lwarmonger said:
We're not sure yet, there's significant numbers supporting both.
fasquardon
There Will Be War - In The Balance
- Thread starter fasquardon
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We're not sure yet, there's significant numbers supporting both.
fasquardon
Just read through the Ynglinga Saga, as far as it has come, and I greatly enjoyed it. Well done KoM! Will follow from now on.
Also, this has made me interested in the other AAR's. Gotta try out a new one tomorrow. And I really ought to write one of my own too...
Also, this has made me interested in the other AAR's. Gotta try out a new one tomorrow. And I really ought to write one of my own too...
Brittany - 1109 to 1120
As the Year of Our Lord, 1120, began, Duke Phillipe de Cournaille realized that his father and his grandfather had succeeded beyond his wildest dreams. In fact, in his estimation, Dukes Hoël and Alain de Cournaille should be considered conquerors in a class with Caesar, Belisarius, or Charlemagne.
After all, had Dukes Hoël and Alain de Cournaille not expanded the Breton Empire[1] from its humble beginnings as a mere rump tip of France, populated by poor marsh salt-producers and repeatedly ravaged by Vikings, to an Empire that now stretched from Leon to Tharasset (and included Leon along the way)?
Had Duke Hoël de Cournaille not taken the Pays Reconquis from the Muslim “kingdoms” that had once ruled the Iberian Peninsula, and followed up that conquest with a focused campaign of missionary work, until the Sheiks still ruling any area of consequence in the Iberian Peninsula could be counted on the fingers of one hand?
Had Duke Hoël de Cournaille not followed up on taking the Pays Reconquis by driving the Muslims from Mauretania and Africa, and left the African Sheiks to the Catholic instruction of Duke Bohemond de Hauteville of Apulia?
Had Duke Alain de Cournaille not followed up on the conquering work of his father, both by wresting control of the remainder of the Iberian Peninsula from the once rising, now proven decrepit, unworthy, and abandoned by God for their sins, Jimenez family that once claimed the Kingdoms of Aragon, Castile, Léon, and Navarra?
Had Duke Alain de Cournaille not followed up on the Crusading work of his father, aiding both the Duke of Carinthia and the Duke of Abghazia in wresting large chunks of the Levant from the corrupt Fatimid dynasty, taking them out of the hands of Muslim Sheiks and placing them into the hands of good Christians?
Had Duke Alain de Cournaille not fulfilled the quietly held dream of the de Cournailles from such time as they became entrenched in the Iberian Peninsula, to one day turn on the Capet dynasty of France and take full control of their own destiny by grabbing the Aquitaine Corridor that at one time separated the Breton ancestral lands from the Pays Reconquis of the Iberian Peninsula?
While once it seemed obvious that poor Brittany would be ever destined to be passed back and forth from France to England and back, until one or the other could incorporate it in perpetuity, was it not true that the Breton Empire was now a match for either England or France?
And Hell, had Duke Alain de Cournaille not had the good grace to drop dead shortly after the stresses placed on the Breton realm by the new conquests of Aquitaine, Gascony, and Poitou threatened to cause the Breton Empire to burst apart at the seams, thereby allowing the Bretons to unite (with some minor exceptions, such as the soon-to-be-returned-by-force-to-the-Breton-Empire county of Faro) around the less controversial Duke Phillippe?
It was. And so Duke Phillippe de Cournaille felt small by comparison[2] to the giants that were his father and grandfather, in a way. It was true that Duke Phillippe was at least as prepared for his coronation as Duke of Brittany as Dukes Alain and Hoël had been. Duke Phillippe had been installed as the Count of Rioja for fully half of his life, first coming to rule at the age of 16. That was at least as much preparation as Duke Alain had had before coming to the throne, and Duke Alain had only been prepared through rule in Nantes, far removed from Valencia, which had come to represent the center of Breton power. Duke Hoël himself could also claim no more.
Still, Duke Phillippe felt small. Or perhaps he felt like Alexander, who was said to have wept that there were no more worlds to conquer. For whatever worlds there might be to conquer, they were far away from what Duke Phillippe could hope to claim.
To the East of the French lands in the middle (and in the main) lay the Holy Roman Empire, which although reduced from its glory days was still a power to be reckoned with. Even the Breton Empire itself could not contend with the Holy Roman Empire, at least not yet.
Alternatively, to the East of the French lands in the far South were the Italian lands of the Carinthian Duke (formerly known as Teodolfo von Zähringen, now styling himself Agostino I). Duke Agostino had been a staunch ally in the wars against the Fatimids, and so Duke Phillippe could not encroach on his territory now. Besides, due to the richness of the Italian lands, Duke Agostino could, if desired, hire more mercenary troops to defend his lands than Duke Phillippe could hope to recruit from the entirety of the Breton Empire; Carinthia was certainly not a realm to trifle with.
Still more alternatively, to the East of the French lands in the North lay the Duchy of Flanders. Duke Alain had embarked upon his French adventures in part to defend Duke Arnolf de Flandre from the unprovoked (well, some would say that Duke Arnolf’s recent declaration of independence from France was sufficient provocation, but those were in the minority, and usually named “Capet” to boot) attack that France had launched. Admittedly, Duke Alain’s dreams had always included conquering access ways from Iberia to Vieux Brittany, but they could have waited a bit. In any event, attacking Duke Arnolf was a non-starter.
To the East of the Mauretanian lands lay Sicilian territories; having fought the Zirids (prior to the conversion of their remnants to Catholicism) for the African lands only to give them away to the Dukes of Apulia (now styling themselves the Kings of Sicily), Brittany could scarcely war against Sicily for them again. Admittedly, there were a few scattered Muslim provinces left between Mauretania and Egypt that might be conquered, but simple territorial principles would demand that Duke Phillippe then turn them over to King Mauger. Hardly worth the effort, then.
To the East of Africa lay the Carinthian territory of Egypt and Arabia; beyond that lay more heathen lands. While conquering the remaining territory of the heathens (perhaps the Emirate of Qarakhnid or the “King” of the Seljuks might deserve to lose some territory?) might serve Christ well, Duke Phillippe was forced to admit that the closest heathen territory lay several months away by sea, followed by more months of hard marching across inhospitable desert territories. Not a viable option.
To the East of the Holy Roman Empire…well, those lands might as well be the moon as far as Duke Phillippe was concerned. All Duke Phillippe knew of those lands were vague rumors of a “Russian” Empire.
To the North of the Breton lands was ocean. Admittedly, across the oceans were islands with more lands that could be conquered. But the Breton Empire was difficult enough to hold together without adding island realms to it.
