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EU4 - Development Diary - 24th of July 2018

Good morning all! What would Tuesday be without an EU4 dev diary? Tragic, I say, so here for the last of the Summer dev diaries while the bulk of the Swedes are on vacation, I bring to you a summary of balance changes coming in the 1.26 Mughal Update. This is not exhaustive (We'll post up the full changelog closer to release) and is about changes made to the game and its existing mechanics, rather than the new stuff we've added. We'll have another Dev Diary in the future to act as a "roundup" of new mechanics and how they work.

Estates:

As we have mentioned before, Estates now cause a disaster at 100% influence rather than 80%. They also no longer have a minimum requirement for land. In addition to this:

- Confiscating estate land now gives a +5 unrest modifier in the province for 15 years. This modifier goes away if you give the land to another estate.
- Confiscating estate land now adds 25 local autonomy in the province that the estate was previously in.
- Advisors generated by Estate interactions now scale in cost depending on estate influence.
- Influence from estate events generally increased.
- Cossack Estate now gains twice as much influence per development in granted provinces.
- The cap for how much development in granted provinces can increase influence is now 50% rather than 40% for all estates.

Trade Nodes:

- Bengal trade now flows into Doab, which in turn flows into Lahore (renamed from Kashmir) undoing the injustice to these nodes.
- General renaming and reshaping of Indian trade nodes (see screenshot)
- The Katsina Trade Node now connects to Ethiopia instead of Alexandria.
- The Ethiopia Trade node now also connects to Aden.
- Coromandel flows straight to the Cape

Trade n stuff.png


In general this means more Indian trade will be able to flow around Africa into Europe without needing massive amounts of control in Aden. Zanzibar isn't quite the slush fund it used to be, but remains lucrative.

Tributaries:

Far away tributaries with no expectation of help or feasible reason to be a subject was something we're looking to change with this update. As such, the AI is no longer interested in establishing new tributary relationships with nations who do not border them. This goes for both asking and receiving requests. Existing tributaries are fine, so Ayutthaya & Khmer won't suddenly want to abandon Ming in 1444.

Speaking of Ming, 1.26 may as well be renamed the Sukhothai update, as declaring an independence war no longer calls in your overlord's Tributary overlord. Sukhothai can now declare war against Ayutthaya without Chinese intervention.

Expansion:

An issue in EU4 that we've long recognised is that conquest is almost always a good idea: you are able to immediately get a financial benefit from land, buff up your own forcelimit, size, trading potential, while at the same time denying your foes that land. We've been wanting to change this so that one has to consider what they conquer with a bit more forethought and with that we turn to your States.

Your maximum number of States is now far more important: If you hold more territories than your state limit, you will face a yearly corruption penalty, currently +0.02 per territory (not per province). For example, if you have a State Limit of 15, you can have up to 15 States AND up to 15 Territories without penalty. Overseas Colonial Regions and Trade Charter Companies are exempt from this calculation. This corruption hit is halved in Easy mode, and entirely absent in Very Easy. Additionally sending Missionaries and cultural conversion are not possible in Territories. You must make them a state to do these.

In conjunction with this, all nations' base state limit has been doubled (up from 5 to 10).

There is a define ALLOWED_TERRITORY_VS_MAX_STATES which allows you to tweak this value in defines.lua

Subjects:

In the interest in encouraging more indirect rule, holding a subject for a long time will gradually reduce their liberty desire. Subjects can now also gain trust with their overlord, instead of having it pinned at 50.
Force Limit Contribution from subjects now scales with the subject's own FL, minimum of +1 + 10% from vassals, +20% from marches.


End Game Tags:

Preventing weird country formations, like Ottomans to Byzantium or Minghals or England to Mughals to Shan to Mughals to Japan is something we're historically not very good at. It generally involves a lot of different file changes and something usually gets overlooked. In script as of 1.26 we now have a scope known as "End game tags" which will prevent most cases of such nations forming other nations (Holy Roman Empire, Rome and Papal States are so special they trump this list, eg: Byzantium can for Rome, Italy can form Holy Roman Empire...).

