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Europa Universalis IV - Development Diary 10th of October 2023 - Yemen and Arabia

Greetings everyone! Today we will take a look into Yemen and the Arabic states, coming back to a more regular type of DD.

Let us start with the content for the Yemeni countries:
rassid missions.png

yemen missions.png

Note: Mission icons are still WIP.

As you might notice, the first mission tree is for the Rassids while the second one is for all Yemeni countries. The reason for this is that they are one of the two unique tags that follow the Zaidi school of Islam (the other one is Gilan on that note) and even are a Feudal Theocracy, so figured they deserve a bit more attention.

In general, though, the Yemeni tags are relatively similar with a similar focus which is the unification of southern Arabia, expansion into the Horn of Africa, and, of course, trade.

The Yemeni tags won’t have any big gimmicks to play with as you will probably either form the Mamluks / Egypt or Arabia later on. With that being said, they still have some interesting additions and small design experiments. An example is the addition of more age-lasting rewards like in the “Unite Yemen” mission:
age rewards.png

Note: Completing missions with age-limited modifiers after the age has passed will just give some small monarch power instead.

These kinds of rewards should incentivize you to focus on certain missions and allow us to give impactful rewards without having to worry about them stacking too much indefinitely as this was the case with permanent rewards.

A bit of a theme for the Yemeni mission rewards is to strengthen the Propagate Religion Trade Policy as you can see in the following missions:
propagate religion.png

And as a trade-focused nation, you will gain the ‘Thalassocracy’ reward when you manage to make the Gulf of Aden the highest-valued trade node and make a monthly income of 300 ducats.
thalassocracy.png

What is a Yemeni country without its focus on coffee?
coffee.png

The “Port of Mukha” requires you to have a workshop, shipyard, and 20 development in the coffee province. The resulting plantation will then pretty much carry your economy while you can focus on “Qahwah Monopoly”.

Now a short insight in the Rassids-specific missions:
rassids missions 1.png

rassids missions 2.png

And when you are done with the Yemen mission tree then you can form into Arabia to continue your campaign. With “Unite Arabia” you will be able to form Arabia a lot earlier too:
unite arabia.png

With that being said, let’s take a look at the Arabic content. Before I go into the Arabic mission trees, I should mention that Arabia has received new ideas so they are no longer a drawback to form:

Code:
ARB_ideas = {
    start = {
        tolerance_own = 2
        years_of_nationalism = -10
    }

    bonus = {
        siege_ability = 0.15
    }

    trigger = {
        tag = ARB
    }
    free = yes

    ARB_arabian_pincers = {
        cav_to_inf_ratio = 0.25
        cavalry_power = 0.25
    }
    ARB_pact_of_umar = {
        dhimmi_loyalty_modifier = 0.1
        global_tax_modifier = 0.2
    }
    ARB_engage_in_indian_ocean_trade = {
        trade_steering = 0.2
    }
    ARB_conversion = {
        global_missionary_strength = 0.03
    }
    ARB_jihad = {
        warscore_cost_vs_other_religion = -0.1
    }
    ARB_new_caliphate_rising = {
        missionaries = 1
        missionary_maintenance_cost = -0.25
    }
    ARB_mubarizun = {
        army_tradition_decay = -0.01
    }
}

Also forming Arabia will now fire the following flavor event, allowing you to change your capital to one of the important provinces from the Caliphate states:
arabia_capital_event.png

Now to the mission tree for the Arabic countries and Arabia as a whole:
arabia_missions.png

These missions are available to all Bedouin and Hejazi countries. The mission tree is split into 5 parts, 2 of them are inspired by Hejaz while the other 2 smaller parts are inspired by Najd. The last and biggest part is telling the narrative of the formation of a new Arabic Caliphate, and as such possesses a large number of conquest missions.

Starting with the Hejaz-flavored mission parts which branch from the missions “Promote Shura” and “Protectors of the Two Cities”. Here are some highlights of these missions:
wahabism.png

protectors_of_the_cities.png

expand_jeddah_port.png

Note: Jeddah is a Coastal Desert province. So in total, the province will have a -5% Local Development Cost from mission rewards after completing these missions.

