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Why can't we play Muslims or pagans?

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Darkrenown said:
it's extra religion groups you cannot add, and I said I wasn't sure that was intended. Now I could be wrong, and at the end of the day we have never promised every possible aspect of our games would be moddable, but that wasn't the impression I got the last time I spoke to Doomdark about modding CK.
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If it is the case that you guys locked out the creation and playability of new religion groups, well... maybe you guys should considering changing this in a patch. I agree with you guys on Muslims and Pagans. We'll get access eventually, we just have to be patient while the DLC for it is in the oven. But there are other users here who really wanted to do things like add in the Jewish Khazars and other groups, and they shouldn't be prevented from doing that with modding, IMO. I'm not one of those users who pretends to be an expert on programming PI games so I'm not going to tell you what is and isn't easy to change. But if it is a case of changing a no to a yes or a 0 to a 1 in the hardcoding, please consider opening religions to modding if they really are locked as you said may be the case. Thanks.
 
I'd agree, a fix that allows modders to unlock religions would solve the real issue entirely whilst keeping them completely unplayable in the vanilla game as intended. As I stated, when you use a mod you have to accept it may "break" the game and its playability is in no way the problem of the company who developed the game if in this case unlocking religions created unrealistic events etc.
 
Listen, there's too much complaining going on here. I play pagans almost exclusively, and yes that makes me miss stuff. But still, it's fun. Yes, it's mildly annoying to hand edit the save game in order to play, but it's really just a minor hassle. And the modding possibilities are endless, really! I'm sure a pagan mod with new events and tweaked mechanics will pop up relatively soon.
 
Jia Xu said:
If it is the case that you guys locked out the creation and playability of new religion groups, well... maybe you guys should considering changing this in a patch. I agree with you guys on Muslims and Pagans. We'll get access eventually, we just have to be patient while the DLC for it is in the oven. But there are other users here who really wanted to do things like add in the Jewish Khazars and other groups, and they shouldn't be prevented from doing that with modding, IMO. I'm not one of those users who pretends to be an expert on programming PI games so I'm not going to tell you what is and isn't easy to change. But if it is a case of changing a no to a yes or a 0 to a 1 in the hardcoding, please consider opening religions to modding if they really are locked as you said may be the case. Thanks.
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Well, there is a cheat for character switching (although I admit it's a hassle) and religions are actually really easy to mod in. I created a Jewish Khazar mod myself... and then didn't release it because the Khazars just ended up getting gobbled on day one. :p

(Might end up putting it out anyway once I tweak a bit more.)
 
3dmadness said:
You completely miss the point, by your logic if Scotland and England were the only playable nations the game would still be "Crusader Kings" and would still be what we brought. In addition, they have made the Muslim nations fine, they work just like all others work but they want to make you pay more for what is there, to fix your point this is like buying a car and paying extra to get the trunk open.
To make it simple, they made all the factions workable then left some out to make you pay more to play them.

Also baffling? You find being angry at getting a game with half the factions locked out for later payment baffling?

To the other gentleman, just saying that it's ok because lots of other companies do it is not justification, it is condemning.
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No, what I find baffling is that you're angry about something that works exactly as advertised. To use your example, if I bought a game that was advertised as only allowing you to play as Scotland or England, no, I wouldn't then complain about not being able to play other countries. I got exactly what I thought I was getting. It's not like you were mislead about the game's content. Playable Muslims/pagans is not "half the game". It's extra.
 
There's not a lot of room for legitimate complaining on the Muslim/Pagan issue, guys. If you're here and reading this post, it means you have internet access. If you have access to the internet then you have all of the information on this game at your finger-tips and there's no reason why you couldn't do the bare minimal research on the game before purchasing it.
 
