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Werewolf CCXXVIII: WereWolf! The Musical

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beartjah said:
Well, seems like I wasn't the only goodie that was failing spectacularly :p

Anyway, now that the game is over: could someone explain why exactly a Van Helsing is consider to be so good? I genuinely couldn't/can't figure it out myself, which made me weary of using my scan early on Jeray to see if I could trust him after his phishing in fear of it being a really bad of using it.
In hindsight I probably should've scanned Jeray anyway though, but I hadn't expected him to actually go after me for my paranoia...
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What really threw me off was how I misinterpreted my scan. I was feeling really confident that you weren't a major goodie from it, but obviously that was wrong.

Also alxeu actually scanned me with his super-scan.
 
jeray2000 said:
What really threw me off was how I misinterpreted my scan. I was feeling really confident that you weren't a major goodie from it, but obviously that was wrong.

Also alxeu actually scanned me with his super-scan.
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And I was probably going to shoot Beartjah with the information you provided, if I had shot anyone the night I died.

Imagine that update. :oops:
 
What's are your thoughts on the different deadlines for night and day?
 
alxeu said:
And I was probably going to shoot Beartjah with the information you provided, if I had shot anyone the night I died.

Imagine that update. :oops:
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It wouldn't have said you had done it fyi.
 
Sleepyhead said:
We knew Arkasas was priest scanned (SA) and we had reports on you and Jerman which indicated priest. You were kneeling in front of a tree in a ruin, whispering, torches lit at odd hours and Jerman had stuff like wealthy and charming individual who is not alone. Ornate palace. Graveyard mentioned. Whispering secrets.

Given how pickpoint games usually work (more priests and VH than seers), I made sure our pack was wolf heavy from the start and it seems the other pack did the same.
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I didn't even really consider it. I figured any goodie with enough points for seer would take it, so that didn't factor into my thought process. I just stuffed the pack with wolves because cultists were expensive and I felt their low percentage scans were not worthwhile, and zealots were too risky if a pack had more than one of them.

For the orange pack, we never really considered spockyt, at least not while I was alive. I wrote him off as a unimportant goodie, and basically figured with all the subpar picks from the goodies, we didn't have a priest or seer. Ironic since after Randy got hunted I was the last living player Spockyt could get a meaningful result on.
 
Dr.Livingstone said:
What's are your thoughts on the different deadlines for night and day?
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I'm opposed to it being used again. Besides it being an offsite addition, and thus inherently heresy, it really just increases the power of behind the scenes forces, the wolves and JL. The average villager isn't going to change their view much on the outcome of the lynch in terms of using any scant powers they have, while to JLs and wolves it can be powerful. This A) weakens the public game and takes influence away from average villagers, and B) can contribute to a baddie route if a JL doesn't form to take advantage of the delay, as this game shows. The baddies were able to consolidate information and misdirect the village (admittedly for more reasons than the delay, but it contributed) and by the latter half of the game the village in essence was nothing more than collateral in the fight between the packs.
 
I am amused that a majority of the people who voted to kill me turned out to be baddies. I had intended on making role claims to people via PM but didn't have time -- looks I would have had better luck saving myself by actually claiming Sorcerer's Apprentice :p
 
jeray2000 said:
Didn't really make a difference to me at least. Maybe if we had a proper JL up coordinating scans and protection it would have had more of an effect.
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aedan777 said:
I'm opposed to it being used again. Besides it being an offsite addition, and thus inherently heresy, it really just increases the power of behind the scenes forces, the wolves and JL. The average villager isn't going to change their view much on the outcome of the lynch in terms of using any scant powers they have, while to JLs and wolves it can be powerful. This A) weakens the public game and takes influence away from average villagers, and B) can contribute to a baddie route if a JL doesn't form to take advantage of the delay, as this game shows. The baddies were able to consolidate information and misdirect the village (admittedly for more reasons than the delay, but it contributed) and by the latter half of the game the village in essence was nothing more than collateral in the fight between the packs.
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Yeah, pretty much my feelings on it, though from my perspective at least it seemed less like it was a help for the wolves and more like it didn't affect gameplay in any meaningful sense. Still, I'm glad that it was actually tried out in a big, mostly because I wanted to see it in action for a while. I will say that as a GM it was a help with so many restless scans, especially towards the middle of the game where a lot of them were still alive but wanted to wait until closer to/after the deadline to send in orders.

