WW CCXLVII - DOOM OF THE WEREYAK 8: HASTINAPUR, 722 BC

Witch Agatha

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Yeah, don't trust any random contact. Especially Chieron claiming traitless, that was an obvious lie when literally every villager had a trait this game. Same thing gave Culann away.
Which is how you know I’m still a newbie. I knew I had to scan someone who I thought was mostly a villager. Because I know my limitations, and I was going to need help.
 

Culann

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Yeah, don't trust any random contact. Especially Chieron claiming traitless, that was an obvious lie when literally every villager had a trait this game. Same thing gave Culann away.

I wasn't aware every villager had one. Also I didn't think it mattered I was pretty sure you suspected me before hand.
 

Team Wombat

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I have many things to say, but they will have to wait until later tonight. Thanks for hosting, Yakman, and congratulations on the win, team evil.
 
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Arkasas

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Small, questionably balanced games have a tendency to produce Stockholm Pacts for some reason. Consider this game, for example.
 

Sleepyhead

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I'm really happy I outed Sleepy, then.
He deserved it.

The truce never was gonna last and calling it off on a day when you hunt is fair game.
But doing a stab in a back and only calling off the truce after the fact really feels dishonourable.
Which was why I decided to follow all chnces I had, no matter how unlikely they were.
It never was a stab in the back, that was part of the absurdities you put out in the thread. How you thought that the unknowns were somehow off limit I cannot fathom - they were always fair game.

The truce was a 'don't kill me because wombat was a moron to give you my name' type of arrangement and 'if you still kill me do remember my packmate has both of your names'.

I cordially informed you that you were the only player standing in the way of baddie victory at parity, hence obviously truce up. I figured you'd want your cultists to win in your severely disadvantaged situation, but I figured wrongly.

I did a couple of mistakes, a potential one in not letting Wombat know Graymarch wasn't to be lynched and a proper one in failing to save him myself. I also clearly shouldn't have told Wombat we had your and Arkasas' names, as that prompted him to give you mine. I though letting him know we were already better informed would keep him from passing my name along, but boy was I wrong there. At that point I figured it was game over for me but not for my mate. I was absolutely correct in keeping Chieron's name from Wombat, it's the only wolf name he didn't have and the one who won.

Only after we hit the nail on the head with Panzer and aedan helped us with Arky did I think this was winnable for me personally, making it the more frustrating to see you out me on a misunderstanding you could've at least tried to clear privately before going public and then continue on to implicate your mates.
 
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aedan777

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One thing I must say is if the success of a plan for baddie victory depends on the village's knowledge of that plan, I don't see how the plan can succeed since the village will (as was done here) undoubtedly find some other way whether or not the plan also offers them a chance of victory. I guess that didn't really matter since wagon didn't seem to care if he had no chance of winning, but I still don't see how there could be any success for such a plan.
His plan basically relied on both him being right about who the last wolf was (he wasn't) and the village cooperating for a very slim chance at victory. Thanks to alxeu's contact with Wagon that chance was basically zero, but he might have managed to trick some people.

He still had another chance, albeit more random. He could have followed my plan to kill a non-wolf and hope that Chieron would hunt two villagers, extending the game a day and giving him a chance to convince the village to help him win then. But he decided to help the other pack win against the village instead.
 

Chieron

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Yeah, don't trust any random contact. Especially Chieron claiming traitless, that was an obvious lie when literally every villager had a trait this game. Same thing gave Culann away.
There was no meaningful trait to claim, to be honest.
Thing is, without the seerish/priestly scans, the normal villagers lack information, but such calls to "come here and put forward a role claim" are also weird.
I never really know, how to react to them, so normally, I don't.
 
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Culann

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Wagon could have won. If he had known that Chieron was a baddie.

Nah, I don't think so. The village would have never gone along with him to lynch Chieron and had he hunted him instead of Agatha the village would have just lynched him. I still don't know the entirety of his plan. I just don't believe Alxeu would have done anything to help him win either. I still don't see how the self outing could have won him the game. I'll concede I may not being seeing something so I'm curious to say the least.
 

Culann

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Thanks for hosting @Yakman ! I hope the next time I'm the sorcerer it'll be less insane. I think I got a baptism by fire here.

