Rex Germania - A Brandenburg to Prussia Strategy AAR

[HistoryDude]

Muscovy is going to be annoying. Maybe you could figure out a way to pit Poland-Lithuania against them somehow?

What does the game consider "attacking a member of the HRE"? How do alliances work for that? If you declare war on their ally, and they honor their alliance, does that count as "attacking you"? I wouldn't think so, but it would make life easier...

Are you planning on raising more armies and repairing forts during this war? Will you pay for that by robbing the Hanseatic League in the peace treaty?

 

[coz1]

Yeah, those loans are killers. I avoid them like the plague. But indeed, the best thing to do in order to get into the black is mothballs forts and perhaps destroy some military units that are costing maint. I really hate to lower maint. too because of what you noticed. But if you have to do it briefly, you can. Just be careful. And I agree with jak - never use harsh treatment. If you beat them, much of that risk goes away. At least for a time.

I would also agree on Lubeck to get rid of the trade embargo if you really need to go to war. Were I you, however, I would sit back and rest for a time more while loans are reduced and you are back to a more sturdy economy. I told you the early years of Brandenburg can seem very tedious.

 

[Rensslaer]

Probably better to mothball the non-trade ships (puts them at 0 maintenance and hull strength) and keep overall naval maintenance at 100 for your trade ships.

I did an open-mouthed gape at this suggestion, then went to look up how to do this. I've done it now -- 30 years in the future. Wish I'd known about this previously. This is why I value your advice!

Your merchant placement right now looks to be the best that it can be without further conquest. So, the only way to increase your income peacefully is to build more light ships for trade (a very good investment).

I find/found at some point that the barques/trade ships come to a point of diminishing returns, though, so I stopped building them. Even if I placed them in different CoTs it didn't seem to help.

I would ABSOLUTELY NOT be spending mil points on harsh treatment right now. It's much better to just fight the rebellion when it pops up. The exception to this rule is when something happens later in the game, but for now, do not do this.

<sighs> I'm slowly giving up this addiction to spending monarch points.

I'll mention this later in an update, but I think since I was learning on my own at first, I found all these opportunities to spend monarch points for stuff, and figured that was how to do things. In retrospect, after advice from you and others, I'm seeing these less as "levers" to be manipulated than as traps to be avoided. But this has been a hard sell over time, learning what not to use monarch points for.

If you click on Gotland, you can see if their government is a pirate republic (this lets them raid you) or a normal republic. Building a few galleys and giving them the mission to "hunt pirates" can protect your coasts from raiding.

Yes, Gotland was a pirate republic. I had also seen Scottish and English privateers operating as pirates previously, so I assume it was Gotland, but it might have been someone else.

Have you ever experimented with sending out privateers, and is it a way to earn (steal) ducats without angering neighbors? Or is there a catch, other than possibly having your ships sunk?

Muscovy is going to be annoying. Maybe you could figure out a way to pit Poland-Lithuania against them somehow?

What does the game consider "attacking a member of the HRE"? How do alliances work for that? If you declare war on their ally, and they honor their alliance, does that count as "attacking you"? I wouldn't think so, but it would make life easier...

@HistoryDude Oh, yes, we will see Poland-Lithuania in action soon enough.

So far as the HRE goes, if an HRE member attacks another HRE member, it's internecine warfare and is frowned upon by the Emperor and all other HRE members. So it ruins relationships and angers the Emperor, who will often ask you to return the provinces (which you can rather easily ignore, I've found).

But I believe if a non-HRE country attacks an HRE country, it can be considered an attack upon the whole HRE. Please correct me @jak7139 if this is incorrect.

Yeah, those loans are killers. I avoid them like the plague. But indeed, the best thing to do in order to get into the black is mothballs forts and perhaps destroy some military units that are costing maint. I really hate to lower maint. too because of what you noticed. But if you have to do it briefly, you can. Just be careful. And I agree with jak - never use harsh treatment. If you beat them, much of that risk goes away. At least for a time.

I would also agree on Lubeck to get rid of the trade embargo if you really need to go to war. Were I you, however, I would sit back and rest for a time more while loans are reduced and you are back to a more sturdy economy. I told you the early years of Brandenburg can seem very tedious.

