Home Trending Latest threads New posts Developer diaries

New Duel Engine

Jump to latest Follow Reply
  • We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Crusader Kings II 69875 Bug Reports 19709 User Modifications 10589 Suggestions 5969 Tech Support 6364 After Action Reports
Status
Not open for further replies.
Show only dev responses
On a different note, I'm not sure I agree it is a good idea to give everyone a combat trait. It effectively reduces the number of levels of ability from 5 to 4, making it all a lot less granular.
It should also be noted that your event will result in men and women being equally skilled at combat. In Medieval times that makes very little sense.
 
Meneth said:
Would you happen to have the previous version at hand? It'd simplify me updating the integrated version in PB.
Click to expand...
Damn, I didn't think of that :(

But these are the changes to the base version:
common\traits\combat_traits.txt: customizer = no / random = no added to all
common\traits\targeting_traits.txt: customizer = no added
events\combat_trait_events.txt - 5550114 removed (was commented out), 5551199 added (new trait hand out event)

Additionally for VIET version:
events\combat_trait_events.txt - added VIET trait checks to 5550100, 5550101, 5550102, 5550103
events\duel_engine_events.txt: multiple events, changed trait checks
 
jordarkelf said:
Damn, I didn't think of that :(

But these are the changes to the base version:
common\traits\combat_traits.txt: customizer = no / random = no added to all
common\traits\targeting_traits.txt: customizer = no added
events\combat_trait_events.txt - 5550114 removed (was commented out), 5551199 added (new trait hand out event)

Additionally for VIET version:
events\combat_trait_events.txt - added VIET trait checks to 5550100, 5550101, 5550102, 5550103
events\duel_engine_events.txt: multiple events, changed trait checks
Click to expand...
Thanks. Should be simple enough to do.
Due to my concerns voiced above I'll keep the PB version of the assignment for now.
 
Meneth said:
On a different note, I'm not sure I agree it is a good idea to give everyone a combat trait. It effectively reduces the number of levels of ability from 5 to 4, making it all a lot less granular.
It should also be noted that your event will result in men and women being equally skilled at combat. In Medieval times that makes very little sense.
Click to expand...
Hmm... good point. I will limit it to strong women or women with martial education only. New version uploading in few minutes once I have that re-written.
 
Last edited:
NEW VERSION OUT

No tournaments yet, sorry.
New in this version:

-Combat traits are now handed out in a new game within a few days of starting to everyone* aged 15 or up. Most people will get the starting trait "poor fighter", but people with good skills may still get a higher one.
-The VIET version now also takes VIET traits like agile and perceptive into account in handing out combat traits
-VIET traits effect on duels was overhauled
-The combat traits and the targeting trait should no longer be handed out at random to new characters, and are blocked from the customizer
-There is now a version compatible with CK2+, currently for version 2.06.3. Big thanks to minrog for doing the first version, I will try to keep it compatible in the future.

*women only get a combat trait if they are strong or have martial education. Unlike "natural" progression under this system every male starts with a combat trait, but that's preferable to the alternative IMO as otherwise only people with a martial education trait will get it. During natural progression this is not the case.
This hand-out system will likely be changed in the future to use a more fine-tuned approach that takes the likely education and previous combat prestige - if any - into account to make it resemble natural progression more.
 
Last edited:
Minor update added to the above which restores the feature that combat traits can be handed out as a result of showing bravery or heroism in combat, and added a chance of demotion if a character becomes craven during combat (all in battle_events.txt).

This used to be in but at some version it was accidentally removed.
 
Hmm, all males have combat training? All?

I don't think that I bite. Take, for example, the modern day. Most people have zero combat training and are not only "poor warriors" but are simply incapable of fighting an actually-trained opponent, even if he/she is a poor one, and thus do not try to do so nor pretend that they're the modern-day equivalent of a "duelist" of any sort. In CK2's setting, more of the characters have combat training, because CK2 only models feudal lords, their families, and their courts. However, the situation is still analogous. The average CK2 15-year-old should not have a combat trait if they don't have a martial education. [He could gain one or two levels in early adulthood through dedicated practice/experience in actual blood-blood-everywhere combat, however.] I share Meneth's concern about effectively reducing the trait distribution granularity by 20%.