As for the Najd-flavored part, here are the following highlights:
befriend_local_amirs.png

Note: Countries which do not have the government mechanic gain +15% Permanent Reinforce Speed instead.
the_harsh_desert.png


found_riyadh.png

Before moving on to the last part of the mission tree, I should mention a special decision available to Bedouin and Hejazi countries. Near the city of Medina used to be an old gold mine which was virtually exhausted in EU4’s timeframe. However, as your early economy in Arabia is barely sufficient enough to cover your state maintenance, we have added a decision that allows the Medina province to help boost your economy for the early years:
restore_cradle_of_gold.png

And once gold runs out of its usefulness to you, you can restore Cloth production once more.
close_cradle_of_gold.png

At last, we now take a look at the core of the mission tree which is heavily dedicated to expansion to mirror the past achievements of the Islamic conquests. As these missions are quite self-explanatory, I will focus on the big highlights of this part:
topple_mamluks.png

abbasid_legacy.png

unite_the_homeland.png

caliphal_ambitions.png

Note: The mission is significantly easier to complete than the Unify Islam decision.

rightly_guided.png

That was it for this week. Next week @Pavía will present you a feature breakdown of 1.36 as well as new and exciting QoL and modding additions. Until then, I wish you all a great week!
 
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Not to beat a dead horse, but I think there's something that needs to be pointed out about this whole DLC and the communication around it.

Beforehand, though, I want to preface that by saying that I really appreciate the turn towards experimental mechanics, (slightly) more dynamic culture and so on. That's great and gives great hopes for EU5!

But you guys need to understand that the main issue you see exploding here in the thread is the communication surrounding this DLC, that has been built up over one or two years. It's been communicated - by Johan - that you want to leave a well polished EU4, and for that reason The Middle East and South American regions will be revisited.

What has been communicated in these recent DD's is not a regional revisit, but a sporadic revisit of some states in the region, and some not in the region. So what you see here is a discrepancy between the expectations that you've created, and the actual product communicated thus far.

I think it's great to see you interact with the fans here on the forums. I don't think that anybody - except for a few trolls now and then - is on these forums if they're not fans of Paradox or at least particular games. So the bad vibes in this thread is not meant to insult or hurt anyone, but is litterally disappointment from the hype you've created yourselves.

As someone else said: this is THE opportunity to please the crowds by postponing release and including more states in the overhaul. :)
 
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Hi there! We understand that there might be some disappointment with the countries not getting content in the DLC (all in honesty, I had a list of like 20 interesting countries when we started planning it, so some would always be out of the final list).

However, we'd like this DD to be more focused on receiving and gathering valuable feedback about Yemen and Arabia; for instance, I like the suggestions of making Mecca and Medina possible capitals of the Caliphate, let's see if we can get it into the release version of the DLC.

I'll talk next week of the main features of the DLC as a whole, what was our design focus, and also about the 1.36 free patch, and how both are set together. I think that it will be a more appropiate moment and place to discuss about the final content list. ;)
I disagreed when I saw this, but I’m retracting that— I’ll look forward to reading what you post next week. But I really, really hope that includes content for Hisn Kayfa and Oman. It’d be pretty wack for them to be neglected in the Middle Eastern DLC while Byzantium got a ton of content.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m happy for a new Byzantium tree/new Byz flavor. But there are other tags far more relevant to the region that need both far more.
 
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Hi there! We understand that there might be some disappointment with the countries not getting content in the DLC (all in honesty, I had a list of like 20 interesting countries when we started planning it, so some would always be out of the final list).

However, we'd like this DD to be more focused on receiving and gathering valuable feedback about Yemen and Arabia; for instance, I like the suggestions of making Mecca and Medina possible capitals of the Caliphate, let's see if we can get it into the release version of the DLC.

I'll talk next week of the main features of the DLC as a whole, what was our design focus, and also about the 1.36 free patch, and how both are set together. I think that it will be a more appropiate moment and place to discuss about the final content list. ;)
There should be options to change the caliphal dynasty, especially if the country's dynasty is non-Quraysh. The Rassids in Yemen, the Hashimiyyah in Mecca, the Husayniyyah in Medina, the Bolkiahs in Brunei, the Kirams in Sulu, the Sayyids in Delhi, the Saadis in Morocco, the Hafsids in Tunis, and some others I may not remember are Quraysh dynasties. The Mamluks also have a branch of the Abbasid dynasty, while Granada has some Umayyad descendants, one of whom led a Morisco rebellion against Castille some time after the Reconquista.