@coz1 Also struggling to quit using loans to prop up my military. I'm sure if I had started out by setting a firm financial foundation I would have been better off by now, but having not done so (having, to some degree, figured that my financial situation would improve as I conquered territory) it's difficult. I keep finding that I'm required to "punch above my weight" with these wars, and without mercenaries it's difficult to do so.

Update hopefully coming within the week. Cannot promise. But thank you for your readership and comments!

We have two votes so far for Lubeck as the correct target to attack (see the final screenshot of the update above). Any more thoughts?

Rensslaer

 

[jak7139]

I find/found at some point that the barques/trade ships come to a point of diminishing returns, though, so I stopped building them. Even if I placed them in different CoTs it didn't seem to help.

There is a diminishing return on protecting trade with them. But having a fleet of them is still useful for solidifying control of your trade interests without conquest. Usually, once you have enough control in your home node, you just send the fleet to your next weakest node downstream and so on.

I'm seeing these less as "levers" to be manipulated than as traps to be avoided.

EU4 has a lot of buttons to click and is not very good at telling you what they do or which ones are worth it. It's something that comes with experience. If you play enough, you can plan ahead: "I should save my points for the next tech. I shouldn't click this button right now, etc."

Have you ever experimented with sending out privateers, and is it a way to earn (steal) ducats without angering neighbors? Or is there a catch, other than possibly having your ships sunk?

I've done a little bit with privateers, but not a lot. So most of this info is coming from the wiki (link to the wiki article that I got most of this info from).

When you normally protect trade, your ships are increasing your amount of trade power within the node you send them to. For privateers it is similar, however, you are not getting the trade power directly.

When privateering happens, the game creates an invisible "pirate" nation in the trade node. All trade power created by all privateering nations in the node is given to that nation. Then, the pirate nation gives the different privateering countries 50% of the income earned.

The "hunt pirates" button on your ships, is meant to counteract this (and stop raiding from countries like Gotland). If a privateering fleet and a hunting fleet meet, no battle takes place unless the two nations are at war. Hunting pirates also decreases the income you get from privateering. And there is an opinion malice with other countries for stealing their money (-1 opinion per month, capped at -100).

But I believe if a non-HRE country attacks an HRE country, it can be considered an attack upon the whole HRE. Please correct me @jak7139 if this is incorrect.

This is correct. If an outside nation attacks an HRE nation directly, it is considered an attack on the HRE. The Emperor, all his allies, plus the declared on nation and all of their allies will join (the Emperor can refuse the call to arms, but this comes with significant penalties to the Emperor. The AI will basically always aceept the CtA unless they are severely weakened).

But if an outside nation attacks an ally of an HRE nation (like your alliance with Hungary), then these rules do not apply. That is just a normal war. This is why allying nations outside of the HRE as a smaller power within it is a bad idea unless your ally is a superpower (Russia, France, Ottomans), or you are strong enough to hold your own.

I keep finding that I'm required to "punch above my weight" with these wars

This sounds a lot like how Prussia was historically. A small nation with a significant military who was able to beat much larger nations.

 

[Bullfilter]

Phew! Been a bit busy recently with RL (sport) and before that AAR writing (gotta keep the 4 AARs tended to) and reading. So a big catch-up post follows.

I realized, at this point, that any mercenary army would have to have about 3-4 months away from combat to come to full combat strength, just like any newly recruited army.

Good to know. Have got to 1700 in my first game and have never hired (or recall fighting) a mercenary army!

Naturally, there’s a temptation after such mistakes to reload and redo, but I hate doing that, and very rarely do.

Mistakes are part of the fun, especially for AAR's.

Defi agree. The AI usually needs the help. And it makes for good story drama!

Mercenariess and condottieri are two distinct things gameplay-wise, but yes are essentially the same. It's just a nation sending its own troops to help instead of the countryless mercenary companies.

Thanks for explaining.

up until a few years ago, mercenaries were 1000-strength units that you could "build" just like normal troops. They were just more expensive and didn't use manpower.

