At least that's typical- waiting for telephone companies to install the stuff! Hurry those Dreadnaughts. Oh these blue countries, no sense of border identification.
-
We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Hi, long time lurker, first time poster! This is actually the first time I caught up with this AAR's current updates, even though I've been slowly reading it for months... Telephones are a must but don't bother with refineries - in 1.1 nothing requires fuel (corrected in 1.2) so there's practically no demand for it. Considering you're up against France (typically second only to the UK in global power projection), Siam is doing great! Dreadnoughts should tip the balance (although cruisers seem to be working alright already) allowing you to at least get a white peace, even if much of your Middle East is overrun.
I haven't posted here in a while so I comment to let you know you have several lurkers that appreciate your AARing. (On a game note, you are doing extremely well.)
You are more optimistic than I would be about that war with France. 
I wonder if a peace deal with the Turks will give you enough additional forces to turn the tide of war, or if it's merely going to result in more Thai people dying at the hands of the French...
I wonder if a peace deal with the Turks will give you enough additional forces to turn the tide of war, or if it's merely going to result in more Thai people dying at the hands of the French...
Utrecht? Have you not seen the Spanish fight in that area? Don't you know no one can ever win in the Lowlands?
(Ignore all evidence contrary to my thesis when answering the above questions.)
(Ignore all evidence contrary to my thesis when answering the above questions.
)
You are more optimistic than I would be about that war with France.
Well, at this time I would assume his massive manpower comes from conquered lands, so unless they assimilate they are an mix of races.
It had become my practice, since about 1840 or 50, to station small picket fleets around the approaches to Siamese home territory during periods of wartime. That way they would act as a “canary” or a “tripwire” to sound the alarm and let me know if the enemy were approaching my shores. Often, these were sailing ships, because they weren’t intended necessarily to stop the enemy fleet – just to give warning. And so, even in 1924, the picket fleet in the Straits of Malucca were sailing ships – old wooden frigates – so that I wouldn’t have to spare valuable warships for such duties.
In early November, they sounded the warning (using radios, ironically!), that a fleet of French cruisers and monitors was steaming into the straits, heading for our home waters.
They engaged, such as that was, and then retreated as a fleet of somewhat obsolete ironclads arrived, followed by another.
Around the other side of the world, while the fear and drama of possible invasion happened closer to home, our troops finally secured the Belearic Islands, off the southern coast of France.
Two main battles continued to rage against the Ottomans. One in Ankara, one of the targets of conquest, and the other at Bulgarian Petrich, in the Balkans. In both cases, the Turks were suffering badly, and wouldn’t be able to stand for much longer. All around them, Siamese armies were conquering provinces and bringing the war closer to a close.
Having captured the Belearics, troops were also landed in Corsica, where again there were no French defenders. The blockade of French ports continued, the most important of which was Marseilles, which brought in .3 Warscore just by itself, so long as it was blockaded.
Back home, the stopgap battle of 15 Ironclads reached its end, as two of the Ironclads had been sunk, and the rest could not continue the battle. They were exhausted, and retreated into port. More fleets were en route, from Japan and Korea, to hold up the advance of the enemy fleet. But for now, they were on the loose again.
But good news arrived from the east, and buoyed the hopes of the worried Siamese leaders. On December 2nd, peace was finally achieved against the Ottoman Turks. They gave up everything that had been asked in the war – two major, industrialized provinces, and they accepted humiliation (which doesn’t count for much in the late game, but so what?).
The Great Power arrangement was not greatly altered by the war – not obviously, at first, anyway. Siam remained in 4th place, far from the 3rd place Americans. The Ottomans remained in 5th place. But if you look closely, they were very near to being passed up by the Austrians, and even perhaps by the Russians.
The small Siamese enclave in eastern Asia Minor grew to become a massive chunk out of lands that had been Turkish-held for centuries.
The French incursions to the south, in Arabia, meanwhile, were minimal, and were being contained.
The two states we had acquired from the Ottomans had been packed with factories before the war. For some reason – I still haven’t figured out why – the factories in Ankara were destroyed, but the ones in Konya were intact. That would be helpful.
Taking a step back now, to late November, I want to explain what was happening in the Arabian Peninsula, as Siamese armies freed from combat in the Ottoman Empire – troops who were no longer needed for the conflict – arrived in Jaffa and began marching inland to make a counterattack.
As they were marching, however, the futility of that attack became apparent, and another plan emerged.
Troop transports, carrying troops from the Ottoman war, had landed them along the coast of Hedjaz, and these had filtered out across the desert in small groups (to avoid attrition), and had occupied most of the French-held provinces of Arabia.
