• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Showing developer posts only. Show all posts in this thread.

Darkrenown

Star marshal
141 Badges
Jan 8, 2002
24.837
17.048
no
  • Leviathan: Warships
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For The Glory
  • For the Motherland
  • Gettysburg
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Impire
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • King Arthur II
  • Knights of Pen and Paper +1 Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Lost Empire - Immortals
  • Magicka
  • Majesty 2
  • Majesty 2 Collection
  • March of the Eagles
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Naval War: Arctic Circle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Rome Gold
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Ancient Space
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Hearts of Iron II: Armageddon
  • Cities in Motion
  • Cities in Motion 2
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • A Game of Dwarves
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Deus Vult
  • Dungeonland
  • East India Company
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
Hello again, it's time for the 4th Heart of Darkness developer diary. This time I'll be talking about the changes we've made to wars and the military in general. While there's no flashy new battle screen like we revealed for naval battles last week, I think you'll still rather like these changes. So, let's get to them!

First of all, we have Ticking War Score (or TWS) based on certain War Goals (WGs), the idea of which is to make it possible to take land from larger nations without having to launch a total war and occupy 90% of their country. TWS can be caused to Tick in two ways, mostly by holding the land in question, but also by winning the majority of battles when using certain War Goals. WGs which deal with the transfer of land use the former, while the Humiliate and Assert Hegemony Goals Tick on battle score.

The way TWS works in land based Goals is fairly simple: When you add a Goal to take land from someone, occupying at least 75% of that State (or country in the case of an Annex goal) will cause your War Score (WS) to Tick upwards a little each day. On the other hand, if you fail to occupy the State after 2 years, the Owner of the land starts gaining WS instead. If this is your only goal, eventually one side or the other will Tick to 100 WS and will be able to force the other side to surrender.

Things become a little more complex when you start adding additional WGs. In this case, if the Attacker adds a Goal, any accumulated TWS is cut to the WS cost of your original Goal and each Goal may only Tick to it's WS cost, so that you cannot occupy one State until you have 100 WS then add several more WGs to demand in the Peace. For example your Goal is for State A, State A costs 25 WS to demand, you occupy State A and eventually your WS reaches 100. Instead of making peace you add a Goal to also take State B, which costs 30 WS. Your TSW is instantly cut to 25, as it is all from occupying State A. Now if you occupy States A and B your TWS will eventually Tick upwards to 55.
For the Defender things are slightly different, if they add a Goal, all TWS is wiped from their score, as they are no longer fighting a purely defensive war, and their TSW for holding onto their land is capped at the WS cost of their targeted land.
The moral of the story is, TWS is your friend when you fight for a single WG, but it becomes less useful as you add more demands, so don't get greedy unless you want to fight a total war.

For Humiliate and Assert Hegemony there is some TWS added each day to the side with the greatest WS from battles after a certain minimum have been fought (currently 5), and WS from battles is no longer capped, so wars fought over these CBs need not revolve entirely around occupation.

In other WG news, you can no longer Justify Goals against nations you are at war with, but on the other hand, Goals you have a valid CB for no longer cost Jingoism to add to wars.

Finally, for WGs, we have added two new ones: Liberate Nation, which is like Free People, but it releases all States of a given nation, and Dismantle Fortifications, which removes Forts and Naval bases in a given State.
HoD DD4 wargoals.png

But to achieve those new War Goals you need to know about the changes we've made to the military! First, let me list the changes made to units:

  • Irregulars have been boosted to be less useless, even if they will never match up to real units one-on-one and are outclassed in the mid to late game.
  • Cavalry is now the irregular equivalent on the cavalry side, and is a cheap low-stat unit mainly useful for uncivs or cheap recon.
  • Dragoons are now the 'base' cavalry unit for civs with average recon, manuever and combat stats.
  • Cuirassers are now an early-game tank with high offensive combat stats but low manuever and no recon.
  • Hussars are flankers and scouts with poor combat stats but excellent manuever and recon.
  • Engineers are now the main siege unit used to reduce the effects of enemy forts. They also contribute some support value from the second rank.
  • Tanks are a siege unit used to batter down late-game fortifications along with engineers. They have strong offensive combat stats but are weak on the defense.
  • Artillery is now exclusively a support unit only useful in the second rank.
  • Planes are a special unit that combines recon and support from the second rank.
  • Guards are an elite unit that is strong on the offensive but weak on the defensive, making all-Guards armies impractical.