Ah, the exact same mechanic (no doubt related) that old EU Rome used.

Buhler and Cisielsky do both have siege pips though.

Hadn’t realised there were siege pips! I’ll have to take a look next time my game is fired up and start accounting for it.

those 17,000 strong stacks of allied armies pass by where they might be most useful. Grr… And I have a lot of my troops tied down in sieges, so they can’t wander the countryside like my enemy seems free to do

Where possible (and of course it isn’t sometimes) I generally prefer to break the back of the enemy’s military in the field before settling down to wholesale siege warfare, in CK2 as well.

You can tell vassals what to do on the vassal screen (located in the same area as your economy, stability, and diplomacy tabs). The other way, which includes allies, is to click on an enemy or occupied province while at war and set an objective for your ally/vassal to occupy the province. It usually works, but you never know with the AI.

Another new discovery for me. Thanks jak.

But what thoughts do you have on how I could improve trade more?

The trading system remains largely a black box to me so far.

I had been paying off loans (down to only 14 loans, from a high of 21!)

Wow! I think I may have drawn (or been forced to draw) one or two loans in my whole game so far - 21!? That’s amazing/terrifying!

We decided to build a couple “early carrack” ships (they might be the first in the Baltic!)

Useful, but as a Baltic power the galleys may be a good adjunct for the battle fleet.

Strategy Quiz: Who do you pick, and why?

I pick the top right screenshot to declare on Lubeck.

And, as you've already said, you can't take any land right now without angering everybody.

Me too, for the reasons jak gave.

You can also use the favors you've built up with your allies to ask for money from them.

Didn’t know that, either.

Yeah, those loans are killers. I avoid them like the plague.

Agree.

Good luck for the next part. I found with mine, if you want to benefit most from the advice (which I couldn’t get on time for the bulk of the AAR until I caught up the narrative in 1693), then it’s best to play and post in shorter sessions. But that may not suit.

 

[El Pip]

Have absolutely nothing to contribute on this but thought you might appreciate knowing you have some non-expert readers still gamely following along. Aside from the actual AAR chapters it is nice to see all the back and forth and discussion on game mechanics and buttons. No idea what most of it means, but it all seems jolly clever so I'm sure it must be helpful.

 

[Rensslaer]

There is a diminishing return on protecting trade with them. But having a fleet of them is still useful for solidifying control of your trade interests without conquest. Usually, once you have enough control in your home node, you just send the fleet to your next weakest node downstream and so on.

EU4 has a lot of buttons to click and is not very good at telling you what they do or which ones are worth it. It's something that comes with experience. If you play enough, you can plan ahead: "I should save my points for the next tech. I shouldn't click this button right now, etc."



This sounds a lot like how Prussia was historically. A small nation with a significant military who was able to beat much larger nations.

@jak7139 Brandenburg is in a tough place with the Baltic Sea traffic, I feel, because its primary node is landlocked Saxony. It has nodes all around it, but they're either controlled by enemies or they're flowing the wrong direction. You'll see how I adapt to this as the game goes on. But it's tricky.

I'm glad you feel (I think) like I'm playing the role of Brandenburg properly. It's a hungry, growing state that seeks to empower itself largely for self-protection reasons. It's surrounded by threats and the larger it grows the more it has control over its destiny. But perhaps this could be said of any country.

Phew! Been a bit busy recently with RL (sport) and before that AAR writing (gotta keep the 4 AARs tended to) and reading. So a big catch-up post follows.

Hadn’t realised there were siege pips! I’ll have to take a look next time my game is fired up and start accounting for it.

Where possible (and of course it isn’t sometimes) I generally prefer to break the back of the enemy’s military in the field before settling down to wholesale siege warfare, in CK2 as well.

@Bullfilter thank you so much for your readership, and that goes for everybody else as well. I know it's a commitment to read through these detailed AARs, and I appreciate your time! How is your team doing?

Yes, the siege pips are important for taking those walls down.

And I'm sure you're right about destroying the enemy before settling in for a siege. In general I try to make sure the really big stacks are contained before I settle into sieges (many of which require a large army anyway - enough to withstand a typical enemy attack). Sometimes the enemy is tied down in sieges of their own, so I don't worry about them so much. Other times I'll send armies to cause trouble and try to draw them out of their sieges, which the AI will sometimes take the hint.