And meanwhile, our main army heading south from Amman was angling toward Tabuk, rather than toward the battle in Kaf. Siamese troops at Kaf would be able to hold them for a while – that was their job, and it wasn’t a happy one. But this would allow Gen. Chao Nitithala, who was an expert at defensive fighting, would be entrenched in the mountains of Tabuk when the French army came back to defend its own territory.
In early November, they sounded the warning (using radios, ironically!), that a fleet of French cruisers and monitors was steaming into the straits, heading for our home waters.
They engaged, such as that was, and then retreated as a fleet of somewhat obsolete ironclads arrived, followed by another.
Around the other side of the world, while the fear and drama of possible invasion happened closer to home, our troops finally secured the Belearic Islands, off the southern coast of France.
Two main battles continued to rage against the Ottomans. One in Ankara, one of the targets of conquest, and the other at Bulgarian Petrich, in the Balkans. In both cases, the Turks were suffering badly, and wouldn’t be able to stand for much longer. All around them, Siamese armies were conquering provinces and bringing the war closer to a close.
Having captured the Belearics, troops were also landed in Corsica, where again there were no French defenders. The blockade of French ports continued, the most important of which was Marseilles, which brought in .3 Warscore just by itself, so long as it was blockaded.
Back home, the stopgap battle of 15 Ironclads reached its end, as two of the Ironclads had been sunk, and the rest could not continue the battle. They were exhausted, and retreated into port. More fleets were en route, from Japan and Korea, to hold up the advance of the enemy fleet. But for now, they were on the loose again.
But good news arrived from the east, and buoyed the hopes of the worried Siamese leaders. On December 2nd, peace was finally achieved against the Ottoman Turks. They gave up everything that had been asked in the war – two major, industrialized provinces, and they accepted humiliation (which doesn’t count for much in the late game, but so what?).
The Great Power arrangement was not greatly altered by the war – not obviously, at first, anyway. Siam remained in 4th place, far from the 3rd place Americans. The Ottomans remained in 5th place. But if you look closely, they were very near to being passed up by the Austrians, and even perhaps by the Russians.
The small Siamese enclave in eastern Asia Minor grew to become a massive chunk out of lands that had been Turkish-held for centuries.
The French incursions to the south, in Arabia, meanwhile, were minimal, and were being contained.
The two states we had acquired from the Ottomans had been packed with factories before the war. For some reason – I still haven’t figured out why – the factories in Ankara were destroyed, but the ones in Konya were intact. That would be helpful.
Taking a step back now, to late November, I want to explain what was happening in the Arabian Peninsula, as Siamese armies freed from combat in the Ottoman Empire – troops who were no longer needed for the conflict – arrived in Jaffa and began marching inland to make a counterattack.
As they were marching, however, the futility of that attack became apparent, and another plan emerged.
Troop transports, carrying troops from the Ottoman war, had landed them along the coast of Hedjaz, and these had filtered out across the desert in small groups (to avoid attrition), and had occupied most of the French-held provinces of Arabia.
And meanwhile, our main army heading south from Amman was angling toward Tabuk, rather than toward the battle in Kaf. Siamese troops at Kaf would be able to hold them for a while – that was their job, and it wasn’t a happy one. But this would allow Gen. Chao Nitithala, who was an expert at defensive fighting, would be entrenched in the mountains of Tabuk when the French army came back to defend its own territory.
Good result in the Ottoman War. I blame dastardly French agents for the loss of factories in Ankara. That and the fact that your and Ottoman troops had been fighting over the provinces for so many months.
Good that the French fleet has sailed/steamed into Siamese home waters ready to meet and greet the first dreadnaughts.
What are your objectives against the French?
Good that the French fleet has sailed/steamed into Siamese home waters ready to meet and greet the first dreadnaughts.
What are your objectives against the French?
Last edited:
The battle of Tabuk, something I think will be included in the Chao of Arabia movie.
At least there are no transports attached to the French fleet, so no impending invasion of the homeland - yet.
Good job winding things up with the Ottos.
Good job winding things up with the Ottos.
Good job ending the Ottoman war at last. And will occupying those provinces and/or besieging them have any serious affect on the supply line of the French troops in Arabia?
So far, so good. I had thought that the sea battle was prelude to a French invasion, but luckily no sign of that yet.
Just don't get greedy and start adding acquire state wargoals!
Just don't get greedy and start adding acquire state wargoals!
Good result against the Ottoman Empire. Do you reckon the Frenchies will try a landing close to home?
Indeed!