Choosing from the Umayyad and Abbasid dynasties should provide appropriate buffs and debuffs, with the Umayyads having a focus on military expansion and the Abbasids having a focus on vassal swarming and institution spread; and perhaps choosing the descendants of Muhammad SAWS provide permanent legitimacy and prestige buffs.

I went into detail with this previous post on this same thread.
 
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Not wanting to add to the echo chamber, but honestly, after Total War's absolute fiasco of a DLC attempt, raising your voice DOES help.

1) Rather disappointed overall, sure, some of the things seem great but it is rather sporadic, odd, and just weird in some areas.

2) Is the price going to be the same as the previous or is it going to be cheaper because it is a regional dlc? Only asking because CA tried to give us a race pack for half the base game price for half the usual dlc content. Still reeling from that loss.

3) Why were other countries at least not given a cursory clean up? A few new generic mission for the area could be researched and coded in a day, or two, tops.

This just leaves a bad taste in my mouth, and I do not think I will be supporting EUIV any longer if this is the scope of what the final DLCs are going to be.
 
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Some advice for the PDX team here. Consider revamping how you communicate with the player base. In general, I think you do a great job of communicating and interacting with us. However, i think you’d be well served to begin the release cycle with a high level overview of what a new DLC will entail before taking the deeper dives into specific tags/mechanics. While dripping out information weekly does serve to build anticipation it also creates a lot of anxiety as we begin to be concerned that each of our specific desires might not be addressed. Rather than let the angst build as we wait to see what’s coming each week I’d suggest you rip off the band-aid in week one by sharing, at a high level, whats in, out, and on the bubble of the DLC before you go into detail in later weeks.

Theres been a lot of great work shared so far but because you have still not helped us set our expectations many of us aren’t focusing on what you’ve done but what you haven’t, or might not do. If you set expectations up front we, as a playerbase, might be able to get over our disappointment(s) earlier and move on to be excited about what is actually on the way instead of a long running period of wailing and gnashing of teeth which is what we seem to have here.

Again, while I’m certainly not stoked about everything you’ve shared so far I think you’ve shared a lot of cool stuff and I appreciate your interaction with the community. I’m just suggesting there might be a little less painful way to share the good news and the bad news of each new DLC.
 
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Hi there! We understand that there might be some disappointment with the countries not getting content in the DLC (all in honesty, I had a list of like 20 interesting countries when we started planning it, so some would always be out of the final list).

However, we'd like this DD to be more focused on receiving and gathering valuable feedback about Yemen and Arabia; for instance, I like the suggestions of making Mecca and Medina possible capitals of the Caliphate, let's see if we can get it into the release version of the DLC.

I'll talk next week of the main features of the DLC as a whole, what was our design focus, and also about the 1.36 free patch, and how both are set together. I think that it will be a more appropiate moment and place to discuss about the final content list. ;)
I'm sorry man, i usualy support everything you guys at Tinto do for us and EU4, but i simply can not hit that like button on your comment. This is probably the first time i hit dislike button on devs comment and i appologize. Anyways i still do hope that your final list of countries updated in KoK is bigger. So many players mentioned Oman, Trebizond, Jerusalem and Nubia. And what about Timurids or Mughals? Are they included in this DLC or do you plan DLC about post Mongolian world?

If this is your final list please delay if possible so more countries could be included.
 
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I'm sorry man, i usualy support everything you guys at Tinto do for us and EU4, but i simply can not hit that like button on your comment. This is probably the first time i hit dislike button on devs comment and i appologize. Anyways i still do hope that your final list of countries updated in KoK is bigger. So many players mentioned Oman, Trebizond, Jerusalem and Nubia. And what about Timurids or Mughals? Are they included in this DLC or do you plan DLC about post Mongolian world?