Wow! I think I may have drawn (or been forced to draw) one or two loans in my whole game so far - 21!? That’s amazing/terrifying!


Good luck for the next part. I found with mine, if you want to benefit most from the advice (which I couldn’t get on time for the bulk of the AAR until I caught up the narrative in 1693), then it’s best to play and post in shorter sessions. But that may not suit.

Well, I know loans are a handicap, and I know they can become a down-and-out curse. I KNOW that, as a player and as a strategist. And still sometimes I find that I will choose the mercenary army over not taking a loan because the circumstances appear to warrant. Yes, they terrify me also!

For me, it takes an entirely different mindset to play the game (I can do so for 5 minutes at 3 am if I'm up for something) versus writing an AAR. I know I did one AAR (Sforza!!! for EU 3) where I'd take screenshots as I played and make notes to follow later. Generally I do not do that, so my AAR writing and playtime are entirely separate. I had started where I was only about 5-6 years ahead of the AAR in gameplay but now I've found myself 30 years (at one point -- 20 years now) ahead, so you'll see advice from a couple weeks back finally adapted into gameplay.

Have absolutely nothing to contribute on this but thought you might appreciate knowing you have some non-expert readers still gamely following along. Aside from the actual AAR chapters it is nice to see all the back and forth and discussion on game mechanics and buttons. No idea what most of it means, but it all seems jolly clever so I'm sure it must be helpful.

@El Pip I really do appreciate that you're reading even though you're not familiar with the game! I always appreciate your comments. I do hope you'll take a look at EU IV sometime -- the EU series is one that I've found quite amazing, even though my personal historical interests are more in line with Victoria or HOI.


Two closing comments:

1) I have an update ready to post. I will probably post it midday Atlantic Coast time in the US. This will take us through the first half of this war.

2) I want to remind you to please vote in the Q1-2024 AARLand Choice AwAARds! As always, I don't pressure or expect any of my readers to vote for this work. I'll encourage of course. But we have a LOT of talented writers, quite a large number of them right here in the EU IV section, and so I appreciate any votes that I get, but I also want to make sure that other deserving folks get votes for their works also. That's what keeps everybody encouraged and active.

Thank you! Be back with you in a few hours, here.

Rensslaer

 

[Rensslaer]

Okay… So at the end of the last update I asked which of those four targets would you expect me to declare war upon? Which, in other words, would make the most sense (I think this is a valid link for you to look back).

You unanimously – among those who said so – chose Lubeck, primarily because it had the smallest set of allies to fight, with the fewest amount of troops (30,000 under arms at start, compared to my 17,000 plus allies).

And, yes, that is a valid choice, with valid reasoning. Does it surprise you that it’s not the choice I made?

Honestly, I didn’t like the choices for Lubeck, between Humiliate and Superiority in Trade Dispute. Maybe it’s partly because I don’t fully understand the implications of each. But ideally I wanted to take that Center of Trade, which would involve annexing Lubeck. That wasn’t on the table. So I went with a second choice.







If you look back at the graphic at the end of the last update, the obvious bad choices were Anhalt, who was additionally allied with Brunswick (adding only 4,000 more soldiers, but I wasn’t sure if they could start calling their allies in, like last time), and Hamburg, which was allied with Austria, which could also call in Sweden and Mecklenburg and Munich and Naples and Lucca and Naples. Suffice it to say that all that daisy chain of alliances would have increased my enemies from 30,000 to 107,000!!! And that’s assuming they didn’t start hiring mercenaries. Eesh! I didn’t want to even think about that. I suspect declaring against Bremen was similar.

So Oldenburg it was. It’s drawing in Gelre (part of the present-day Netherlands), but it only increased the troopcount from 30,000 to 35,000, and I suppose I figured that didn’t sound like too much more. I chose to call in Berg, Magdeburg, Luneburg and Ansbach to help me, which gave us 7,000 more soldiers than our enemies in this war. Oldenburg in the shot above is the country circled in red, and Bremen, Hamburg and Lubeck are circled in yellow. Gelre is outside of shot to the west, Rugen is the island just offshore from Brandenburg to the north, and Anhalt is just south of Brandenburg (the last 3 are all outside of the screenshot).