Also, we really need to work on your optimism DBW. It worked out! Thanks again for rallying us and taking one for the team.
 

Dedonus

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Nah, I don't think so. The village would have never gone along with him to lynch Chieron and had he hunted him instead of Agatha the village would have just lynched him. I still don't know the entirety of his plan. I just don't believe Alxeu would have done anything to help him win either. I still don't see how the self outing could have won him the game. I'll concede I may not being seeing something so I'm curious to say the least.
Wagon's only real chance was that Chieron hunting two villagers. Had Wagon not had his vote on me, the village would have outnumbered the baddies.
 

aedan777

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I wasn't aware every villager had one. Also I didn't think it mattered I was pretty sure you suspected me before hand.
There was no meaningful trait to claim, to be honest.
Thing is, without the seerish/priestly scans, the normal villagers lack information, but such calls to "come here and put forward a role claim" are also weird.
I never really know, how to react to them, so normally, I don't.
In this game every dead villager had had a trait so far, and I'd claimed one, strongly suggesting that traits were overwhelmingly common among villagers. Grimlock's claim of consumptive was one of the main reasons I considered it possible he might be a villager. As for it mattering, I was suspicious of everyone after it got revealed how many baddies there were. Every bit of evidence I could use was important.

In more general circumstances, making a role claim to the JL is important, even if you don't have what you think are useful powers, because wolves are less likely to do so than villagers. There have been plenty of games where the JL has (or should've) just started killing players who didn't make claims and take out overwhemlingly baddies.
 
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Arkasas

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It never was a stab in the back, that was part of the absurdities you put out in the thread.
So what you're saying is that it was just a one-night stand and Wagon shouldn't have become so emotionally invested in it?

Deep.
 
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Chieron

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Wagon's only real chance was that Chieron hunting two villagers. Had Wagon not had his vote on me, the village would have outnumbered the baddies.
Exactly. And the village would need to lynch unaligned baddies, forcing the wolves to hunt villagers to keep the balance.
Wagon hunting me without parity would just have been a village win (and vice versa).
Changeling could've tried to interfere by rerouting the hunt in such a case, making it village win.
Had the priest been active, the cultists would've been more in danger.

Anyway, thanks for hosting @Yakman .
Game was more stressful and exciting than expected, but so is baddie life.
 

Dedonus

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Exactly. And the village would need to lynch unaligned baddies, forcing the wolves to hunt villagers to keep the balance.
Wagon hunting me without parity would just have been a village win (and vice versa).
Changeling could've tried to interfere by rerouting the hunt in such a case, making it village win.
Had the priest been active, the cultists would've been more in danger.

Anyway, thanks for hosting @Yakman .
Game was more stressful and exciting than expected, but so is baddie life.
I even was scanning you tonight, so if you all hadn't offed me and reached parity, we would have know whom to run up next.
 

Culann

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If I’m ever having a drink with any of you Ark is on the top of my list. Your sense of humor seems close to mine.


I even was scanning you tonight, so if you all hadn't offed me and reached parity, we would have know whom to run up next.

Nah I had you nullified tonight.
 

Dedonus

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If I’m ever having a drink with any of you Ark is on the top of my list. Your sense of humor seems close to mine.




Nah I had you nullified tonight.
You already nullified me last night.
 

Team Wombat

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It never was a stab in the back, that was part of the absurdities you put out in the thread. How you thought that the unknowns were somehow off limit I cannot fathom - they were always fair game.

The truce was a 'don't kill me because wombat was a moron to give you my name' type of arrangement and 'if you still kill me do remember my packmate has both of your names'.

I cordially informed you that you were the only player standing in the way of baddie victory at parity, hence obviously truce up. I figured you'd want your cultists to win in your severely disadvantaged situation, but I figured wrongly.

I did a couple of mistakes, a potential one in not letting Wombat know Graymarch wasn't to be lynched and a proper one in failing to save him myself. I also clearly shouldn't have told Wombat we had your and Arkasas' names, as that prompted him to give you mine. I though letting him know we were already better informed would keep him from passing my name along, but boy was I wrong there. At that point I figured it was game over for me but not for my mate. I was absolutely correct in keeping Chieron's name from Wombat, it's the only wolf name he didn't have and the one who won.