I really should have foreseen this, and followed the track to Telephones earlier, but I didn't. Oh well -- neither did anyone else! Thanks, Selzro! Welcome! I don't think I'm going to have Dreadnoughts ready by the end of this conflict (unless I drag it out..... which I wouldn't do!
). And I think you've seen in a subsequent update that the French aren't quite that powerful on the Arabian Peninsula. Still going to be a difficult peace to come out of intact!Excellent, VictorianPrince! Great to see you're still here. I'll be lurking and sometimes commenting in yours, too.
You are more optimistic than I would be about that war with France.
I think in the update just after your comment you started to see what might be a turning of the tide. But yes, even the ending of the Ottoman war may not be enough...
Utrecht? Have you not seen the Spanish fight in that area? Don't you know no one can ever win in the Lowlands?
(Ignore all evidence contrary to my thesis when answering the above questions.
Do you think I'd be able to make that stick at a court martial? It was, of course, very unwise for him to have accepted battle there, and so....
Yes, I got tremendous numbers of troops from Egypt, Somalia and further south into the African interior. The Siamese Army is VERY integrated and diverse at this point.
Thanks! Yes, it could have been some collateral damage thing -- the Battle of Ankara took a long time, with comparably little happening in Konya. I wish I had Dreadnoughts to meet the French -- still waiting on Telephone Factories, unfortunately. Objectives? Peace on the best terms possible -- don't expect much!
Great idea! Lu lu lu lu lu lu!
Yes, I was very relieved when I realized that was just a force of warships -- THOSE I can deal with. Transports landing troops are another matter.
Thanks! Victoria doesn't track supply -- surrounding enemy forces can cause them to be eliminated if you force them to retreat after a battle (there's nowhere to go!), but they don't go out of supply in the HOI 3 sense.
Yeah, I was glad about that too!
Acquire State wargoals? Why, of course not! I think they're going to try. But I don't see their ships yet. Frankly, I'm not sure how they got this fleet past my fleets in the Mideast region.
Assumptions, assumptions!
I'll see if I can use them more usefully than that.Hey, another update coming up relatively soon! This week, anyway. Probably midweek. Thanks for your comments and readership!
Rensslaer
So that's the plan. Get out of the war as quickly as possible. Can't you offer to be humiliated? Seems the quickest way out. Meaningless at this stage. I suspect the French fleet was on Madagascar. That's one place you should definitely target in your next war with them.
To be honest, I don't remember (yet) how I got out of the war!
I might have taken your advice, or I might have found a different way. Madagascar isn't French in this game -- I think it may even be independent. But definitely not French. They have a small base at Bourbon, but I'm not sure they had ships there. I think they probably slipped through a hole in my defenses somewhere.Update coming at lunch today, which means about 3-4 hours from now....
Rensslaer
Before we continue to examine the war with France, I want to mention that, of course, other priorities continue if they do not take away from the war effort. The Ottomans, whose war we recently completed, have been expanding south through Africa fast. Very fast! But not fast enough.
By stationing troops in a potential colony nearby our most recently settled lands, we've increased our rate of colonization, and so even though the Turks were there first, there's a good chance (well, every chance) that Siam will get the Mombassa area before the Ottomans do. We're trying to cut them off from further southward expansion -- to build a wall against their expansion so they can't reach the southern half of Africa. We will succeed if we can grab these colonies faster by using troops (the Ottomans' troop levels seem to be somewhat down, lately -).
While war with France still rages in Arabia, most of the fighting is being done at sea. They've reached as far as Hainan (off the coast of Hanoi) and even Japan before the end of 1924, where our reserve naval forces and even a Chinese navy (off Hainan) fought them -- not enough to kill them, but enough to weaken.
We've placed a naval "redoubt" of 42 ships near the Red Sea to contain any French attempts to exit into the Indian Ocean. We're also using every ship we can throw at them to block the Straits of Malacca. In every battle, often with ironclads facing off against more modern monitors or cruisers, we're gradually losing in a one-on-one face-off, but so long as we cycle our ships out when they get too close to being sunk, and bring in fresh reinforcements, we're holding them at bay (or out of bay - no pun intended). As shown below, when ships are about to be sunk, we retreat them into port, select out those ships that can still fight and send them back out, while the ships near to sinking remain in our Naval Base to repair.
The French organization and strength is being whittled down, and we have more ships than they do.
We have troops occupying the Belearic Isles and Corsica, troops fighting for Bourbon (that little island off the coast of Madagascar), and in Arabia. But we're looking for more ways to land and have effect against French-occupied land, and there was a plan I formulated against Algeria. Quite a clever plan, I thought, but one which relied on some contingencies I couldn't know until I landed...
