A Paradox Employee Contacted Me Regarding Current Backlash on Forum

[Irushian]

Templates could easily work with districts as well.

 

[Coconut_Cookie]

You only have to design a few templates(Research,Alloys,Consumer Goods,Admin,Unity) that's not micro and would only take a few minutes at the start of the game.That's far less that what I would spend on actually managing the planets .

Templates can work in a game like Moo2 because you have less resources there. If you want templates to work in Stellaris the economy should be static (which it currently mostly is) but wouldn't it be more fun if the market would have some influence on your internal economy? The only times I've seen templates in games like these is as a band aid for a lot of pointless micro, I'd rather see the actual problem adressed. The actual problem is that the player needs to build and upgrade everything on their own that adds to a lot of small pointless decisions. Of course you want your pops to be employed and housed.

Templates could easily work with districts as well.

Absolutely true. But if the only things the player would need to do was to choose the districs and build a few infrastructure buildings would take a huge load of low level decision making off the player. An infrastructure building could be something like silos, an academy (civilian or military). The bonus these buidings could give is allow for a percentage of your pops to get a higher level job so you would want those buildings on densely populated planets.

The building slots that are "zoned" in the districts you choose could then have buildings that only spawn ones certain needs are met. For example certain new industrial buildings could require an academy, access to a certain set of (special) resources. This should reduce micro, would allow future expansions to add economic events it also shouldn't be too hard to teach the ai to use.

Edit: I don't think a planet should ever be "done". If all the essential buildings would have infinit levels to get upgraded a planet could have an infinite number of jobs and housing space. The aim of this would be that empires can organically transition from wide to tall and vice versa. A major advantage in this case could be that there could be events or mechanics that relocate pops of conquered worlds to worlds that are still in control of their original empire. There would be a bit less planet specialization for regular resources but it could allow empires to not immediately crash and burn after losing 1 war. It would enhance role play if losing a single war would not mean the end of a game for the player too.

 

[Cat_Fuzz]

RE: Templates - ironically this does kind of exist already, albeit they are not player created, and due to issues with the AI (natch), they don't build properly.

If they were to re-address the construction queues of planet focuses, and the AI could use them effectively then we'd already have what people are asking for in game.

 

[Tech Noir Synth]

I don't get why people are so fixated on this. If pop control/migration system was working in the first place (marking planet as "done" to have it contribute its entire growth to migration pool instead), there'd be no need for crunches like resettlement.

I have been saying the same thing for years. Automatic migration is already in the game. Growth gets reduced on one planet and gets added to another.

But why does this not work once my planets are fully developed? I have build all the housing I can, all the jobs, all the districts. The planet is finished. Why does the growth not get funnelled into my other planets?

Its such an easy fix. Change it so that something like 80% or 90% of pop growth, or maybe 60% gets funnelled into other planets. The rest, you simply discard and pops no longer growth on that planet when it has no more housing and jobs. No one would have to do any horrendous micromanagement once a planet is fully developed.

Why is this not a thing???

 

[Olterin]

Its such an easy fix. Change it so that something like 80% or 90% of pop growth, or maybe 60% gets funnelled into other planets. The rest, you simply discard and pops no longer growth on that planet when it has no more housing and jobs. No one would have to do any horrendous micromanagement once a planet is fully developed.

Why is this not a thing???

The even worse part is, it kind of already is. If you don't have population controls allowed, you can pass a planetary decision that stunts planetary growth and gives a massive emigration push to make the rest move off-world. It's just ... the decision as is is kind of useless, since it slashes pop growth by 75% multiplicatively first and puts the remaining 95% of growth into the migration pool second. If only the order were reversed ... I'm not sure if the pop control decision that you get with population controls enabled was supposed to do the same, considering that it also does have an emigration push modifier, iirc, so uh, yeah... Yeah...

It's not even asking for new stuff, it's asking for stuff that's supposed to already be in the game

 

[sillyrobot]

The even worse part is, it kind of already is. If you don't have population controls allowed, you can pass a planetary decision that stunts planetary growth and gives a massive emigration push to make the rest move off-world. It's just ... the decision as is is kind of useless, since it slashes pop growth by 75% multiplicatively first and puts the remaining 95% of growth into the migration pool second. If only the order were reversed ... I'm not sure if the pop control decision that you get with population controls enabled was supposed to do the same, considering that it also does have an emigration push modifier, iirc, so uh, yeah... Yeah...

