Sforza!!! - A Milan AAR

[coz1]

A trading Emperor? Bah!

That would certainly give you some sigh of relief knowing you'd have the manpower to deal with whatever came your way.

 

[unmerged(24320)]

Rensslaer: In July 1477, Austria declared war on Hungary, creating a major conflict relatively nearby...We hope for the best, especially as all of Austria’s allies dishonoured their alliance!

very interesting. Hungary must be reasonably decent as Austria's allies feared Hungary more than they liked Austria ! ! yes ? ?

Rensslaer: ...Near the same time, Tuscany declared war on Urbino...we decide to embargo them in protest. We’ll see how that works out.

that should be neat to watch ! !

Rensslaer: ...In October, we start trying to improve relations with the various electors of the Holy Roman Empire...

this is always a good thing to do ! ! and, good luck ! !

Rensslaer: ...And, finally, it comes to be that we get to demonstrate the real meaning of Sforza!

this is over my head as i am not familiar with any of the EU games ! !

that said, this has been an exceptional read ! !

 

[Rensslaer]

A tough trade situation you find yourself in. I enjoyed that section, lots of info since I haven't really bothered with trade in the demo yet.

Alot of people really find trading tedious (Joe!), but I enjoy the trade. I see it as a game inside a game -- something more mindless, but still strategic, like Tetris.

Maybe you will find it easier to maintain hold when you take Shrewd Commerce Policy?

That's on my list, as soon as I get an open slot. It's still a little ways off, though.

Yes, I am definitely going to have to bone up on my trading technique. I was actually doing rather well to get in on trade using onesies and twosies, but the minute I turned my back for a moment, they would disappear like leaving a sandwich unattended around a dog.

:rofl: Nice analogy!

I take it that if you swamp a COT with traders you don’t run the risk of being banned from that COT as in EU II? So how long before you annex your first vassal? Are they all in an alliance with you? Otherwise you might lost them if they get into a war with let’s say Austria. Joe

I think the AI will consider banning you if you make too much of a nuisance of yourself, so should be similar to EU II in that respect. My vassals are all in alliance with me (diplo-vassals, as opposed to force-vassals, automatically come with an alliance). Yes, I wouldn't want to lose them! If all stays on track, my first diplo-annexation will come in about 1483.

Looks like an interesting AAR. Helps to sate my taste for EU3 while I wait to upgrade my computer then purchase it. Will be following this

Thanks! I'm always happy to encourage interest! EU 3 really has caught my fancy -- an uncommonly good game. As I've said elsewhere, I got burned out on it after beta-testing for hours every day for 3 months, but after a 2-week break I went right back to it.

I'm surprised you didn't take the Traditional Italian method of competing for CoT spots. "Nice merchant you have here in the Centre of Trade... It'd be a shame if anything happened to it.. accidents do happen, capisce?"

:rofl: Yeah -- there is that "merchants despised" spy mission, but it doesn't work quite the same.

Heh, becoming emperor could give you nice advantage over your enemies. I like the idea of Italian emperor ruling the Roman Empire.

It never occurred to me that was an exception to the rule, but I guess it was! Quite funny, actually.

this is over my head as i am not familiar with any of the EU games ! ! that said, this has been an exceptional read ! !

Roy! I was just wondering earlier today why I hadn't seen you around the EU 3 forums... That would be why! But great to see you following my fast-paced tale (fast-paced, relative to Fire Warms, anyway). In explanation, Sforza -- the name of the most famous royal family of Milan -- meant "Force" in Italian.

Fiftypence, Stnylan, Lord E, Billy Bob & Duke of Wellington, thank you too for your comments! And thanks to everyone who's lurking, though I'd love it if you'd let me know you're here.

Rensslaer

 

[Mike von Bek]

This is great stuff, Rens - Im inspired to try and become the Emperor myself with some out of the way place now!

 

[unmerged(24320)]

Rensslaer: ...I was just wondering earlier today why I hadn't seen you around the EU 3 forums...

actually, i have been following three EU 3 tales, two English ones and one that ended too soon ! ! anyway, i suspect that you started this AAR either just before or just after i was last on the fora ! ! that said, i picked up both this and coz1's AAR today ! ! and, mighty glad i found them ! !

Rensslaer: ...In explanation, Sforza -- the name of the most famous royal family of Milan -- meant "Force" in Italian.

cool ! !

 

[CatKnight]

A pretty good start so war, Renn!