Recon/Siege:
New stat: Siege (replaces Fort Attack)

Recon and Siege operate as follows: The highest siege/recon value in an army is used, but the army must be composed of at least 10% recon/siege units to gain the full benefit of the value.

Recon and Siege Efficiency (the % of recon/siege brigades in the army compared to optimal number) is now displayed in unit view.

Recon reduces the dig-in bonus of enemy units and speeds up occupation. Siege reduces the number of effective fort levels in an enemy province (forts slow down occupation speed and damage dealt to units in battle).

Occupation and Attrition:
Occupation speed scales with army size up to a point. Sieging with single brigades will be very slow, while sieging with a proper army with good recon and siege stats will be much faster than before.

Supply Limits have been flattened to reduce the differences between the province owner and others, making it more viable to use large armies in enemy territory. However, all units engaged in an occupation will take a fixed amount of attrition regardless of size to represent desertion, disease and resistance from the population.

And that's not all, Mobilisation has been changed as well: Instead of all your units appearing at once and at 0 Organisation, units now appear in smaller chunks, but are fully organised. The Speed at which units appear is influenced by the Railway level in their home States, so smaller Nations with advanced Rail networks should be able to field their Mobilised troops a lot faster than sprawling, backwards nations:
HoD DD4 Mob.png
hod dd4 mob2.png
(mobilisation progress shown on the recruitment mapmode)

Finally, we have added a button to disband brigades from soldier pops that are too small to support them:
HoD DD4 Button.png
and we have added a rather fun feature from Their Finest Hour, Battle plans!
HoD DD4 Battleplans.png

These allow you to draw out plans with arrows, icons for units and bases etc. either for your own fun, or to share with other players in Multiplayer to better coordinate with them. Plans can be saved and edited later, and you can toggle multiple plans on or off at any time to see how they interact.

Next week: Colonisation!
 
Last edited:
Great diary. Any chance of a WS cost break for Liberate Nation during a Great War? The one thing I didn't like about total war in V2 is that it never ends with the losers all having their empires disbanded. How practical is it to liberate large countries like India?

Well all WS costs at 65% of normal while in GW already, Liberate nation is capped at 100 WS now too, so during a GW the most it could cost is 65.
 
With Liberate Nation, will that free just the cores of the nation, or will it free all regions the nation has cores on?

All states they have cores on. Might be worth adding that we reworked the Polish cores a bit so the end up with more sane borders when liberated.
 
Isn't this a bit too much? The defender has to wait 2 years before even starting to get WS from land control?

I don't think so, the Attacker needs a period to attack before the Defender starts racking up score from the Status Quo, and if they are doing well they can still gain WS in other ways. Still, it's a value in defines, so it's easy to edit if you want it to be less.

I read that as meaning that it would take 2 years for warscore to accumulate from simply not losing territory.

Exactly.
 
I didn't really understand this sentence. Could someone explain it?

Which part? The justifying thing seems obviously, so I assume it was the part about Jingoism you didn't get, so:
Each time you want to add another goal to an existing goal it costs 7% Jingoism, if your population isn't Jingoistic enough you can't add more goals. We have changed this so that if you have a Valid CB, you can add these goals for free. This can be pretty helpful when fighting a nation that holds a lot of your cores, you can add all your core state Goals without waiting for Jingoism levels to rise.
 
I understand that, but it just seems too much. The attacker, when he decides to attack, already has his armies prepared. The defender has to react, mobilize, repel the invasion, and hold it for 24 months. During that whole time, each day the invader occupies your land adds up and doesn't go down. I don't know how much you get from winning battles, so it can be that you can defeat the invasion that way, but since land ownership seems to weight more for this specific WG, I don't know. Anyways, the testers should know weather or not this is too much and it's easy for me to change.