If this is your final list please delay if possible so more countries could be included.
Well, we are kinda living in a post Mongolian world.
 
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Not to beat a dead horse, but I think there's something that needs to be pointed out about this whole DLC and the communication around it.

Beforehand, though, I want to preface that by saying that I really appreciate the turn towards experimental mechanics, (slightly) more dynamic culture and so on. That's great and gives great hopes for EU5!

But you guys need to understand that the main issue you see exploding here in the thread is the communication surrounding this DLC, that has been built up over one or two years. It's been communicated - by Johan - that you want to leave a well polished EU4, and for that reason The Middle East and South American regions will be revisited.

What has been communicated in these recent DD's is not a regional revisit, but a sporadic revisit of some states in the region, and some not in the region. So what you see here is a discrepancy between the expectations that you've created, and the actual product communicated thus far.

I think it's great to see you interact with the fans here on the forums. I don't think that anybody - except for a few trolls now and then - is on these forums if they're not fans of Paradox or at least particular games. So the bad vibes in this thread is not meant to insult or hurt anyone, but is litterally disappointment from the hype you've created yourselves.

As someone else said: this is THE opportunity to please the crowds by postponing release and including more states in the overhaul. :)

Community team member here, mostly speaking on my own behalf. Firstly I apologize to those who got their hopes up about a nation they wanted to see get cool stuff just for that to turn out not to be the case. Whether it was Oman, Hejaz, Timurids, etc. I'd say "We hear you" but that line is pretty cleché at this point.

I agree communications on this pack could have been handled better, putting the vague idea of a "Middle East DLC" out into the wild for everyone to use their imaginations deciding what that exactly entails is what lead to some feeling let down. Implication and expectation are important. This is something I believe we should be more careful about in the future.

Sometimes the line between open and clear communication and avoiding promises or setting false expectations can be blurry and difficult to dance on. Especially so far in advance. I can understand as a fan how frustrating it can be to get your hopes up for something only for that thing to be not what you expected. Even if it's good or great!

And we do still believe King of Kings will be good for what it is! A flavorful immersion pack with an emphasis on Mamluks, Persia, and Byzantium playthroughs. (with a little bit extra sprinkled where we can of course, I'm personally excited for QQ/AQ :)).

As my friend and colleague @Pavía already mentioned, we'll be discussing more of the design focus in next week's Dev Diary, so I won't get into that now. But suffice it to say, we're eager to share our thoughts with you then <3
 
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Community team member here, mostly speaking on my own behalf. Firstly I apologize to those who got their hopes up about a nation they wanted to see get cool stuff just for that to turn out not to be the case. Whether it was Oman, Hejaz, Timurids, etc. I'd say "We hear you" but that line is pretty cleché at this point.

I agree communications on this pack could have been handled better, putting the vague idea of a "Middle East DLC" out into the wild for everyone to use their imaginations deciding what that exactly entails is what lead to some feeling let down. Implication and expectation are important. This is something I believe we should be more careful about in the future.

Sometimes the line between open and clear communication and avoiding promises or setting false expectations can be blurry and difficult to dance on. Especially so far in advance. I can understand as a fan how frustrating it can be to get your hopes up for something only for that thing to be not what you expected. Even if it's good or great!

And we do still believe King of Kings will be good for what it is! A flavorful immersion pack with an emphasis on Mamluks, Persia, and Byzantium playthroughs. (with a little bit extra sprinkled where we can of course, I'm personally excited for QQ/AQ :)).

As my friend and colleague @Pavía already mentioned, we'll be discussing more of the design focus in next week's Dev Diary, so I won't get into that now. But suffice it to say, we're eager to share our thoughts with you then <3
While it is nice and very nice steps with regards to communications and kudos to you personaly,I find it scandalous that a dlc named king of kings set in Persia completely skips the major power of this area,the Timurids whose content is very small and very dated and focuses on the Byzantines who already have content in the Purple Phoenix.Btw this isnt a personal attack,just voicing some frustrations and again thanks for your response.To add I also like the content of AQ/QQ.
 
