Go with service and conquer Lucania and Apulia. Vassalize all OPM's possible in Greece and become the new Macedonia!
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Hmm, Macedonia could very well fall to the invading hordes of Tylis (if Tylis isn't stabbed in the back by Getae). So the other Greeks will be busy. You should concentrate on Italy.
Use your navy to blockade Rome (if you can), then fight a defensive war against Rome and her allies.
Listening to all suggestions, it seems the current plan is:
- Take the initially proposed Ideas (Professional Soldiers, Civic Duty & Deification)
- Enact 'Use Pike Phalanx'. Wait with the decision of which citizenship law we should use, and wait with taking a stance against piracy.
- Conquer Apulia and Campania from Rome if possible, Apulia alone at minimum.
- Annex Lucania
- Guarantee Syracusan independence, just in case, but don't go as far as an alliance
- Attempt to form an alliance with Carthage
- Agree to proposed alliances by the Leagues. Do not agree to any Macedonian alliance proposals (as we might want to attack them after we have dealt with Rome)
All seems very doable apart for an alliance with Carthage, they do not like us and we do not like them but that will not prevent us from trying. Though I fear they would be unreliable allies at best. Also Syracuse is a Greek city, can we really allow it to fall to the Barbarians? If Carthage attacks it and Syracuse seems unable to defend itself, I think we should intervene, but if more of you feel otherwise we may leave them to their fate.
- Take the initially proposed Ideas (Professional Soldiers, Civic Duty & Deification)
- Enact 'Use Pike Phalanx'. Wait with the decision of which citizenship law we should use, and wait with taking a stance against piracy.
- Conquer Apulia and Campania from Rome if possible, Apulia alone at minimum.
- Annex Lucania
- Guarantee Syracusan independence, just in case, but don't go as far as an alliance
- Attempt to form an alliance with Carthage
- Agree to proposed alliances by the Leagues. Do not agree to any Macedonian alliance proposals (as we might want to attack them after we have dealt with Rome)
All seems very doable apart for an alliance with Carthage, they do not like us and we do not like them but that will not prevent us from trying. Though I fear they would be unreliable allies at best. Also Syracuse is a Greek city, can we really allow it to fall to the Barbarians? If Carthage attacks it and Syracuse seems unable to defend itself, I think we should intervene, but if more of you feel otherwise we may leave them to their fate.
Luckily for our potential Carthaginian alliance they decide to invade Mauretania, however despite some diplomatic efforts they refuse an alliance. However the war starts well, the Romans do move in towards Croton, but we invade Lucania and sweeps away the Lucanian army and meet the Romans in battle. Eventually Pyrrhus drives them to Apulia and from there they retreat into Samnium. Pyrrhus lay siege to the Apulian cities, while the army in Epirus is shipped to Taras and from there invade Lucania and besiege their cities.
Romans try in vain to drive Pyrrhus away from Apulia. However bad news as the Macedonians manage to defeat the invading Galatians. Alliances are created with the Aetolians, Achaeans as well as Syracuse. Lucania is liberated and put under Epirote control. Two years after the war starts Pyrrhus march into Campania. For nearly a year the Romans try to drive him away, but eventually Campania is under our control
Pyrrhus decide to move against Rome. However while victorious the army is not in good enough shape, so we retreat and let the army rest. While war rages in Italy we are drawn into a war in Hellas as the Achaean League invade Sparta.
While our militia army is sent to support the Achaeans it wins one battle against the Spartans as Sparta falls and sees its independence end. It is quickly sent back to Italy, it can be noted it is now led by the former Strategos of the Bithynian army, who could not despite all his skill save it from Pontus. A few months after the fall of Sparta it is Pontus that forces us into a new war as they go to war with the Aetolians. They are unfortunately supported by the Seleucids and the Bosporans.
Luckily while none of our many victories against Rome has been decisive, they are eventually forced to accept our demands of peace, actually they offer us more then what we have demanded for a few months.
The war with the eastern kingdoms look like it might end on its own, especially as both Pontus and the Bosporan Kingdom asks and receives a white peace each. The Seleucids appearantly want more.
King Antiochus himself lead an army that promptly lay Taras under siege. However the Seleucid navy is quickly sent to the bottom of the sea. After a few battles their army is destroyed. While they have more armies, they are unlikely to have a large enough navy at the moment, so the chance for the war ending seems good.
While the most prudent course of action might be to wait until a white peace can be arranged with the Seleucids and then act, we could strike now; Pyrrhus army is in good condition and while our manpower may not be at the levels we might wish it should be enough.
For our main presumptive targets, Macedonia has recently conquered Crete and seems to be in quite good position, but we have two allies to help us against them (the Leagues). Illyria is another option, they recently got beaten by the Scordisci in a war, so we could try to take Taulanti from them. However there is one very ambitious thing we could do, invade the Seleucids. Risky I agree, but we are already at war with them and all we need is military access to Macedonian ports (and more importantly so we can march our army into Argolis and from there board our ships) to securely get to Lydia or Caria...
