburg Empire was launched – directed at the Imperial capital.
On July 5th Budapest and on the 10th Vienna fell to the Entente. With the government in flight the Austro-Hungarian Empire surrendered on July 13th 1917. Now fighting a two front war alone and struggling on both fronts it seemed that Berlin would soon throw in the towel as well. It would take one year and the lives of hundreds of thousands more Frenchmen to finally convince the Kaiser that the game was up.
Just before the final lurch towards Vienna the French had engaged in a costly one month campaign on the Western Front. Again Alsace-Lorraine remained tantalisingly out of reach, however the French finally stepped foot onto German soil as Aachen, Koblenz and the great city of Cologne all fell. After this the Entente forces (having grown far more multinational on the Western Front since the Rhine Directive with Commonwealth and Italian soldiers making major contributions) sat down to rest and prepare to resume their march into Germany. The fall of the Austro-Hungarian Empire spirited the Western Front (now the only active front for the Entente) into action as the Italians (a major contributor to the Western Front with twice the number of troops as the Commonwealth in that theatre) crossed the Rhine to capture Dusseldorf and then Essen – taking advantage of a weak point in the German lines. Reinforcing these gains another all out offensive was called. Yet rather than break the Germans fought to the death for every yard of German soil, the war truly had reached its most brutal stage.
This great push by the French and their allies into German territory ran out of steam by the beginning of December. Great gains had been made, but at unbelievable cost. Ever since the Rhine Directive battles on the Western Front had seen casualty figures soar. In August the great hero of the French high command – Marshal Petain – was killed by a German shell as he travelled towards the front line in the battle for Frankfurt. The most popular of all France's Generals was dead. At the end of December a renewed offensive was launched on all fronts and in just one weak the French suffered ¼ of a million casualties – gaining not a crap of land.
Over the course of the war the French and British fleets had forced the Germans out of the North Sea. With no clear opportunity for advance on the front line the French looked to make a landing behind enemy lines in order to get progress going again and speed the end of the war. The French fleet made the mistake of entering the Baltic, expecting the Germans Navy to be too weak to oppose a substantial French force. They were wrong, dead wrong. To the North of the Pomeranian coast two German fleets – one from Kiel and the other from Koenigsburg trapped the French fleet and virtually annihilated it. Just a few rag tag ships managed to escape and return to port. Of the mighty French navy at the start of the war just 3 battered battleships, 2 heavy cruisers and an assortment of destroyers remained.
Seeing no other alternative the French brought the last of their reserves (the troops meant for the amphibious landing) to the front and called upon all the Commonwealth, Italian and even Greek and Serbian soldiers they could for one last push. Beginning February with an all out assault on Baden involving upwards of a million Entente and perhaps as many as 600,000 Germans. Finally, but only after a month of the worst fighting of the war, the Germans broke and an endless advance began. But by bit, town by town, city by city and street by street the French advanced across the German heartlands towards Berlin.
In the East the Germans had arrogantly refused to even speak with the Bolshevik government throughout 1917. Making frankly pathetic gains against the overstretch Red Army which was simultaneously fighting a Civil War the Germans finally agreed to meet with a Russian delegation in Warsaw in February 1918. The Germans made bold demands – all of Poland and the Baltics, independence for Finland and and the annexation of parts of Western Ukraine and Belarussia. It was frankly absurd considering the actual circumstances on the ground with the French camped so deep in Germany and looking to breakthrough in Baden. Trotsky prolonged the negotiations for as long as possible, advocating a solution of 'neither peace nor war' in which the Bolsheviks did not make peace due to the unacceptable German demands, but attempted to keep the front line as static and peaceful as possible. With the Germans having to continuously send larger parts of their army Westward the tactic, although unpopular at home, was extremely successful.
After a final and valiant stand by the German army at the Battle of Potsdam through August and September the French entered Berlin on September 18th. After placing the Kaiser under arrest both he and his government were forced to sign an unconditional surrender to the Entente. Likewise the Generals of the German armies in the East agreed with the Bolsheviks to withdraw back to their pre-war Eastern border so long as neither side pursued territorial changes in that sector.