Numbers in diaries are just to give you an idea, so of course will change if we notice problems. I changed the tick speed for defenders earlier this week.
 
I understand that, but it just seems too much. The attacker, when he decides to attack, already has his armies prepared. The defender has to react, mobilize, repel the invasion, and hold it for 24 months. During that whole time, each day the invader occupies your land adds up and doesn't go down. I don't know how much you get from winning battles, so it can be that you can defeat the invasion that way, but since land ownership seems to weight more for this specific WG, I don't know. Anyways, the testers should know weather or not this is too much and it's easy for me to change.

If the Attacker is occupying his wargoal, you are losing the war so WS Ticks against you. If he occupies it for a bit and you retake it, it will tick back down to 0 though, you don't need to wait 2 years to remove his TWS, it just doesn't Tick in your favour until then. And again, TWS is not the only way to get WS here, TWS is to prevent stalemates dragging on, you can counter-invade if you are able and beat the Attacker in the traditional fashion.
 
Well I can say I've definitely had that problem many times before, I am happy with that change. However, does that mean we will no longer be able to add wargoals that cost infamy?

You can still add them, they just cost Jingoism as normal. And you can't rustle up new cheap Goals by justifying while at war.
 
I do have one question though. Have you thought about redoing the CBs? Many still feel a bit unbalanced/unrealistic? There have been tweaks to stop weird conquests, but at times I still see the old 'Russian Conquest of Southwest England'. Non-core conquests didn't happen in Europe during the timeframe (balance of power and what not), so I feel a nerf isn't that out of order. Make it a costly thing to do, so that it's still an option for MP or aggressive SP players and virtually blocking it off for every sane AI country. The Free People CB also seems to be used in weird ways in Asia (instead of conquering GB often does a lot of Free People in Southeast Asia).

AI's use of WGs was totally overhauled, I mentioned this in a previous DD so I didn't repeat it in this one, but they make a lot more sense now (most of the time :p).
 
Rereading the DD makes me wonder if you've buffed forts as well. Somehow I don't think the impact at the moment is that much (i.e. I don't see that I'm loosing less troops then normal, nor does the AI etc.) Is this effect significant or should I just generally pay closer attention to whats happening :p?

Can't blame you for missing it, since it isn't shown, but forts have always reduced the defender's losses by 10% per fort level.
 
Can I ask whether you plan to include a way of designing templates for armies, and optionally basing military recruitment around these templates? I always use the same compositions for my armies depending on the time period, and it is so painful micromanaging the individual brigades during recruitment drives. This alone has stopped me from playing games with the UK, Russia and China, and it becomes incredibly tedious in the late game for most of the GPs. It's pointless microing which sucks up time and enthusiasm I want to spend microing my economy or wars.

No, but why not just set a rally point with merge on and use the build army screen to build units in army sized batches?
 
Because if you do that and build more than one "batch", then they auto-merge into a blob and you need to resort them anyway.

I was assuming you have the common sense to move your new army out of the way before the 2nd batch appears :) Or setting separated RPs and building a separate army around each.
 
Justifying goals at war was a player only exploit we wanted rid of, and being able to fake up multiple goals doesn't jive well with justified goals being Jingoism-free. Besides, if "It's not like the you don't end up getting 99% of the possible infamy most of the time anyway" is correct you shouldn't notice any difference anyway :)
 
Any changes to colonial soldier pops and colonial warfare?

Immersion always gets a hit when I am waging a war against Russia as Sweden and 50% of soldiers are African... Or when 150k French African troops start invading my colonies.

EDIT: I think that usability of colonial troops in European wars should be somehow limited and campaigns in the heart of Africa should be of a more limited scale

we'll talk colonial changes next diary, but its not really restrictive like that.

Just a non related question I don't know where else to ask:

Are you going to add new nations for this expansion? And if so, which ones?

we've added a few/a lot depending on how you see it. There will be more info next diary