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EU4 - Development Diary - 14th of September 2021

Hello and welcome to the 2nd Dev Diary for the content of the Sub-Saharan region. Today we will continue with West Africa and take a look at Songhai.


Songhai is the militaristic powerhouse, which will replace Mali as the dominant power of West Africa until its end through infightings for the throne and at the hands of the Moroccans invading from the North. As a result of that, the mission tree of Songhai focuses on militaristic advancement, the conquest of West Africa and the expansion into Maghreb (basically turning the tables on the Moroccans).
dd_son_mission_tree.png

The second and third columns are classic conquest missions. Although I like to avoid pure conquest missions, they are inevitable for a country which is famous for its militaristic expansion.
With that said, the second column focuses on the conquest of the western territories of West Africa until you knock at Mali’s doorstep. The mission “Take the Empire Title” requires you to be a stronger power than Mali by having a bigger military, more prestige, higher stability and more Power Projection than Mali. As a reward you gain the Empire title and a permanent claim on every province owned by Mali or its subjects.
The third column focuses more on the “miscellaneous” conquest targets such as the tribe of Air, the Maghrebi of the North or the important Center of Trade Jenné (I call them Jenné here for consistency sake with the game). Speaking of which, if you are at war with Jenné and siege their capital down they get an event asking them to try for a white peace through a marriage. If they decide so, you as Songhai get the following event:


dd_son_widow_event.png

This event is a reference to the peace Jenné gained through the marriage of Sonni Ali with the widow of the deceased ruler of Jenné. Songhai would also get a consort if they have not the Iqta reform active too.

With the mission "Contact with Maghreb" you gain the first claims on Maghreb and over the course of the two following missions you will conquer Maghreb.

Someone might now wonder why the fourth column looks so empty though, and there is a good explanation for it. If you finish the mission "Eliminate the Mossi Threat" you get the following event:

dd_son_choose_missions.png


You have the choice of either converting the traditional people of your country or tolerating them for who they are, and even become their protector. Either choice will unlock a different set of missions you can pursue. Unlocking the religious missions gives you access to these ones:
dd_son_religious_missions.png

The highlight of the religious missions is the mission "Invite Scholars" as it requests you to have invited any religious school scholar. The reward is that the invited scholar becomes a "resident of your country", which means you can always invite the scholar without having the need of a diplomatic relation with a country of the scholar's school (that was quite the mouthful...). "Convert West Africa" is quite self explanatory which is converting all of the provinces of the Sahel, Niger and Guinea regions (you are NOT required to convert uncolonized provinces though). The reward is a little bit unusual: every country, who has the "Same Religion" opinion modifier of Songhai will now also get a permanent increased +25 (value might change) opinion of Songhai - as long Songhai is in the Muslim religious group. Additionally, it gives permanent +1 Tolerance of the True Faith.

Meanwhile, the path of tolerance has these missions for you:
dd_son_tolerance_missions.png

While the religious missions are quite self explanatory, the tolerance missions are a little bit different, but at their core they mirror the religious path. With "Guarantee the Old Traditions" your Dhimmi estate will get a new estate privilege, which replaces the privileges "Guaranteed Dhimmi Autonomy" and "Guaranteed Religious Minority" with "Guaranteed Traditions", a stronger combination of these two privileges before:
dd_son_dhimmi_estate_privilege.png

Completing "Pagan Alliances" will permanently increase the opinion of all Fetishist countries of you by +25 (value might change). "Unite the Tribes" is the final tolerance mission. You must ensure that at least 35 owned provinces are Fetishistic and that you have a stable and tolerant empire (so basically, have stability, no rebels, +3 Tolerance of Heathens). Completing it will give you the following event:
dd_son_adjust_islam.png

dd_son_reject_islam.png

This concludes the alternative missions.

