Hello Ciccillo. Do you think this mod would be compatible with "Cultures and portraits revamp" and "ARKO's armories"?
Thanks in advance.
Thanks in advance.
In Novo Iure: Dynamic de jure structure and improved cultural toponymy
- Thread starter Ciccillo Rre
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Hello!
The mod is not in line of principle compatible with "Cultures and portraits revamp" as both touch the common/cultures files. However, you can play with both mods by deleting the common/cultures folder of In Novo Iure. The only practical consequence of this is that new Welsh and Breton dynastic names will take whatever denomination CPR gives them (the other change I made on the original culture file is to give the persian gfx clause to the turkish culture, but this practically irrelevant if you use another graphical mod).
The mod is not in line of principle either compatible with "ARKO's armories", as both mods touch the common/dynasties and common/religions files. Similarly, you can delete these from my mod and have more anglicised or gallicized Celtic dynastic names, and the original 1.103 colors of Orthodox religions on the religion map. Also, both mods affect the gfx/flags folder; again you should simply delete that folder from my mod and use ARKO's flags instead.
You should be fine using my mod with only the landed_titles.txt file and the localization, plus of course the history files.
Is de jure Empire of Tartaria effected? It's not exactly historically relevant since Tartary covered a massively larger amount of land area than in game. Plus it was only a reference name.
Yes, it now includes the duchies of Perm and Derbent (the latter with revised borders) but excludes the duchies of Cherson and Crimea. However, it changes dynamically over time; please see the maps in the first posts.
Sounds really good Ciccillo Rre, i'll download and see if i can merge it with my current game ok 
So i don't have any feedback yet, but just fyi the links in your second post:
Umayyad Al-Andalus, 867
A Welsh/Cambrian/Briton Conqueror of England/Logres, 1066
Those two both don't seem to be working currently?
Edit: One question/thing to look at maybe.
Edit2: It's ok you can ignore this as i see your mod did not change anything here, so something i can look to mod myself
As Rhodri The Great (north wales leader) the default game has him have a claim on 'Duchy of the Isles', which has no De Jure holdings and does not seem to be active in the game? Has this been fixed changed in your mod?
So i don't have any feedback yet, but just fyi the links in your second post:
Umayyad Al-Andalus, 867
A Welsh/Cambrian/Briton Conqueror of England/Logres, 1066
Those two both don't seem to be working currently?
Edit: One question/thing to look at maybe.
Edit2: It's ok you can ignore this as i see your mod did not change anything here, so something i can look to mod myself
As Rhodri The Great (north wales leader) the default game has him have a claim on 'Duchy of the Isles', which has no De Jure holdings and does not seem to be active in the game? Has this been fixed changed in your mod?
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Interesting mod, though there are compromises. For instance the duchy of Holstein should be a part of the German kingdom and the HRE, at least since 1111, if you want to be accurate. Likewise the duchy of Carinthia was a part of the German Kingdom, not the kingdom of Italy. Carinthia was since 976 a duchy of the German Kingdom and since 743 it fell under the suzerainity of the ruler of Bavaria and it went to East Francia in 843 (treaty of Verdun).
Great! Let me know!Sounds really good Ciccillo Rre, i'll download and see if i can merge it with my current game ok
Weird, I see the latter but not the former. Also, one of the maps seems to be missing. I'll check this out at some point.
I plan on not making changes to the characters and history files, except for the "de_jure_liege" clauses, otherwise updating the mod to new versions of CK2 will become to cumbersome.
I agree. Holstein should perhaps be under Germany in 1066, although that would give the Kaiser a free CB on a legitimately Danish province (weakening Denmark too much).
As for Carinthia, that is one of my greatest problems. The issue is that Aquileia and western Friuli belong de jure to Italy throughout the time period. I hope they will revise the provinces layout in that area at some point. I still haven't found a satisfying enough compromise; we'll see in future version what can be done. For instance, I am thinking about putting Italy into Francia in 867 and Carinthia into Bavaria in 867 (and later into Germany). In 1187, the Empire of Italia would stretch from the Alps to Sicily and Carinthia may be by that time under Italy. I will think about it, and I am open to suggestions.
Holstein was split between Denmark, the Wends and the German Kingdom (Saxons), so it was as much a legitimate part of Denmark as a part of these other two.
Regarding difficult borders, something similar applies to Aprutium (Abruzzo region), which by the treaty of Benevento of 1156 became a part of the kingdom of Sicily and later Naples (Peninsular Sicily), however that doesn't apply to Spoleto.