And so Duke Phillippe resigned himself to minor conquests, at best (certain French borders were still disputed, and at some point the Duchy of Munster needed to be forcibly evicted from the Canary Islands), and began plans to build up some of the infrastructure in his demense that had been so woefully neglected during the Conquest Years.
[1] OOC Editor’s Note: Or, if you like, the Greater Breton Harmonious Co-Prosperity Sphere.
[2] OOC Editor’s Note: Generous, Deceitful, Wise, Suspicious, Rebellious, Pragmatic, and Hostile, Duke Phillippe’s diplomacy has a -6 point adjustment from traits. At least the Rebellious trait will go away soon now that he’s the Duke.
As the Year of Our Lord, 1120, began, Duke Phillipe de Cournaille realized that his father and his grandfather had succeeded beyond his wildest dreams. In fact, in his estimation, Dukes Hoël and Alain de Cournaille should be considered conquerors in a class with Caesar, Belisarius, or Charlemagne.
After all, had Dukes Hoël and Alain de Cournaille not expanded the Breton Empire[1] from its humble beginnings as a mere rump tip of France, populated by poor marsh salt-producers and repeatedly ravaged by Vikings, to an Empire that now stretched from Leon to Tharasset (and included Leon along the way)?
Had Duke Hoël de Cournaille not taken the Pays Reconquis from the Muslim “kingdoms” that had once ruled the Iberian Peninsula, and followed up that conquest with a focused campaign of missionary work, until the Sheiks still ruling any area of consequence in the Iberian Peninsula could be counted on the fingers of one hand?
Had Duke Hoël de Cournaille not followed up on taking the Pays Reconquis by driving the Muslims from Mauretania and Africa, and left the African Sheiks to the Catholic instruction of Duke Bohemond de Hauteville of Apulia?
Had Duke Alain de Cournaille not followed up on the conquering work of his father, both by wresting control of the remainder of the Iberian Peninsula from the once rising, now proven decrepit, unworthy, and abandoned by God for their sins, Jimenez family that once claimed the Kingdoms of Aragon, Castile, Léon, and Navarra?
Had Duke Alain de Cournaille not followed up on the Crusading work of his father, aiding both the Duke of Carinthia and the Duke of Abghazia in wresting large chunks of the Levant from the corrupt Fatimid dynasty, taking them out of the hands of Muslim Sheiks and placing them into the hands of good Christians?
Had Duke Alain de Cournaille not fulfilled the quietly held dream of the de Cournailles from such time as they became entrenched in the Iberian Peninsula, to one day turn on the Capet dynasty of France and take full control of their own destiny by grabbing the Aquitaine Corridor that at one time separated the Breton ancestral lands from the Pays Reconquis of the Iberian Peninsula?
While once it seemed obvious that poor Brittany would be ever destined to be passed back and forth from France to England and back, until one or the other could incorporate it in perpetuity, was it not true that the Breton Empire was now a match for either England or France?
And Hell, had Duke Alain de Cournaille not had the good grace to drop dead shortly after the stresses placed on the Breton realm by the new conquests of Aquitaine, Gascony, and Poitou threatened to cause the Breton Empire to burst apart at the seams, thereby allowing the Bretons to unite (with some minor exceptions, such as the soon-to-be-returned-by-force-to-the-Breton-Empire county of Faro) around the less controversial Duke Phillippe?
It was. And so Duke Phillippe de Cournaille felt small by comparison[2] to the giants that were his father and grandfather, in a way. It was true that Duke Phillippe was at least as prepared for his coronation as Duke of Brittany as Dukes Alain and Hoël had been. Duke Phillippe had been installed as the Count of Rioja for fully half of his life, first coming to rule at the age of 16. That was at least as much preparation as Duke Alain had had before coming to the throne, and Duke Alain had only been prepared through rule in Nantes, far removed from Valencia, which had come to represent the center of Breton power. Duke Hoël himself could also claim no more.
Still, Duke Phillippe felt small. Or perhaps he felt like Alexander, who was said to have wept that there were no more worlds to conquer. For whatever worlds there might be to conquer, they were far away from what Duke Phillippe could hope to claim.
To the East of the French lands in the middle (and in the main) lay the Holy Roman Empire, which although reduced from its glory days was still a power to be reckoned with. Even the Breton Empire itself could not contend with the Holy Roman Empire, at least not yet.
Alternatively, to the East of the French lands in the far South were the Italian lands of the Carinthian Duke (formerly known as Teodolfo von Zähringen, now styling himself Agostino I). Duke Agostino had been a staunch ally in the wars against the Fatimids, and so Duke Phillippe could not encroach on his territory now. Besides, due to the richness of the Italian lands, Duke Agostino could, if desired, hire more mercenary troops to defend his lands than Duke Phillippe could hope to recruit from the entirety of the Breton Empire; Carinthia was certainly not a realm to trifle with.
Still more alternatively, to the East of the French lands in the North lay the Duchy of Flanders. Duke Alain had embarked upon his French adventures in part to defend Duke Arnolf de Flandre from the unprovoked (well, some would say that Duke Arnolf’s recent declaration of independence from France was sufficient provocation, but those were in the minority, and usually named “Capet” to boot) attack that France had launched. Admittedly, Duke Alain’s dreams had always included conquering access ways from Iberia to Vieux Brittany, but they could have waited a bit. In any event, attacking Duke Arnolf was a non-starter.
To the East of the Mauretanian lands lay Sicilian territories; having fought the Zirids (prior to the conversion of their remnants to Catholicism) for the African lands only to give them away to the Dukes of Apulia (now styling themselves the Kings of Sicily), Brittany could scarcely war against Sicily for them again. Admittedly, there were a few scattered Muslim provinces left between Mauretania and Egypt that might be conquered, but simple territorial principles would demand that Duke Phillippe then turn them over to King Mauger. Hardly worth the effort, then.
To the East of Africa lay the Carinthian territory of Egypt and Arabia; beyond that lay more heathen lands. While conquering the remaining territory of the heathens (perhaps the Emirate of Qarakhnid or the “King” of the Seljuks might deserve to lose some territory?) might serve Christ well, Duke Phillippe was forced to admit that the closest heathen territory lay several months away by sea, followed by more months of hard marching across inhospitable desert territories. Not a viable option.
To the East of the Holy Roman Empire…well, those lands might as well be the moon as far as Duke Phillippe was concerned. All Duke Phillippe knew of those lands were vague rumors of a “Russian” Empire.
To the North of the Breton lands was ocean. Admittedly, across the oceans were islands with more lands that could be conquered. But the Breton Empire was difficult enough to hold together without adding island realms to it.