It's not even asking for new stuff, it's asking for stuff that's supposed to already be in the game

Even then it ends up useless because it both costs enough influence that a decent-size empire takes decades of influence gain to pay for the decisions and there is a relatively low cap on the immigration side per colony.

 

[Olterin]

Even then it ends up useless because it both costs enough influence that a decent-size empire takes decades of influence gain to pay for the decisions and there is a relatively low cap on the immigration side per colony.

Those are thankfully all easy problems to solve, should such a solution actually be desired. And yes, I absolutely agree, the decisions are entirely worthless right now, I just wished to point out that they do exist, so clearly there was design intent to allow us to funnel growth around using migration like that. It just doesn't work ... like, at all.

 

[Kayden_II]

Any new news from this other platform from this guy or girl who's just stating that he or she works for Paradox ?

Otherwise: *Still awaits an interaction out of Paradox HERE before I act like a dog that gets thrown a bone to*

I mean for my taste, a lot of you ( no insult(s) intended ) are too hasty that you're already concentrating your energy and time by pointing out your stuff ( concerns, suggestions, solutions and argumentations with or against each other ). That's not that new and literally the subsequent reaction(s) from a thrown bone. I would still concentrate to get an interaction out of Paradox and at best, HERE since this "contact" looks still not that serious to me. Otherwise I've the suspicion that this thread will follow the usual pattern: All the stuff above gets pointed out, but this thread goes then down to page number 02 and is a little while later completely forgotten so that Paradox can still act clueless when the very same stuff arises days, weeks, months or years later again and again and again. Side-Note: Remember how inadequate the search-function of this forum is and how it's considered as "necroing" ( pun intended ) to pull out a thread like this one afterwards.

 

[HugsAndSnuggles]

The even worse part is, it kind of already is. If you don't have population controls allowed, you can pass a planetary decision that stunts planetary growth and gives a massive emigration push to make the rest move off-world. It's just ... the decision as is is kind of useless, since it slashes pop growth by 75% multiplicatively first and puts the remaining 95% of growth into the migration pool second. If only the order were reversed ... I'm not sure if the pop control decision that you get with population controls enabled was supposed to do the same, considering that it also does have an emigration push modifier, iirc, so uh, yeah... Yeah...

It's not even asking for new stuff, it's asking for stuff that's supposed to already be in the game

The fix is even more trivial: removing pop growth reduction from those decisions would make them usable (in case of pop growth control it stops all growth, adding a stronger push, IIRC). Of course, it would also require removal (or revision) of immigration cap (which, currently, is applied after the growth was drawn from the pool) - no idea why it was added in one of the follow-up patches to 2.2, but its execution is sloppy and usefulness is questionable.

 

[Zagreb 887]

Any new news from this other platform from this guy or girl who's just stating that he or she works for Paradox ?

Otherwise: *Still awaits an interaction out of Paradox HERE before I act like a dog that gets thrown a bone to*

I mean for my taste, a lot of you ( no insult(s) intended ) are too hasty that you're already concentrating your energy and time by pointing out your stuff ( concerns, suggestions, solutions and argumentations with or against each other ). That's not that new and literally the subsequent reaction(s) from a thrown bone. I would still concentrate to get an interaction out of Paradox and at best, HERE since this "contact" looks still not that serious to me. Otherwise I've the suspicion that this thread will follow the usual pattern: All the stuff above gets pointed out, but this thread goes then down to page number 02 and is a little while later completely forgotten so that Paradox can still act clueless when the very same stuff arises days, weeks, months or years later again and again and again. Side-Note: Remember how inadequate the search-function of this forum is and how it's considered as "necroing" ( pun intended ) to pull out a thread like this one afterwards.

On a optimistic note, it's like they pretend to acknowledge the problems, we can see it as a form of progress, compared to their usual deafness with game issues isn't it?

More seriously, I think we should wait maybe a week or two to have an official communication about all of this, be it to sincerely address all the concerns and give us a route plan, or to drown the fish one more time...

But you're probably right, maybe they just wait for this thread to reach the necropolis of page 2, or they just will create another quarantine mega thread "the game is broken"

 

[pliznobn]

But you're probably right, maybe they just wait for this thread to reach the necropolis of page 2, or they just will create another quarantine mega thread "the game is broken"

With the way the mods here have been behaving, a "criticism megathread" would not surprise me.

 

[ImperatorDecens]

My main issue is that Fleet Manager & Recruitment bugs where the game thinks you are at full strength when you are actually only say 44 out of 50 ships.

I think the UI for that and the Shipyard selection for ships could be vastly improved.