My primary goal at war start was to acquire Rugen and Anhalt as vassals, and perhaps others (see! By this time I at least was thinking in terms of vassals instead of outright annexation…. Except for Lubeck. Anyway…).

So that’s the setup. It sounded simple. It even started off simple, as you will see. But it got confusing quick!









In the first 2 months of the war, four battles took three whole armies completely off the board!

The entire army of Anhalt surrendered 19 July. The Battle of Lubeck was won 5 August, the survivors pursued to Hamburg, and the rest of the army surrendered to Prince-Elector Friedrich II on 13 August. Meanwhile, Duke Friedrich of Hohenzollern, the Elector’s heir, relieved our allied capital of Berg from a small siege by Oldenburg, and the entire Oldenburgian army surrendered to him on 26 August.

In these first two months, we’d eliminated nearly 17,000 of our opposing soldiers for the loss of only 4,200 of our soldiers. We also had two enemy capitals under siege (we didn’t have the resources to besiege Hamburg and still maintain the initiative against the remaining enemy). We’d already developed 7% Warscore. But the cost of making even just Rugen a vassal was 18%.

Duke Friedrich moved his army to take Rugen next.

In other consequential news, in September 1476 the Ottoman Empire also declared war upon Poland and Lithuania.







Could the Polish/Lithuanian Empire fight off both Hungary and the Ottomans, at the same time??

In October the Rugenese army was also taken off the board – another 3,000 troops for the loss of only 250 Brandenburgers. The Duke then left a token force to siege the island city and marched for Anhalt, where the walls had already been breached. In December 1476 he assaulted the fortress and forced its surrender. I am always braced for mass casualties when I assault a fort, but this wasn’t terrible.

Feeling like things were going pretty well, overall, we decided that a lot of our troops were tied up in sieges, and we needed more troops to pursue offensive moves. We hired two mercenary companies, which unfortunately would require time to form up and then time to get up to combat readiness, so wouldn’t be available for combat for some time still.

In January Duke Friedrich decides to take more of the enemy soldiers off the board with a swift attack with overwhelming force (15,000 against 3,000) in mid-February.









Unfortunately there had been other enemy armies lurking nearby outside of our awareness, and they dogpiled in. Soon the Duke was fighting 24,000 enemy with 15,000!

Some Magdeburgian allies came to assist, and the Duke believed it might be possible to achieve some good result from this large combat – sapping the enemy strength, perhaps? But alas, it only sapped us more. By 8 March the allies agreed to give up and retreat, having lost 7,000 soldiers for the destruction of 4,000 of the enemy. It was already a dark day for Duke Friedrich, but on that same day word reached him….



GASP!!!











His father, Prince-Elector Friedrich II “Irontooth” had succumbed to a pestilence during the prolonged siege of Lubeck. Thus Prince-Elector Friedrich III succeeded to the throne and the Electorship. A period of mourning was ordered, throughout the land, but the fighting continued. And there was a succession concern which I believe Friedrich III essentially blew off, which irritated the Emperor but improved the country's internal tension (+1 stability, +10 prestige, relations improved with the Ansbach relatives).

There was nothing for it.

Prince-Elector Friedrich had other business to attend to. He married Renata of Wurttemburg to solidify and renew that alliance.

Around the world, Burgundy defeated the English along the English Channel ports of France, acquiring the entire coastline from Brittany to Flanders!









In April 14,000 of the enemy besieged Braunschweig. This was not an immediate concern – it would hold out for some time, and at least this kept their troops where we could find them.

Meanwhile, I looked to note how our mercenaries were affecting our economy. I’ve hired two companies – the Schwartze Garde and Grand Company, both with 9,000 soldiers. I’m spending 20 ducats a month for being over my force limit (42,000 soldiers vs. a forcelimit of 22) and another 5 ducats a month for the mercenaries’ pay. Hmm… Need to finish this war quickly – we cannot afford this.