Also, though I'm less concerned here: you lose a combat trait if you gain craven in battle now? Since when does a person's personal combat ability suddenly decline because they're frightened? And who says cowards don't know how to fight? That event (gaining craven) is already annoyingly arbitrary (at least you were personally participating in a battle as opposed to sitting back at home with your Brave trait that you got from when you were 6 and your ward saw you smash a spider with your bare hands) and difficult to rid yourself of its effects.

I like what I hear about taking the VIET traits into account now as well (also, PB has fully integrated all of cybr's traits from VIET now, BTW). I was always a little sad that it didn't actually matter that my character was agile or perceptive, or specifically not deaf (absent-minded can kind of go either way-- talking 1:1 combat here), for example, in a duel. Now I guess I don't have to be. :)
 
Meneth said:
On a different note, I'm not sure I agree it is a good idea to give everyone a combat trait. It effectively reduces the number of levels of ability from 5 to 4, making it all a lot less granular.
It should also be noted that your event will result in men and women being equally skilled at combat. In Medieval times that makes very little sense.
Click to expand...

Problem is though that in PB, If you start as someone like Alexios Komnenos, he has no combat skills as he has an economic education which doesn't really make sense. So in a dual he's toast.
 
Jaidal said:
Problem is though that in PB, If you start as someone like Alexios Komnenos, he has no combat skills as he has an economic education which doesn't really make sense. So in a dual he's toast.
Click to expand...
Oh, I agree PB's solution isn't ideal either. It gives too few people combat traits.
NDE's solution gives too many people combat traits though.

I'll probably add some of the conditions from NDE's solution to PB's solution to create some sort of middle ground between the two.
 
For a next version I'll likely them only to leaders, once I figure out a good way to do it. Everyone with martial education and maybe based on some more traits.
It's very much a trick to find the optimal middle ground for gen 1.

Maybe something like this?
Code: 
OR = {
	AND = {
		is_ruler = yes
		martial = 7
	}
	martial = 10
	in_command = yes
	trait = misguided_warrior
	trait = tough_soldier
	trait = skilled_tactician
	trait = brilliant_strategist
}
Would give it to any ruler with 7 or more martial, or to anyone with 10 martial, or any army commander, or anyone with a combat trait at all (yes probably a bit double check here but if you somehow get a non-martial army commander at game start they should know how to fight, right?)

Also, though I'm less concerned here: you lose a combat trait if you gain craven in battle now? Since when does a person's personal combat ability suddenly decline because they're frightened? And who says cowards don't know how to fight? That event (gaining craven) is already annoyingly arbitrary (at least you were personally participating in a battle as opposed to sitting back at home with your Brave trait that you got from when you were 6 and your ward saw you smash a spider with your bare hands) and difficult to rid yourself of its effects.
Click to expand...
I might add it to some other event, or create a new on_action one for it, at the moment though nothing can decrease combat traits other than old age and I want the system to be more dynamic. Craven seems to fit if only because it means that the character receiving it becomes frightened and runs from the battle, which could mean that they overestimated their combat skills.
 
Last edited:
jordarkelf said:
For a next version I'll likely them only to leaders, once I figure out a good way to do it. Everyone with martial education and maybe based on some more traits.
It's very much a trick to find the optimal middle ground for gen 1.

Maybe something like this?
Code: 
OR = {
    AND = {
        is_ruler = yes
        martial = 7
    }
    martial = 10
    in_command = yes
    trait = misguided_warrior
    trait = tough_soldier
    trait = skilled_tactician
    trait = brilliant_strategist
}
Would give it to any ruler with 7 or more martial, or to anyone with 10 martial, or any army commander, or anyone with a combat trait at all (yes probably a bit double check here but if you somehow get a non-martial army commander at game start they should know how to fight, right?)