 

[MichaelJanuary]

Some want to get rid of the notification spam, others, like me, rely upon it to micro their empire properly.

Its not that we want to get rid of notifications, its that they are intrusive (especially the popup ones). Put it in a message history so you can attend to it at your convenience,, or add the icons to the outliner for things like low stability, high crime. Preferably show the numerical values, so i can tell if its 1 unemployed or 8.

Personally, I would much rather see [[92 pop, 3 unemployed, 2 open build slots, 65% stability, 10% crime]] on the outliner directly without having to open the planet screen. An indicator for how may items in the build queue would be nice, as well as what its currently building.

It would also be great if the outliner display could be configured to show different values (like pop stats OR resource output OR stability OR crime).

I hate referencing other games, but take total war settlement list as an example. You don't have to click every settlement to see how much its producing, or what its happiness levels are, or whether it has open build slots. This is completely configurable, and sortable, with simple icons and 1 or 2 clicks. This is game interface design 101. I should be able to just glance at the outliner to see how much minerals each planet is producing? Or how much energy? Or what the relative stability levels are.

BTW: I get that TW is a turn based game, but these figures can be updated to the outliner once a month, and would still be a helluva lot more useful in the outliner than hidden away on a different screen on a secondary tab under a mouseover.

 

[Coconut_Cookie]

Its not that we want to get rid of notifications, its that they are intrusive (especially the popup ones). Put it in a message history so you can attend to it at your convenience,, or add the icons to the outliner for things like low stability, high crime. Preferably show the numerical values, so i can tell if its 1 unemployed or 8.

Personally, I would much rather see [[92 pop, 3 unemployed, 2 open build slots, 65% stability, 10% crime]] on the outliner directly without having to open the planet screen. An indicator for how may items in the build queue would be nice, as well as what its currently building.

It would also be great if the outliner display could be configured to show different values (like pop stats OR resource output OR stability OR crime).

I hate referencing other games, but take total war settlement list as an example. You don't have to click every settlement to see how much its producing, or what its happiness levels are, or whether it has open build slots. This is completely configurable, and sortable, with simple icons and 1 or 2 clicks. This is game interface design 101. I should be able to just glance at the outliner to see how much minerals each planet is producing? Or how much energy? Or what the relative stability levels are.

BTW: I get that TW is a turn based game, but these figures can be updated to the outliner once a month, and would still be a helluva lot more useful in the outliner than hidden away on a different screen on a secondary tab under a mouseover.

Nearly all the older paradox games have had a ledger menu with nearly all the information you could ever want and a message log in the bottom of the screen. These two things make it sooo much easier to keep track of things without filling the entire screen with a loads of notifications, most of which are irrelevant to the player. A ledger could also keep you informed of things that aren't directly related to you. In EU3 I often use the ledger to keep track of army and fleet sizes of other countries, or to keep track of how wars are going and who could become a potential opponent. While a lot of this information maybe shouldn't be 'free', there should be a way to keep yourself better informed in a more easy way.

 

[Daimonin]

In this thread: People rehashing what has already been said on the forums a million times by hundreds of other people, while the devs... are *totally* listening and making notes on what needs fixing and what can be done to fix it, and I would never even think of suggesting otherwise. If only there were obsessive people on these forums that probably spend more time analyzing the games problems then the entire dev team combined. Oh wait, there is, they do, and they at least used to make good posts on how to negate those problems. Only to be *attentively listened to* by dev/null.

Bah, Stellaris is the reason I haven't bothered with CK3, and possibly never will. Just can't trust Paradox to actually work on the core game when they could sell NEW DLC instead, not to mention after the bait and switch between stellaris at release and now, including the 1.9->2.0 "update".

At the state of the game now, paradox would be better off just rolling back to pre-2.0, and then spending a year or two fixing, tuning, and backporting some of the decent features and changes since then. Or at least just taking a year or two of no dlc, focusing everything on bug fixes, balancing, and proper integration of existing DLC only. But fire-and-forget DLC that barely interacts with the base game, and completely ignores other DLC is their strategy instead so....

 

[TomorrowsHerald]

In this thread: People rehashing what has already been said on the forums a million times by hundreds of other people, while the devs... are *totally* listening and making notes on what needs fixing and what can be done to fix it, and I would never even think of suggesting otherwise. If only there were obsessive people on these forums that probably spend more time analyzing the games problems then the entire dev team combined. Oh wait, there is, they do, and they at least used to make good posts on how to negate those problems. Only to be *attentively listened to* by dev/null.

