Distiller - A late minute addition inspired by the role-blocker from Ciry's game. I think this has the potential to be a keeper. It is more valuable
for a baddie than for a goodie in the early game. In the endgame it is probably more of value for a goodie. I know lots of people think lover is too powerful
and this could be seen as a watered down version of lover.
The distiller has my seal of approval.
Touch of Good/Evil - I think these are best put on apprentices rather than on starting scanners. For this game I restricted them so people couldn't touch themselves (ewww!) but didn't think about this:
White Daimon has a rule that baddies should never be able to switch sides. A rule I fully support, I might add.
Putting ToE on baddies definitely violates that.
Spiritual Witness - Never liked this myself and only included it so people would have more things to chose from. Noone picked it so I guess noone else likes it either.
You might want to reduce the cost a bit though. I took plotter because it was 1 point I still had left that I couldn't use elsewhere. SA was cheaper, yet SA is probably more powerful (and therefore, very popular.)
It definitely was something that worried me as a potential problematic trait in the game though.
How I was to know reis was the only person who even had that ..?
Parity Check
Actually I think I gave the wrong answer to that one. I think I normally check after each step, after lynch+brutal, after sorcerer scan, after hunter hunt, after wolf attack+hunter retaliation. What do you guys think?
Definitely check that every step of the way. It's how slinky used it in Fierce Creatures, and that game had a very clear case where the two methods would have derived different results for silly reasons. Eg. the wolves eating the newly claimed sorcerer's apprentice at a point where that apprentice caused parity to occur ..
Stealing Apprentices - I'm not sure what I think here. Should it be allowed, not allowed or restricted like I had in this game?
Baddie apprentices being stolen violates the "no baddies turning back" rule. For goodie apprentices it's less big of a deal since paranoia in the JL = good.
However, the restriction is kinda counterproductive. The problem is apprentices turning in the first place. Restricting it like that just means that they don't get to choose after getting turned once anymore, it doesn't stop baddie apprentices from going "gee, I know all the wolves, and there is this Ironman JL going .. might as well throw in my hat with them". And with goodies, you at least still have a chance that the priest turns the seer's apprentice or vice versa, in which case you get complete trust in the JL going whereas the baddie variant will always have to worry about the apprentices turning (at least, until you're certain all goodie scanners are dead
)
Leader - "Can only redirect to people with at least 1/3 of the votes of the lynchee." This was never put to the test but I think it's about right and can be used if Leader is used.
Didn't stop us from going "wait, we have 6 votes, might as well leaderlynch hc" today
Cloak of Invisibility - Nobody used it, not even as a standing order to save themselves. Nobody picked it (despite all the pre-game talk about it being "overpowered" ). Doesn't seem to be that game-altering so might be used again.
It's situational, if someone plays his cards exactly right it could be very powerfull, but I think that if you can manage to know when you'll get hunted / scanned / whatever up front and activate the cloak and *then* get advantage out of that .. more power to you
RPing traits - I tried to only hand them out in such a way that people who didn't like them could back out and I think this is the way to go if any of these are kept.
Nice. Definitely a keeper.
I had thought that the number of cultists and wolves would be switched, so I thought we had another day.
If you'd stopped to think about why HC was suddenly going after TNT like that on the last day, you might have realized that parity wasn't *that* far off.
Though to be honest at that point you guys didn't actually have a way to stop us any more. Lord_D's leader order made the village vote pretty much irrelevant.
*Cough*
Clearly I am a master at this game.
It made me laugh pretty hard though, because I had done absolutely nothing to warrant suspicion yet, and at one stage it seemed pretty obvious you were just ..going after me for the lulz.
You did worry me for a little bit, so I scanned you, but after that I just went .. nah. Everyone ignored you anyway
In hindsight, what you did was pretty good for us. Without protection and enkhuus dead getting to Rendap wasn't hard at all.
Though to be honest, if he hadn't gotten killed, I'd have scanned and turned him ..
That aside, you people continue to nearly always think I am a wolf, bad memories?
Villagers in general made themselves look pretty suspicious. The wolves, however ..