The war was over. Casualty figures can never be entirely accurate but it is estimated that somewhere in the region of 1.3 million Frenchmen died during the war – the vast majority during and after the Rhine Directive, with a further 3.5 million being injured. The country that suffered worse than any other was Germany which saw around 2.5 million war dead, well over a million civilian casualties (through a mixture of famines caused by blockade and the blood drench French march across Germany) and as many as 5 million wounded. Across Europe an entire generation was either dead or deeply scared by the horrors and physical wounds of war. Russia was in the throws of Revolution and Civil War, German society was swiftly breaking down whilst the great victors (primarily France and Italy, Britain having played a far smaller role in the conflict) had suffered the most bitter sweet of all triumphs. Nonetheless, it was now down to the all conquering Entente to decide the fate of the shattered continent.
The destruction of the war and the outlook of the generation who had come through it is perhap best shown through a comment made by a British journalist in October 1918 ''to walk through the ruins of Germany's cities is to know actual doubt about the continuity of civilisation''. This catastrophe, unlike anything Europe had ever experienced in the sheer scale of the destruction and loss of life, had brought the society of 'La Belle Époque' to ruins. But what would emerge from the ruins of the the old society in France, Russia, Germany, Eastern Europe and Italy remained in the balance.
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And so the guns go silent over Europe.
For some reason in this play through the German government was mental the the revolutionaries timid. By the time I was reaching into Saxony the revolt risk in Poland was around 40% - I've seen the German Revolution break out with dissent almost hald that! So million more had to die and Germany proper had to be reduced to ruins. It really was quite amazing how the level of manpower losses I was suffering ballooned after my big offensive using the chit. It just cost more and more to take each province. Nonetheless, France stands triumphant over Europe! With the Russian situation in the East (the Bolsheviks hold all the former Empire at the mo and are still in CW) and the failure of the British to be more than a minor aid and America to enter the war at all (they spent all their time fighitng Mexico) France has pretty much free reign to dictate the peace. We'll have an election next to decide what to do. Aside from the peace there is still a hell of a lot to think about.
For some reason in this play through the German government was mental the the revolutionaries timid. By the time I was reaching into Saxony the revolt risk in Poland was around 40% - I've seen the German Revolution break out with dissent almost hald that! So million more had to die and Germany proper had to be reduced to ruins. It really was quite amazing how the level of manpower losses I was suffering ballooned after my big offensive using the chit. It just cost more and more to take each province. Nonetheless, France stands triumphant over Europe! With the Russian situation in the East (the Bolsheviks hold all the former Empire at the mo and are still in CW) and the failure of the British to be more than a minor aid and America to enter the war at all (they spent all their time fighitng Mexico) France has pretty much free reign to dictate the peace. We'll have an election next to decide what to do. Aside from the peace there is still a hell of a lot to think about.
Annex Alsace-Lorraine (of course :blink: ), but also Mainz, Saarbrucken and Trier. Etablish a french protectorate of the remaining Rhineland, and divide Germany into Prussia, Hannover, Bavaria, Saxony. Or make all the former confederate states independant. And demilitarize North Gemarny.
The Rhineland is french !
The Rhineland is french !
Hear, hear! However... we should focus more on aid. In case some people decide to revolt. If the British call out our demands as too high, we must give some headway. Only through Unity are we strong! LONG LIVE THE ENTENTE!
Ten million. It is the smallest and certainly erroneous estimate. Millions of lives lost and... we are celebrating? Why? Because France "triumphed" in the end? Because France is now the "unchallengeable sovereign" of Europe? Tell me, what is France if not the French? What is good for France, if not what is good for the French? That said, what has the average frenchman gained from this so-called victory? Suffering is the only answer, even more suffering than the proletariat already had. Apart from the usual hunger, disease and the massive list of problems they already had, now they have to mourn their father, spouse and son, they have to tend for the disabled veterans whom the state will most surely forget now that the capitalistic objectives of this war have been accomplished. And we are celebrating...Why?