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Community team member here, mostly speaking on my own behalf. Firstly I apologize to those who got their hopes up about a nation they wanted to see get cool stuff just for that to turn out not to be the case. Whether it was Oman, Hejaz, Timurids, etc. I'd say "We hear you" but that line is pretty cleché at this point.

I agree communications on this pack could have been handled better, putting the vague idea of a "Middle East DLC" out into the wild for everyone to use their imaginations deciding what that exactly entails is what lead to some feeling let down. Implication and expectation are important. This is something I believe we should be more careful about in the future.

Sometimes the line between open and clear communication and avoiding promises or setting false expectations can be blurry and difficult to dance on. Especially so far in advance. I can understand as a fan how frustrating it can be to get your hopes up for something only for that thing to be not what you expected. Even if it's good or great!

And we do still believe King of Kings will be good for what it is! A flavorful immersion pack with an emphasis on Mamluks, Persia, and Byzantium playthroughs. (with a little bit extra sprinkled where we can of course, I'm personally excited for QQ/AQ :)).

As my friend and colleague @Pavía already mentioned, we'll be discussing more of the design focus in next week's Dev Diary, so I won't get into that now. But suffice it to say, we're eager to share our thoughts with you then <3
I do apretiate some clarifications regarding on what we can expect in KoK. However i'm still in the favor of further delaying this DLC/update if it will bring content for at least Oman and Trebizond. Also not to mention Nubia that devs said they view it as Middle East country.

I do have one question and i don't know if you as community manager can answer it but what about Granada/Andalusia or Mughals that were mentioned in Domination DD? Will they be part of update/DLC or this is something it would be adressed in next DD?
 
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I do apretiate some clarifications regarding on what we can expect in KoK. However i'm still in the favor of further delaying this DLC/update if it will bring content for at least Oman and Trebizond. Also not to mention Nubia that devs said they view it as Middle East country.

I do have one question and i don't know if you as community manager can answer it but what about Granada/Andalusia or Mughals that were mentioned in Domination DD? Will they be part of update/DLC or this is something it would be adressed in next DD?

That is something I cannot answer at this time, unfortunately.
 
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Community team member here, mostly speaking on my own behalf. Firstly I apologize to those who got their hopes up about a nation they wanted to see get cool stuff just for that to turn out not to be the case. Whether it was Oman, Hejaz, Timurids, etc. I'd say "We hear you" but that line is pretty cleché at this point.

I agree communications on this pack could have been handled better, putting the vague idea of a "Middle East DLC" out into the wild for everyone to use their imaginations deciding what that exactly entails is what lead to some feeling let down. Implication and expectation are important. This is something I believe we should be more careful about in the future.

Sometimes the line between open and clear communication and avoiding promises or setting false expectations can be blurry and difficult to dance on. Especially so far in advance. I can understand as a fan how frustrating it can be to get your hopes up for something only for that thing to be not what you expected. Even if it's good or great!

And we do still believe King of Kings will be good for what it is! A flavorful immersion pack with an emphasis on Mamluks, Persia, and Byzantium playthroughs. (with a little bit extra sprinkled where we can of course, I'm personally excited for QQ/AQ :)).

As my friend and colleague @Pavía already mentioned, we'll be discussing more of the design focus in next week's Dev Diary, so I won't get into that now. But suffice it to say, we're eager to share our thoughts with you then <3
Thanks for being clear here. So that means there won't be any new flavor for induvidual nations, right? It hasn't been straight up confirmed but I do wonder why the team is avoiding to be directe here. If there is indeed stuff, confirming it might calm down the disappointment many do have.
 
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Thanks for being clear here. So that means there won't be any new flavor for induvidual nations, right? It hasn't been straight up confirmed but I do wonder why the team is avoiding to be directe here. If there is indeed stuff, confirming it might calm down the disappointment many do have.

That's correct, barring minor adjustments or "continuations" of what we've shown (Such as mission trees we didn't fully show off) a vast majority of the nation-specific content has been already shown or directly mentioned in DDs.

I want to dispel any theories that next week is secretly a mega Oman DD. As much as I wish it was with all this feedback.
 
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Community team member here, mostly speaking on my own behalf. Firstly I apologize to those who got their hopes up about a nation they wanted to see get cool stuff just for that to turn out not to be the case. Whether it was Oman, Hejaz, Timurids, etc. I'd say "We hear you" but that line is pretty cleché at this point.