I kenw Lord-D was a wolf, and I had was suspicous about Falc as well
Yes. Nobody listened to that though. Not even me
(I didn't know about lord_d until the very last day ..)
As for Falc - he was good, until I turned him - the day rendap died
I was quite happy with my ability to lay so low this game. I don't think I even got quoted
once in analysis, though Randakar being the sorcerer kind of helped with that. And I don't think I ever got more than two votes.
You're welcome
I'm glad its over, though... my poor inbox was overflowing, and that didn't help my ability to GM the Lite or Diplomacy at all.
Well, apologies for the spam.. but I hope you had fun regardless
Now, who the hell had me hunted?
I'm guessing that was Euro ..
Only village and the seer listened me. I could have played like AOK, all my suspicion was right. But if I hit sorcerer or cultist with this kind of village, then of course I would have been lynched.
The thing about suspicions is that knowing when to listen to them is the hard part. Everyone can suspect anyone else, and be right about it, figuring out which suspicions to act on is the key.
I still haven't really quite mastered it, and I'm not sure I ever will.
Also I think with this setup, there is no way to win.
You could have gotten turned by me, and joined the dark side.
Or the village could have gotten to me first, and you would have been an almost unkillable JL spokesperson of doom, leading the village to victory.
There's many ways this could have ended. I'm only happy that it turned out well for me
I was annoyed with Walrus brutalizing me. He said afterwards that he was vindicated, when in fact I voted that day for the_hdk knowing nothing of the candidates. All I knew was that EUROO7 was my wolf master, Taiisatai64 was a cultist in Rousseau pack, and Randakar was the sorcerer. None of that was useful for my voting that day, and so I voted the_hdk because it put my vote where it could be analyzed, rather than throwing it away. As it stood my vote did end up being innocuous, but Walrus was convinced I was suspicious for no good reason, and he brutalized me. I always hate when I die for the wrong reasons, particularly when people then insist they were right. If I'd been lynched for inactivity I'd have had only myself to blame, since I wasn't paying any attention, but instead I got brutalized for totally the wrong reason.
If it consoles you, a lot of villagers got lynched for the wrong reasons as well
No priest made difference. Also distiller cultist made outing in this game.
Edited: how can we know that guardian is not cultist?
No priest was a bit of a challenge, I give you that. But I blame inexperience with this kind of setup. If this kind of way of setting up a game was more normal people would realize there is no guarantee of either scanner role to be there. Or any of the protectors, for that matter.
And .. you can't.
No, that's not what I mean't. A cultist is trying to infilitrate the JL as a protector, say. He only wants the name of the Seer. He asks you who to protect. You don't say "Rendap", you say a name that has been scanned and is unlikely to be a cultist. Then, if that person is hunted, this infilitrater is almost certainly a baddy. If there is a no hunt, you don't trust him.
You will go far, young padawan
Understood your logic, but in this situation this won't work. So I've confirmed cultist and JL mouthpiece will make announcement we've got baddie and that would be cultist. Baddies will contest that you should bring wolf, not cultist.
Edited: The issue is unless we hit wolf, the protector won't trust JL.
You don't out him. You just say that so-and-so is suspicious, and preferably you give them your reasons, too.
Or even better, you have someone else say it, together with a bunch of other people..
Now I firmly believe that the village could have won only by miracle, because:
- Overpowered sorcerer. Touch of bad too overpowered compared touch of good.
That sorcerer didn't actually have touch of evil. And the apprentices couldn't use that trait until they turned into sorcerers themselves. Which never happened.
- No priest means we can't do nothing against hunter cultist.
You can try to catch them the old-fashioned way, you know. That's what happened to vain.
- Then distiller and lover cultist.
- So on.
I think the JL is victimized by apparent attempt to nerf JL.
The village had distillers and lovers, too. If you hadn't come out and said "I'm the Seer" the wolves would have had no idea who to sit on.
So no, that wasn't overpowered at all. In fact, it didn't even *do* anything this game. Except getting Kiwi killed
@Johho - is more of that AAR coming?