A few other highlights of the mission tree and for Songhai:
  • The right most column will focus on the economical part of Songhai. As Songhai replaces Mali, it is only fitting that they have also gold and trade related missions (the rewards are however not as explosive as Mali's used to be)
  • The left most column focuses on the modernization of Songhai, with the first mission giving you support for Feudalism in your capital + random province.
  • "Embrace the Glory of Battle" enables a decision, which at a price of 200 Mil Power, which reduces your Global Manpower Modifier by 15% and Manpower Recovery Modifier by -10%, but increases Discipline by 2.5%, Yearly Army Professionalism by 0.5 and Army Tradition by 0.5. This modifier is active as long your ruler lives and can be renewed with every new ruler.
  • "Modernize Songhai" disables the event "Comet Sighted" as your people will finally live in a more enlightened time.
Now one last thing before finishing the Dev Diary. In my very first Dev Diary (in which I made a lot of rookie mistakes, I admit it) I presented the content for Mali. Over the week it has seen some changes I think you all might like.

1. Mali has discovered Fezzan, Mamluks and the path to Mecca (see image below)
dd_son_mali_pov.png
2. Mali's privilege "Controlled Gold Mining" has seen some rebalancing (btw, in the code the modifier already affected Goods Produced and not Production Efficiency. Just the tooltip was messed up last week and I didn't notice it.... so yeah, sorry about the misunderstandings). Again, the values are nowhere near final but it is getting there.
dd_son_gold_privilege.png

3. Mali previous "Abu Bakr" missions have seen a rebranding, changing the name to Ko Mamadi, the Madinke (Mali) version of Muhammad ibn Qu. (Abu Bakr was originally used because of consistency with the achievement name. In hindsight, this was a dumb decision of mine)
dd_son_mali_missions.png

4. The final Mali mission with the 15k Ducats requirement and its reward have been completely replaced. Now it only requires you to have 3 Level 3 Advisors and Monthly Income of 50 Ducats.
The reward is the following event
dd_son_mali_pilgrimage_route.png

I would like to talk more about it in this Dev Diary, but I think it is bloated enough already. The pilgrimage summed up is recreating the pilgrimage Mansa Musa did a century ago, but this time you have the choice to go on an alternative route, which goes through Europe. The pilgrimage takes around 5 years to complete and every ~100 days your travelling group visits a region where you enjoy the hospitality of the local people there. You can decide to leave a donation or move on. If you decide to make a big gift, the greatest nation of the region will receive this:
dd_son_mali_gold_donation.png

The rate of inflation has been lowered significantly and the AI is more inclined to refuse if the event would put them over 15 Inflation. The ducats you get are currently 1 year of Mali's Income and the Inflation scales with the Percentage of trade income compared to your total income (values might change later). Although I will miss the bankruptcy pop-ups, I have to admit that this design is much healthier for the game overall, and that a total crash of a continent does not belong in the base game.

That's it for today. I hope you enjoyed the Dev Diary. Next week we will explore the Horn of Africa. Until then I wish you all a good time!

**********

Mordred Edit; If you are interested in hearing more about the freeze on map changes, please check this thread! https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/eu4-no-mapchanges-and-whys.1490842/
 
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I will repost this every single time until @Johan himself refers to it and notifies all of these problems will be looked upon. I want my favorite game to be back.