The good news is all of my armies are back up to combat readiness and are moving from the Berlin area toward Brunswick and beyond.

When they made it to Braunschweig on 3 July they – 28,000 strong – fell upon the 16,000 Bremeners, Hamburgers and Gelreans encamped around the city. The campaign lasted 3 weeks, and the combat was at times very intense.







On 16 July Rugen opened their gates and surrendered. And on 25 July the Brandenburgers and Magdeburgers had their victory at Braunschweig – 9,000 enemy casualties vs. 7,000 allied. Not a great margin, but a gain, to be sure.

By August the siege at Lubeck had advanced to minus 14% chance of surrender (it’s been a long haul since we cannot blockade the city) and one of our armies from Braunschweig has followed the Bremener army home where they defeated the demoralized army and forced the surrender of its entire 3,000 complement. A siege at Bremen began (at -57% -- again, due to no blockade).

Total warscore is 18%, with 6% of that from won battles, the rest from holding Anhalt and Rugen.

Our economy continues to slide, from the outrageous deficits being tacked up from the mercenary armies (who, fortunately, are winning our war).

Finally in September Lubeck gets to 7% chance of surrender.

And let us step out from our war again to witness another of the great moments of history. It’s September 1477. The Burgundian Succession, where the Duke of Brittany has inherited the throne of Burgundy and they enter a Personal Union. At the same time most of the Lowlands – Holland, Brabant, and Flanders also become personal territories of the Duke of Brittany.







This causes an Imperial Incident. If I’m reading the screenshots correctly (as I don’t recall) I believe Brandenburg went with “abandon the claims” which basically undercuts Austria (the Emperor) and lets him deal with this as he sees fit, without Brandenburg’s help (we’ve got enough on our plate already).

By February 1478 it would result in war between Austria and the Brittanic/Burgundian alliance.

And this is as good a place as any to take a breather. Another update in a week or so, I expect, to finish out this war.

Thoughts?

 

[El Pip]

@El Pip I really do appreciate that you're reading even though you're not familiar with the game! I always appreciate your comments. I do hope you'll take a look at EU IV sometime -- the EU series is one that I've found quite amazing, even though my personal historical interests are more in line with Victoria or HOI.

I picked up EUIV in an Epic giveaway awhile ago, but sadly it was only the base game and the several hundred pounds necessary to get all the expansions is off-putting. Even the basic bare minimum you need to make it worth playing (according to Paradox) starter pack is £75, which also seem a bit steep.

But what of Brandenburg? Another expensive war and again the slight feeling that it's not really worth it. Maybe it is, but all the debts being racked up seem to take ages to pay off and maybe that money could be put to better use on developing what you already have? Or at least hiring mercenaries in advance to increase the chance of the 'quick cheap' wins you probably need rather than these slow and expensive dragged out conflicts.

That said there do seem to be several big wars kicking off all around you, so will this small conflict really matter compared to the big Ottoman-PLC and Burgundian-HRE wars. Not idea, seems like it shouldn't but perhaps due to game mechanics it will.

 

[coz1]

I have to say, that is a new one - Brittany in PU with Burgundy. That could turn out interesting.

As to the war and/or economy. Part the reason I really suggested perhaps waiting. For me, the budget is everything. Loans? It is not just paying them back. It is the amount of interest paid each month that cause a negative effect in the balance. So too now with mercs. I may be in the minority, but I don't DoW if I don't think I can take them without mercs. They are a luxury or perhaps a last ditch effort to stave off defeat.

 

[jak7139]

In the first 2 months of the war, four battles took three whole armies completely off the board!

A good start!

Around the world, Burgundy defeated the English along the English Channel ports of France, acquiring the entire coastline from Brittany to Flanders!

One of the larger Burgundys I've seen. An impressive achievement.

Our economy continues to slide, from the outrageous deficits being tacked up from the mercenary armies (who, fortunately, are winning our war).

They are winning your war. But perhaps hiring two companies was overkill?

By February 1478 it would result in war between Austria and the Brittanic/Burgundian alliance.