I think if this keeps up you'll need to change your AAR name to "Trade Wars: The Italians Strike Back" or some such.

How's the Roman/French war going?

 

[Lord E]

The trading wars are going fine I see, and now that you have started improving the relations to several electors soon we shall see a trading emperor I think. That would be cool

 

[Rensslaer]

Milan has a casus belli against Switzerland because of the core we gained on both of her provinces. Switzerland is in mountainous territory, but is not a particularly strong country. Switzerland also has no allies nearby which she can count on to come to her aid. It’s possible that Brunswick and Hamburg may find a way to make their presence felt, but I find it doubtful without a succession of military access treaties.

King Galleazzo Sforza has always intended to make Milan into a great Mediterranean power, and this seems like a perfect opportunity to make a first step.

With minimal negative impact in the eyes of the world – as we are, after all, the aggrieved party – Milan declares war against Switzerland, and the King takes the helm of his primary army himself.

Thankfully, each of our vassals meets their pledge to aid us – we do not have to begin the process of diplo-annexation over again. The main Swiss army – for whatever reason – sets forth immediately for Savoy! That’s fine with us – it leaves us undistracted, and the Savoians can stand up for themselves with their ruler-general and a respectable army. Both Mantua and Modena quickly ask for military access so they can get at their new enemy – now there’s some commitment!

Each of these armies descends, first upon Schwyz, Switzerland’s easternmost province. War is joined, first, with the King’s army alone against the weak Swiss defenses, at the end of April. After only a few days’ fighting, the Swiss retreat and leave the field to us.

Our siege begins on May 1, 1479. However, by the end of the month, the regiments from Mantua and Modena soon arrive, and we outnumber the Swiss defenders of the city by almost 8:1. An assault against the city walls is ordered.

Glory be! The assault is magnificently successful. The siege lasted 31 days, but the assault itself (with backup from Mantua and Modena) lasted only about 5 days. Magnificent work! And my units only lost about 50 soldiers each! Modena’s regiments lost about the same. Mantua suffered no losses at all! No muss, no mess!

This province becomes ours to control, and will surely be our spoils from this war. However, the Swiss will require the thumbscrews to be applied more firmly before they will realize the justice of this settlement.

 

[CatKnight]

Your allies join your invicible armies?

Hm... I wonder if that should be 'invincible' or 'invisible'

Maybe 'invisible!' The AI knows we players sitzkrieg when we don't like the war we're in! Gah!

 

[Rensslaer]

Your allies join your invicible armies?

Hm... I wonder if that should be 'invincible' or 'invisible'

Maybe 'invisible!' The AI knows we players sitzkrieg when we don't like the war we're in! Gah!

Is there a typo someplace?? I can't find it. I don't even remember using the word!

Renss

 

[CatKnight]

Is there a typo someplace?? I can't find it. I don't even remember using the word!

Renss

:grins: Yeah. In the game/screenie. The display telling you 'X' is honoring your alliance.

 

[Rensslaer]

:grins: Yeah. In the game/screenie. The display telling you 'X' is honoring your alliance.

Oh! Hey, you're right! I deem you an honorary beta-tester!

I'll go report that. I'll give you the "find".

Rensslaer

 

[unmerged(58610)]

Until 1515, no-one beat the Swiss, who had handed several Imperial armies their butts and now I am being asked to accept that a puny Milanese oondottieri army, which should have had some 90% cavalry by the way, can defeat them. The Swiss would have waited for the enemy to come to them and should be treated as landsknechts who were after all introduced in 1508 by Maximilien I to copy a way of war the Swiss had employed for two centuries.

It's not your fault that the Swiss ai is not defensively minded nor that there is no Condottierri warfare flag for Italian states - negatives on fighting non-Italians, but greatly reduced casualties.

In terms of your tale, highly enjoyable and nits picked aside EU3 seems to have much to recommend it.

 

[Olaus Petrus]

Invasion would have been much harder if Swiss would have kept their main force in their mountains. But I haven't seen a single Paradox game where AI is good at defensive warfare, they always seem to think that attack is the best defence.

 

[Rensslaer]

Invasion would have been much harder if Swiss would have kept their main force in their mountains. But I haven't seen a single Paradox game where AI is good at defensive warfare, they always seem to think that attack is the best defence.