GAMEBREAKING PROBLEMS
  1. Pillage capital and concentrate development resulting in giga dev cities.
  2. The American tribes mechanics are still broken, including development issues as well as tribes reforming into monarchies/republics in the 1500s.
  3. The AI still does not handle the government capacity correctly, releasing nations here and there. A proper fix is much needed!
  4. Colonization is not playing correctly this patch and definitely needs to be looked at. This is because of the problem with American tribes as well, because the tribes reforming and gaining all their tribal land results in a coastline covered in uncolonizable provinces.
MAJOR PROBLEMS
  1. The institution system is balanced horribly, and is one of the major problems of the games that last until 1600s and later. It basically results in African tribes being on equal technological foot as European powers. Only the Printing Press institution is spreading at a correct speed; the pace of the rest of them is seriously concerning and due to change. Besides the too fast spread, some are reporting that a part of the problem is because of the AI, that prioritizes the technology over ideas and other monarch power sinks too much.
  2. The mercenaries scaling is broken. Lategame mercenary armies are too big; they need to be capped, or balanced in a different way. The mercenary effect on Army Professionalism is also worth to be looked at, as a simple -5% change every mercenary company hired is off-balance when we hire a 5K or 100K company, or when we don't disband them after the end of the war.
  3. Favors are unbalanced, despite the 5-year band-aid fix. They allow for way too much diplomatic forced action.
  4. The AI.
    1. The AI's usage of mercenaries is broken, including total chaos in the decision making when to get them and when to recruit more regular troops, or getting mercenaries without considering Professionalism, leading to loss of it instead of slackening recruitment standards.
    2. The AI generally fails in regard to buildings (is incompetent economically), and has many bugs related to combat, as seen in post #9 (https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...ven-major-problems-list.1477366/post-27581985). Since most of the problems are easily moddable out of the existence, they might be not really difficult to be rid of, and thus Paradox notice on this issue is advised!
IMPORTANT BALANCE PROBLEMS
  1. The conditional military access allows for seriously ahistorical gameplay. Getting rid of it is not necessary, but limiting it would be much appreciated; for example, it could only work for the same religion, so the Ottomans could not go through entire Europe to siege Paris. In this example, they would have to either ask for the access, or wage war against the HRE to get to France.
  2. Burgundian Inheritance often results in France declaring war on Austria with all of her allies. This effectively always destroys France from that moment on. The conditions should be changed, so France can fight toe to toe.
  3. Council of Trent is surprisingly working correctly, but the balance is horribly off. The tradeoff between the two sides (conciliatory and harsh) is the difference in price paid from the Curia Coffers; however, at that point of the game, the Coffers are flowing with money, making the choice utterly one-sided.
  4. The Middle-East is very much not working correctly. Persia almost never forms, and thus the Ottoman Empire, after dealing with the Mamluks, never have a strong rival on the other side of their territory, leaving the fight to the Habsburgs and usually-declining Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. The whole area of Persia seems to be extremely border-gorey, with no nation being able to unite the rest and form Persia. Lack of mission trees in the Middle-East may be related to this issue.
  5. Centralization of states mechanic is currently not worth it in any situation as long as the Expand Administration mechanic exists.
  6. After the rebalance of navies, galleys are effectively winning over heavy ships not only in interior seas, but in oceans as well. This 'rebalance' requires to be rebalanced again.
MINOR PROBLEMS
  1. Many missions are outdated. It is not about the entire mission trees (although the power creep is real), it is about such missions as Spanish cultural conversion of Grenada, which is now broken (ineffective in cost to reward). There are many more examples, including:
    1. Missions on the Indian subcontinent often require high estate loyalty/influence, which was not adjusted to the estates rework.
  2. Manchu forms much more rarely than before, and Prussia almost never forms. Mughals never form. Zaporozhie is a not very amusing joke, being nowhere to be seen ever, despite very unique mechanics it possesses.
  3. The heir claim increase speed during a regency has been reported to be too high, resulting in new rulers never being lower than 'good claim'.
  4. Rivalry is working in a strange way. Why would a nation on the other side of a continent rival you?
  5. Many areas of the interface need work on to be accessible to the player, like information how Revolution works, or what is the "Too high influence with the Holy Father" when excommunication is unavailable.
 
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It seems the team listened to at least some feedback from the readers. Hovewer, the question remains: did Johan changes his stance on not having new provinces? Many people expressed how the reason map updates were scraped was, at the very least, strange and questionable, and also expressed love for the map updates in general
 
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I can say for myself: without map update with new tags/revolters and etc, I'm probably not bothering with buying this DLC.

I know they are part of the free update but the point remains.
 
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Have the stance on map change been reverse or are there will still be no new provinces and tags? The reason for it was kind of ubiquitous as what does "I am tired of people's savegames being broken" mean? I mean you already have to update for the new patch already and you can always revert back to the old version if you need to complete a campaign. Is this an excuse for tidying up Eu4 and getting ready for Eu5 or are the dev team really intimidated by the playerbase? And as I recall there was no issue with Leviathan's launch regarding the map changes.
 