I hope Brittany wins this. A weaker Emperor would be good for you and Burgundy/Brittany is far away.

I may be in the minority, but I don't DoW if I don't think I can take them without mercs. They are a luxury or perhaps a last ditch effort to stave off defeat.

I'm of the same mind as well usually. The exceptions are when my economy can handle more mercs, or that the enemy is distracted/in a weakened state but I still need mercs to win. Sometimes the diplomacy just works out that way and you need mercs to shake things up.

 

[Bullfilter]

In the first 2 months of the war, four battles took three whole armies completely off the board!

As others have said, a good start.

in September 1476 the Ottoman Empire also declared war upon Poland and Lithuania.

That seems to be their national pastime!

Unfortunately there had been other enemy armies lurking nearby outside of our awareness, and they dogpiled in. Soon the Duke was fighting 24,000 enemy with 15,000!

Well, at least they put up a fight. Were you generally aware such numbers were out there somewhere, or was it a genuine surprise?

It was already a dark day for Duke Friedrich, but on that same day word reached him….



GASP!!!

Well, that was a double blow.

Burgundy defeated the English along the English Channel ports of France, acquiring the entire coastline from Brittany to Flanders!

An interesting development. Can’t help but think a powerful Burgundy that helps contain France for a while and balances Austria seems a fairly good thing.

I’m spending 20 ducats a month for being over my force limit (42,000 soldiers vs. a forcelimit of 22) and another 5 ducats a month for the mercenaries’ pay. Hmm… Need to finish this war quickly – we cannot afford this.

What was your rough treasury and income/monthly balance at that point?

When they made it to Braunschweig on 3 July they – 28,000 strong – fell upon the 16,000 Bremeners, Hamburgers and Gelreans encamped around the city. The campaign lasted 3 weeks, and the combat was at times very intense.

This seemed to signal the righting of the ship of state.

It’s September 1477. The Burgundian Succession, where the Duke of Brittany has inherited the throne of Burgundy and they enter a Personal Union. At the same time most of the Lowlands – Holland, Brabant, and Flanders also become personal territories of the Duke of Brittany.

As above, even more so.

I may be in the minority, but I don't DoW if I don't think I can take them without mercs.

Same here as well, in my very limited, part of one game experience - having never hired a mercenary army by 1700!

In general, things still seem to be on track - if the economy doesn’t collapse!

 

[The Kingmaker]

All caught up again. So I haven’t played a lot of EU, which leads me to a random question: I noticed that for each of your potential wars, the enemy was allied with Hamburg. Since the reason not to go to war with Hamburg was to avoid their daisy-chain of powerful allies, wouldn’t they all be brought in no matter what if Hamburg decided to support their ally? Or are only direct allies brought into a conflict, not allies of allies?

 

[Bullfilter]

All caught up again. So I haven’t played a lot of EU, which leads me to a random question: I noticed that for each of your potential wars, the enemy was allied with Hamburg. Since the reason not to go to war with Hamburg was to avoid their daisy-chain of powerful allies, wouldn’t they all be brought in no matter what if Hamburg decided to support their ally? Or are only direct allies brought into a conflict, not allies of allies?

It varies depending on the nature of the war and the DoW terms, iirc. The DoW screen details who will do what before you click the button.

 

[jak7139]

Or are only direct allies brought into a conflict, not allies of allies?

It varies depending on the nature of the and the DoW terms, iirc.

Yes, that's correct. When declaring war, it only brings in the direct allies of the nation.

Two exceptions exist: If an outside nation attacks into the HRE, the Emperor gets to call all of their allies as well, even if not directly declared on. The second exception is something any nation can do. When declaring war, you can set which enemy nations also get to call their allies in. This makes their land cheaper to take (removes the penalties for taking land from a secondary participant, bringing the costs down to normal levels), with the drawback being that you are now fighting more people.

 

[Lord Durham]

When they made it to Braunschweig on 3 July they – 28,000 strong – fell upon the 16,000 Bremeners, Hamburgers and Gelreans encamped around the city. The campaign lasted 3 weeks, and the combat was at times very intense.

