true. I played once or twice in Russia on very hard - with the AI having higher taxes (>higher force limits) and the morale penalty/handicap, you could also name that simply suicide...
Raaage!
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true. I played once or twice in Russia on very hard - with the AI having higher taxes (>higher force limits) and the morale penalty/handicap, you could also name that simply suicide...
Yea, on lower difficulties it was kind of ok but since I am playing on very hard it is just a joke. Timmies and GH are just super strong for a loooong time. Hell, even in my Sweden game I had the joy to fight the GH several times and Norway got nearly totally owned.
I am already thinking of starting in 1453 instead of 1399. Borders are just too ugly later on, last game I had monster hungary....
I am already thinking of starting in 1453 instead of 1399. Borders are just too ugly later on, last game I had monster hungary....
Which should be the point.
The Hordes were sacking Moscow even in the XVI century. What's more, this game is designed to allow different histories to play out, while most are completely unrealistic, a surviving Timurid or Golden Horde is not out of the question. Their surviving, conquering, and replacing Russia as the dominant Eastern power is not out of the question either. Having to wait until the XVI century to have to defeat the Hordes, when in the Middle-Late XVI century the Hordes were still sacking Moscow isn't a problem for me.
Well, if it would be Moscow, ok then. But on vh difficulty Timurids eat everytime whole Middle East, Anatolia, Egypt and Tripolis while GH eats up large parts of Eastern Europe including Constantinople, Balticum and Finland. They never start to break apart slowly before 1550 (in case of GH) or 1600 (Timurids). Therefore it is Sweden, Lithuania, Bohemia, Hungary or Austria who start blobbing up to Ural while the russian kingdoms have to be super lucky to get a decent territory at least...
The Timurids nearly destroyed the Ottomans, so I have no problem with them taking Anatolia. As for the Middle East I rarely see them go much farther than Judea (and that is a one in three game type of deal for me) before collapsing under their own weight.
I've only seen a Golden Horde take Finland or Constantinople once. I've seen them dominate Russia and take out most of Lithuania every now and then.
Having someone else replace Russia in beating back the Tartars is good alternate history. Granted occassionally we would like to see Russia take out the Hordes, but at the time of the game start (1399) the odds of Russia forming and taking over Tartary are astronomical not only from a game perspective but from a historical perspective as well.
Anyways... this is a rage topic. I just wanted to point out that there was nothing wrong with the Hordes starting to fall apart in the XVI century.
That is fully untrue, at 1399, GH was just shadow of it's own glory. It fell apart fully only 30 years later, and then only once or twice, there was mere tries of hans, trying bring it back to power. Altough, the khanates, were quite a powers until moscow came to power, and started to conquer them, they were not a big threat to western countries. In game, GH eat poland ussualy, and then go to eat hungary, austria and bohemia - if they do not get stopped, or not force all their neighbours to pay them jarlyk... that is why they should have muscowy paying them tribute ATB, and at truce with poland and genoa.
EDIT: and in the middle of TSC and at truce with Novgorod.
What is fully untrue? The GH? The Golden Horde, while weakened by Timur before the game start, was still very much a major power in the region, far stronger than any of its neighbors. It fell to internal dissent and civil war. The Crimean Khanate, readily regarded as one of the strongest powers in Eastern Europe for a couple centuries, was primarily trying to state that it was the true successor to the Golden Horde. As for it not being a threat to western countries, which countries are you referring to? The countries that didn't border the Hordes or the ones that did? Sure, the Timurid Empire was not a threat to France, nor was the Crimean Khanate, but that's not an adequate comparison. If you mean the Crimean Khanate, a Horde that dwells on only a fraction of the former land that the GH made up, it was a significant threat to Hungary, the Balkans, Poland-Lithuania, and all neighboring Russian states. 50-60,000 Cavalry was a significant threat and that was only one campaign against Russia, not the full scope of their power, in the early XVI century. It wasn't necessarily stronger than Poland-Lithuania, but it was certainly enough to challenge them. As for the Golden Horde... This. The GH was indeed a shadow, but it had the ability to regroup until the 1410s and 1420s.
The GH never normally does that in my games. I've only once seen them reach Finland or Constantinople by the AI on its own. They don't go off to eat Hungary, Austria, and Bohemia. Hungary, Bohemia, and Austria normally beat the GH.
I'm also continually in Raaage! by Central Asia and the existence of the Nogai and Kazakhstan in the beginning of the game. It just doesn't have the thought or care in it. I suppose it could be worse, but that doesn't make it good.
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Compare in size : Poland-Lithuania(or Lithuania-Poland or just - The Commonwealth) and Crimean khanate. While it could be quite a power, and they raided the borders, when comed to war, we kicked their asses, and they were only able to run. And they never reached warsaw. I think neither even cracow, but not sure.
Still Maybe Golden Horde was a power. But not an invincible foe. As it is in game. I mean, it should not be that muscowy colonize them from the beggining, but i think they should be going to part, at least, there could be some events for GH, spawning some crimean rebels, astrakhanian ones, and kazanian ones.
But it is my opinion - let's end this disscussion and go back to rage - Here is another rage.
Just winning, but then...
DAMN YOU EMPEROR!!!
@Valiant_Hogers:
No, it is not really about rage. Somehow, I still like Hordes but some of the steppe nomad gov. boni are too OP imo, that's all. But I won't derail the thread any further.
Bring on more RAGE comics
No, it is not really about rage. Somehow, I still like Hordes but some of the steppe nomad gov. boni are too OP imo, that's all. But I won't derail the thread any further.
Bring on more RAGE comics
@Valiant_Hogers:
No, it is not really about rage. Somehow, I still like Hordes but some of the steppe nomad gov. boni are too OP imo, that's all. But I won't derail the thread any further.
Bring on more RAGE comics
Do something yourself, i mean, i can't do all the pictures u lazy bastard ;P.
I just did but in another thread called "If a lot of countries are united". Couldn't express my feelings better than doing a little comic