And so Duke Phillippe resigned himself to minor conquests, at best (certain French borders were still disputed, and at some point the Duchy of Munster needed to be forcibly evicted from the Canary Islands), and began plans to build up some of the infrastructure in his demense that had been so woefully neglected during the Conquest Years.
[1] OOC Editor’s Note: Or, if you like, the Greater Breton Harmonious Co-Prosperity Sphere.
[2] OOC Editor’s Note: Generous, Deceitful, Wise, Suspicious, Rebellious, Pragmatic, and Hostile, Duke Phillippe’s diplomacy has a -6 point adjustment from traits. At least the Rebellious trait will go away soon now that he’s the Duke.
The story of Bohemia
(Feb 19, 1109- April 19, 1120)
Beginning Stats
Date: Feb 19, 1109
Leader: Bratislava Premyslid the Lucky (1058-?)
Liege: Dietmar Von Franken
Titles: Duke of Bohemia, Silesia, Moravia, Franconia, Pomeralia, lesser Poland, and Meissen, Count of Praha, Weimar and Pressburg
Vassals: 20
Income: 8.10(355.26% growth)
Manpower: 2967(-1071.51% growth)
Martial: 19
Diplomacy: 22
Intrigue: 11
Stewardship: 15
Laws: Semisalic Primogeniture, Traditional Custom, Ecclesial Balance
End Stats
Date: April 19, 1120
Leader: Bratislava Premyslid the Lucky (1058-?)
Liege: Jaromir Von Franken
Titles: Duke of Bohemia, Silesia, Moravia, Franconia, Pomeralia, lesser Poland and Meissen, Count of Praha, and Pressburg
Vassals: 23
Income: 11.25(138.89% growth)
Manpower: 50690(1708.45% growth)
Martial: 23
Diplomacy: 22
Intrigue: 18
Stewardship: 17
Laws: Semisalic Primogeniture, Traditional Custom, Ecclesial Balance
Goals:
1. Stay in HRE (yes)
2. Add Slupsk into my demesne (no)
3. And have fun (yes)
4. Have ai not kill me
Start map
End map
Well I was looking for a sub to play for me this session, but it didn’t happened. I was able to play for about hour. I in that time nothing really happened. I have been talks with other players about alliance and broader agreements, hopefully I can get those up and maybe I get an arr reward. Oh and i am out of the HRE now, done by edit.
Arr reward Increase the wealth level of Praha.
(Feb 19, 1109- April 19, 1120)
Beginning Stats
Date: Feb 19, 1109
Leader: Bratislava Premyslid the Lucky (1058-?)
Liege: Dietmar Von Franken
Titles: Duke of Bohemia, Silesia, Moravia, Franconia, Pomeralia, lesser Poland, and Meissen, Count of Praha, Weimar and Pressburg
Vassals: 20
Income: 8.10(355.26% growth)
Manpower: 2967(-1071.51% growth)
Martial: 19
Diplomacy: 22
Intrigue: 11
Stewardship: 15
Laws: Semisalic Primogeniture, Traditional Custom, Ecclesial Balance
End Stats
Date: April 19, 1120
Leader: Bratislava Premyslid the Lucky (1058-?)
Liege: Jaromir Von Franken
Titles: Duke of Bohemia, Silesia, Moravia, Franconia, Pomeralia, lesser Poland and Meissen, Count of Praha, and Pressburg
Vassals: 23
Income: 11.25(138.89% growth)
Manpower: 50690(1708.45% growth)
Martial: 23
Diplomacy: 22
Intrigue: 18
Stewardship: 17
Laws: Semisalic Primogeniture, Traditional Custom, Ecclesial Balance
Goals:
1. Stay in HRE (yes)
2. Add Slupsk into my demesne (no)
3. And have fun (yes)
4. Have ai not kill me
Start map
End map
Well I was looking for a sub to play for me this session, but it didn’t happened. I was able to play for about hour. I in that time nothing really happened. I have been talks with other players about alliance and broader agreements, hopefully I can get those up and maybe I get an arr reward. Oh and i am out of the HRE now, done by edit.
Arr reward Increase the wealth level of Praha.
Pressburg Boarder Agreement Treaty
I Bretislav Premyslid, Duke of Bohemia, Franconia, Holstein, Lesser Poland, Meissen, Moravia, Silesia and Pomeralia, Margrave of the East, Defender of the Faith of East, Regent of Poland wish to suggest boarder agreement to Agostino I Von Zahringen Duke Carinthia, Aswan, Cairo, Damietta , Pisa, Lombardia, Sardinia, Verona, Regent Egypt and Defender of the Faith of Middle East. The boarder would be as followed lands south of the Danube River and Bodensee Lake would be under Carinthia rule and lands north that would be under Bohemia rule. The lands Pecs, but not Varadzin will follow under Bohemia too. The Pressburg Boarder Agreement Treaty will remand under affect for no less than 130 years(date of April 19, 1250) and may be renewed. Failure to agree to said treaty once signed, punishment will be excommunication.
Map:
I Bretislav Premyslid, Duke of Bohemia, Franconia, Holstein, Lesser Poland, Meissen, Moravia, Silesia and Pomeralia, Margrave of the East, Defender of the Faith of East, Regent of Poland place my seal on to the treaty.
Re: Pressburg Boarder Agreement Treaty
what do the colours on your map mean hyme?
fasquardon
what do the colours on your map mean hyme?
fasquardon
hyme said:Pressburg Boarder Agreement Treaty
I Bretislav Premyslid, Duke of Bohemia, Franconia, Holstein, Lesser Poland, Meissen, Moravia, Silesia and Pomeralia, Margrave of the East, Defender of the Faith of East, Regent of Poland wish to suggest boarder agreement to Agostino I Von Zahringen Duke Carinthia, Aswan, Cairo, Damietta , Pisa, Lombardia, Sardinia, Verona, Regent Egypt and Defender of the Faith of Middle East. The boarder would be as followed lands south of the Danube River and Bodensee Lake would be under Carinthia rule and lands north that would be under Bohemia rule. The lands Pecs, but not Varadzin will follow under Bohemia too. The Pressburg Boarder Agreement Treaty will remand under affect for no less than 130 years(date of April 19, 1250) and may be renewed. Failure to agree to said treaty once signed, punishment will be excommunication.
Map:
I Bretislav Premyslid, Duke of Bohemia, Franconia, Holstein, Lesser Poland, Meissen, Moravia, Silesia and Pomeralia, Margrave of the East, Defender of the Faith of East, Regent of Poland place my seal on to the treaty.
I Agostino I of the von Zähringen dynasty, Duke of Carinthia et. al., Crusader of Egypt, Lord of Italy, Slayer of Infidels, place my seal on to the treaty.
