We have been experiencing some issues with the servers lately so I can't follow-up on it at this time. Sorry.
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Hearts of Iron 4 Wiki
- Thread starter Meneth
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We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
[snipped images]@SolSys
Please look into the issue of the graphic not updating for the page File:HOI4_ULTRA_thumbnail.png and the linked page HOI4_ULTRA_(Historical_Industry_Project). Thank you.
Screenshot showing updated "good" image with green border and outdated, distorted "bad" image with red border.
Screenshot showing outdated, distorted "bad" image with red border.
cc: @Vorondil
I've found that "purging" the wiki cache, by going to the page (view) history and replacing the "history" in the url with "purge" works after the wiki updates overnight. I'm not sure how well it works for other users, though it certain works well on my end for most files.
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Isn't the dev responsible for the update of wiki? As there is no official manual. Can't believe the air designer content still hasn't been updated yet.
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@SolSys
Thank you for your help!
The graphic for HOI4 ULTRA (Historical Industry Project) and for File:HOI4 ULTRA thumbnail.png are now finally up to date.
cc: @Vorondil
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This is a community maintained wiki -- I believe it says so on the banner -- and, as such, we encourage users to edit content they deem important rather than waiting to be done at an unknown point in time.
(Please take the time to thank wiki editors using the "thanks" link next to their edit history.)
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Absolutely, but there is some question as to the business sense of relying on a community wiki for a manual for what is a very complex game - and I don't think it's inappropriate for customers to ask why someone would build such a complex game but not go to the effort of making sure there was appropriate guidance as to how to play it (and given the wiki is the avenue chosen for this, this thread seems a not-inappropriate place for that? But I could be wrong).
Sorry, I'll give the dead horse a break again now for a bit
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Keep saying it ever since. Judging from my experience of managing B2C customer bases of tens of million, albeit in a different industry I may only speculate PDX believes it can reap the upside in revenue of remarkable and well-deserved HoI4's growth in popularity yet keep a no fringe business / ops / cost model of a "nerds' sandbox". All those customers furiously asking basic questions on the forum, they do add to the recognized revenue of the day yet no less they will take their toll conversion / LTV / long term revenue both for the base game and for future DLCs.
- I tried to find a description of the process on how to make contribution to wiki yet I failed miserably?
- Is there a way to upload / test new wiki page code and not ruin the current version of it? I had a cursory look at the the editor and so far I've found only WYSIWYG editor for the content blocks and hard core editor of native HTML code. Was I too dumb?
- Or may be some kind soul have already developed parsers that convert game files into wiki format? My guess there should definitely be one for country events.
- There are some style guidelines which you can use. Otherwise contributing works more or less the same as with any other wiki which uses the mediawiki software(e.g. wikipedia).
- If you just want to see how something looks like which you enter in the source editor, you can use the preview button. The WYSIWYG editor is kind of its own preview. If you want to save things which you test, you can use your user page ( https://hoi4.paradoxwikis.com/User:Joshua_Happytree ) or you can create a subpage of your userpage by appending a / and then a name. A commonly used name for test pages is "Sandbox", so you could use https://hoi4.paradoxwikis.com/User:Joshua_Happytree/Sandbox
BTW: the source editor is not for HTML code. What you enter there is usually called "wiki markup" or wiki code. You can learn more about the code at https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Formatting - pdxparse can generate the wiki markup for hoi4 events and other things. For hoi4, you can usually be found at https://github.com/BiscuitCookies/pdxparse . Higher up in this thread there are multiple posts by BiscuitCookie with more information about pdxparse.
pyradox can generate some lists and tables from the hoi4 files. But it is maintained anymore. my fork has some fixes for hoi4, but I don't own the game, so it is difficult for me to fix things
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@grotaclas , thanks for your kind help. While copying Artillery technology article source into my sandbox I mistook the original tab for my sandbox so tried to save into an original article. Luckily I was banned by abuse filter for "Common vandalism" So three questions:
where A is the Ahead of Time (AoT) in years, B is the base cost of technology in standard research days, C is a country-wide research bonus-malus and T is limited technology bonus. I've tested the formula on a dozen of technologies with different base costs, technology bonuses and country-wide bonuses-maluses. In 80% of the cases the formula outputs exactly the number of days the game shows and in the rest of cases the difference is one day. My guess the difference is due to rounding yet I failed to reliably understand what kind of rounding the game uses. The best results I got with simple rounding yet as I said sometimes the actual number of days as shown in the game differs one day up or down. So:
So three questions:- Can someone unblock me? If it's possible with access rights that limit me to editing only my own sandbox and not the live articles. Don't want to make troubles until I learn to work with the engine.
- I've played around with research and:
- As I said in the main forum post there are currently two formulas in the Research article (https://hoi4.paradoxwikis.com/Research) -- ln x and e^x. Logarithmic formula does not produce the results observed in the game so I suggest to take it down.