I agree communications on this pack could have been handled better, putting the vague idea of a "Middle East DLC" out into the wild for everyone to use their imaginations deciding what that exactly entails is what lead to some feeling let down. Implication and expectation are important. This is something I believe we should be more careful about in the future.

Sometimes the line between open and clear communication and avoiding promises or setting false expectations can be blurry and difficult to dance on. Especially so far in advance. I can understand as a fan how frustrating it can be to get your hopes up for something only for that thing to be not what you expected. Even if it's good or great!

And we do still believe King of Kings will be good for what it is! A flavorful immersion pack with an emphasis on Mamluks, Persia, and Byzantium playthroughs. (with a little bit extra sprinkled where we can of course, I'm personally excited for QQ/AQ :)).

As my friend and colleague @Pavía already mentioned, we'll be discussing more of the design focus in next week's Dev Diary, so I won't get into that now. But suffice it to say, we're eager to share our thoughts with you then <3
Appreciate your answer, but it leaves a bitter taste in the mouth to know that the long awaited ME DLC (I'm a ME main) ends up to be ... this
I wish to know why the byzantines have been elected to be a main focus and not the Timurids...
Also 2 caucasian minors have been chosen over countries/regions like iraq, syria, hormuz, nubia and oman; is this solely because of the many byzantium fans?
All in all, it's a huge disappointment for many of us. What we wish to know is, will there EVER be a MENA/Arabic world FOCUSED DLC
 
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All in all, it's a huge disappointment for many of us. What we wish to know is, will there EVER be a MENA/Arabic world FOCUSED DLC
? https://eu4.paradoxwikis.com/Cradle_of_Civilization

That's correct, barring minor adjustments or "continuations" of what we've shown (Such as mission trees we didn't fully show off) a vast majority of the nation-specific content has been already shown or directly mentioned in DDs.
Ah, that's dissapointing to hear. Thanks for the confirmation though. Like others have said, I wouldn't be opposed to a short delay for the dlc to add 3 or 4 more mission trees. I couldn't tell you if i'd make much business sense, but I think the community would largely appreciate it.
 
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They have names - Georgia and Armenia. Don't be biased man, not cool...
They don't get any significant (or at all!) buffs at the start. 99% of the time, only the human player will be able to "stream roll" through the fragile muslim world, as you "anticipate".

And mentioned "relevancy"... you have to be careful there - this is a double-edged sword - some would say (I think I would not - but this is a complex case) that arabic countries and the islamic world as a whole was in decline and "irrelevant" in the EU4 time period, since this was the time when european-centered colonialism and imperialism was born. Islamic "Golden age" was dead and gone (with last flare of the Ottobros till mid 17th century). I guess that's the reason why the game is named "Europa Universalis", afterall.
I like to think that history is a complex a thing, and I try not to jump to hasty conclusions and deem some countries and populations "irrelevant". But that's just me.
I expected a DLC of a region left untouched for years despite its importance, as they promised, they did not do that.

Saying 3 christian minors is not biased nor is it insulting. The steam rolling refers to the tree being lackluster, it's not interesting. The mission trees should be interesting, engaging and exploring alt history paths. These were basically "conquer ME.". This extends to the other trees, in comparison to prior DLCs, it feels the lack of flavour and mechanics.

There is no point to make here about relevancy, the DLC was middle east focused and they spent a lot of time on countries considered to be not in the middle east (1 is balkan, the other 2 are caucasian). Those should have been touched in an update for their appropriate region. Just see how people wish to get theodoro in this immersion pack that is centered on the middle east, last time I checked theodoro lies in eastern europe/pontic steppe. Besides if relevancy was such an important thing, I don't think a south america DLC would be necessary or atleast not for the native south americans. Neither would it have been necessary to update countries such as the teutonic order, molucca minors, native north americans,... after all they were not "relevant" in the grand scheme of things.

In the end it was a strawman, I never said those countries and populations are "irrelevant", they did not have relevancy in that time period. ;)
And dude, instead of the timurids they did byzantium...
 
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