They are celebrating because now they got their Imperialistic ideas trough and can gained land that is now reduced to rubble and isn't worth anything. They are celebrating because they think that the people think them as heroes and liberators. They are celebrating because they have successfully got rid of so many French that could have supported. The motto of these capitalist pigs is more like Strength through unity, unity through faith!
People of France we have to do something. Let us help our Russian Bolshevik comrades by helping ourselves to overthrow this capitalist hive of scum and villainy.
The French people have fought and slaved for this victory, let us not make their sacrifices in vain!
To Versailles! Freedom for Alsace-Lorraine!
((So, as the Soviets didn't seem to actually sign anything like Brest-Litovsk, they gain the Danzig corridor in the peace treaty? I suppose they kept their word and fought with us to the end, regardless of the name changes in between. Lucky strike for them, maybe they would be able to support the Spartakusbund TTL?))
To Versailles! Freedom for Alsace-Lorraine!
((So, as the Soviets didn't seem to actually sign anything like Brest-Litovsk, they gain the Danzig corridor in the peace treaty? I suppose they kept their word and fought with us to the end, regardless of the name changes in between. Lucky strike for them, maybe they would be able to support the Spartakusbund TTL?))
We need to be careful with the bolsheviks. I may be, and sincerely hope that I am wrong, but the bolsheviks and some of their ideas cause a certain uneasiness in me. As fellow socialists, they most certainly deserve a chance, but they must be constantly observed.
We are celebrating victory because the alternative would have been far worse. How much more would the people of France have suffered if the Germans had been triumphant, if their armies had marched trough our land? Look at Belgium and see the horrors they would have inflicted on us. If the unpatriotic pacifistic cowards of the extreme left had been successful in undermining the morale of our troops the people of France would have payed a far greater price for defeat then we did for victory.
But we won, and at a horrible cost. We must make sure that our sacrifices have not been in vain. Germany can never be allowed to threaten us again. Let us draw the border along the Rhine, leave a moderately powerful Prussia in the East to contain the Bolsheviks and divide the rest into small republics and princedoms. Placing different political systems in power in the german states will ensure that they will not easily unite again. Let us divide the German colonies with Britain and Italy to soothe the british vanity and reward our most stalwart allies. And let us favour the Italians over the Serbs in the division of Croatia to secure the continuation of our friendship. Let us give aid in the reconstruction of Luxembourg and Wallonia with the ultimate objective of incorporating them into France as semi-autonomous provinces following democratic referendums, so that all frenchmen may be united in our great republic.
Great news, that will be fun.
Thanks, it seemed like the patriotic thing to do.
But we won, and at a horrible cost. We must make sure that our sacrifices have not been in vain. Germany can never be allowed to threaten us again. Let us draw the border along the Rhine, leave a moderately powerful Prussia in the East to contain the Bolsheviks and divide the rest into small republics and princedoms. Placing different political systems in power in the german states will ensure that they will not easily unite again. Let us divide the German colonies with Britain and Italy to soothe the british vanity and reward our most stalwart allies. And let us favour the Italians over the Serbs in the division of Croatia to secure the continuation of our friendship. Let us give aid in the reconstruction of Luxembourg and Wallonia with the ultimate objective of incorporating them into France as semi-autonomous provinces following democratic referendums, so that all frenchmen may be united in our great republic.
@Serpent: I've decided that after the war we will have another election where the various parties can put forth thir visions of the post war world. Obvs the game is not hugely flexibile, but I'm happy to change things up so we can have an ahistorical peace settlement.
Nice avatar change btw
Great news, that will be fun.
Thanks, it seemed like the patriotic thing to do
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I would like to express my thoughts on the peace treaty that we'll eventually sign with the central powers:
Antagonizing Germany even further would only lead to even a greater hatred towards France within our neighbours borders.Occupying large chunks of german/austrian/hungarian/turkish-inhabited territory will lead to massive internal problems for our nation and a renewed feeling of revanchist nationalism in the defeated countries, which subsequently would lead to more bloodbath in the future. The most reasonable solution is to draw the borders of a new Europe not based on imperialist ambition, but in ethnic areas. Regions inhabited by French should belong to France, by Turks to Turkey, by Italians to Italy and so on.