The Bagratuniad:
Anja's Song:
Part 1 - The Nefarious Pirate
Today, Anja Sigridsdatter is a favourite of the feminist and the romantic writer, her mysterious origins, blood-soaked deeds and mastery of the men of her age, make her an easy fit for such stories. Likely, if you actually met her, she would seem as sadistic and unpleasant as she seemed to her contemporaries. (from The Last Viking by Markku Oikari)
Anja's Song:
Part 1 - The Nefarious Pirate
Today, Anja Sigridsdatter is a favourite of the feminist and the romantic writer, her mysterious origins, blood-soaked deeds and mastery of the men of her age, make her an easy fit for such stories. Likely, if you actually met her, she would seem as sadistic and unpleasant as she seemed to her contemporaries. (from The Last Viking by Markku Oikari)
December 19th, 1100
Skagerrak
Damn that boy anyway, why did he have to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory? But perhaps I was wrong to have set friends against each-other. Downtime Ynglings are little more than strils anyway, I should have expected them to be equally guilt prone.
Last night we slipped some men ashore near Swedish border, the news is not good, King Olaf is either dying or dead, giving his judgment against me the force of a dying curse. Likely I will be unable to return to Norway until his great-grandson is on the throne, in which case, I will be lucky to still be alive. I will need to consider this more.
...
June 03, 1101
Gulf of Riga
Once more we go a-Viking. Would prefer to take more productive action, but the motley crew needs their fill of loot and adventure. There have already been 3 attempts at mutiny, wish to avoid number 4.
Today we sail on behalf of the High Chief of Estonia, one of the three great Pagan powers on the Baltic. Apparently the locals have a long tradition of Viking - met an elder near Narva who claimed he once abducted a queen from my country.
June 22, 1101
Gulf of Danzig
On our way "home". The Wend coast nicely raided, managed to "recruit" some of the locals, motley crew is sated for now. Got our hands on a herald for one of the more important Southern courts. Once gently persuaded, he was kind enough to update my knowledge of the international situation. Seems like a good time to take stock of the situation:
Assets:
6 Dragon Ships
176 persons-at-arms
Of these (in order of dependability):
1 real Yngling, with all that implies
143 Norwegian "old guard"
17 Estonian volunteers
15 Wendish "volunteers"
82 of which are women
94 of which are men
Vulnerabilities:
Only one real Yngling. Me.
143 Norwegian potential mutineers
17 Estonians who will run away as soon as they see a better opportunity for plunder
15 Wends who will run away as soon as they think no-one is looking
Potential enemies in Norway (just how sentimental is Geir about the days when we were lovers?)
Very likely I will be called a witch by competitors as soon as they see politically expedient.
I'm a woman.
I have to sleep some time.
Major Powers:
Germany - very powerful; also, contains Saxony and Bohemia, each likely stronger than any one of the Scandinavian Kingdoms. Rumours are of a Crusade against the Estonians - may be wise to move soon!
Britain - strong contention over the isles between Scotland and England. Possible opportunity?
France - large and stable. Sounds dull.
Brittany - seems to have taken place of old history's Spain. Doing so well I suspect time-agents. Commintern? If so, why in Loki's name Brittany???
Russia - Most interesting. Appears rumours I heard in Norway were more than 2 years old, dynastic war quite severe. Usual sob story, misrule, massacre, starvation etc., huge opportunity for smart lady.
June 25, 1101
Gulf of Riga
Lost 3 of the Estonians on a raid-of-opportunity on the tribe of Samogitia. Booty sub-par.
Have been considering Russia further. Unified Russia is likely to be as great an enemy to Yngling hegemony as the Poles ever were. Might be able to help my successor if I were able to sow some confusion. Not sure how I feel about that. Would feel good to burn Viken to the ground.
...
August 03, 1102
Chernigov
Have been in Chernigov for some time now, it being the most important city in Russia at the moment. Choas is rife in the country, as I had heard. This has been good for recruitment. Current numbers of my "Druzhyna" (a Russian word for "companions" and given our current makeup, it seems appropriate):
307 persons-at-arms
Of these (in order of dependability):
1 of Me
1 Wend <-- Bozena has proven herself a capable and trustworthy second
127 Norwegians
24 Estonians
134 Russians
20 Kipchaks
177 of which are women
130 of which are men
However, there are flavours of chaos, and this is distinctly intra-dynastic. Most of the violence is restricted to the upper echelons of society, and while in absolute terms there is more deprivation than the War of the West in Norway, in relative terms it is far less. In my opinion, once the Rurikids stop killing each-other, no matter which side wins, they will continue the Chernigovian Rurikid project and unify Russia. Only a portion of the family fights to hold on to a different crown from Smolensk/Chernigov/Kiev/Ryazan, and the Pereyaslavlians only do that to ensure Pereyaslavl is the premier princely title, not (as it is currently) Smolensk.
But for now, Chernigov's politics remains a poisonous snake-pit of the first order. The current Prince, Rogvolod of the Pereyaslavlian line (but a different faction from the Pereyaslavlian line that currently controls Pereyaslavl), is dying as I write this. The Chernigovian and Keivian factions vie with each other to decide his successor. Due to the support of the powerful Georgian Prince Kvirike, the safe money is on the Chernigovians.
Unfortunately, my fortunes in this snake-pit have become tangled with those of Rogvolod. Now I must get out of here before Rogvolod dies...
fasquardon
Last edited:
Anja's intelligence regarding France appears to be...somewhat behind the times, shall we say?fasquardon said:
ulmont said:
Remember this is set during 1101 AD, and also Anja doesn't have the advantage of magical player communications - all of her information comes via word of mouth, and depends heavily on whose mouth is doing the talking.
fasquardon
That's enough to make all the difference; I was thinking about 1120. Carry on.fasquardon said:
The Treaty of Ascalon
Let our first word be one of truce! Let all Christian men here forget their wars and their strife, and sup and pray together in the honour of Jesus Christ our Lord.
Let our second word be one of wonder, that love of our Lord could drive we, feeble men that we are, to the achievement of that which a generation ago seemed all but impossible. Witness Carnithian Egypt, Abghazian Jerusalem, Dioclean Danubia and Breton Mauritania.
Let our third word be one of gratitude, that to Carnithia Brittany has given Al Alamayn, Quena, El-Arish, Eilat, Sinai, Al 'Aqabah, Petra, Beersheb, Monreal, Kerak and Safed; that to Dioclea Brittany has given Famagusta; that to Abghazia Brittany has given Amman, Irbid, Tadmor, Syria, Palmyra, Damascus, Baalbek, Tripoli, Druz, Suwaida, Sinjar and Tarsos. For surely generosity is one of the virtues of the Godly.