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Cool stuff. You know what would be even cooler? Some well researched map changes to go along with this DLC. ( :
 
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I wish this kind of interactive approach to missions were taken long ago. Good to see at least some nations getting such interactive trees
 
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Will the stance towards not adding new provinces be reviewed? I think the feedback to the decision indicated that a majority would rather see new provinces added for the underdeveloped regions and it really wouldn't do Africa justice to have an expansion done on its current map.
 
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There are plans to update the tag setup of west Africa? Because current map have some historical misconceptions, the two majors are:

- What Macina tag in 1444 is supposed to represent?

- Mossi was not a unified kingdom, one of the mossi kingdoms "Yatenga" is a tag already present in game files but for some reason this is not present at the start while Mossi is, Mossi should be split in Yatenga and in at least two more tags.

I am a bit concerned with the historical flavor of this update, the game is old, but every regional update with no exception made the initial 1444 setup of the region more historical and more interesting, even Leaviathan with all his release problems made a good job in the historical setup of SEA. I sincerely hope that West Africa will not be the first exception for this rule. Somethings in the current version of the map are historically wrong, only missions trees for the tags already present will make a suboptimal update when compared with every other regional update made previously.
 
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But something that is too bad is still probably better than something obviously too strong
@Ogele I know that it's not very... PDX-like, but if you ever felt like you could use some help with figuring out how to make choices like this balanced(ie. feasible but not too strong) I'd be more than happy to help you out or point you in the direction of some other community members who likely could provide some insight

But even if you don't, I think as long as you listen to the community feedback below DDs like you did with the previous one it's going to be okay ^_^
I am not entirely sure what is meant with "PDX-like", but I certainly have my ears open for balance suggestions. I want to avoid repeating the mistakes of Leviathan and as such I am always happy to read constructive feedback (I need to mention that not every feedback can be included in the final version, but I give my best in that regard)
 
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So are you accepting feedback on the Portuguese National Ideas? Cause they are still a bit absurd.
How about this:

Traditions:
10% infantry Combat Ability
+25% Colonial range

Legacy of the Navigator
−33% Morale hit when losing a ship
5% Ship durability

Feitorias
+10% Global trade power
+10% Fort defense

India Armadas
+1 Naval Shock

Spice must Flow
+1 Merchant

Triangle Trade
+10% Goods produced modifier

Encourage the Bandeirantes
+15 Global settler increase

Royal Absolutism
−15% Construction cost
+0.50 Yearly absolutism

Ambition:
+20% Tariffs
Agreed with the suggestion and in awe of your steadfastness in your cause. But was discussing this with friends literally yesterday
Screenshot_20210914_183033.jpg
 
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I always looked at Dev Diaries to see what future DLCs would be about. If I wasn't interested in the content of the DLCs, I waited for their premiere, at least to be able to watch the free content - changes on the map.
Now what are you going to offer to people who won't buy this DLC? - broken save, which will be after the update anyway?

There are no new provinces and new TAGs, so I'm not interested in these DLCs!
 
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I will repost this every single time until @Johan himself refers to it and notifies all of these problems will be looked upon. I want my favorite game to be back.