Regarding Carinthia, Aquileia was a part of the margraviate of Verona, so you could transfer Aquileia to the 'duchy' (since it actually was margraviate) of Verona; then what's left of Carinthia can and IMHO should go the German Kingdom. Then Steiermark could be transferred to Carinthia and Passau, though the name suggest otherwise, but roughly half of the holdings correspond with Upper Austria and the other half with Bavaria. In general the province set up in this region in vanilla (like in more parts of the HRE) is not ideal, judging from screenshots of EU IV at least for Austria that is much better there.
Trentino was since 951/952 a part of the German Kingdom (it was one of the rare territorial transfers between the kingdom of Italy and the German Kingdom) and should (IMHO) be united with Tirol in one duchy. Salzburg OTOH should IMHO be a part Bavaria, not Tirol.
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Went fine, i had to blend some of your mod with files i'm working on, so i can't use it as a default separate mod, but it now very much part of my build and i'm really liking what i see in terms of the name changes and different culture language usage. Awesome stuff and adds a lot of flavour.
It's working fine with the other two mods i do use:
Subjugation CB Nerf by trias10:
http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?692991-Mini-Mod-Subjugation-CB-Nerf-for-1.10
And the 'Almendra' map font used in Decorus Visum by ancestral:
http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?649962-MOD-Decorus-Visum
Ok the link that was a missing map (A Welsh/Cambrian/Briton Conqueror of England/Logres, 1066) is now fine. The issue with the first link on that same page (Umayyad Al-Andalus, 867) is still there for me. I click on the 'show' button and it changes to 'hide' but unlike the rest of the links no map is displayed? maybe check if others have the same issue as me, if not then it might just be at my end?
Yeah i realised after i posted and had got your mod up and running that this was not part of what you were doing! So don't worry about it, it's not a huge issue at all
And thanks to you and whomever helped you, playing as i do mostly in 'Brettaniai' all the place names now really reflect the cultural differences during the time of the game (much more than the vanilla game for sure!), and as a welshman, i'm pleased to see this later (Danish/Saxon) term for the people of Cymru is now replaced with a more believable alternative (Cambrian) for the time period. Great work and it adds hugely to the enjoyment of my game.
I had Aquileia and Trent in the duchy of Verona, but what was left of the duchy of Carinthia together with Steiermark looked very weird on every de jure map, like an improper appendix of Germany. I decided to remove it, but no solution is ideal. I am still thinking about it, I hope they will redesign the map in the area. Maybe if we make a petition...
On the other hand, I'd not join Trent with Tyrol as at least in vanilla Trent is disconnected from the rest of the duchy by the mountain barrier. I still see it as more italian in nature as a province.
I'm very happy that you enjoyed it! Actually, you being a welshman, as long as you speak Welsh I'd be happy if you made comments on the work by me and Yakdast: we have lots of room for improvement!
And I am glad that you were able to merge this with other mods, it's supposed to be compatibility-friendly. I'm planning to release a "light" version, with even less files affected, for 1.11.
I'm very happy that you enjoyed it! Actually, you being a welshman, as long as you speak Welsh I'd be happy if you made comments on the work by me and Yakdast: we have lots of room for improvement!
Well it all looks fine so far, nothing stands out, but if i notice anything i'll let you know. Oh, one thing. Is the size of the text in a given province controlled by your mod at all, is that all game engine stuff? I ask as, for example, 'Morgannwg' (in place of Glamorgan), and 'Heortfordscir' (in place of Herefordshire) have really small text! You basically can't easily read them on the map unless zoomed right in. Does your mod control that at all?
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Just some general rambling on the 'welsh' stuff:
'Welsh' is the name that the saxons and danes (Offa's lot etc) gave to the people they encountered when they first came to Britain, in the german root tongue 'welsh' ('Walha' - Germanic and 'Welisc', 'Wealh' Old English/'Walsche', 'Walisch' Middle English) meant 'foreigner' or 'stranger'. It probably wasn't used widely until about the 4th or 5th century during the Germanic (this is Danes too) influx into the British Isles.
The people before these influxes probably thought of themselves as Britons (Brythoniaid/Brythonic, rather than welsh, as that would have been a derogatory term to start with) and maybe as the Britons found themselves being pushed back and ousted from their power bases and lands (thus 'Brittany' in france and links to the Basque region), the terms of Cymru and Cumbria came about. John Davies (his book, 'A history of wales' is good) mentions the first use of the term 'Kymry' in a poem around the 7th century, and it was used to represent the 'homeland' of the people that would come to call themselves Welsh.
I have no issue with the 'welsh' starting out in the early game (867 ad) as 'Cambrian'(or 'Brythonic' perhaps more accurately?), but that should shift to 'Welsh' by a later date (if it does not currently in your mod - i haven't played much of it yet!)? Depending on who you read, this shift happened, when the people started to refer to themselves as 'Welsh', between the 5th and 10th centuries! Quite a spread.