All three words do I officiate, all three words do I verify, let them be written as I say.
-Kvirike Bagratuni, April 18 1120, from The Kutaisi Archives, Treaty Sub-Library
fasquardon
The political situation within the Principality of Smolensk or formally Smolensk are complicated, the signing of the Peace of Moskva merged the Principality of Pereyaslavl with the Principality of Smolensk, although there were conditions as the war wasnt decisevely in Smolensk's favour. The Compromise of 1119 was thus: A new capitol was to be declared and the seat of government moved there, somewhere which fit the required prerequisets, being that it was situated in lands formally belonging to Pereyaslavl among others.
The Rurikovich line descending from Svyatoslav it was agreed would be the nominal ruling family of the new realm granted that they succeeded in gaining the approval of the ranking nobility. There was much arguing for a new capitol but eventually it was agreed that the major trade city of Москва́ situated on the Volga river would be the new seat of power and as such Dmitri Rurikovich of the Yaroslav line of Rruikovich's would be the next nominal Prince then the reigns of power would pass back into the hands of the recently returned Svyatoslav line returning from Georgia.
The new realm would be known as the The Grand Duchy of Muscovy Великое княжество Московское. And be the center of Russian power. This was a precarious relationship but not much could be done. Vasilii Rurikovich, Prince Regent of Smolensk collected to himself much prestige governing the Principality on Yaroslav's (The Younger's) behalf, making many suspisious when Yaroslav the Younger died. However Giorgi Rurikovich while Georgian was seen as the legitimate successor to Yaroslav as not only was he his brother but the son of Davyd and Burudukan of Imertia (whom many secretly rumored was an angel sent by God to marry Prince Davyd as she was so beautiful and he death never confirmed, she simply disappeared).
Vasilii solidified his control over the central Russian Principalities and Crimean Tartars declaring the Principality of Poltoslk under his protection and protested the German pretensions in the Baltics and Finland.
-Historic Logs.
--Map
The Rurikovich line descending from Svyatoslav it was agreed would be the nominal ruling family of the new realm granted that they succeeded in gaining the approval of the ranking nobility. There was much arguing for a new capitol but eventually it was agreed that the major trade city of Москва́ situated on the Volga river would be the new seat of power and as such Dmitri Rurikovich of the Yaroslav line of Rruikovich's would be the next nominal Prince then the reigns of power would pass back into the hands of the recently returned Svyatoslav line returning from Georgia.
The new realm would be known as the The Grand Duchy of Muscovy Великое княжество Московское. And be the center of Russian power. This was a precarious relationship but not much could be done. Vasilii Rurikovich, Prince Regent of Smolensk collected to himself much prestige governing the Principality on Yaroslav's (The Younger's) behalf, making many suspisious when Yaroslav the Younger died. However Giorgi Rurikovich while Georgian was seen as the legitimate successor to Yaroslav as not only was he his brother but the son of Davyd and Burudukan of Imertia (whom many secretly rumored was an angel sent by God to marry Prince Davyd as she was so beautiful and he death never confirmed, she simply disappeared).
Vasilii solidified his control over the central Russian Principalities and Crimean Tartars declaring the Principality of Poltoslk under his protection and protested the German pretensions in the Baltics and Finland.
-Historic Logs.
--Map
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Birth of Finland
Who would have ever thought that the son of pagan chief could create a nation.
Our story begins in the year 1066 when Sven Kolsson Sverkerätten was the Duke of Östergötland.
Duchy of Östergötland was smallest Duchy in whole Sweden and was held in the shadow of Duchy of Uppland.
Duke Sven had always been jealous to Duke Birger Strömsö beacause Birger was next in line to inherit the throne of Sweden. When Duke of Östlanded was in losing counts and bishops Sven saw an opportunity to rise in the inheritance line and he decided to vassalize Bishopric of Bergenhus by promising them safety. With this done Duchy of Östergötland was now more powerfull and Duke Sven was now the heir ot the throne.
Years passed and crusade was called. When Kingdom of Sweden asked Sven's armies to fight against the infidels Sven was more than happy to raise his men under Swedish banner. Though Sweden never managed to even go in the holy land Sven decided to send his armies to east to Finland. He wanted to add more counties under his rule. This new crusade to bring Chirstianity to Finland was the last crusade for Sven as he was killed while defending the fort of Vanhalinna in Finland.
His son Johan was now the new Duke and the liberator of Finland.
Johan was not much of a crusader and he almost lost Finland to the pagans before Sweden came to his help. For years Swedish armies tried to get a foothold in Finland but the pagan alliances had the advantage as they knew the surroundings. Duke Johan managed to liberate Kemi and Kola from the lappish pagans and to be sure that Christianity would stay in Finland he created the Bishopric of Kemi to watch over Kemi and Kola.
Johan died shortly after liberating Kola and his son Magnus inherited the title of Östergötland.
Magnus was known as a crusader. He was the one who liberated Finland by defeating all of the Finnish Chiefs by tricking them to bealive that he wanted a peace by inviting them to a small cottage in Tarvasjoki but instead of peace Magnus hanged the chiefs. Magnus was also too power hungry, when Swedish counts started to rebel against King of Sweden Magnus joined them and almost lost his lands. He somehow managed to fight back but was outnumbered as Sweden was winning the civil war against other rebels, so Magnus decided to pledge himself to HRE and with their help he managed to survive. Magnus never had a heir and he threw himself out of the castle window while visiting the court of Germany.
He was the last surviving male member of Sverkerättens and the next Duke of Östergötland was to be his sisters son Jörgen Knýtling.
Jörgen was only a boy when he inherited the throne and Östergötland was mostly ruled by nobels. War with Sweden still continued and young danish duke didn´t really know what to do. After years of hopeless fighting two men came to his court, these men were brothers from the court of his grandmother who had died not so long time ago. The brothers brought glory to Jörgen by defeating Duchy of Uppland and it's vassals. This was a great loss to Sweden that had lost a war against England and was losing vassals. Jörgen was crowend as the Duke of Uppland and few years later as the Duke of Finland.
The court of Östergötland was moved to Finland.
When Jörgen grew older he wanted that all the world would know him as the Prince of Finland. Still Duke Jörgen was vassal to HRE but when HRE was crumbling Jörgen's loyalty towards them decreased.
Peace with Sweden was made but Jörgen was still not happy because King of Sweden was still the King of Finland. Jörgen called his Grand Council to a meeting where new borders were drawn. Jörgen's dream of Kingdom of Finland was now in everybodys mind when he claimed that Satakunta, Tavasts, Kexholm, Torzhok and Söndermanland were legally his.
