Home Trending Latest threads New posts Developer diaries

HIP Release - 2019-12-20 [Frosty1]

Jump to latest Follow Reply
  • We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Crusader Kings II 69871 Bug Reports 19708 User Modifications 10589 Suggestions 5969 Tech Support 6362 After Action Reports
Notary said:
I just had a very pleasant campaign where I tried to collect as much artifacts as possible but now they are practically worthless to me.
Click to expand...

... you do realize this new version is not save-compatible with previous versions, right?

And even if it were, nobody's stopping you from finishing up a campaign on an older version. It just means you won't be able to play Deus Ex Artifactae going forward, similar to how Deus Ex Sanguinas strategies were eliminated in earlier versions of HIP. Just add it to the list of HIP's anti-snowballing efforts, alongside Imperial Decay, dynamic levies, CB restrictions, retraction of Eldership succession from unreformed Baltic pagans, the aforementioned bloodline nerfs (+ the fact that historical bloodlines deactivate if you don't belong to a certain culture), the severe nerfs to troop stat boosts from religions, the trade post limit changes for MRs... you get the idea.

As for the Supernatural Events thing, I frankly do not believe it would be worth the amount of time and work needed to have unrealistic-boosting and realistic-boosting versions of basically every single artifact. The Holy Grail is easy because the artifact can only be gotten by a single event (so you just need to put a single rule-check into a single event and you're good), it does not interact with other events once it spawns (like the way e.g. the Reichskrone and the Imperial Diadem do), and the supernatural effect itself is about as harmless as you can get from a snowballing perspective (bonus Health just makes you current character not die as early from a natural death, but it doesn't prevent the usual age-related penalties from taking hold even if you do live longer, and sometimes you don't really want to live as long with your character as you'd end up living). If you feel like you have the time to spare though and this issue is important to you, feel free to make a submod that does the whole artifact-boosts-types-gated-by-rule thing you're talking about.
 
  • 1
Reactions:
Delnar_Ersike said:
... you do realize this new version is not save-compatible with previous versions, right?

And even if it were, nobody's stopping you from finishing up a campaign on an older version. It just means you won't be able to play Deus Ex Artifactae going forward, similar to how Deus Ex Sanguinas strategies were eliminated in earlier versions of HIP. Just add it to the list of HIP's anti-snowballing efforts, alongside Imperial Decay, dynamic levies, CB restrictions, retraction of Eldership succession from unreformed Baltic pagans, the aforementioned bloodline nerfs (+ the fact that historical bloodlines deactivate if you don't belong to a certain culture), the severe nerfs to troop stat boosts from religions, the trade post limit changes for MRs... you get the idea.

As for the Supernatural Events thing, I frankly do not believe it would be worth the amount of time and work needed to have unrealistic-boosting and realistic-boosting versions of basically every single artifact. The Holy Grail is easy because the artifact can only be gotten by a single event (so you just need to put a single rule-check into a single event and you're good), it does not interact with other events once it spawns (like the way e.g. the Reichskrone and the Imperial Diadem do), and the supernatural effect itself is about as harmless as you can get from a snowballing perspective (bonus Health just makes you current character not die as early from a natural death, but it doesn't prevent the usual age-related penalties from taking hold even if you do live longer, and sometimes you don't really want to live as long with your character as you'd end up living). If you feel like you have the time to spare though and this issue is important to you, feel free to make a submod that does the whole artifact-boosts-types-gated-by-rule thing you're talking about.
Click to expand...

Thank you a lot for taking the time to answer me! I think now I get the point of why it was done.

Still, when I mentioned my campaign, I didn't mean that I want to continue playing it, that campaign is finished of course. The main issue for me is worthlessness in general, for future campaigns too. Previously finding something like the Bones of St. Peter or stealing the Ark of the Covenant was a really big deal, but now it mostly adds to prestige and piety, both of which good rulers already have plenty of. Another issue for me is crowns. I always thought that they didn't represent just the headgear, but the institution of the coronated monarch, and that is why the basileus ruling the byzantine bureaucracy would get a bonus in stewardship for example. But now they are not just debuffed severely but also stripped of uniqueness.

I think I just don't like that an entire mechanic in the game, which adds good flavor to it, was really downgraded in importance.
 
Last edited:
  • 1
Reactions:
HandicapdHippo said:
It wasnt just flavour though, artifact stacking was just ridiculous, even a slow ruler could become basically superhuman next to courtiers with top tier education and traits.
Click to expand...

Yes, I fully agree, they were quite overpowered, especially if stacked, and I now understand the necessity to nerf them, but in my opinion the present debuff is simply too much and it made the artifacts underpowered. Previously artifacts were powerful tools which could significantly buff the attributes of it's owner, but now instead of being unique and useful tools still worthy of being desired they are mere trinkets with no unique functions, and trying to get them is now more trouble then it is worth.