Glad you used the term campaign. One force engaging another force in a given province does not result in a battle lasting several weeks. Prior to WWI the longest battle was likely Gettysburg at 3 days. That was an outlier. The Battle of Vienna (1683) lasted some 14 hours. Also rare. Most engagements usually ran a few hours to barely surviving contact. I've always written these contests as campaigns, meaning maneuvers, skirmishes, recon, a major battle or two, chasing down a beaten enemy or running for the hills. I realize it's just a game thing to call all conflicts a battle, but from a narrative POV there's quite a distinction. Anyway, that's my minor nit and I'm sticking to it .

 

[HistoryDude]

Hopefully Brandenburg gets some new vassals out of this.

Burgundy-Brittany is new. Can they fight off Austria? If they can, will they go after France?

 

[Historywhiz]

Hopefully Brandenburg gets some new vassals out of this.

Burgundy-Brittany is new. Can they fight off Austria? If they can, will they go after France?

Brittany is one of the more sensible pairings for The Burgundian Inheritance. I’ve seen Scotland, I’ve seen Cleves, I’ve seen Oldenburg and Milan and The Palatinate. Heck I’ve even seen Hungary!

 

[VILenin]

And, yes, that is a valid choice, with valid reasoning. Does it surprise you that it’s not the choice I made?

Subverting our expectations, as ever, I see.

So that’s the setup. It sounded simple. It even started off simple, as you will see. But it got confusing quick!

A succinct a description of EUIV wars in general, it feels like, although maybe that's just me!

Hungary and the Ottomans working together feels odd, even if teaming up against the P-L Commonwealth makes a certain amount of sense. Hopefully both sides bleed each other badly while accomplishing very little.

I picked up EUIV in an Epic giveaway awhile ago, but sadly it was only the base game and the several hundred pounds necessary to get all the expansions is off-putting. Even the basic bare minimum you need to make it worth playing (according to Paradox) starter pack is £75, which also seem a bit steep.

I'm in the same boat. I've owned EUIV for years now, but the massive amount of dlc for the game is daunting. Even with the dlc subscription option to make it more affordable, the sheer amount of content in the game now is rather overwhelming. I have very mixed feelings about the non-stop stream of dlc attached to Paradox games these days.

(Boy, do I sound old saying that.)

On the one hand, if Id been playing EUIV or HOI4 since launch, the steady addition of new content would probably be welcome to give me new ways to play the game and new mechanics to engage with. But as someone who likes to check-in with a game every couple years or so, I feel like I'm constantly being asked to both buy and learn a whole new game. I feel this most acutely with Stellaris. I love the base game, but I semi-dread every time I return to it, knowing I'm going to have to learn/relearn large swathes of the game.

Anyway, enough of that.

@Rensslaer Do you have a horse in the Burgundian Inheritance war? I imagine you're not overly worried about Austria itself, given that you're likely to run into conflict with them at some point, but would Brittany draw Burgundy out of the HRE? For that matter, how interested are you in preserving the HRE? Is angling for Emperor part of the long-term goals at the moment?

 

[Rensslaer]

Quick partial feedback since 2 readers have brought up the EU IV DLC thing...

@El Pip and @VILenin have you looked into the "subscription" service on Steam? I posted before starting this AAR and asked which DLCs I would really need, and which I could skip. More than one user replied back that it made more sense to do the subscription, which provides access to ALL of the DLCs (even the new ones).

The subscription is $5/mo or $15/qtr (there may be a slight savings for the quarter -- like maybe it's $12/qtr). And considering that I only play one of these games at a time and I don't want to spend the huge outlay (same as you) to catch up on all the DLCs, I figured this was worth it and relatively affordable.

True, at the end of the year I've spent $50-60 without actually buying any of the DLCs permanently, but I've enjoyed the playing all through, and if I want to play it again, or want to switch to a different Paradox game, I simply continue the subscription (or switch to a different one, if I want to switch games).

I wasn't really sure how much I would like EU IV. I, also, bought it when it first came out and then didn't play for a decade. lol But now that I'm playing I'm having a blast (it's kind of addictive) and thinking of all the other scenarios I could have fun playing.

Rensslaer