The right will probably ask me, infuriated: Is this the way you honor the sacrifice so many fellow countrymen did for France, by allowing Germany the easy way out? Well, to them my answer is this:
I believe the only way of properly honoring the brave Frenchmen who perished in this war is to guarantee that an horror like the one they suffered in their wet trenches will never happen again.
Antagonizing Germany even further would only lead to even a greater hatred towards France within our neighbours borders.Occupying large chunks of german/austrian/hungarian/turkish-inhabited territory will lead to massive internal problems for our nation and a renewed feeling of revanchist nationalism in the defeated countries, which subsequently would lead to more bloodbath in the future. The most reasonable solution is to draw the borders of a new Europe not based on imperialist ambition, but in ethnic areas. Regions inhabited by French should belong to France, by Turks to Turkey, by Italians to Italy and so on.
The right will probably ask me, infuriated: Is this the way you honor the sacrifice so many fellow countrymen did for France, by allowing Germany the easy way out? Well, to them my answer is this:
I believe the only way of properly honoring the brave Frenchmen who perished in this war is to guarantee that an horror like the one they suffered in their wet trenches will never happen again.
A division of Europe on ethnic lines seems like a kindness, but truly it is not. If the principle of ethnicity is the main determinant of national borders it makes ethnic minorities a liability and thus a target, making ethnic cleansing a means to territorial gain. It also leaves most borders long, winding and more difficult to defend, which favours powerful states at the expense of the weak. Further, since many regions are inhabited by mixed ethnicities there will still be more or less oppressed minorities who can become the victims or implements of aggression. It is a destructive principle that will cause more suffering than it would prevent. And it would reward Germany for losing the war by allowing them to incorporate parts of the former Austro-Hungarian Empire that has ethnic germans scattered all the way to Transylvania.
It also opens up the argument that if Europe is divided along ethnic lines, then why should not Africa and Asia be as well? If the ethnic principle is made international law it will eventually destroy our Empire and all other colonial empires that are not built upon expulsion of the native inhabitants. In reality it favours only the americans who will gain free access to world markets at our expense. It would make us the losers of the war and all our sacrifices would mean nothing.
It also opens up the argument that if Europe is divided along ethnic lines, then why should not Africa and Asia be as well? If the ethnic principle is made international law it will eventually destroy our Empire and all other colonial empires that are not built upon expulsion of the native inhabitants. In reality it favours only the americans who will gain free access to world markets at our expense. It would make us the losers of the war and all our sacrifices would mean nothing.
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As said before, there will be a german revanchism. We We would better make limit its power before revanchist parties takes power of restored germany.
We need to install different regimes in the various new states of Germany. We have to be friend with the reborn state of Bavaria, by giving them Wurttemberg and Tyrol, and maybe Baden, and install a puppet king at the head of this nation. Germany will pay for his crimes towards French.
We need to install different regimes in the various new states of Germany. We have to be friend with the reborn state of Bavaria, by giving them Wurttemberg and Tyrol, and maybe Baden, and install a puppet king at the head of this nation. Germany will pay for his crimes towards French.
@up If you didn't notice, that statement was referring to the situation which was present 2 years ago. It is obvious that the French society is not happy about high losses suffered during the war, but those sacrifices allowed us to win the war. Now that the war is over, amnesty should be offered to all anti-war activists, as they are no longer harmful.
The proposed peace treaty should not be humiliating to the Germans, as that will only result in German revanchism. They need to be weak enough in order not to be a threat to us and strong enough in order to contain the Russians. They were soundly beaten and can only blame their own rulers for this, as they started the war. Considering the small contribution of the British Empire to the war effort, France should dictate the peace terms. Kaiser should abdicate and we should let the Germans decide what form of government they want to adopt. Alsace-Lorraine should become a part of France, where it rightfully belongs. Poland should become an independent nation. A non-aggression pact for 10 years should be signed by all belligerents. Germany should pay war reparations, but there is no point in demanding something which they will not be able to pay - the extent of the war reparations should be reasonable.