I`m with Paradox decision on this one, they never said a word about playing anything but christian feudal lords, as in CK1 by the way, and they manage to have one of the smoothest launches of a Paradox game, with tons of new features and mechanics, not counting the historical research that went into it

You may or may not like the game, but in my opinion they delivered what was promised

I loved CK1 and put countless hours in it, but, for many reasons, it was a train wreck in it`s original state and probably didn`t even sell that well, eventually it evolved into a very playable/not frustrating game, but it took, literally, years

Here with CK2 they have a very solid base to build upon, I think they took the right path focusing on the base game, I don`t know if it was a conscious choice or just a low budget or what, but IMHO it was the right thing to do
 
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Jia Xu said:
If it is the case that you guys locked out the creation and playability of new religion groups, well... maybe you guys should considering changing this in a patch.
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Well yes, if it wasn't intended I would expect it to be changed, that is what I meant. I just don't want to give a firm answer because I'm not directly involved and so don't know for certain. I'll see if I can find out next week.
 
My character, and Byzantine Emperor at the time, decided it was a good idea to convert to Islam.

In the middle of a civil war.

Which, by the way, he was losing badly to begin with :)
 
rpstrategist said:
Maybe because... To my knowledge there was not a single muslim king who went crusading.

And if i have missed one, then i'm sure he can be modded into heretic christian or something.
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But what does that matter?

1. The AI plays the muslim & pagan characters.
2. The AI can wage war, defend against crusades, marry and generally do all the things the player can, the dukes and kings just have a different name to be honest..

So... Again, why can't we just play them?
"oh but they didnt have the same feudal system as Europe did in that time".
So? They do in the game, for the AI to even function... So why can't we just play it?
Or just bloody give them the same mechanics as the European kingdoms, just keeping their localized count-duke-king names (i cant remember them of the top of my head).
Why not?

Heck, just copy the pope mechanic from the christian nations and rename him, let the muslim nations go on Jihad like in Medieval 2 Total War.
Sometimes obsession with historical accuracy really dampens gameplay in a way i'm truly sad to see.

Even if we couldn't crusade, we could still do all the other fun things in the game, and using our allies to help DEFEND against the AI crusades.. Why would that be so incredibly unplayable and boring according to Paradox?
It's like saying that you shouldn't be able to play the african or native american nations in Europa Universalis because they don't have proper tech. Or that you shouldn't be able to play the uncivilized nations in Victoria 2 because they also didn't have proper tech or government options (yet).. It makes no sense..
And i must argue that the muslim/pagan nations ARE half the game. Purely based on content, they are.
By the same logic as the uncivilized nations in V2 are half the game. If i could only play as European christian nations in EU3 or V2 i frankly wouldnt have bought them.
 
Baleur said:
But what does that matter?

1. The AI plays the muslim & pagan characters.
2. The AI can wage war, defend against crusades, marry and generally do all the things the player can, the dukes and kings just have a different name to be honest..

So... Again, why can't we just play them?
"oh but they didnt have the same feudal system as Europe did in that time".
So? They do in the game, for the AI to even function... So why can't we just play it?
Or just bloody give them the same mechanics as the European kingdoms, just keeping their localized count-duke-king names (i cant remember them of the top of my head).
Why not?

Heck, just copy the pope mechanic from the christian nations and rename him, let the muslim nations go on Jihad like in Medieval 2 Total War.
Sometimes obsession with historical accuracy really dampens gameplay in a way i'm truly sad to see.

Even if we couldn't crusade, we could still do all the other fun things in the game, and using our allies to help DEFEND against the AI crusades.. Why would that be so incredibly unplayable and boring according to Paradox?
It's like saying that you shouldn't be able to play the african or native american nations in Europa Universalis because they don't have proper tech. Or that you shouldn't be able to play the uncivilized nations in Victoria 2 because they also didn't have proper tech or government options (yet).. It makes no sense..
And i must argue that the muslim/pagan nations ARE half the game. Purely based on content, they are.
By the same logic as the uncivilized nations in V2 are half the game. If i could only play as European christian nations in EU3 or V2 i frankly wouldnt have bought them.
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But you knew you couldn't play as muslim/pagans and it didn't stop you buying CKII. Why do you complain now then ?
 
rpstrategist said:
But you knew you couldn't play as muslim/pagans and it didn't stop you buying CKII. Why do you complain now then ?
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That's not a real answer. That's like saying "you knew this game had bug "x", why did you buy it anyway?". :)

I guess Paradox has all the right to reserve that part of the gameply for a paid expansion. No need for any other excuses.
 
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