As a gameplay mechanic in the game, much like the emergence of 'english' in place of anglo-saxon, you could either have this trigger by a set date (hmm between 900 and 1000 ad perhaps?) or perhaps have it trigger with the creation of the Welsh Kingdom title? Those are very gamey options (compared to the history), but maybe a fun way to introduce the shift? I'm not sure what happens in your mod on this point so far, do the 'welsh' stay as 'Cambrian' throughout the game?
Sounds interesting, i'll certainly look forward to something like that.
Unfortunately, this is out of my control, and I guess it's hardcoded.
Thanks for your discussion on the denomination of the Welsh, I was well aware of the issue (hence I chose 'Cambrian' as their name, unfortunately it cannot change dynamically) but other people may be interested and I am totally convinced it is something that people should know more about, in general.
A possibility to solve the issue would be to have one unique culture that merges the Bretons and the Welsh (including the people of Strathclyde) in 867, say the 'Britons'. At some point (say in 900, or in 950) however a process of cultural split akin to the one that affects the Norse culture starts. We may make a petition to the devs for them to include it, or we can mod it. However I am not going to do this for the moment as it involves touching the characters files, hence making the mod updates a hell. We will see.
Gah! well no big deal but it is a shame that some of the new awesome names you have used do not always show as clearly as they should due to this. Oh and just a question, i mentioned 'Heortfordscir' (in place of Herefordshire) and was just wondering if this IS the correct name for that region? As there is in fact a 'Hertfordshire' today which is over to the east (north of London more or less) and not related to Herefordshire at all. I don't know the historic names, but the one you currently use for Herefordshire might be for Hertfordshire?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Hertfordshire
Hmm. I'll have a look at the code that starts to change the Anglo-Saxons to English once the Normans arrive in 1066, as i think we could use that for the same type of affect here?
I would say the Bretons in Brittany need to stay 'Breton'.
The Bretons in Cornwall need to become 'Cornish' (much as the Anglo-Saxons become english), and probably stay that way even if under de jure control by wales or either the more historically correct english.
The 'welsh' culture in south west Scotland is interesting, keeping in mind it was the Irish that influenced much of that region:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/legacies/immig_emig/scotland/western/article_1.shtml
So i'd need to read up more on that welsh connection, but those people need to drift to 'Scottish' at some point.
Oh i hear you! I currently have over 30 files modded, that all need readjustment each time a new patch comes out, or i add a mod etc. It can get too much work, so i understand the desire to simplify things.
The county of Herefordshire will receive the name of Hereforscir for the Anglo-Saxons and the Norse in the next version, thanks for pointing out the mistake. The associated barony of Hereford will not change its name for the Anglo-Saxon and the Norse.
As for the Briton/Welsh(/Breton?) cultural shift, I think the wisest thing to do is to work it out at a more mature stage of the development of CK2.
Does this work with the normal version of Portrait Realignment Pack? If not, can you PM me your version and tell me the differences?
The differences (with respect to the full version of PRP) are that the Persians and the Turks look like in Vanilla (but the Turkish holdings pictures are the same as the Persians'). The Bulgarians, Vlachs and Serbians look like the Byzantines. Also, the Anglo-Saxon never get differently looking holdings pictures, regardless of their religion.
I can send you my version if you want if you send me your email address via PM. If you prefer the full version of PRP, it should work fine with my mod as long as you do the following: in the cultures.txt file, substitute all the words "turkishgfx" with "steppegfx". After you have done this, if you still want the Turks to have the steppe holding graphics, substitute "persiangfx" with "turkishgfx". Please let me know if you have any problem. I actually have made these changes for the mod to work as a stand-alone without PRP, as PRP includes this graphical-cultural "steppe" type that does not exist for the moment in vanilla.
"the Byzantine Empire is the 'Empire of the Romans'"
Shouldn't that just be for the Greek culture(or all Romaic cultures)? Most other cultures didn't recognise them as the true successor.
Shouldn't that just be for the Greek culture(or all Romaic cultures)? Most other cultures didn't recognise them as the true successor.
I thought about what to do with that. I'd like the de jure area to be the "Romania" as it was called like that by the Franks as well (despite they didn't think it was the actual successor of the Roman Empire), but importantly it was deemed as such by the Persians, Arabs and Turks as well. There are technical problems with the short vs. long form of the name that must be homogeneous as well as with the specific title of the Emperor that I have to resolve before finding a more suitable compromise.
For instance I'm thinking on having a general "Empire of Romania" that is called though "Rhomania" if Greek (Romaic) with the title of the Emperor being in that case "Basileus of the Romans".
The reason why I haven't decided yet is that I am planning on finding a symmetrical solution for the HRE as well, but I expect Paradox to release a DLC specifically geared towards the HRE, so I'd better wait and see for the moment.