- I suggest to update e^x formula to have both country-wide and technology bonuses. It would look like
where A is the Ahead of Time (AoT) in years, B is the base cost of technology in standard research days, C is a country-wide research bonus-malus and T is limited technology bonus. I've tested the formula on a dozen of technologies with different base costs, technology bonuses and country-wide bonuses-maluses. In 80% of the cases the formula outputs exactly the number of days the game shows and in the rest of cases the difference is one day. My guess the difference is due to rounding yet I failed to reliably understand what kind of rounding the game uses. The best results I got with simple rounding yet as I said sometimes the actual number of days as shown in the game differs one day up or down. So:
- Can someone either update the article or unblock my sandbox so that I can create the new article source for someone to check and transfer it into the live wiki?
- I think may be a table could be helpful that would show the loss of research days due to rushing the technology ahead of time yet with a technology bonus. Like a player has a 150% research bonus and wants to start researching 40's technology on April, 1st, 39. The table would convert the number of research days in 1939 into the "effective research days" with the Ahead of Time malus and technology bonus. So to calculate the end date of research the player will:
- Take the number of effective research days in 1939 from the table.
- Subtract them from the base research cost in days.
- Divide the result by the technology bonus.
- Add this to the Jan, 1 of the technology year and thus get the end date of research.
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I unblocked you. You didn't accidentally edit the main article. You edited your sandbox and got blocked by the overzealous abuse filter, because you added lines which contain the word "poor" and the abuse filter doesn't like the first three letters of the word. I restored the blocked edit. You can make further experiments in your sandbox, but try not to change lines which contain the first three letters of the word "poor", so that you don't get blocked again. Maybe @SolSys can teach the abuse filter to not block these letter.@grotaclas , thanks for your kind help. While copying Artillery technology article source into my sandbox I mistook the original tab for my sandbox so tried to save into an original article. Luckily I was banned by abuse filter for "Common vandalism"
- Can someone unblock me? If it's possible with access rights that limit me to editing only my own sandbox and not the live articles. Don't want to make troubles until I learn to work with the engine.
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Technology sharing is another source of bonuses. In my opinion a single "aggregate B%" is fine here.
The most accurate definition of research time would be the Python snippet at the end of the section. Any attempt to convert such a discrete loop into a continuous integral will necessarily be somewhat imprecise. In that sense the integral shown in the wiki:
just attempts to express the same thing in math terms. Both the ln x and e^x formulas derive directly from this integral. The e^x one solves for t and the ln x one calculates the integral from 0 to T and then adds the remaining research days without AOT.
The actual formulas used by the tooltip are a bit different than these two and also take into account saved research days. But I think the existing formulas are better at conveying the mathematical(-ish) relationship of the inputs.
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- I forgot about those two I'll add them to the calc. I only play SP and don't join factions so don't use tech sharing. That's why I forgot about that.
- Thanks for the saved research days, I should really tinker around with optimizing research through tech juggling. Haven't used it so far yet I guess it may produce interesting results.
I guess it's a matter of personal taste. You can always put zero in one cell and a lump sum into another
For me breaking down them are necessary as the Tech part of my HoI4 Google Sheets separately tracks limited tech boni got through foci, the changes in trade laws due to expenditure of PP and removal of country-wide research debuffs due to foci. So I can't use a lump sum Here are the results I've got. The formulae text are directly copy-pasted from the calculation cells and not re-written. To cross-check with the game, this is Turkey at Jan, 1, 36 after FA'ing "Mechanized our Army" and "Accelerate Native Fighter Development" from the rightmost military focus tree. It'd be great if you point out what I'm doing wrong with ln x
| =ROUND(365*(B37+1/2)*(1-exp(-2*((C37/365*1/(1+D37+E37)))))) | |||||||
| =ROUND(365*(B37+C37/(365*(1+D37+E37))-ln(2*B37+1)/2)) | |||||||
Tech name | AoT | Base Cost | Tech Bonus | Country Bonus | Game + 1 day saved | e^x | ln x |
| Mech 40 | 4 | 200 | 200% | 5% | 496 | 496 | 1125 |
| Support 39 | 3 | 150 | 300% | 5% | 234 | 235 | 777 |
| Fighter 40 | 4 | 200 | 150% | 5% | 574 | 574 | 1137 |
| Engineer 45 | 9 | 150 | 300% | 5% | 637 | 637 | 2785 |
- Yeah, I previously used a big unwieldy table of pre-calculated discreet values It's just I decided to make my Google Sheets "cleaner"
- I've found two cases when ln x shows accurate results and e^x is off for 1-2%. Those are techs with high base cost, low AoT and, probably, low research boni. For Turkey at 1-Jan-36 these are Refining 37 and Atomic 40. Turkey initially has 5% bonus for Atomic and 10% for Refining. Yet starting from the next techs down the same tech lines e^x formula does work. Though I guess as the time passes closer techs out of these trees may become accurate and those further away -- not.
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The ln x formula applies when the research starts before but finishes after the tech becomes current. That's why it might work for refining and atomic. The techs in your quoted spreadsheet all finish before they become current (sixth column is smaller than second column in days).It'd be great if you point out what am I doing wrong with ln x
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Yes, you're right! Huge thanks!!! Outputting the results of two formulae depending on the research duration will cover all cases.
PS Have done no math for the past 30 years