The current list is:

Mughals
Ottomans
Byzantium
Rome
Holy Roman Empire
Rum
Qing
Russia
Commonwealth
Japan
Yuan
Hindustan
Bharat
Arabia
Papal States
Spain
Great Britain
Italy
Germany
Ming

That's the bulkier of the balance changes. As usual, there will be more nuanced changes in the fine details to come along in the full Changelog, which we will be sharing closer to release.

We are well aware that balance changes can get people worked up and are seldom without contention. I have very fond memories of forums around the the 1.12 release. Remain civil when expressing your feelings over your favourite balance changes as, although I endeavour to explain why we make changes, there are as many opinions as eyeballs in the world. Thanks for your time.

And if Balance Changes are not your cup of tea, let's have a look at some of the other National Idea changes brought along in the 1.26 Update. We'll look over at the Bengal region, where there is now a distinction between The Bangal Sultinate, and the Bengali Minors in the area.

I love U.png


Bengal Sultanate ideas
start =
infantry_power = 0.1
global_manpower_modifier = 0.15

bonus
backrow_artillery_damage = 0.15


bng_combat_piracy =
trade_efficiency = 0.1

"Pirates have infested the waters of the Bay of Bengal for too long. We must protect traders en route to our ports by discovering and eliminating pirate havens along the Arakan coast."

bng_habshi_generals =
army_tradition = 0.5

"Abyssinian slave-soldiers purchased in Arab markets play a significant role as elite infantry soldiers. Those that excel as leaders shall be given greater levels of command, while those who demonstrate exceptional loyalty shall make up the palace guard."

bng_clearing_the_delta =
development_cost = -0.1

"The Bengal Delta contains an immense expanse of potentially very profitable land that goes unexploited due to thick forestation. We must subsidize efforts to clear the forests to make way for new farmlands, cities, and trading posts."


bng_attract_sufis =
idea_cost = -0.1

"Sufis have long been innovators of Islamic thought as well as wise councilors. If we wish to be a leading voice in the future of the Islamic world, we must patronize Sufi lodges and convince the wisest among their order to settle in our domain."

bng_conquest_of_the_gangetic_plain =
leader_land_shock = 1

"To our west are the fertile and populated lands of the Indo-Gangetic Plain. The Sultans of Bengal have long coveted its great cities and vast wealth, but only now as a new and ambitious crop of generals rise to power is our ambition likely to become a reality. We must do all we can to ready our forces for the coming conquest."

bng_rupees =
global_tax_modifier = 0.1

"The lack of a widely adopted standardized currency is stunting the development of Indian commerce. As one of the foremost economic powers in the subcontinent, we are well placed to begin the minting of a new silver coinage with standard weights, which we shall call the rupee."

bng_bengali_industrialization =
global_trade_goods_size_modifier = 0.1

"Bengal is uniquely situated in India to begin a revolution unlike any seen before. We stand poised to exploit new developments in our already world-class textile and shipbuilding industries. Let us begin an industrial revolution!"


Bengali Minors ideas =
start =
merchants = 1
infantry_power = 0.1
}

bonus =
prestige = 1
}


hindu_sufi_syncretism =
religious_unity = 0.5

"Beyond the eastern frontiers of the Islamic world, came Sufi mystics to settle land grants or to commune with nature in Bengal, intermingling with the Hindu population. Cooperation led to extensive land reclamations in forested and marshy areas and helped to introduce new syncretic forms of music, painting, dancing and sculpture reflected in the temples and shrines constructed during this period."

ganges_brahmaputra_confluence =
trade_efficiency = 0.1

"The mighty Ganges and Brahmaputra have traveled far to intermingle and spread out into the Bengal Delta, funneling trade and commerce in its wake. For thousands of years the area around the delta has been a natural place for the easy exchange of goods and ideas."

rice_fields =
global_manpower_modifier = 0.2

"We Bengalis are primarily rice eaters, and the rainfall and soil in the area lends itself to massive surplus rice production, with the mighty silt laden rivers and monsoon allowing for three separate growing and harvest seasons a year."