Only after we hit the nail on the head with Panzer and aedan helped us with Arky did I think this was winnable for me personally, making it the more frustrating to see you out me on a misunderstanding you could've at least tried to clear privately before going public and then continue on to implicate your mates.
Ok, I can't let this pass. A couple notes:

I was a cultist and could win with either pack. My giving up your name to the other pack was as a result of you threatening them (I kept your name from them for a day out of respect for you after they knew I had scanned you, so technically I lied to them, saying that "my scan result wasn't interesting" or something like that). I wanted to keep all the baddies alive as long as possible for a better chance of winning, so I essentially forced a mutually assured destruction pact in by setting up the Stockholm. Besides which, they had three wolves to your 2, so technically, they were the leading pack at that point. Sleepyhead's relevant conversation is in yellow, mine in green.


We have scan confirmation on Wagonlitz (clairvoyance) and Arkasas (cultist Graymarch) as traitless wereyaks, you guys royally screwed up voting as a pack on Avernite. I launched the offensive to score goodie points, you and definitely the Capn should try to get some as well.

Sigh...

Arky is actually brutal (cultist scans don't reveal traits, [NOTE: I was incorrect on this point, but Yakman didn't reveal sleepy's traits in my original scan - I went back later and asked him for clarification] which is why I am still suspicious of J. passerpout having a clairvoyance scan and knowing me), but your basic points are correct. I don't control packs (MAW would never have been my first hunt in a million years, and the avernite voting was imbecilic), and I was hoping to avoid interpack warfare this early, but so be it.

I'd appreciate knowing the rest of your pack, if possible (who the sorc is, etc) so I can steer the hunts of my pack to have a better change of targeting goodies. Re: goodie points - I think nuking Graymarch buys me some time if I haven't been scanned yet, and I'm damn near impossible to kill anyway without a scan.

Also, reminder that Grimlock has an unused scan.


Yes Yakman just corrected his scan result on that account and cultist scans does reveal traits ("special role and any traits"), it's right there in the rules.

I won't spill any beans. You could well be that final wereyak of the hooves we have yet to identify, with the whole not knowing the cultist ruleset thing.

If you guys hunt me then be prepared for outing and hunt on Wagonlitz/Arkasas. If you're indeed a cultist that'd be very bad news for you. So that's one name to cross of the hunt.


You got three names from me already and you have scan result, focus on that for the hunt.

Sigh,,,

I'm opening this conversation to everyone relevant, because I am not playing messenger boy and because no one listens to me, anyway.

Wagon, Arkasas, Sleepy is a wereyak from the Horns of terror. He knows both of you already and your roles (clairvoyance and cultist scan), respectively.

I'm out of scans., having scanned sleepyhead and J. passerpout. Grimlock is a cultist, currently with one unused scan (his scan was changelinged from aedan to Avernite, giving us the seer.

Pretty much everyone has reason to be pissed at me; Wagon and Arky because I didn't tell you all about sleepy initially; sleepyhead, because I pushed on graymarch as an alternate choice.


This isn't a Stockholm; per se; just a plea for you all not to freaking kill each other while we still have active JL members on the loose.

Your Panzer hunt came at a time when the priest, doctor, and changeling were still on the board, after you had indicated a Dedonus hunt and we had agreed that Dedonus was a good choice.

The sorc has blocked Claude, Chieron and Capage already, none of them can be the priest.

We're leaning on a hunt on dedonus tonight


Your response to our queries about the hunt was practically taunting Wagonlitz, which was completely unnecessary (Heck, you could have claimed a changling screwed up the hunt, which was totally believable). I would have outed you myself in Wagon's position (although providing the PMs was another issue entirely)

So yeah the truce is up, figured we'd make a play for it. Aedan's solo action was in our favour. You're the only one standing in our way for baddie parity Wagonlitz, which you probably realise.

You can spill the beans, work with the goodies and incriminate yourself for one shot at a hunt, potentially hurting one of the unaligned in the process and drag this out while you search for the final horny wereyak, but my packmate still has your identity and hunts tomorrow.

Your thoughts for today?

So, yes, I was mad, and still think I have some reason to be, especially since I asked for the sorc's name multiple times with no result. The game was practically unwinnable for the goodies, and your actions essentially gave the goodies a shot.