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    Real Strategy Requires Cunning

Rocket88

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RabidDwarf said:
Thanks Tim, I actually just started playing the C.O.R.E today and I enjoy the event which you described, at peace time things like car and trains make a negative impact on the oil resource. I don't expect to cripple let's the UK by 1941 but do some damage and this mod looks like I can have more fun in planning out my convoy raiding.

In my first CORE game I had about 80SS at the outbreak of war - with another 25-30 built in the first 12 months. During this period they sank over 7000 UK convoys - almost all of their starting level. It works!
 

unmerged(52476)

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One should not forget, however, that the ASW mission is bugged and ships on ASW do not find any subs! As the AI does not know this, it sends a big part of its navy sailing around useless, and only its combat fleets will now and then stumble over enemy submarines.

If this will be fixed in the upcoming patch, submarine warfare is hopefully going to me much more harder (and funnier!).

Besides events, remodeling resource distribution on the map would be a possibility to decrease stockpiles (a much better one and much much harder to implement, too).
 

blue emu

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Snowmelk said:
One should not forget, however, that the ASW mission is bugged and ships on ASW do not find any subs! As the AI does not know this, it sends a big part of its navy sailing around useless, and only its combat fleets will now and then stumble over enemy submarines...
In fact the AI usually moves its fleets around with "No Orders"... something the Human player can't do... not ASW.
 

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blue emu said:
In fact the AI usually moves its fleets around with "No Orders"...
Hmm, interesting. Does anyone know why exactly it is doing this?

Still, I am pretty sure that in the rather rare cases when my submarines are intercepted, it is from a battle fleet (i.e. something including capitals) and not one of the many DD flotillas (which are around as well, as my planes keep sinking them).
 

blue emu

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Snowmelk said:
Does anyone know why exactly it is doing this?
The AI moves in mysterious ways... in this case, quite literally (it uses "No Orders" instead of "Move", to move its units).
 

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blue emu said:
The AI moves in mysterious ways... in this case, quite literally (it uses "No Orders" instead of "Move", to move its units).
Maybe they weigh anchor and let the ships drift randomly with the current...
actually, this would describe the AI movement pretty well ;)
 

blue emu

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A bit off-topic... but whenever someone mentions the AI moving its ships around in an odd manner, I just have to post this pic:

It's a model-I Submarine (500 km range), with AI orders to move from a spot just off the Canary Islands to a new location just off the Spanish coast. Check out the route that the AI picked... with it's 500 km range Sub:

long.jpg


EDIT: It seems that the Nationalist Spanish Navy uses those cheap Naval charts compiled by the infamous Japanese navigator Ueda Fukarwi (pronounced: Whe' da fuck ARE we?)
 
Last edited:

sbr

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blue emu said:
A bit off-topic... but whenever someone mentions the AI moving its ships around in an odd manner, I just have to post this pic:

It's a model-I Submarine (500 km range), with AI orders to move from a spot just off the Canary Islands to a new location just off the Spanish coast. Check out the route that the AI picked... with it's 500 km range Sub:
Just stopping by to say 'Hi' to Grandma in Newfoundland on the way out. :rofl:
 

Mattias

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Arn't we drifting away from the topic here ;) - where is the moderator :D :)

Edit: Seriously, the economic system in HoI ia a tad to simplified to reflect the grim economy of war, why did all thoose uneducated players complain about the learning curve in Victoria, they could have bought it anyway to support the developement of the gaming industry :mad: .

... and Blue Emu is a good moderator! /M
 
Last edited:

blue emu

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Mattias said:
Arn't we drifting away from the topic here ;) - where is the moderator :D :)
True... this was perhaps not the best place to display my "Francisco Franco World Tour" picture...

... I'll PM myself a warning! :mad:
 

unmerged(52476)

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Another simple way to reduce resource stockpiles is to lower the resource production for everyone in the difficulty settings. As all simple solutions, this might result in rather funny and unexpected results, as the economy of several countries might be completely screwed up.
 

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blue emu said:
... I'll PM myself a warning! :mad:
So there, corrected. :eek:o
 

TheLand

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blue emu said:
In fact the AI usually moves its fleets around with "No Orders"... something the Human player can't do... not ASW.

That's true but I think there's a question-mark over the AI's use of the ASW order as well.

I certainly notice a lot of AI fleets with 'ASW' orders, and once every 6 months or so they actually engage my submarines.... :confused:
 

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Using events to reduce the stockpile instead of the production

MartinBG said:
In my mod I made events for every more significant oil producing country to reduce their oil production when they are not at war with me (Germany). Another event fires when we are at war to restore their oil production. ...
Snowmelk said:
Another simple way to reduce resource stockpiles is to lower the resource production for everyone in the difficulty settings. As all simple solutions, this might result in rather funny and unexpected results, as the economy of several countries might be completely screwed up.
I think reducing the big stockpiles themselves in peacetime might be feasible, I don't think it disturbs economy as much as limiting production. I'm not sure it's necessary to replace resources with money (like Blue Emu mentioned).

The question is; how big should the stockpiled be allowed to be in peacetime and should different materials have differently sized stockpiles? Example; In Scenarios Germany has stockpiles of oil from 500 in 1936 & 1939 to 2000 in 1938 (and 20 000 in 1941).

It's obviously more attractive to use non country specific persistent one "size fits all" events to decrease all oversize stockpiles but it is possible to make them country-specific as well (= a lot more events). /M
 

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Mattias said:
It's obviously more attractive to use non country specific persistent one "size fits all" events to decrease all oversize stockpiles but it is possible to make them country-specific as well (= a lot more events). /M
Just make a few events (e.g. big, intermediate and small stockpile) and group the countries in these events.
 

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No need to have different stockpiles for smaller contries?

Snowmelk said:
Just make a few events (e.g. big, intermediate and small stockpile) and group the countries in these events.
I'm not sure the maximum size of the stockpile has to be different for different countries. I have a (pre-war) source which states the German oil usage in 1938 was about 5 000 000 tonnes. This sounds much but is actually only twice as much as one big Swedish (= small country :) ) cold-war underground depot (most depots from the WW II era were probably built as above ground storage-tanks which is cheaper). /M
 
Last edited:

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Cold War storage was built for much worse assumptions than pre-WW2 storage ever was. Germany in 1938 used about 44 Million Barrels of "Oil" (c.6.2 million tons). I would not, therefore, use the Swedish bunkers as anything like a sensible guideline.

Tim
 

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HistoryMan said:
Cold War storage was built for much worse assumptions than pre-WW2 storage ever was. Germany in 1938 used about 44 Million Barrels of "Oil" (c.6.2 million tons). I would not, therefore, use the Swedish bunkers as anything like a sensible guideline.

Tim
I know it's not a very good one because many of them were hidden and designed to withstand tactical nuclear weapons but if a small scandinavian state could afford such well built stores in the 50's and 60's it might be possible to afford fairly big depots above ground in the 30's don't you think?

In game I think it's fairly resonable to allow any state to store about 1000-2000 tonnes and limit the rest via events. The biggest problems seems to be the US and Venezuela but the Soviet Union and UK gathers big stores rather quickly as well (at least in the 1936 scenario). German oil production can be decreased by modding the techs för coal to oil to more realistic values. /M