One thing that I thought went well this game was the cultist. We only had one, but at least from the outside, it seemed like the uncertainty of it did affect who/which nights they decided to scan. For the other baddie role of Zealot, I probably wouldn't do them outside of a pickpoint game.
 
beartjah said:
Well, seems like I wasn't the only goodie that was failing spectacularly :p

Anyway, now that the game is over: could someone explain why exactly a Van Helsing is consider to be so good? I genuinely couldn't/can't figure it out myself, which made me weary of using my scan early on Jeray to see if I could trust him after his phishing in fear of it being a really bad of using it.
In hindsight I probably should've scanned Jeray anyway though, but I hadn't expected him to actually go after me for my paranoia...
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I don't think the issue necessarily is that VH is overpriced in relation to similar traits, looking at the pickpoint table for goodies, assassin is worth 8 and getting a scanning power is worth 3 so being an assassin villager with priestly/seerish/sorcerous (depending on which you chose) powers and a Van Helsing both would cost 11 points, with the VH being a strictly better version (your scan can instantly clear someone or discover they are a baddie and get their exact role and traits). I think assassin was overpriced for the goodies, since it's worth the same as a GA or a doc, despite the fact that the assassin's name not being revealed benefits the baddies more than the goodies. Maybe I'm crazy but I'd knock assassin down a couple points and adjust VH to still be assassin+3. Doing that would get VH closer to GA and doc which I think would fit better with its worth.
 
happycats517 said:
I don't think the issue necessarily is that VH is overpriced in relation to similar traits, looking at the pickpoint table for goodies, assassin is worth 8 and getting a scanning power is worth 3 so being an assassin villager with priestly/seerish/sorcerous (depending on which you chose) powers and a Van Helsing both would cost 11 points, with the VH being a strictly better version (your scan can instantly clear someone or discover they are a baddie and get their exact role and traits). I think assassin was overpriced for the goodies, since it's worth the same as a GA or a doc, despite the fact that the assassin's name not being revealed benefits the baddies more than the goodies. Maybe I'm crazy but I'd knock assassin down a couple points and adjust VH to still be assassin+3. Doing that would get VH closer to GA and doc which I think would fit better with its worth.
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I don't think it should be cheap for goodies to be able to kill someone without getting them lynched, nor should it be cheep for baddies to get an extra kill.

And I disagree about the assassins name not being given benefiting baddies more than goodies. In cases where a goodie shoots another goodie and their name is given in the update it's almost guaranteed the village will waste a day lynching the good assassin. However in the worst case the baddie can keep their shot until it will give parity, and their name being shown doesn't matter.
 
k-59 said:
I don't think it should be cheap for goodies to be able to kill someone without getting them lynched, nor should it be cheep for baddies to get an extra kill.

And I disagree about the assassins name not being given benefiting baddies more than goodies. In cases where a goodie shoots another goodie and their name is given in the update it's almost guaranteed the village will waste a day lynching the good assassin. However in the worst case the baddie can keep their shot until it will give parity, and their name being shown doesn't matter.
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I don't disagree that the assassin should be cheap, I do disagree that it is worth as much as a GA or a doc to the goodies. I think the 6 points it was worth to baddies was just about fine, which would've made a VH cost slightly more than a protector (9 based on my thought process of it being the same cost as assassin + scanning powers) which I think is fine value for the role.

Yes, the name not being revealed keeps a goodie from being killed for a wrong shot, but that can already be avoided if the shot is carried out with JL blessing, it also makes it harder for the assassin to gain legitimacy from a baddie kill as there is no official confirmation that they were the ones to carry it out. When you flip around to the baddies, they cannot use a hunter shot unless it is on a baddie from another pack, JL orders, or to hit parity. Their name not being revealed allows them to use assassination to take down seers, priests, or other major goodies who are well protected from hunts without having to fear reprisal. Assassin greatly benefits baddies over goodies versus the normal hunter that reveals names because it gives the much greater freedom on how they use it.
 
Thanks for hosting.
 
aedan777 said:
As an aside though, I'm surprised SPLIT was the only one to scan me all game, I expected to be a scan magnet as usual.
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You were zapped of your power when they tied you with another.
 
@Panzer Commader are you planning to start the next one in the near future?
 
Neato. I'd like to request the next Big, as well. I have some ideas I want to try, and a theme worked out, already. Security Chief will be returning, at least, and worked out a bit more.
 
Panzer Commader said:
Yes the thread should be up in 2 or 3 days
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great, I'm sure you'll fit right in.

alxeu said:
Neato. I'd like to request the next Big, as well. I have some ideas I want to try, and a theme worked out, already. Security Chief will be returning, at least, and worked out a bit more.
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@EUROO7 - Mr. President, please update the list. (Also, why did you bring back the list?)
 
Arkasas said:
great, I'm sure you'll fit right in.



@EUROO7 - Mr. President, please update the list. (Also, why did you bring back the list?)
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Presumably because a lot of people wanted to host games all at once?
 
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