GAMEBREAKING PROBLEMS
  1. Pillage capital and concentrate development resulting in giga dev cities.
  2. The American tribes mechanics are still broken, including development issues as well as tribes reforming into monarchies/republics in the 1500s.
  3. The AI still does not handle the government capacity correctly, releasing nations here and there. A proper fix is much needed!
  4. Colonization is not playing correctly this patch and definitely needs to be looked at. This is because of the problem with American tribes as well, because the tribes reforming and gaining all their tribal land results in a coastline covered in uncolonizable provinces.
MAJOR PROBLEMS
  1. The institution system is balanced horribly, and is one of the major problems of the games that last until 1600s and later. It basically results in African tribes being on equal technological foot as European powers. Only the Printing Press institution is spreading at a correct speed; the pace of the rest of them is seriously concerning and due to change. Besides the too fast spread, some are reporting that a part of the problem is because of the AI, that prioritizes the technology over ideas and other monarch power sinks too much.
  2. The mercenaries scaling is broken. Lategame mercenary armies are too big; they need to be capped, or balanced in a different way. The mercenary effect on Army Professionalism is also worth to be looked at, as a simple -5% change every mercenary company hired is off-balance when we hire a 5K or 100K company, or when we don't disband them after the end of the war.
  3. Favors are unbalanced, despite the 5-year band-aid fix. They allow for way too much diplomatic forced action.
  4. The AI.
    1. The AI's usage of mercenaries is broken, including total chaos in the decision making when to get them and when to recruit more regular troops, or getting mercenaries without considering Professionalism, leading to loss of it instead of slackening recruitment standards.
    2. The AI generally fails in regard to buildings (is incompetent economically), and has many bugs related to combat, as seen in post #9 (https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...ven-major-problems-list.1477366/post-27581985). Since most of the problems are easily moddable out of the existence, they might be not really difficult to be rid of, and thus Paradox notice on this issue is advised!
IMPORTANT BALANCE PROBLEMS
  1. The conditional military access allows for seriously ahistorical gameplay. Getting rid of it is not necessary, but limiting it would be much appreciated; for example, it could only work for the same religion, so the Ottomans could not go through entire Europe to siege Paris. In this example, they would have to either ask for the access, or wage war against the HRE to get to France.
  2. Burgundian Inheritance often results in France declaring war on Austria with all of her allies. This effectively always destroys France from that moment on. The conditions should be changed, so France can fight toe to toe.
  3. Council of Trent is surprisingly working correctly, but the balance is horribly off. The tradeoff between the two sides (conciliatory and harsh) is the difference in price paid from the Curia Coffers; however, at that point of the game, the Coffers are flowing with money, making the choice utterly one-sided.
  4. The Middle-East is very much not working correctly. Persia almost never forms, and thus the Ottoman Empire, after dealing with the Mamluks, never have a strong rival on the other side of their territory, leaving the fight to the Habsburgs and usually-declining Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. The whole area of Persia seems to be extremely border-gorey, with no nation being able to unite the rest and form Persia. Lack of mission trees in the Middle-East may be related to this issue.
  5. Centralization of states mechanic is currently not worth it in any situation as long as the Expand Administration mechanic exists.
  6. After the rebalance of navies, galleys are effectively winning over heavy ships not only in interior seas, but in oceans as well. This 'rebalance' requires to be rebalanced again.
MINOR PROBLEMS
  1. Many missions are outdated. It is not about the entire mission trees (although the power creep is real), it is about such missions as Spanish cultural conversion of Grenada, which is now broken (ineffective in cost to reward). There are many more examples, including:
    1. Missions on the Indian subcontinent often require high estate loyalty/influence, which was not adjusted to the estates rework.
  2. Manchu forms much more rarely than before, and Prussia almost never forms. Mughals never form. Zaporozhie is a not very amusing joke, being nowhere to be seen ever, despite very unique mechanics it possesses.
  3. The heir claim increase speed during a regency has been reported to be too high, resulting in new rulers never being lower than 'good claim'.
  4. Rivalry is working in a strange way. Why would a nation on the other side of a continent rival you?
  5. Many areas of the interface need work on to be accessible to the player, like information how Revolution works, or what is the "Too high influence with the Holy Father" when excommunication is unavailable.
Plus, the game would definitely benefit from some more "regionalization":

- sub-continent or super-region based rivalry: being Spain, you are more likely to have beef with Portugal, England, France or Ottomans, rather than Hungary, Russia or Sweden. Ciao to the situations like if you play Italy, you have to have rivals (because you are not strong enough... yet) and you have to choose between Great Britain or Fars;
- more region-based Age objectives: why should you see more Manchu banners age reward or Emperor of China with mandate over 50 objective when you are not playing in Asia?
- Great Powers should be also regionally based: why would you care if Vijayanagar suddenly got stronger and bigger than you when you are Naples and have to lose your recently attained (and well-deserved) GP status? Especially from the countries you have yet to even hear of?
- regionally-based Defender of Faith mantle: should you really sent your troops half across the globe to defend some guys who recently converted into your state-religion?
- some sort of regionalization in Institution and Tech development, which would, In some way, bring the Westernization back:
-1) you have worked hard and spent thousands of ducats and mana to develop your provinces and be the first one to spawn Renaissance/Manufactories/Enlightenment in Europe and get your just reward but it gets spawned in Beijing? Simply because it has huge dev... while don't even have a Mill or University? Really?
2) Why would the China, Japan, Middle-East or Africa bother about such thing as Renaissance and lag behind (or get to spawn it in their respective region) when their culture and religion strictly forbade or simply didn't care for such things at all?
3) As mentioned before, seeing as Ottomans, Mamluks, Japan, natives etc. can have the same tech level as Europeans is disturbing (it shouldn't be impossible, but it shouldn't be easy)