Ack! The plan was to land at Algiers -- the only coastal place where the French didn't have an army waiting -- and to slip quickly into the mountains just south of the coast. This would allow us good defensive position to attract their attention, distracting them from the coast where we could land more troops, and we'd be getting favorable casualty ratios in the interior while we added more troops in waves.
That was the plan. I wasn't ready to find a large French army already stationed in the mountains where we needed to go, and I was a little surprised by how quickly the nearby coastal armies responded. I had no time to set up, and so a battle ensued.
The casualty ratio wasn't horrible -- not really -- when they attacked. Not when you consider they outnumbered me 8:1. But in the long run it was not sustainable, and though I could throw another 2-3 similar-size armies in there quickly, I decided it was not worth the slaughter, or the risk of losing (in terms of warscore). I backed out as soon as I could (after 1 week).
As you can see in the above screenshot, the French attacked me in the seas off Mallorca and the Belearic Isles. Their regional superiority was hard to blunt, right next to their home ports, and so although we maintained about a 2/3 blockade of all of her ports, we were challenged here and there.
The naval battles where we had an edge, we stayed in combat and fought. Where we didn't have an edge, we inflicted as much damage as possible, then withdrew.
And so it was with these battles near the Red Sea (Obokk), in the Med (Mallorca), and off Africa (Cote D'Azur). Our losses were generally older ironclads, and so no great loss. The French losses were none sunk, but many damaged, and much organization reduced. We finally could not sustain the battle to protect our Siamese coasts from the French fleet there (there were now 3 of their fleets working off our Asian coasts). We fled into port.
You might remember, from last update, that we had sent a medium-size army into the mountains of Tabuk with Gen. Chao Nitithada as a defensive expert to inflict casualties against the French. The French army had moved south from Kaf to defend Tabuk, and it happened just as we had planned -- better, in fact!
If you look at those combat numbers, that's effectively a Siamese die roll of 9 versus a modified French die roll of -4. The result, considering their Tactics advantage and other considerations, was a slow but steady reduction in their power without really touching us. We could have hoped for better casualty infliction, but this would do.
Meanwhile, throughout the rest of the Arabian peninsula, we were prevailing. Mecca fell, and Nejd, and Medina.
The French had pursued us into Oman (while our troops then slipped behind them and began occupying their rear), and thanks to our forts there we're maintaining a good war of attrition there as well. The French could not hope to win in a battle styled so. Not regionally, anyway.
By mid-March, the French had +11 Warscore against us. Our blockades and conquests and our few won battles were whittling that down, slowly – they’d grabbed as much Warscore as they could against us and now that we’d retreated out of the Netherlands (Utrecht is the one battle that killed us and increased French Warscore, primarily), they had reached their high-water mark – for us, it was only up from here!
In winning the battle of Tabuk, we actually picked up .6 warscore, which was handy (it made up for all of our lost naval battles -- I'll take that). The French retreated into Medina, where our battle resumed.
Speaking of the naval war, you can see that though we may be losing the battles, we're winning the war. The French navy is significantly reduced in strength and organization! Both off the Arabian coast and off Korea, this is obvious. If we keep this up....
Worldwide, our strategy was beginning to overcome our early defeats. The island of Bourbon fell. We won at Medina. Most of French Arabia was now occupied by Siam, and the rest was under siege. The only effective French army in the region was stuck in a hopeless battle in Oman, where it was outnumbered and couldn't effectively retreat.
On the diplomatic front, we even snatched Two Sicilies out of the Ottoman sphere (not into ours -- yet -- but good enough, and progress made).
By stationing troops in a potential colony nearby our most recently settled lands, we've increased our rate of colonization, and so even though the Turks were there first, there's a good chance (well, every chance) that Siam will get the Mombassa area before the Ottomans do. We're trying to cut them off from further southward expansion -- to build a wall against their expansion so they can't reach the southern half of Africa. We will succeed if we can grab these colonies faster by using troops (the Ottomans' troop levels seem to be somewhat down, lately -
).While war with France still rages in Arabia, most of the fighting is being done at sea. They've reached as far as Hainan (off the coast of Hanoi) and even Japan before the end of 1924, where our reserve naval forces and even a Chinese navy (off Hainan) fought them -- not enough to kill them, but enough to weaken.