Young Duke also participate in few minor wars against Sweden together with Kingdom of Norway. 16 year old Jörgen fell in love with the young Princes Filemona while visiting the Court of Norway. Filemona was the daughter of King of Norway.
///As the reward i would like claims on the folowing counties : Satakunta, Tavasts, Kexholm, Torzhok and Söndermanland. Also if possible my loyalty towards the HRE could be decreased. Danke ///
This story is shaping up nicely, but maybe its time for a new grand update post with maps and all? 
The Treaty of Chartres
The Treaty of Chartres
It was a cold winter day, at the end of November in the Year of Our Lord 1128, but none of the people arrayed at what appeared to be a festival appeared to feel the cold.
And why would they? Great roaring bonfires were scattered liberally throughout what had become a parade ground, so that any man might feel the heat from the great tree trunks as the trunks burned and the men walked past. Moreover, the wine and ale vendors were doing a splendid business with this impromptu festival, so that many a man could feel no cold no matter how far from a fire he might be.
For this was the Meeting of Chartres, where Phillipe de Cournaille, King of Brittany, and Guillaume de Flandre, King of France and Duke of Flanders, set forth to solemnize their borders.
Great flags fluttered in the breeze, signifying the presence of representatives from hundreds of noble families across France and Iberia. Tournaments were held daily (so far, a certain García Ramírez, from Navarra, had been performing extremely well), and feasts were held nightly, with plump pigs roasted whole, great pies, and barrels of wine by the score.
It had taken a generation of war, but Brittany had reconnected the ancestral lands of Vieux Brittany with the Pays Reconquis of Nou Brezhoneg, and in recompense for the aid of Flanders in conquering Aquitaine and Gascony had in turn aided Flanders in pressing a claim to the Kingdom of France itself.
As was always the case, during the prosecution of the war the borders had become a bit...fluid, to the point where no one really understood where Brittany ended and France began anymore. To solve this problem, Kings Phillipe and Guillaume met in Chartres, Guillaume's new capital, and sealed as follows:
Know Ye All Men By What Follows
That the lands of old Brittany, Poitou, Aquitaine, Gascony, Bourbon, Auvergne, and Toulouse, and all vassals therewith, are hereby confirmed as Breton possessions, now and forever, for the Kings of Brittany to rule and defend with the strength and wisdom granted them by Our Lord Jesus Christ.
That the lands of Berry, Burgundy, Champagne, Dauphine, Anjou, and Normandy, and all vassals therewith, are hereby confirmed as French possessions, now and forever, for the Kings of France to rule and defend with the strength and wisdom granted them by Our Lord Jesus Christ.
Let it be so.
The Treaty of Chartres
It was a cold winter day, at the end of November in the Year of Our Lord 1128, but none of the people arrayed at what appeared to be a festival appeared to feel the cold.
And why would they? Great roaring bonfires were scattered liberally throughout what had become a parade ground, so that any man might feel the heat from the great tree trunks as the trunks burned and the men walked past. Moreover, the wine and ale vendors were doing a splendid business with this impromptu festival, so that many a man could feel no cold no matter how far from a fire he might be.
For this was the Meeting of Chartres, where Phillipe de Cournaille, King of Brittany, and Guillaume de Flandre, King of France and Duke of Flanders, set forth to solemnize their borders.
Great flags fluttered in the breeze, signifying the presence of representatives from hundreds of noble families across France and Iberia. Tournaments were held daily (so far, a certain García Ramírez, from Navarra, had been performing extremely well), and feasts were held nightly, with plump pigs roasted whole, great pies, and barrels of wine by the score.
It had taken a generation of war, but Brittany had reconnected the ancestral lands of Vieux Brittany with the Pays Reconquis of Nou Brezhoneg, and in recompense for the aid of Flanders in conquering Aquitaine and Gascony had in turn aided Flanders in pressing a claim to the Kingdom of France itself.
As was always the case, during the prosecution of the war the borders had become a bit...fluid, to the point where no one really understood where Brittany ended and France began anymore. To solve this problem, Kings Phillipe and Guillaume met in Chartres, Guillaume's new capital, and sealed as follows:
Know Ye All Men By What Follows
That the lands of old Brittany, Poitou, Aquitaine, Gascony, Bourbon, Auvergne, and Toulouse, and all vassals therewith, are hereby confirmed as Breton possessions, now and forever, for the Kings of Brittany to rule and defend with the strength and wisdom granted them by Our Lord Jesus Christ.
That the lands of Berry, Burgundy, Champagne, Dauphine, Anjou, and Normandy, and all vassals therewith, are hereby confirmed as French possessions, now and forever, for the Kings of France to rule and defend with the strength and wisdom granted them by Our Lord Jesus Christ.
Let it be so.
Here's a pretty good map (minor differences due to edits) fasquardon posted in the main threadbuneres said:This story is shaping up nicely, but maybe its time for a new grand update post with maps and all?
fasquardon said:
December 27th, 1116
Dovrefjell, Norway
One moment: Warmth, lights, the hum of machinery, the sharp tang of adrenaline at the back of the mouth. The next: Cold, dark, utter stillness, and the dry crunch of snow underfoot sending chills up his back, remembered and loathed from a hundred training marches. A clear night, the aurora making swooping sheets of green and pink overhead - and the sky was empty. Eyvind sighed in relief and some surprise; it had worked. He looked about; Henrik or Geir should be meeting him, if they had made it.
There: A man coming down the hillside, mittened hand held up in greeting. He spoke in Old Norse: "Hail, wayfarer. You have come far. I bear word for you from Geir Jonsson; he says, Halkjell har våknet." The last phrase was in uptime Norwegian, and Eyvind relaxed; only an Yngling would have found meaning in it. He replied: "Greeting. I would have words with Geir, or with Henrik Haraldsson if he is here; will you take me to them?"
"I do not know a Henrik; but Geir lives, and waits for you at his farm in Viken; I am his son Ragnvald."
Ah so; not a random stril then, but a man of the Ynglings. Eyvind reappraised the man; he didn't hold himself with the slight tension that showed in most uptime Ynglings, the instant readiness to fight, nor did he consciously project dominance as was taught in uptime schools. Geir would have had other things to do and to teach. But the axe at his side had seen use, and he was powerfully muscled; with the weapons of the age he might well be a match for Eyvind, who had trained mostly with guns and tanks before joining the Secret Hird. Well, they were on the same side, and respect was due an Yngling who could outfight you. Eyvind relaxed his stance; no need to fight or dominate here. "That is well. Let us begin; I think we have a ways to go."