mustard_oil_ilish_mach =
war_exhaustion_cost = -0.10

"Wars may torch the granaries and markets. The weather may wither or crush the crops in the fields. Elephants and ants may try to eat what we have planted. Give us a little oil, however, and our fish-laden rivers will give us the food we Bengalis desire most!"

jute_production =
#production_efficiency = 0.1

"Native to our region, Jute is a long, soft, shiny vegetable fiber that can be spun into coarse, strong rope, matting or thread. In high demand for its resilience and relatively light weight, we can benefit from its cultivation and production."

opium_fields =
global_tax_modifier = 0.1

"What's that? People will give us gold and silver for our flowers!? The opium of our region is highly prized and easily grown, commanding twice the price of any other opium in the world. Let the trade begin!"

bengali_renaissance =
global_institution_spread = 0.1

"The Bengal Renaissance that took place in this region was a reaction to the encounter and impact of Europeans arriving for not only commerce, but for study, art and scholarship. The Bengal Renaissance blended together Hindu teachings from the past with Western education, politics and law, as well as a re-casting of Bengali culture. This led to a flourishing of the arts and sciences."

And if neither Balance changes nor National Ideas are your thing, well, swing by next week, where we'll talk about that new image you keep seeing in the buildings interface is. There are still a fair few dev diaries to come before Dharma is due to hit the shelves.
 

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Although I'm still wondering how few things will work (can I just switch states to convert ? Will TC be even more OP ? ), I like the idea to make it more difficult to become a big blob.

Some say it's the fun of EU4 to become the big blob. I agree it's fun but, at least for me, it stops being fun when it's too easy.
If you cheese all the bonuses, get a massive state early on, there is no resistance in front of you to make it really fun.
The fun part, at least for me, is reaching this massive power state not using it.
I'll hope those change will make the challenge to be the top power much more interesting.
 
Well that's a shame, games of constant tag switching was one of my favorite things in EUIV.
In my last game I went Ottoman >(kurdish + invite timurid)> Timurids > Mughals > Mamluks > Persia and had a lot of fun.
 
Additionally sending Missionaries and cultural conversion are not possible in Territories. You must make them a state to do these. Additionally sending Missionaries and cultural conversion are not possible in Territories. You must make them a state to do these. this kills the game
Nope, it brings territories in line with trade company land.
 
I agree with many here.

Why buff TC? Seems counter-intuitive.


I don't think limiting religious/culture convert to state core is the right way to go. Culture conversion hardly matter in most run unless you want to min-max how many culture you have to accepted.

Furthermore I agree with many that temporarily turning state without coring is tedious micro-management and harm religious conversion gameplay. I much rather have faster convert speed in state vs territory instead of fully limited to state only.
 
If conversion requires full cores, One Faith is definitely shot. If it only requires stating.. ugh, the micro. I actually did a lot of stating and unstating in my One Faith so I could turn the missionary strength policy on; it isn't a fun bit of micro.

The increase to base number of states will be... er, interesting. Unfortunately I think it will just make the rich richer. Here's a list of what it does for the game start Great Powers:

  • Ming will be able to full core 150 additional development at game start.
  • The Mamluks will be able to integrate Medina, Hejaz, and Fadl and state those lands, while also having all of their original land stated. (An extra 87 development from land they don't have to work for, outside of attacking Medri Bahri. If they successfully take land from QQ or the Ottomans or the Beyliks, that number goes up.
  • France will have eight free state slots at game start. They can already take 89 development within partially owned states at game start. If their eight free slots went to Normandy, Provence, Brittany, Picardy, Burgundy, Wallonia (not counting the province owned by Liege at start), Flanders, and Holland, they would gain 427 stated development on top of that inital 89, for a total of 516 development. One can add a little more if France ends up taking Italian land instead of, say, Flanders or Holland.
  • England will be able to core only one additional state if the devs choose to turn their current territories into states. However, even in this case, they will be able to take 83 full core development in those states (Leinster, Picardy, Vasconia, and The Isles).
  • The Ottomans will be able to core nine additional full states at game start instead of four. So, instead of full coring (as an example) Karaman, Morea, Dulkadir, and Cukurova (136 development, all but one province of which is accepted/primary culture), they could core the four states already mentioned, Aleppo, Syria, Palestine, Bahari, and Delta (360 additional development, of which 352 will be accepted/primary culture if they accept Egyptian). This does not count Constantinople, either of Candar's provinces, or stuff in Albania, which brings the count to 422 development.
  • The Timurids will be able to core 11 completely new states. At present, there is 105 development present in states they already own that they can take back from subject integrations, fighting Ajam, and taking Hormuz. Should they annex and state Transoxiana, Merv, Khiva, Ferghana, Gulf Coast, Farsistan, Iraq-e-Ajam, Azerbaijan, Luristan, Khuzestan, and Tabarestan with their open slots, they would gain 353 development, almost 300 of which is already their cores. (An overall gain of 458 dev.)
  • Lithuania will immediately gain 63 stated development. As those states include Mazovia, Pskov, and Sloboda Ukraine, they will be able to gain 62 additional development by fully conquering those states.
  • Castile will be able to create ten full states. They have 33 development they can conquer from fully stated lands already. Those ten states could encompass Aragon, Catalonia, Valencia, Sicily, Grenada, Apulia, Calabria, Lazio-Campania, Central Italy, and the Western Mediterranean Islands (so, full Iberian Wedding + conquering Grenada). This is 313 development, not counting Rome, Corsica, or the non-Neapolitan part of Central Italy.
  • As a bonus, Muscovy can core two additional full states if the devs have them state everything they own at game start. They currently have 72 unowned development in already stated areas. If their other game start territories (Perm, Samara, and Oka) are added in, this grows to 122 development. Should they use their two additional states on Novgorod and South Karelia, they can get 202 additional stated development.
Note that all of these numbers are taken without Administrative Ideas or any technology taken into account.
 
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Really excited for this buff to Bengal, since I myself am Bengali, but I have to ask, is it possible to play as Bengal but play with the Bengali Minor ideas instead of Bengali Sultanate ideas? Like maybe playing as a Bengali Minor, forming Bengal (This kind of happened historically sometimes) and keeping the Bengali Minor ideas? The Bengali Minor ideas actually seem more suitable for the Bengal Sultanate historically so it might be more immersive to play with those since after the first Sultan died Bengal wasn't that much of a military powerhouse in the subcontinent, and even depended on Ming and Timurids to diplomatically end a war they were fighting in with Jaunpur.

I think maybe changing the new army tradition idea for Bengal to something else like a tolerance or trade idea would make more sense since historically Bengal was actually pretty bad at keeping up what the game would consider army tradition. A tolerance idea (Like the old Hindu-Sufi syncretism idea) or a trade idea would make much more historical sense than army tradition for Bengal.

Also, the "rupee" idea should be changed to "taka" or "tanka". Even today in Bengali-speaking states of India, Bengalis call the rupee "taka", and this word was in use even during the Bengal Sultanate though possibly as "tanka" to refer to silver coins so it doesn't make sense for the idea to be called rupees.

Regardless, I'm really happy to see my home region getting some love, keep up the good work Paradox! :)
 
I'm 50/50 on this dev diary. I like the changes to the trade nodes and the estate interactions, but I don't like the changes to territories. It looks now like religious ideas are going to be far less useful for expanding empires. I like to blob and not being able to convert territories at all seems rather harsh. The historical colonial empires sent missionaries all over the world to spread their one true faith. Not being able to do that in EUIV seems rather silly. I'd rather have a penalty to missionary conversion speed than not being able to convert at all. Not to mention that One Faith is practically impossible to accomplish now. It is already very hard to convert everything in time, let alone if you can't convert territories anymore.
 