I might add it to some other event, or create a new on_action one for it, at the moment though nothing can decrease combat traits other than old age and I want the system to be more dynamic. Craven seems to fit if only because it means that the character receiving it becomes frightened and runs from the battle, which could mean that they overestimated their combat skills.
Click to expand...
Instead of using any_realm_character, just use any_realm_lord.
 
Meneth said:
Instead of using any_realm_character, just use any_realm_lord.
Click to expand...
+1. Will do that, should cut down on the useless people.

On another note my new tournament system is mostly working. I am cutting down the four levels (at least for now) so it will just be a single realm tournament again -- much easier to script and means I can spend more time making sure the jousting etc. works as intended.
 
jordarkelf: Take a look at the system of assignment I coded for PB: https://github.com/Meneth/PB-git/commit/2ba25b65ae2779877c55e150607914e9a2557127
It uses a variable based on the traits of the character to assign the traits. It should assign them to any ruler in the game that is above baron level and is either Feudal or a Patrician, if my understanding of "any_playable_ruler" is correct. This includes children, but since they're unlikely to have many of the traits mentioned that shouldn't really cause any issues.
 
TOURNAMENTS BETA

Anyone want to help me test the Duel Engine tournaments system?

Changelog from the version up in the first post:

-Replaced the vanilla tournament system with one inspired by the AGOT mod, which adds several new features such as:
--The tournament winner can pick the Queen of Love and Beauty, and maybe start a romance with them
--Some new events during tournaments
--Tournament winners now get medals, and you can see who has one by a new decision
-Added jousting during tournaments
-Jousting now determines the tournament winner
-All duels are less likely to result in death
-CK2 compatible version now has a proper CK2+ version of battle_events.txt
-Meneth's trait assignment system is used for the combat traits

Changes from the old DE/tournament version:
-Only one tournament exists, no more count or duke tournaments (like in vanilla)
-No more people outside of the realm are invited as that never worked anyway
-Rulers will only joust with rulers, barons still joust with lowborn
-The AI will no longer be able to refuse a joust with the player, since this was very annoying (the AI is the one to always start a joust now, so they can still reject beforehand though)
-Wounded jousters no longer become craven if they refuse a new round
-Tournaments no longer last forever, they should end at most after a year
-Random winners will be picked only if there are no valid candidates

---

Downloads:

Vanilla
VIET
CK2+

---

Possible issues:
-In some cases normal duels may be called instead of jousts, easily visible as the death reason will be death_combat instead of death_accident. I am still trying to track down if that is actually happening
-In one game I had the tournament not start at all, in a year.
-Jousts may still continue after a winner is selected
-Double winners may be selected, or a real 2nd/3rd as well as a hedge knight. There should be some logic to prevent this but I have seen it happen.
 
Last edited:
Jordarkelf, I'm trying to port (or rather, update, since we've a severely outdated version of the duel engine) this to Lux Invicta and I'm facing with a rather strange bug; duels against characters who have a dynasty don't start. Duels against lowborns go OK, but the battle duel event never starts for characters who have a dynasty (event number 5556000 triggers)but nothing else happens, not even a followup event telling if the enemy retreats or duels). Any ideas on this?
 
DarkReborn said:
Jordarkelf, I'm trying to port (or rather, update, since we've a severely outdated version of the duel engine) this to Lux Invicta and I'm facing with a rather strange bug; duels against characters who have a dynasty don't start. Duels against lowborns go OK, but the battle duel event never starts for characters who have a dynasty (event number 5556000 triggers)but nothing else happens, not even a followup event telling if the enemy retreats or duels). Any ideas on this?
Click to expand...
That rings a bell but unfortunately I'm not sure on the details... it depends on what version you guys originally implemented.
At one point I had a check on dynasty in the following battle events (5556001 and up), which was supposed to prevent "important" characters from dying too fast, before I included non-lethal outcomes in the main duel engine. If that is what you're running into there should still be a check for dynasty somewhere in the LI version of the files.

I'd be willing to look them over if you like, maybe I can just spot the error since I am probably more familiar with this code.

Some time tomorrow though, it's close to 3am for me :D
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom
Back