January 16th, 1116
Viken, Norway
The room was silent except for the crackle of the fire. Eyvind shook his head, trying to shake the air of unreality about it all; here was Geir, whom he had last seen young and healthy three weeks ago, looking aged beyond belief, with sons older than Eyvind and a grandson old enough to sit in council with his elders. He set aside the culture shock, and went for the part he could understand without making the mental effort to think like a downtimer: Yngling dominance games. "So Anja is out there somewhere, strength unknown, intentions unknown?"
"Yes. We've had the occasional bits of news - raiding in the Baltic, mainly. Some atrocities, even by local standards; men blinded, livestock killed, fields burned. Nothing lately, though. She may have run into someone smarter or tougher; or - not. She'll be getting on a bit, though; she's pushing forty-five by now."
Eyvind reflected. "Well - not an immediate problem, then, and perhaps not one at all. Who knows, she may even be trying to help us; weakening the Baltic polities, building a power that will ally with us - she was never disloyal, Anja. Headstrong, but loyal. Let's think of matters closer to home. What next?"
"Ah." Geir frowned, staring into the fire. "I've thought about that, and I think there are two answers. First, foreign policy. I believe the time has come to conquer Sweden. We have, now, a strong base in a fairly unified Norway, with Ynglings in many powerful positions. Let's push on."
"Fair enough," Eyvind nodded, "I can get behind that. Axes and shields, it'll be interesting. And the other?"
"Domestic politics. I think the Secret Hird made a mistake, which we should rectify."
"What mistake?"
"The pure, male-descended blood. Consider: Here we sit, six of us, all Ynglings. And nobody knows it but us. If we follow our instructions, our own descendants will be ground into poverty and submission! Unless of course they are female, and lucky enough to marry into the Yngling line. It cannot stand, Eyvind; none of us who got sent back will stand for it. And what's more, it can't possibly work: We cannot guide the politics of a Norway that allows only pure-blooded Ynglings into the upper class, if we are not acknowledged as pure-blooded Ynglings! So... someone writing that document had a rush of blood in a downwards direction, and let the Destiny and Will of the Yngling People overrule any actual thinking about what's possible. You know what I'm talking about?"
Eyvind nodded, slowly. He'd seen it happen, of course: Ynglings so devoted to the idea of themselves as the master race that they forgot the long centuries of calculation, loss-cutting, and desperate fighting that had gotten them even to the precarious dominance they had in the uptime. There was a whole genre of literature that served them, power-porn as they called it. The Secret Hird had tried to recruit only the cold-bloodedly realistic - if nothing else, the powermongers tended to the assumption that Norway could win a nuclear exchange, so they wouldn't be too attracted by a way to avoid that war - but it wasn't hard to imagine one slipping through the cracks, and carrying along whatever committee had written those objectives by sheer rhetoric. After all, it was an ideal, that all Ynglings should be descended from King Olav; it was just that nobody had thought about how that ideal would affect the agents sent back, and their descendants.
"All right, I see the problem, right enough. I don't fancy being a stril, or my sons being strils, any more than you do. So what do you propose to do?"
"I think we need to get out of the trap we got ourselves into, uptime. four-fifths of our population couldn't fight because we didn't trust them; and the rest couldn't do anything but fight because they had to keep a lid on! And you saw what happened: China could grow around us, because sure, the Party skimmed off the best of everything, but at least it was possible to get into the elite. So... I think we need to do away with the whole thing. No more Ynglings, no more strils, just Norse. We're all in it together, we'd better behave that way."
Eyvind blinked, shocked; never mind Liberal, here was Radical beyond Radical, a doctrine to overturn worlds and nations. And yet, wasn't that precisely what they had done? Truly, it was a new world; anything was possible here. And yet: "But in that case... why? Why fight to make Norway supreme, if not because we'll rule in it? We might as well settle down on farms and make children, and wait for, I don't know, the Burgundians to buy Denmark."
Geir sighed, sinking back down into his chair. 'Yes... I know. Well. We'll still have strils; I don't see a way around that. Nobody with the ambition and aggression it took to get sent back here will stand for any sort of egalitarianism, either. Even now, we don't have a really clean slate; we still have to pay for our fathers' choices. Even now... But we can make the same choice as them. And we can make it before we are forced to, and so reap larger benefits. Listen: In the uptime, after the Twenty Years' War, 'Yngling' meant "anyone who speaks Norse and fought in the war". It didn't have anything to do with the bloodline. Well, they had to do it that way. It was either that, or a civil war that would tear Norway apart. And why? Because there were never enough Ynglings. And there never were, at any time, in the uptime history. It was the same every time the franchise was expanded: We had absolutely no choice, we had to have more Ynglings - more upper-class fighters. So first it was female descent, and freeing any slave who would fight, and then marriage licenses for strils, and childlessness taxes, and marriage licenses handed out like candy - and at last the Great Emancipation. Forced, every time; and because it always came at the last minute, it was always just enough to get us over the crisis. Well, I say we learn from that. Let's forget about Yngling blood, we never enforced it anyway when push came to shove. Let's talk about Norse blood. Let's have a large fighting population right from the start, and not find ourselves forced to fight huge political battles to expand it every time we have a war, and get just enough people just in time. Let's consider every man of Norse descent just as good as ourselves, and work from there to subjugate the rest of Europe. There are strils enough outside Norway; let's not find any inside."
There was silence then. Geir's sons stood around their father, hulking men in peak physical condition, facing Eyvind; the fire glinted in their eyes. Eyvind felt no intimidation; they needed his conviction, not his mere forced cooperation. Even so, it was clear that five-sixths of the adult, male Ynglings in the land were of one mind in this; and that had to weigh in his decision. He turned it over in his mind, but could not get a grip on it; it was too large a revolution.
"I... will need time, to think. You may be right. But I cannot say at this moment."
Geir nodded. "Yes, of course. I've had fifty years, and it is a large thought. Think, then."
Dovrefjell, Norway
One moment: Warmth, lights, the hum of machinery, the sharp tang of adrenaline at the back of the mouth. The next: Cold, dark, utter stillness, and the dry crunch of snow underfoot sending chills up his back, remembered and loathed from a hundred training marches. A clear night, the aurora making swooping sheets of green and pink overhead - and the sky was empty. Eyvind sighed in relief and some surprise; it had worked. He looked about; Henrik or Geir should be meeting him, if they had made it.
There: A man coming down the hillside, mittened hand held up in greeting. He spoke in Old Norse: "Hail, wayfarer. You have come far. I bear word for you from Geir Jonsson; he says, Halkjell har våknet." The last phrase was in uptime Norwegian, and Eyvind relaxed; only an Yngling would have found meaning in it. He replied: "Greeting. I would have words with Geir, or with Henrik Haraldsson if he is here; will you take me to them?"