War exhaustion is noticeable so our militia army will remain in Italy so that any revolts may be quickly dealt with.
So what should we do? And if you want war, remember to specify wether or not you feel we should wait until the war with Seleucids end.
Romans try in vain to drive Pyrrhus away from Apulia. However bad news as the Macedonians manage to defeat the invading Galatians. Alliances are created with the Aetolians, Achaeans as well as Syracuse. Lucania is liberated and put under Epirote control. Two years after the war starts Pyrrhus march into Campania. For nearly a year the Romans try to drive him away, but eventually Campania is under our control
Pyrrhus decide to move against Rome. However while victorious the army is not in good enough shape, so we retreat and let the army rest. While war rages in Italy we are drawn into a war in Hellas as the Achaean League invade Sparta.
While our militia army is sent to support the Achaeans it wins one battle against the Spartans as Sparta falls and sees its independence end. It is quickly sent back to Italy, it can be noted it is now led by the former Strategos of the Bithynian army, who could not despite all his skill save it from Pontus. A few months after the fall of Sparta it is Pontus that forces us into a new war as they go to war with the Aetolians. They are unfortunately supported by the Seleucids and the Bosporans.
Luckily while none of our many victories against Rome has been decisive, they are eventually forced to accept our demands of peace, actually they offer us more then what we have demanded for a few months.
The war with the eastern kingdoms look like it might end on its own, especially as both Pontus and the Bosporan Kingdom asks and receives a white peace each. The Seleucids appearantly want more.
King Antiochus himself lead an army that promptly lay Taras under siege. However the Seleucid navy is quickly sent to the bottom of the sea. After a few battles their army is destroyed. While they have more armies, they are unlikely to have a large enough navy at the moment, so the chance for the war ending seems good.
While the most prudent course of action might be to wait until a white peace can be arranged with the Seleucids and then act, we could strike now; Pyrrhus army is in good condition and while our manpower may not be at the levels we might wish it should be enough.
For our main presumptive targets, Macedonia has recently conquered Crete and seems to be in quite good position, but we have two allies to help us against them (the Leagues). Illyria is another option, they recently got beaten by the Scordisci in a war, so we could try to take Taulanti from them. However there is one very ambitious thing we could do, invade the Seleucids. Risky I agree, but we are already at war with them and all we need is military access to Macedonian ports (and more importantly so we can march our army into Argolis and from there board our ships) to securely get to Lydia or Caria...
War exhaustion is noticeable so our militia army will remain in Italy so that any revolts may be quickly dealt with.
So what should we do? And if you want war, remember to specify wether or not you feel we should wait until the war with Seleucids end.
If you think your navy is up to it you could try and get Cyprus from the Seleucids, that way you won't have to fight too many battles and drain all your manpower. Once the Seleucid war is over you should definitely wait for your WE to drop, unless Illyria is in a really bad state at the moment (no/few armies etc) and attacking them now will be a lot easier than doing so in a few years.
I certainly wouldn't go for Asia Minor if I were you. You'd get too spread out. As Rabid said: Cyprus is the maximum and I'm not really a supporter of that idea either. Certainly ater, but just not yet. Macedonia would be my aim. Should you get the opportunity get Samnium before Rome gets it.
I don't know what some of you are talking about.. focus on italy and take Illyra first. taking land from the seleucids wouldn't have any gain.
once you take more than just one region from illyra you can go after macedonia.
once you take more than just one region from illyra you can go after macedonia.
I would focus on Illyria and Greece first, when you get stronger then take on Seleucids
The Seleucids agreed to a white peace after one year. However before we can start a new war with the foes we intend, we find ourselves drawn into one unwanted war as Carthage invaded our Syracusan allies.
While defeating the Carthaginian army in Sicily Pyrrhus is wounded! This is a terrible blow, he still lives but is no longer as effective in leading our army into battle.
Still as most of the fighting is at sea, some difficulties, but in the end the only capable Carthaginian commander dies, and the remainder of their navy is destroyed. The wars continues for a while with nothing really happening, a small interruption comes when Pontus once again attacks the Aetolians. However this time they don't bring in any allies and it all ends in a white peace.
However Macedonia repeatedly asks for an alliance. They have no allies, and the Seleucids and Egypt have allied with each other, so one can understand them somewhat. How should we deal with this, agree to it or stick to our plans and continue to refuse them until we are able to invade. Also how to deal with the Carthaginian war, they can agree to a white peace, if we want anything more at all we would probably have to invade Africa.
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Can add that Rome is allied with the Samnites, Etruscans and Massiliotes. Our war exhaustion is bad, and while our manpower is at acceptable levels, I think that after we end the Carthaginian war we should remain at peace until the revolt risk has dropped.
While defeating the Carthaginian army in Sicily Pyrrhus is wounded! This is a terrible blow, he still lives but is no longer as effective in leading our army into battle.
Still as most of the fighting is at sea, some difficulties, but in the end the only capable Carthaginian commander dies, and the remainder of their navy is destroyed. The wars continues for a while with nothing really happening, a small interruption comes when Pontus once again attacks the Aetolians. However this time they don't bring in any allies and it all ends in a white peace.