That's 'cause for every studious comment like yours, Paradox gets 15 complaints that "the AI just sits there!" :rofl:

It's not your fault that the Swiss ai is not defensively minded nor that there is no Condottierri warfare flag for Italian states - negatives on fighting non-Italians, but greatly reduced casualties.

In terms of your tale, highly enjoyable and nits picked aside EU3 seems to have much to recommend it.

Thank you! I'm curious... Why is it the Condottierri didn't fare well against non-Italians? That's a point of history I'm not familiar with. I'd be curious to hear the background.

Oh, and Catknight -- sorry, someone beat us to it!

Rensslaer

 

[Rensslaer]

In August, as I was waiting for the Swiss to surrender Bern, I found that I had to go to the rescue of Savoy, whose capital was under siege by the Swiss. The walls of Savoie had just been breached, so I figured I could leave the siege alone long enough to go rescue my favorite ally from the depredations of the Swiss!

Finally, by mid-October, the battle to lift the siege of Savoie comes to a close with 400 Milanese soldiers dead, and nearly 1500 Swiss. Unfortunately, Sforza’s army will have to rest for a while to restore the bloodied troops’ morale.

This is unfortunate, because about this same time, two regiments of Brunswickian troops attacked our holding force in Schwyz. I immediately send some newly built regiments, and half of my siege force from Bern, to assist, but they won’t make it in time to prevent my one regiment from retreating.

I finally managed to break the siege, and send the Brunswickians packing, even though they certainly had the better of us, casualty-wise.

Meanwhile, King Sforza was able to beat the Swiss away from the Savoian capital at Piedmont.

Briefly, let me describe some trading issues. Having had trouble getting merchants to stick in other CoTs, I picked one that was nearing 200 in trade volume, but wasn’t quite there yet – Il de France. Strangely, this became a 2nd front in the war against Switzerland, as we ran into a bevy of Swiss traders! We were unable to make tremendous progress against them, but at least were able to compete one out and replace him with one of our own.

Please note that if I’d only done a 2-play, the likely results with the kind of luck I had in this merchant venture would have resulted in no gain for me, regardless of the compete’s success. For a 2-play to succeed, both merchants would have to be successful. On the other hand, with 4 merchants involved, with 2 successful and 2 failed, I still got 1 merchant to stick with my 4-play.

 

[unmerged(21085)]

Great post, in my game, I often use 3/4 merchants a turn to control CoTs around Europe. What really surprise me was the fact you can get quite rich off them as long they stay in there. Sadly monopoly seems hard to do

Are you planning to conquer half of Europe a true Merchant Prince won't
declare war he just pay others to fight for him. :rofl:

Anyway, what is trade income percentage wise on the whole compared to taxes/producation?

Cheers

Sap.

 

[Olaus Petrus]

Well, it seems that my earlier comment was bit premature. AI seems to be causing you trouble after all, thanks to men of Brunswick. I generally have had harder time with warfare of EU3 than in EU2, because after years of play I'm so familiar with EU2 tactics that it's hard to change tactics. And similar strategies I used in EU2 doesn't work in EU3, because you can't build armies as fast and you have to give armies time to rest. (My strategy was to build lots of men to cover the loses of my main armies and send them to force the sieges. Also AI does seem to be smarter than in EU2, but it might be that I haven't yet found weak points of AI) But maybe when I will become more familiar with EU3 warfare I learn to change my strategies. If we allow HoI term I would be Old Guard -general.

 

[unmerged(58610)]

The system they evolved was one in which one siide manouevred/fought into a winning position that was agreed by the other side who withdrew or surrendered. Casualties tended to be very low. Sieges could be just as bloody as elsewhere in Europe, therefore Italian engineers tried to make their cities so strong as to deter any attempt. The system was adopted by all Italian states, not least because all of the Condottierri captains came out of the Gonzago School in Mantua.

The system was blown away by the French. The Italians ambushed them, but instead of surrendering promptly attacked and won.

As soon as an italian state hired a military adviser from outside Italy, an event is going to be triggered along the lines of Our military system in ineffective compared with the way other states wage war; we should change. The responses could range from no and the adviser leaves in a huff to yes and the condottierri captains leave service - some men, depending on the MIL of the ruler, would stay.

Or fight and lose a war against a non-Italian army.

 

[Garuda]

Nice work against the Swiss, even having to bail out Savoy in the process.

May I ask: What's a 2-play? I'm guessing this is sending 2 merchants to a CoT, one to trade out your competitor, the other to take his place?