"I do not know a Henrik; but Geir lives, and waits for you at his farm in Viken; I am his son Ragnvald."
Ah so; not a random stril then, but a man of the Ynglings. Eyvind reappraised the man; he didn't hold himself with the slight tension that showed in most uptime Ynglings, the instant readiness to fight, nor did he consciously project dominance as was taught in uptime schools. Geir would have had other things to do and to teach. But the axe at his side had seen use, and he was powerfully muscled; with the weapons of the age he might well be a match for Eyvind, who had trained mostly with guns and tanks before joining the Secret Hird. Well, they were on the same side, and respect was due an Yngling who could outfight you. Eyvind relaxed his stance; no need to fight or dominate here. "That is well. Let us begin; I think we have a ways to go."
-------------------------------------------------
January 16th, 1116
Viken, Norway
The room was silent except for the crackle of the fire. Eyvind shook his head, trying to shake the air of unreality about it all; here was Geir, whom he had last seen young and healthy three weeks ago, looking aged beyond belief, with sons older than Eyvind and a grandson old enough to sit in council with his elders. He set aside the culture shock, and went for the part he could understand without making the mental effort to think like a downtimer: Yngling dominance games. "So Anja is out there somewhere, strength unknown, intentions unknown?"
"Yes. We've had the occasional bits of news - raiding in the Baltic, mainly. Some atrocities, even by local standards; men blinded, livestock killed, fields burned. Nothing lately, though. She may have run into someone smarter or tougher; or - not. She'll be getting on a bit, though; she's pushing forty-five by now."
Eyvind reflected. "Well - not an immediate problem, then, and perhaps not one at all. Who knows, she may even be trying to help us; weakening the Baltic polities, building a power that will ally with us - she was never disloyal, Anja. Headstrong, but loyal. Let's think of matters closer to home. What next?"
"Ah." Geir frowned, staring into the fire. "I've thought about that, and I think there are two answers. First, foreign policy. I believe the time has come to conquer Sweden. We have, now, a strong base in a fairly unified Norway, with Ynglings in many powerful positions. Let's push on."
"Fair enough," Eyvind nodded, "I can get behind that. Axes and shields, it'll be interesting. And the other?"
"Domestic politics. I think the Secret Hird made a mistake, which we should rectify."
"What mistake?"
"The pure, male-descended blood. Consider: Here we sit, six of us, all Ynglings. And nobody knows it but us. If we follow our instructions, our own descendants will be ground into poverty and submission! Unless of course they are female, and lucky enough to marry into the Yngling line. It cannot stand, Eyvind; none of us who got sent back will stand for it. And what's more, it can't possibly work: We cannot guide the politics of a Norway that allows only pure-blooded Ynglings into the upper class, if we are not acknowledged as pure-blooded Ynglings! So... someone writing that document had a rush of blood in a downwards direction, and let the Destiny and Will of the Yngling People overrule any actual thinking about what's possible. You know what I'm talking about?"
Eyvind nodded, slowly. He'd seen it happen, of course: Ynglings so devoted to the idea of themselves as the master race that they forgot the long centuries of calculation, loss-cutting, and desperate fighting that had gotten them even to the precarious dominance they had in the uptime. There was a whole genre of literature that served them, power-porn as they called it. The Secret Hird had tried to recruit only the cold-bloodedly realistic - if nothing else, the powermongers tended to the assumption that Norway could win a nuclear exchange, so they wouldn't be too attracted by a way to avoid that war - but it wasn't hard to imagine one slipping through the cracks, and carrying along whatever committee had written those objectives by sheer rhetoric. After all, it was an ideal, that all Ynglings should be descended from King Olav; it was just that nobody had thought about how that ideal would affect the agents sent back, and their descendants.
"All right, I see the problem, right enough. I don't fancy being a stril, or my sons being strils, any more than you do. So what do you propose to do?"
"I think we need to get out of the trap we got ourselves into, uptime. four-fifths of our population couldn't fight because we didn't trust them; and the rest couldn't do anything but fight because they had to keep a lid on! And you saw what happened: China could grow around us, because sure, the Party skimmed off the best of everything, but at least it was possible to get into the elite. So... I think we need to do away with the whole thing. No more Ynglings, no more strils, just Norse. We're all in it together, we'd better behave that way."
Eyvind blinked, shocked; never mind Liberal, here was Radical beyond Radical, a doctrine to overturn worlds and nations. And yet, wasn't that precisely what they had done? Truly, it was a new world; anything was possible here. And yet: "But in that case... why? Why fight to make Norway supreme, if not because we'll rule in it? We might as well settle down on farms and make children, and wait for, I don't know, the Burgundians to buy Denmark."
Geir sighed, sinking back down into his chair. 'Yes... I know. Well. We'll still have strils; I don't see a way around that. Nobody with the ambition and aggression it took to get sent back here will stand for any sort of egalitarianism, either. Even now, we don't have a really clean slate; we still have to pay for our fathers' choices. Even now... But we can make the same choice as them. And we can make it before we are forced to, and so reap larger benefits. Listen: In the uptime, after the Twenty Years' War, 'Yngling' meant "anyone who speaks Norse and fought in the war". It didn't have anything to do with the bloodline. Well, they had to do it that way. It was either that, or a civil war that would tear Norway apart. And why? Because there were never enough Ynglings. And there never were, at any time, in the uptime history. It was the same every time the franchise was expanded: We had absolutely no choice, we had to have more Ynglings - more upper-class fighters. So first it was female descent, and freeing any slave who would fight, and then marriage licenses for strils, and childlessness taxes, and marriage licenses handed out like candy - and at last the Great Emancipation. Forced, every time; and because it always came at the last minute, it was always just enough to get us over the crisis. Well, I say we learn from that. Let's forget about Yngling blood, we never enforced it anyway when push came to shove. Let's talk about Norse blood. Let's have a large fighting population right from the start, and not find ourselves forced to fight huge political battles to expand it every time we have a war, and get just enough people just in time. Let's consider every man of Norse descent just as good as ourselves, and work from there to subjugate the rest of Europe. There are strils enough outside Norway; let's not find any inside."
There was silence then. Geir's sons stood around their father, hulking men in peak physical condition, facing Eyvind; the fire glinted in their eyes. Eyvind felt no intimidation; they needed his conviction, not his mere forced cooperation. Even so, it was clear that five-sixths of the adult, male Ynglings in the land were of one mind in this; and that had to weigh in his decision. He turned it over in his mind, but could not get a grip on it; it was too large a revolution.
"I... will need time, to think. You may be right. But I cannot say at this moment."
Geir nodded. "Yes, of course. I've had fifty years, and it is a large thought. Think, then."
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