You are forgetting that Russia only have to spend 10 diplomatic MP to colonization Siberia per provinces with Third Rome DLC.

Throw in the colonist improve your development over time on dozens of 1/1/1 provinces up to 20 or w/e. Then it is no longer a joke.
Yeah, admittedly I don't own Third Rome, but isn't that still a bad deal if it leads to corruption? Also, doesn't it cost 20 DIP?
The colonist improvements I didn't consider, thank you for the reminder. But Russia doesn't have colonists with Third Rome, so is Exploration or Expansion really worth it? I guess we'll have to wait and see the balance from the new settlement growth.

I'm not saying these changes will destroy Russia. I'm just sceptical it'll make them "super OP" as the poster I replied to ponders.
 
Is there anything done to prevent just keeping a single state on hand that you constantly swap out for when needed just to convert provinces?

Otherwise it just encourages micro intensive gamey behaviour blocking you outright from sending missionaries to territories, instead of something like slower conversion speed in territories.
 
Additionally sending Missionaries and cultural conversion are not possible in Territories. You must make them a state to do these.
I truly hope you'll reconsider this particular change. Having to state and un-state land in batches just to convert them is a horrible design call.

If this is intended to be a financial incentive in favor of states, why not just increase missionary maintenance in non-state lands tenfold or so instead, or even add a +2% missionary strength malus? I'd vastly prefer such an approach. Money is cheap compared to the insane amount of Admin points this'll burn during a WC attempt where the goal of conversion is primarily to quell revolt risk, not increase the income (which would still be gimped by the fact that the area is a territory).

Will we still be able to freely convert our subject's provinces, or will the subject have to have the provinces as their states for that to work?
 
Tributaries:

Far away tributaries with no expectation of help or feasible reason to be a subject was something we're looking to change with this update.
End Game Tags:

Preventing weird country formations, like Ottomans to Byzantium or Minghals or England to Mughals to Shan to Mughals to Japan is something we're historically not very good at. It generally involves a lot of different file changes and something usually gets overlooked. In script as of 1.26 we now have a scope known as "End game tags" which will prevent most cases of such nations forming other nations (Holy Roman Empire, Rome and Papal States are so special they trump this list, eg: Byzantium can for Rome, Italy can form Holy Roman Empire...).
You really make me feel like using the forums has an influence on the game.
 
Not realistic. While it makes sense that converting is faster in lands you strongly control, this control is not necessary for missionaries to go and do their job. You don't need you king to stand right behind you to convince people to join your religion, it just speeds it up a lot.
The EU4 missionary system represents mass (forced) conversion of a population that is under the control of the nation state. It doesn't represent the traditional idea of a missionary living with a heathen population in a foreign land, slowly convincing them that there is a better god.
 
Nope, it brings territories in line with trade company land.
Except that you can currently convert those lands before handing them out to a trade company without an extra cost. This change adds a huge admin cost (and state/un-state micromanagement) for the same effect.
 
Yeah, admittedly I don't own Third Rome, but isn't that still a bad deal if it leads to corruption? Also, doesn't it cost 20 DIP?
The colonist improvements I didn't consider, thank you for the reminder. But Russia doesn't have colonists with Third Rome, so is Exploration or Expansion really worth it? I guess we'll have to wait and see the balance from the new settlement growth.

I'm not saying these changes will destroy Russia. I'm just sceptical it'll make them "super OP" as the poster I replied to ponders.

Small things you seems to have forgotten is that Russia has huge bonus to state. +5 just for being tsardom govt and +10 empire rank. There is also the enlightment age bonus giving 20 maximum states.

Throw in expansion finisher +5 state and state maintenance bonus. It goes up to 81 state maximum in late-game with max admin tech.

You would need to take roughly 162 states to start see corruption cost going up.
 
Additionally sending Missionaries and cultural conversion are not possible in Territories. You must make them a state to do these.

You know that what will happen is just people will just switch states as needed, right? Why not just give penalty to conversions in territories, so you can make it but it take longer/more expensive/both?
 
Would really like the thought process of this entire patch note