Bah, Stellaris is the reason I haven't bothered with CK3, and possibly never will. Just can't trust Paradox to actually work on the core game when they could sell NEW DLC instead, not to mention after the bait and switch between stellaris at release and now, including the 1.9->2.0 "update".

At the state of the game now, paradox would be better off just rolling back to pre-2.0, and then spending a year or two fixing, tuning, and backporting some of the decent features and changes since then. Or at least just taking a year or two of no dlc, focusing everything on bug fixes, balancing, and proper integration of existing DLC only. But fire-and-forget DLC that barely interacts with the base game, and completely ignores other DLC is their strategy instead so....

Agreed, there has been a rather excessive proliferation of similarly themed threads but beyond the critique in the Zombie species pack that *might* get a few eyebrows raised, I think the other threads are more therapeutic (I certainly feel better for venting on them). I've been irritated about these problems for a while now but kept my cool in a patient trust for that "big fix around the corner", an attitude I think was commonplace for a lot of forumites that in better times formed the vanguard of Paradox's fan community. There is still a strong craving for Paradox to say everything will be alright (just see the title) but if these threads won't be listened to, they can at the very least help us get all of this crap out of our system.

Blind trust that Paradox will actually support its games and return value for money being one of them.

I think all this represents a growing gap between forumites, paradox, and the changing market they aim to appeal to. I got into Paradox games for grand strategy titles such as Hearts of Iron 2, Darkest Hour, and Victoria 2. Crusader Kings 2 always intimidated me too much to invest in when looking at its infinite list of DLC's and more sandbox RP tone didn't appeal to me all that much, though it was a fun game to play with friends since DLC sharing by the host was possible. Stellaris, however, seemed like a dream come true when announced; the best grand-strategy company (I thought) tackling space, and it represents the only title for which I thus far brought all the DLC because I really thought that they'd go places with it.

Well, you've got to wake up from dreams sometime; Stellaris was never perfect in any state, and while always rather simple and generic, it was more consistent in its direction until 2X (despite its chaotic development stage) I still think that conceptionally the changes of 2X were a good direction, but the lack of consistency and redevelopment of core features rather than the improvement of it and the creation of new ones are directly responsible for the present mess the game is in (nothing proper support couldn't solve, but still) A more general observation for me following HOI4 and CK3 is that Paradox is more interested in developing sandbox then Grand Strategy and that I am not the customer it has in mind anymore.

If given a choice between continuing development from its current state so far as the game makes a profit (regardless of its playability), discontinuing it, and rolling back to 1.9 or 2.1 for redevelopment; I don't think the last of these options is even a possibility. There is no guarantee that they will find better solutions or that there will be a market for it if they do try to re-develop it as the game ages. I don't know what the sales figures are, but last I heard, they were still pretty strong, and so long as they remain so I don't see any pressing reason why they'd consider a change in policy. I have reverted to alternating between 1.9/2.1, but have doubts how representative that attitude is in light of my observation in the prior paragraph.

Like you, while I have looked at CK3 gameplay (which seems pretty good) I haven't bothered to get it; both because it simply isn't my cup of tea, I am a bit short on funds, and also because I do not want to be invested in another Paradox title that I know will fully capitalize on DLC sales; while not necessarily remaining committed to supporting those features after release. For the same reason, unless Stellaris receives the fixes it so desperately needs, I have no intention of purchasing a sequel (I have my eyes on Distant Worlds 2 in that regard) and I wouldn't relent even if they made a copy of Victoria 3 dance the hula in front of me, because I'd have serious doubts as to what apart from branding it would share with its precursor.

Sorry to be by my own admission pretty "salty" in this post, but that is how I feel at the moment.

 

[FlyingPhoenix]

It's interesting both community manager and ambassadors have been conspicuously absent from this discussion. What kind of conversations are occurring in the other media, particularly the discord?

 

[ImaTomato]

Well the subreddit ignores the problem and many people even claim that they fixed performance and I doubt that the Discord is any better.

 

[TomorrowsHerald]

It's interesting both community manager and ambassadors have been conspicuously absent from this discussion. What kind of conversations are occurring in the other media, particularly the discord?

As far as I can tell, the discussions on other platforms amount to:

 

[HugsAndSnuggles]

Well the subreddit ignores the problem and many people even claim that they fixed performance and I doubt that the Discord is any better.

For me, personally, performance, got better over the years. Wouldn't say that it's "fine" (when it comes to default rulesset), but 100-150 years in it's still pretty decent, and current state of the game hardly leaves reasons to play past that point (for me, at least).