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Dev Diary #96: Maybe I *should* diet…

Greetings.

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Well, well, well, looks like this is where the fat chin meme comes to die.

Today I will be talking about one of the free several patch additions coming alongside Holy Fury, namely character shape.
With our next expansion, rather than being a random genetic component, this visual effect will be turned into a dynamic feature.
The game now will keep track of your character’s lifestyle and either increase or reduce his weight accordingly. Going above a certain threshold will result in your character gaining the Fat trait, alongside the appropriate visual, while going below a certain threshold will result in your character gaining the Malnourished trait, alongside a new emaciated look.

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While there are certain events that can result in immediate gain or loss of weight, characters will progress from one state to the other primarily depending on their conditions and lifestyle. Traits, Focus, Society membership and health can all affect a character’s state. Some factors, such as being Gluttonous, will increase a character’s weight, others, such as belonging to a Monastic Order, will reduce it, and others still, such as leading an army during wartime, will keep it balanced.

New events have been added to give flavor to this new mechanic, allowing players the opportunity to change their habits or offer advice to their friends and relatives’ lifestyle. Some old events have also been updated to use new effects and make the mechanic feel fully integrated to the rest of the game.

And that should be about it.

 

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What about doing the opposite, i.e. making the probability of gaining the attractive/ugly traits dependent on the portrait?
That would require code work, since the DNA is not open to script; also, I'm not sure the "good" and "bad" combinations are consistent between portrait sets, so a DNA code that might look pretty on westerngfx might seem ugly on, say, cumangfx.
 
That's nice. Now I wish brawny and frail had something similar.

No. Brawny and frail should be genetic body shape - skeleton size. Frail is "small-frame" from birth. You can't exercise your ribs or skeletal hip to grow wider.
Strong and weak should be (are?) based on upbringing and physical exercise. So a person born neither brawny or frail can still gain strong or weak (+1/-1).

However, I've never seen a person with a combination of these. I would argue that this should be possible.

Hence, a frail person could get the strong attribute, making them cancel each other. Mother Theresa on steroids - neutral strength at best. (-1+1)
A frail person could also be weak - Mother Theresa with no exercise and bad diet. Now we are talking very weak physically. (-1-1)

Similarly, a brawny person could be weak as well as brawny. Born "big-frame" and genetics like Mike Tyson, but choosing to write poetry all day and never exercise, this person's strength is similar to someone not-brawny who is not strong. (+1-1, which is equal to person with 0). A regular person (0) who exercise (+1) will be stronger physically.
Also, a brawny person could be strong. Now we are talking physical strength! (+1+1) Mike Tyson big frame/genetics, AND hard physical exercise.

@Silfae If you could descend to the commonfolk and comment/correct this, I'd be grateful,
 
No. Brawny and frail should be genetic body shape - skeleton size. Frail is "small-frame" from birth. You can't exercise your ribs or skeletal hip to grow wider.
Strong and weak should be (are?) based on upbringing and physical exercise. So a person born neither brawny or frail can still gain strong or weak (+1/-1).

However, I've never seen a person with a combination of these. I would argue that this should be possible.

Hence, a frail person could get the strong attribute, making them cancel each other. Mother Theresa on steroids - neutral strength at best. (-1+1)
A frail person could also be weak - Mother Theresa with no exercise and bad diet. Now we are talking very weak physically. (-1-1)

Similarly, a brawny person could be weak as well as brawny. Born "big-frame" and genetics like Mike Tyson, but choosing to write poetry all day and never exercise, this person's strength is similar to someone not-brawny who is not strong. (+1-1, which is equal to person with 0). A regular person (0) who exercise (+1) will be stronger physically.
Also, a brawny person could be strong. Now we are talking physical strength! (+1+1) Mike Tyson big frame/genetics, AND hard physical exercise.

@Silfae If you could descend to the commonfolk and comment/correct this, I'd be grateful,
You are generally right, but inverted the traits. Strong and Weak are inheritable genetic traits, Frail and Robust are the result of habit or training (so they are usually either gained during childhood, on rare special events, or when picking a focus, such as War for Robust). Since they are opposite traits, you could in theory have a Brawny Weak character, the same as you can have a Dull Genius (good potential, wasted).
 
This is something I didn't even know I really wanted, but I'm glad we're getting it now that I know we are. More character depth is always nice.

Thanks again for always making this great game just a little bit better.
 
With this new mechanic, I can tell the dungeons are going to be the Weight Watchers of the Middle Ages... :D

It would be a last ditch effort if you dont manage to do it another way ;)

Going in seclusion would be too short for it altough it could be another way to lose some pounds.
 
Could the dev be so kind and generous they'd give us more info on the oncoming doctrine available for pagan reformation? (with as usual the "all value subject to change" drill)

Huge Pagan player here so im really curious.

Thanks for the the Fat/Thin feature too :)
 
Less chance of a temperate Dominican who goes on fasts having triple chins.
And more chances of a gluttonous debauched character not being thin as a twig.
I had this petty peeve with the game for years, thanks!

As for attractive/ugly portraits... just don't, thanks. There is no way some of those wouldn't turn out offensive.
 
The fat monk is a stereotype, but there might be some truth to it. One the one hand the church encouraged or even mandated regular fasting. On the other hand monks were relatively well fed compared to poor people and had a strictly set meal schedule. According to at least one study that might have led to obesity in people who were already genetically predisposed to it.

It might be different for certain Indian monks, where constant asceticism is probably more likely in some orders
 
That would require code work, since the DNA is not open to script; also, I'm not sure the "good" and "bad" combinations are consistent between portrait sets, so a DNA code that might look pretty on westerngfx might seem ugly on, say, cumangfx.

If it would be possible to have the likelihood of receiving a trait depend upon having enough good DNA letters (so each DNA letter is assigned a value, and then this is summed), then surely it would also be possible to make it dependent on the gfx set used?

So each letter is assigned a value from a table which is determined by the gfx set, and then the higher the sum, the higher the chance of receiving the fair trait.

The task, then, is going through the portrait sets and assigning values to each set of eyes/nose/neck etc.

If it's possible, baldness should probably be its own heritable trait (hidden or otherwise - which women can inherit from their parents and pass on to their children), because it's quite weird that you can go from having a comb-over to a full head of heir just by having a haircut. Though this depends on it being possible to stop people selecting certain haircuts using the respective tool.

If you want inspiration for effects, these might be of use:

http://www.livius.org/sources/content/synesius/synesius-eulogy-of-baldness/

http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Dio_Chrysostom/Encomium_on_Hair*.html