The Ottoman Empire should be dissolved and France should take control of all former Ottoman regions to the east of Egypt and give them autonomy. This will increase our influence in the Middle East without straining our administration too much.
The proposed peace treaty should not be humiliating to the Germans, as that will only result in German revanchism. They need to be weak enough in order not to be a threat to us and strong enough in order to contain the Russians. They were soundly beaten and can only blame their own rulers for this, as they started the war. Considering the small contribution of the British Empire to the war effort, France should dictate the peace terms. Kaiser should abdicate and we should let the Germans decide what form of government they want to adopt. Alsace-Lorraine should become a part of France, where it rightfully belongs. Poland should become an independent nation. A non-aggression pact for 10 years should be signed by all belligerents. Germany should pay war reparations, but there is no point in demanding something which they will not be able to pay - the extent of the war reparations should be reasonable.
The Ottoman Empire should be dissolved and France should take control of all former Ottoman regions to the east of Egypt and give them autonomy. This will increase our influence in the Middle East without straining our administration too much.
The war is over. Finally.
So, like all the French, like all patriots, we rejoice. But we do not forget the terrible losses suffered by our people.
And the group of the Action Libérale Populaire, within the Republican coalition, will be the voice of liberals, social Catholics, the French of all persuasions, in the discussion of the peace treaty.
What we want is the assurance that never again, that never, Germany threatened France and the emerging new world order.
For this, the re-integration of Alsace-Lorraine in the national community, but also the addition of the west bank of the Rhine, the division of the Reich on confessional lines, with a Protestant state in the north and a Catholic state in the south, which shall join Austria deprived of its empire (except perhaps Bohemia) seems essential and necessary. Of course, these two states should pay France war reparations.
Sharing with our allies British, Italians and Japanese the old Prussian colonies, but also the supervisation the Ottoman Middle East (a state-mandate for Palestine, a state-mandate for Syria and Lebanon to France, and another british on Jordan) will ensure the necessary progress towards the civilization of the peoples of these areas.
We also propose to grant Italy, which is certainly the second nation of this Agreement by its contribution to the war, its irredentist lands on the Adriatic and the Tyrol.
France must also do its utmost to ensure our Polish brothers an independent state (including Galicia, Silesia and Danzig corridor), which will be, with a Greater Romania, our best allies in the East against the Bolsheviks .
Thanks fot this great AAR!
So, like all the French, like all patriots, we rejoice. But we do not forget the terrible losses suffered by our people.
And the group of the Action Libérale Populaire, within the Republican coalition, will be the voice of liberals, social Catholics, the French of all persuasions, in the discussion of the peace treaty.
What we want is the assurance that never again, that never, Germany threatened France and the emerging new world order.
For this, the re-integration of Alsace-Lorraine in the national community, but also the addition of the west bank of the Rhine, the division of the Reich on confessional lines, with a Protestant state in the north and a Catholic state in the south, which shall join Austria deprived of its empire (except perhaps Bohemia) seems essential and necessary. Of course, these two states should pay France war reparations.
Sharing with our allies British, Italians and Japanese the old Prussian colonies, but also the supervisation the Ottoman Middle East (a state-mandate for Palestine, a state-mandate for Syria and Lebanon to France, and another british on Jordan) will ensure the necessary progress towards the civilization of the peoples of these areas.
We also propose to grant Italy, which is certainly the second nation of this Agreement by its contribution to the war, its irredentist lands on the Adriatic and the Tyrol.
France must also do its utmost to ensure our Polish brothers an independent state (including Galicia, Silesia and Danzig corridor), which will be, with a Greater Romania, our best allies in the East against the Bolsheviks .
Thanks fot this great AAR!