The more world's great power list and rivalry between world's finest GPs should be a thing strictly to the late-game, as globalization and colonization of the world is on the sky-rocket and uncolonized land is harder and harder to come by.

I doubt it all would be implemented, though, knowing that this game won't get any major updates in it's mechanics, but at least some of them would improve the situation.
 
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Tolerant Songhai into Fetishist Songhai sounds interesting. Could it be possible @Ogele to do something like this for Mali?
Depends on the workload and time we have. Right now Mali has only one mission which branches out in either being tolerant or being religious though.

@Ogele

Now I'm thinking about it, are Mali / Songhai and others now formable tags or end game tags?
Currently they are neither of those. I am not entirely sure if I want either of those to be reformables, but I will consider it.
 
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I'm really liking the remade Mali pilgrimage! It feels a lot more dynamic and interactive than simply letting gold all of a sudden rain down everywhere between Iceland and Istanbul :) The choice between paganism and Islam for Songhai also feels really good! I hope the AI:s choice between the two routes are almost 50/50 instead of heavily favouring one over the other.
 
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Let's review the content:

Songhai's mission tree
Impact on the game: LIMITED
Nothing inherently bad there, a mission tree isn't going to change the game structure much

Balance: BALANCED
Nothing seems to stand out as useless or broken, and it seems relatively conservative. The relation bonus to one religion group or the other is quite interesting to see and something helpful, especially given the many conquests prone to create AE all around Africa

Creativity: INNOVATIVE
Choice in a mission tree. Now this is something I never expected, and even less hoped to see, but here we are. Choices are interesting and helps making mission trees something else than a free idea slot worth of bonus that fills up as you play. And Prosperity has a modifier at last! Bonus too is the protection against the dreaded Comet, an interesting reward conceptually

Mali rework
Impact on the game: LIMITED
Mission tree again, even if ts reward has quite the impact it stays limited to one player controlled TAG as the AI is likely to never see it as per usual, hence it still won't completely change the gameplay by itself

Balance: STRONG
The Gold isn't free anymore, and in fact the All Power cost makes it a far tougher choice, Mana being a lot more limited than money. It is not a "enact and forget" privilege anymore. The new pilgrimage is actually a lot more interesting as it allows the gold to not simply disappear out of the global economy, but to be redistributed... with major risks, but potentially some rewards if you have ways around the inflation. I can see Genoa in particular be a lot more happy even if it means some careful considerations

Creativity: INTERESTING
The new pilgrimage feels like what a more complex diplomatic system could lead to. Several actions of this kind could replace many generic uncontrolled events and add more agency in how the world interacts. As for the gold related modifiers, they stay as interesting tools to give some creative setup. Only question is, would local version of those exist? Making this one mine harder to deplete for instance
 
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i like the idea of missions 'branching' into mutually exclusive paths depending on a choice chosen, i think it captures some of the dynamic nature of the old mission system that people have been missing

my only suggestion for that feature would be for there to be some way for players to see the branching paths in full with their requirements and rewards from the mission interface so they can make a more informed choice when given the event
 
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1. Tease with fun stuff
/(1 week later)
2. Cancel fun stuff
/(facepalm)
Srsly, guys...
I guess everyone has different tastes, but for me overpowered mechanics aren't fun -- even if they're locked behind a reasonably high price ticket (although let's be honest 15K isn't that much esp with the previous gold mine privilege along with massive concentrate dev)

Part of the enjoyment I derive out of playing as an african nation is that they're challenging to play and when the europeans come knocking, they come knocking hard and not come knocking bankrupt and already defeated by my meme mission tree.
 
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