We've placed a naval "redoubt" of 42 ships near the Red Sea to contain any French attempts to exit into the Indian Ocean. We're also using every ship we can throw at them to block the Straits of Malacca. In every battle, often with ironclads facing off against more modern monitors or cruisers, we're gradually losing in a one-on-one face-off, but so long as we cycle our ships out when they get too close to being sunk, and bring in fresh reinforcements, we're holding them at bay (or out of bay - no pun intended). As shown below, when ships are about to be sunk, we retreat them into port, select out those ships that can still fight and send them back out, while the ships near to sinking remain in our Naval Base to repair.
The French organization and strength is being whittled down, and we have more ships than they do.
We have troops occupying the Belearic Isles and Corsica, troops fighting for Bourbon (that little island off the coast of Madagascar), and in Arabia. But we're looking for more ways to land and have effect against French-occupied land, and there was a plan I formulated against Algeria. Quite a clever plan, I thought, but one which relied on some contingencies I couldn't know until I landed...
Ack! The plan was to land at Algiers -- the only coastal place where the French didn't have an army waiting -- and to slip quickly into the mountains just south of the coast. This would allow us good defensive position to attract their attention, distracting them from the coast where we could land more troops, and we'd be getting favorable casualty ratios in the interior while we added more troops in waves.
That was the plan. I wasn't ready to find a large French army already stationed in the mountains where we needed to go, and I was a little surprised by how quickly the nearby coastal armies responded. I had no time to set up, and so a battle ensued.
The casualty ratio wasn't horrible -- not really -- when they attacked. Not when you consider they outnumbered me 8:1. But in the long run it was not sustainable, and though I could throw another 2-3 similar-size armies in there quickly, I decided it was not worth the slaughter, or the risk of losing (in terms of warscore). I backed out as soon as I could (after 1 week).
As you can see in the above screenshot, the French attacked me in the seas off Mallorca and the Belearic Isles. Their regional superiority was hard to blunt, right next to their home ports, and so although we maintained about a 2/3 blockade of all of her ports, we were challenged here and there.
The naval battles where we had an edge, we stayed in combat and fought. Where we didn't have an edge, we inflicted as much damage as possible, then withdrew.
And so it was with these battles near the Red Sea (Obokk), in the Med (Mallorca), and off Africa (Cote D'Azur). Our losses were generally older ironclads, and so no great loss. The French losses were none sunk, but many damaged, and much organization reduced. We finally could not sustain the battle to protect our Siamese coasts from the French fleet there (there were now 3 of their fleets working off our Asian coasts). We fled into port.
You might remember, from last update, that we had sent a medium-size army into the mountains of Tabuk with Gen. Chao Nitithada as a defensive expert to inflict casualties against the French. The French army had moved south from Kaf to defend Tabuk, and it happened just as we had planned -- better, in fact!
If you look at those combat numbers, that's effectively a Siamese die roll of 9 versus a modified French die roll of -4. The result, considering their Tactics advantage and other considerations, was a slow but steady reduction in their power without really touching us. We could have hoped for better casualty infliction, but this would do.
Meanwhile, throughout the rest of the Arabian peninsula, we were prevailing. Mecca fell, and Nejd, and Medina.
The French had pursued us into Oman (while our troops then slipped behind them and began occupying their rear), and thanks to our forts there we're maintaining a good war of attrition there as well. The French could not hope to win in a battle styled so. Not regionally, anyway.
By mid-March, the French had +11 Warscore against us. Our blockades and conquests and our few won battles were whittling that down, slowly – they’d grabbed as much Warscore as they could against us and now that we’d retreated out of the Netherlands (Utrecht is the one battle that killed us and increased French Warscore, primarily), they had reached their high-water mark – for us, it was only up from here!
In winning the battle of Tabuk, we actually picked up .6 warscore, which was handy (it made up for all of our lost naval battles -- I'll take that). The French retreated into Medina, where our battle resumed.
Speaking of the naval war, you can see that though we may be losing the battles, we're winning the war. The French navy is significantly reduced in strength and organization! Both off the Arabian coast and off Korea, this is obvious. If we keep this up....
Worldwide, our strategy was beginning to overcome our early defeats. The island of Bourbon fell. We won at Medina. Most of French Arabia was now occupied by Siam, and the rest was under siege. The only effective French army in the region was stuck in a hopeless battle in Oman, where it was outnumbered and couldn't effectively retreat.
On the diplomatic front, we even snatched Two Sicilies out of the Ottoman sphere (not into ours -- yet -- but good enough, and progress made).
The Ottomans have merely moved their nefarious plans over to Africa from Asia, I assume to regain before they try for Asia again. I suspect they have a stooge at a high level in the French Civil Service who nudges the political decision makers towards policies that advance Ottoman interests. The age old Franco-Turk alliance.