Oh, and I hope to god that Harding isn't going to take over from TR at the end of this... have Cox win in 1920, Coolidge, Johnson, anyone save from Harding. Besides, it would be convergence. *nods*
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I don't know if a more start differentiation between TR and Wilson could be possible. I don't know why Lloyd George was affronted; it is difficult to conceive of two speeches that complement one another more.
Glad to see you are among the living, Allenby.
Vann
Glad to see you are among the living, Allenby.
Vann
I wouldn't be adverse to a more competent Liberal Party, especially as the best way I can see for them to pull it together is to not drift centre-right. Avoiding that drift means Labour doesn't grow strong at its expense, which can only be a good thing.
Is this likely though, probably not.
As for Germany I'm rooting for a French inspired dismemberment returning the country to a collection of squabbling states that are no threat to man nor beast. Without the fool Wilson to moderate Allied demands, and with the arrogance of the Kaiser et al delaying negotiations till its clearly far too late, I'm hoping Roosevelt carries out the stick part of the carrot and stick offer.
Is this likely though, probably not.
As for Germany I'm rooting for a French inspired dismemberment returning the country to a collection of squabbling states that are no threat to man nor beast. Without the fool Wilson to moderate Allied demands, and with the arrogance of the Kaiser et al delaying negotiations till its clearly far too late, I'm hoping Roosevelt carries out the stick part of the carrot and stick offer.
Interesting to see what the world politicians thinks about the world after the war, but I think it is important that they don’t forget that the war must be won first. The Germans are far from defeated, so the Allies need to press forward and try to save Austria-Hungary so that Germany can be defeated once and for all and then all plans and talk about peace and the new world can come true.
Nice to have you back Allenby, a fine update it was
Nice to have you back Allenby, a fine update it was
And so the torch is passed...
Britain no longer is the militant enforcer of continental division, that post will be filled by America. I wonder if Loyd George intends for Britain to no longer be considered the premier world nation? Roosevelt obviously sees the United States as the heir apparent to the British world security responsibility idea. This should be an interesting end of the war, as Roosevelt is so much different than Wilson...and AH still exists and has more of a reason to continue resisting.
Thanks for the update man!
TheExecuter
Britain no longer is the militant enforcer of continental division, that post will be filled by America. I wonder if Loyd George intends for Britain to no longer be considered the premier world nation? Roosevelt obviously sees the United States as the heir apparent to the British world security responsibility idea. This should be an interesting end of the war, as Roosevelt is so much different than Wilson...and AH still exists and has more of a reason to continue resisting.
Thanks for the update man!
TheExecuter
It's curious the silence that comes from Paris...
Will Lloyd Gorge have the same degree of consideration to the native inhabitants of the colonies of the British and French Empires?
while...
Isn't Teddy a lovely president?
That sounds scaring... I don't see an isolationist USA this time...
Will Lloyd Gorge have the same degree of consideration to the native inhabitants of the colonies of the British and French Empires?
while...
Isn't Teddy a lovely president?
That sounds scaring... I don't see an isolationist USA this time...
Kurt_Steiner said:
Teddy won't be around forever to enforce his own view of American priorities from the 'bully pulpit'. I can see better prospects for America joining a League-style body here, but other than that I imagine there will be broadly the same kind of reaction against intervention as there was historically, baring some huge upset.
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::nods:: You'll never get rid of our amazing, resilient isolationist tendencies over here. Some folks want to board up the doors and windows and hide behind our oceans even now.
Vann
Vann
Vincent Julien said:
Well Lloyd George might alter his tone when votes are involved.
I'd forgotten about Prince Heinrich - we'll have to find something to do with him.
Vincent Julien said:
I was not going to have Harding as President, but now you mention it...
Vann the Red said:
Lloyd George was peturbed by the tone rather than the content. As he observed, the speeches were similar in many respects.
Wilson will be on the sidelines in this timeline by now - probably back to teaching bureaucracy at Princeton!
El Pip said:
A strong Liberal Party will require either of the following: Lloyd George and Asquith patching up their considerable differences of either smashing the other so completely that there is only one clear leader.
Regarding Germany, the French-favoured dismemberment idea might be attractive if the Germans offer strong resistance and their country has to be occupied entirely at huge Allied cost.
Lord E said:
Indeed - the crucial battles are just about to begin. Perhaps the most important of those will be in Central Europe...
TheExecuter said:
Britain will probably regard it as a relief that the United States has committed itself to maintaining the European balance - the burden can be shared.
I think Lloyd George will recognise that Britain will cease to be the sole world superpower (although the French are arguably of that status too), but would welcome the ascent of the United States to that status too. In other words, he wouldn't see it as a loss for Britain if the United States shares its fundamental goals.Kurt_Steiner said:
France has her war aims, but I just didn't bother to incorporate them into the update.
Kurt_Steiner said:
Well of course not, they cannot govern themselves responsibly.
Kurt_Steiner said:
Well, it's a commitment to defend liberty by force if necessary. The US will hope that such a posture will deter aggression by others.
Vincent Julien said:
Mind you, if there is a person capable of the political leadership necessary to change American attitudes, TR is the man. Whether it would last is another matter...
Thank you, everyone!
Allenby said:Britain will probably regard it as a relief that the United States has committed itself to maintaining the European balance - the burden can be shared.
Ah...I see the light. Thanks for your explanation, the idea that Britain and the US would be intended to SHARE power completely escaped me. Thanks!
TheExecuter
Heh, I'd be more for a lenient peace with Germany... you don't want to go into overkill, then you get the intervention of a tiny Oesterreichische corporal...
No overkill is precisely the way to go, several hundred small city state sized countries each with the military power of say, Monaco, would be safest. Then it doesn't matter who comes to power in one of the many Bavaria-lets because there's piss all they can do.aussieboy said:
So what's Pershing doing at the moment? Sitting at home and masturbating? Or something else? Can't imagine he took the 'loss' of the western front command to Wood very well. Mabye the Demycrayts could run him in '20?
At home writing his memoir with the goal of erasing the embarrassment of the Pancho Villa campaign off his record. Or, conversely, back in the Philippines where he did a decent counter-insurgency operation.
Vann
Vann
Right...now that I've seen Allenby appear and post, I want to add my desire for an update to the deluge in this thread.
Mettermrck said:Right...now that I've seen Allenby appear and post, I want to add my desire for an update to the deluge in this thread.
Another one? So soon? You're an even bigger addict than I am!
How long do you suppose until the government declares this thread a Class A drug?
Vincent Julien said:Another one? So soon? You're an even bigger addict than I am!
How long do you suppose until the government declares this thread a Class A drug?
I've already started the paperwork to register this as a category 1 controlled substance over on this side of the pond!
Shhhh!
Don't tell anyone...
TheExecuter
TheExecuter said:
Good that might get the criminal underworld involved. Say what you like about them they do at least ensure a good supply of illegal substances. :nods:
Allenby said:I was not going to have Harding as President, but now you mention it...
Hmm, well, assuming TR dies at the same time he did in OTL, then Harding would automatically become President, unless something happened to him before then (God forbid!) or he resigned. (Eminently possible considering the people Harding hung out with.) If that was the case, then Charles Evans Hughes as Secretary of State would be first in line to succeed....