Can one even compare the Reichskrone representing both secular and spiritual authority and worn by the elected emperors who have to constantly mediate disputes between small and insignificant princes as well as powerful and wealthy landowners or the Imperial Diadem of elected byzantine emperors who literally rule the last remnants of the Roman Empire through a massive bureaucracy to ensure the effectiveness of their government with a piece of metal enchased with some fancy gems and created by your local smith? Now they are almost one and the same and I don't feel it is as it should be.
 
Last edited:
hip.jpeg
 
Notary said:
Thank you a lot for taking the time to answer me! I think now I get the point of why it was done.

Still, when I mentioned my campaign, I didn't mean that I want to continue playing it, that campaign is finished of course. The main issue for me is worthlessness in general, for future campaigns too. Previously finding something like the Bones of St. Peter or stealing the Ark of the Covenant was a really big deal, but now it mostly adds to prestige and piety, both of which good rulers already have plenty of. Another issue for me is crowns. I always thought that they didn't represent just the headgear, but the institution of the coronated monarch, and that is why the basileus ruling the byzantine bureaucracy would get a bonus in stewardship for example. But now they are not just debuffed severely but also stripped of uniqueness.

I think I just don't like that an entire mechanic in the game, which adds good flavor to it, was really downgraded in importance.
Click to expand...

It's a pretty simple thing to undo if you want. Just head to the artifact folder and open 00_artifacts (I recommend downloading Notepad++ for files as well) do a search for crown_hre and copy and paste the vanilla stats over the HRE and Byzantine crowns.

Code: 
crown_hre = { 
    monthly_character_prestige = 1.0
    monthly_character_piety = 1.0
    diplomacy = 4
                   
                 
    quality = 5
    church_opinion = 10
    active = {
        is_feudal = yes
        emf_is_crowned = yes
        OR = { 
            religion = catholic
            religion = fraticelli
        } 

    custom_tooltip = { 
        text = crowned_by_trigger
        OR = {
                trait = crowned_by_myself
                trait = crowned_by_pope
                trait = crowned_by_bishop
                trait = crowned_by_priest
            }
        }
    }
    flags = { religious christian unique crown jewelry crown_jewel }
    picture = "GFX_crown_hre"
    slot = crown
    stacking = no
    indestructible = yes
    allowed_gift = {
        always = no
    }
}

crown_byzantine = { 
    monthly_character_prestige = 1.5
    monthly_character_piety = 1.5
    stewardship = 4
                 
    quality = 5
    active = { 
        emf_is_crowned = yes
        emf_common_coronation_requirements = yes                   
        is_feudal = yes
        has_landed_title = e_byzantium
    }
    flags = { religious unique crown jewelry crown_jewel }
    picture = "GFX_crown_byzantine"
    slot = crown
    stacking = no
    indestructible = yes
    allowed_gift = {
        always = no
    }
}
 
mechl said:
It's a pretty simple thing to undo if you want. Just head to the artifact folder and open 00_artifacts (I recommend downloading Notepad++ for files as well) do a search for crown_hre and copy and paste the vanilla stats over the HRE and Byzantine crowns.

Code: 
crown_hre = {
    monthly_character_prestige = 1.0
    monthly_character_piety = 1.0
    diplomacy = 4
                  
                
    quality = 5
    church_opinion = 10
    active = {
        is_feudal = yes
        emf_is_crowned = yes
        OR = {
            religion = catholic
            religion = fraticelli
        }

    custom_tooltip = {
        text = crowned_by_trigger
        OR = {
                trait = crowned_by_myself
                trait = crowned_by_pope
                trait = crowned_by_bishop
                trait = crowned_by_priest
            }
        }
    }
    flags = { religious christian unique crown jewelry crown_jewel }
    picture = "GFX_crown_hre"
    slot = crown
    stacking = no
    indestructible = yes
    allowed_gift = {
        always = no
    }
}

crown_byzantine = {
    monthly_character_prestige = 1.5
    monthly_character_piety = 1.5
    stewardship = 4
                
    quality = 5
    active = {
        emf_is_crowned = yes
        emf_common_coronation_requirements = yes                  
        is_feudal = yes
        has_landed_title = e_byzantium
    }
    flags = { religious unique crown jewelry crown_jewel }
    picture = "GFX_crown_byzantine"
    slot = crown
    stacking = no
    indestructible = yes
    allowed_gift = {
        always = no
    }
}
Click to expand...

Hey, thank you a lot! That is very helpful, I'll definitely try it.
 
Yeah, I'm a little disappointed by the artifacts being nerfed because I'm a bad player and appreciated the lift up from artifact stacking (I know, I know). It's a totally understandable and reasonable thing to do given the whole motive of the project though and it's not making them *totally* worthless. I'll just have to find other ways to make up for my lack of skill, haha.

I definitely really appreciate the amazing amount of work that goes into this mod and am amazed at how much stuff you put out regularly. Thank you so much for making the mod for all of us.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom
Back