However Macedonia repeatedly asks for an alliance. They have no allies, and the Seleucids and Egypt have allied with each other, so one can understand them somewhat. How should we deal with this, agree to it or stick to our plans and continue to refuse them until we are able to invade. Also how to deal with the Carthaginian war, they can agree to a white peace, if we want anything more at all we would probably have to invade Africa.
...
Can add that Rome is allied with the Samnites, Etruscans and Massiliotes. Our war exhaustion is bad, and while our manpower is at acceptable levels, I think that after we end the Carthaginian war we should remain at peace until the revolt risk has dropped.
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Go for Panormus, do not accept the Macedonian alliance offer. Instead, should Macedonia get attacked by a major, join in the fun.
As the council wishes to conquer Panormus, the main army is moved to Sicily in preparation for an invasion of Africa, as there is little possibility in getting the Carthaginians to agree to ceding Panormus otherwise. Hieron causes some trouble, he wants to rule, but nothing comes out of it, except Hieron losing his position in the court.
The first invasion is a failure, the Carthaginian commander is capable enough and Pyrrhus isn't as good as he used to be, so the army retreats to Sicily to prepare the next invasion. Rather then going straight towards Carthage we land near Thapsus, our numerical superiority and no terrain advantage for the Carthaginians should allow us to deal with the Carthaginian army.
Unfortunately we fail to take into consideration the Numidians. A Massyli army attacks us and we suffer great losses but are able to successfully reach our ships and return to Sicily.
After our army have recovered we make another attempt, this time we land at Oea and takes the city as well as nearby Leptis. However the Carthaginian army and the Massyli army both arrives and we have to retreat. As we lack the means to continue the war; Pyrrhus is extremely unpopular and revolts occur almost monthly, there are no reliable generals of sufficient skill available at the moment as well; there is no choice but to accept a white peace.
However as we recover, we only have a few years of peace until war is upon us again. Pontus yet again declares war on the Aetolians and bring in the Bosporans and the Seleucids. Once again it ends with white peace and the only fighting being a failed Seleucid invasion (this time directly into Aetolia) and the destruction of the Seleucid fleet.
The map shows the important countries around the mediterranean. Green boxes around the names indicate we are allied to them. Our war exhaustion is still rather high, but we now have a few good loyal commanders, one being Pyrrhus grandson Pyrrhus, to lead our armies. There are no changes in alliances that I noted, Macedonia is still on their own, Rome is allied with Etruria, Samnium and Massilia, Carthage with the Massyli, and Egypt and the Seleucids are allies (but as we just signed peace with the Seleucids, they should not be called in if we decide to attack Egypt quickly (to liberate Cyrenaica or something like that)).
We still have not enacted any of the two citizenship laws, just so you know.
The first invasion is a failure, the Carthaginian commander is capable enough and Pyrrhus isn't as good as he used to be, so the army retreats to Sicily to prepare the next invasion. Rather then going straight towards Carthage we land near Thapsus, our numerical superiority and no terrain advantage for the Carthaginians should allow us to deal with the Carthaginian army.
Unfortunately we fail to take into consideration the Numidians. A Massyli army attacks us and we suffer great losses but are able to successfully reach our ships and return to Sicily.
After our army have recovered we make another attempt, this time we land at Oea and takes the city as well as nearby Leptis. However the Carthaginian army and the Massyli army both arrives and we have to retreat. As we lack the means to continue the war; Pyrrhus is extremely unpopular and revolts occur almost monthly, there are no reliable generals of sufficient skill available at the moment as well; there is no choice but to accept a white peace.
However as we recover, we only have a few years of peace until war is upon us again. Pontus yet again declares war on the Aetolians and bring in the Bosporans and the Seleucids. Once again it ends with white peace and the only fighting being a failed Seleucid invasion (this time directly into Aetolia) and the destruction of the Seleucid fleet.
The map shows the important countries around the mediterranean. Green boxes around the names indicate we are allied to them. Our war exhaustion is still rather high, but we now have a few good loyal commanders, one being Pyrrhus grandson Pyrrhus, to lead our armies. There are no changes in alliances that I noted, Macedonia is still on their own, Rome is allied with Etruria, Samnium and Massilia, Carthage with the Massyli, and Egypt and the Seleucids are allies (but as we just signed peace with the Seleucids, they should not be called in if we decide to attack Egypt quickly (to liberate Cyrenaica or something like that)).
We still have not enacted any of the two citizenship laws, just so you know.
Better next time Lofman! Keep going for Panormus. Sicily is vital for Epirus to prosper.
I still don't know what was going on in your mind with expanding to italy first.. you could have easily annexed several places in greece. then you would have had enough power there to take on macedonia.
now you missed a lot of chances.. and there isn't much more to gain in italy, you could have taken all of greece.
now you missed a lot of chances.. and there isn't much more to gain in italy, you could have taken all of greece.