Between A Rock and a Hard Place

[Lofman]

Between A Rock and a Hard Place
​

The Egyptians are Coming!​

Sometimes when you ask yourself "What is the worst that could happen?" the answer will be "The Egyptians declare war on us". Which they just did. Isn't it great. And our two allies can't join, Macedonia due to having a truce with Egypt and Pontus due to being allied to Egypt. The Armenians have no problem joining the Egyptians on their side though. Well one bright thing is that Horemakhet, the Egyptian governor guy in Lydia and Caria decides to declare independence.

Not that I expect him to last. At most he will distract the Egyptians briefly which is atleast something. Well there is fighting. And fighting. And some more fighting. In Greece my army has no problem occupying Argolis. It is in Cyrenaica most of the fighting takes place. The Egyptians suffer massive losses and their manpower is dwindling. Unfortunately after managing to take Cyrene, a massive Egyptian army forces mine to withdraw (by sea, surprisingly my 50 ships manage to deal with the 200+ Egyptian ships, sadly not sinking them but not taking any real losses either) and while it recovers the Egyptians capture Barca (and obviously they recaptured Cyrene).

Dealing with around 100,000 Egyptians divided into four armies isn't the easiest thing but thanks to my great general (and better tech, Egyptian tech is lagging slightly) I keep them at bay, inflicting massive casualties while raising hordes of mercenaries in the west (sadly just militia, either that or elephants and as elephants take more then a year to train it is obvious why I don't go for them). And Macedonia gladly joins the war on our side as we ask them after their truce ends.

The Egyptian king Polyperchon is captured as his army is destroyed in Nassamones, sadly this isn't CKII so it doesn't give us any advantage (other then removing a very good general from the fight). Well after a massive battle against the Egyptians and their Armenian allies that we lost they finally agree to let us pay some gold for peace. Both our and the Egyptians manpower was down at just 1k, but I think that they would be better at dealing with no manpower (can hire mercenaries other then militia for example, their manpower recovers faster as they have a larger pool, and they do have their Armenian allies who could throw in more men while our Macedonia allies would be unlikely to do much outside of Greece due to the massive Egyptian navy) and they occupy Barca and Corniclanum so it is the best peace we could hope for (well maybe a white peace would be better but I think they were still in too good shape for that to be possible)

Polyperchon is sent home to Egypt and we later gain a border with Rome as they conquered Thapsus (and a few provinces in the west) from Carthage. They guarantee our independence but are still not willing to join an alliance. As spend the following years slowly recovering from the war, we get the choice between hellenistic and roman warfare. Well the Romans have done pretty well for themselves, so I decide to go with that. Ariston dies of old age and his reckless son Ameinias becomes the new basileus, another pretty average king that isn't really good at anything but not really bad at anything either.

In the east the Seleucids have some problems as one Lysimachus declares himself king of Mesopotamia (including Seleucia, the Seleucids do manage to keep Babylon due to barbarians occupying it). Thanks to the Seleucid allies (mainly Pontus) the Seleucids prevent Lysimachus from taking any more provinces, but also as the Seleucid allies are more powerful than them it is Macedonia that takes charge of the war and they are content with Lysimachus just paying a very modest sum for peace. The Seleucids doesn't seem likely to recover from this but anything can happen.

And as the truce comes to an end the Egyptians are coming again. Macedonia joins the war on our side while the Armenians join the Egyptians while Pontus as before remains neutral. As Egypt has recovered better (they have much more manpower) I go for a defensive strategy beating up the Egyptian armies as they come to Barca, but as more armies come and my limited manpower is reduced to nothing I hope there is something I can do, but as it is now the year 600 AUC it is time to end this update, but not before looking at how the world looks.

​

Well Rome is bigger. The Aedui are gone and the Cantabri for some reason decide to join the Aedui in the war that led to their demise reducing the Cantabri to one province. Carthage is all but gone and the Seleucids are not in a much better shape.

 

[Wave]

I'd say it's an achievement to survive this far with Cyreneica and I think that you can survive until the end of the game if you haven't changed the end date very far..

Blobbing is... Let's say inevitable in this game and it can't feel very comfortable around there when you're the smallest blob in the area.
How do you manage to beat Egyptians in tech? In my games I usually manage to gain maybe 3 levels during the whole game even if I have good research guys and thus get my arse kicked around.. Although it may affect that you haven't conquered that many poor provinces.

 

[Belgiumruler]

well, Rome is expanding again, Egypt looks Hungry to the West. It wouldn't take long before Rome Declares war on you, you have a border with them now, then, yes then you're pretty much doomed. What's your amount of money now?

 

[Seelmeister]

A very interesting update, and a cliffhanger ending. You did well to halt the Egyptians and secure a peace where no land has changed hands, but it sounds as though this current war is going to be far harder to extract yourself from. The blobbing of Rome is ominous - as you appear a far more likely target than Egypt for them at this stage.

Looking forward to hearing about part 2 of the war!

 

[Surt]

The great showdown is nearing between Rome and Egypt, they now only need to eliminate that small desert country that is between them ... can you relocate your capital to Greece?

 

[Stuyvesant]

Ah crap. I was very impressed with you fighting the Egyptians to a standstill and getting peace for 200 gold. I should've realized the Egyptians would be back as soon as the truce expired. They probably used some of the money they extorted from you to rebuild their army...

If you manage to survive the current war without getting torn to shreds, I'd suggest beating up on the pitiful remnants of Carthage, while your Egyptian truce lasts. Although, to be honest, at this point I think Cyrenaica is screwed - either Egypt will get you, or the Romans (sweet mercy Rome is humongous). Now that the Seleucids have imploded, there's really no threat to Egypt short of Rome itself.

Since I've never really gotten the hang of the AUC calendar Rome uses, can you tell me how many years remain in the game?

 

[Lofman]

I'd say it's an achievement to survive this far with Cyreneica and I think that you can survive until the end of the game if you haven't changed the end date very far..

Blobbing is... Let's say inevitable in this game and it can't feel very comfortable around there when you're the smallest blob in the area.
How do you manage to beat Egyptians in tech? In my games I usually manage to gain maybe 3 levels during the whole game even if I have good research guys and thus get my arse kicked around.. Although it may affect that you haven't conquered that many poor provinces.

Started off with 3 decent provinces, fairly slow expansion and while the provinces taken from Egypt doesn't provide much research, Achaea does.

well, Rome is expanding again, Egypt looks Hungry to the West. It wouldn't take long before Rome Declares war on you, you have a border with them now, then, yes then you're pretty much doomed. What's your amount of money now?

Rome is unlikely to declare war on me due to great relations (and all that trade might also have an effect), me being reasonably strong, and they not having any reason to attack me (and still having other targets). There is however a risk they decide to go after Macedonia, which could be a problem. Have 362 gold at the start of the next update.

A very interesting update, and a cliffhanger ending. You did well to halt the Egyptians and secure a peace where no land has changed hands, but it sounds as though this current war is going to be far harder to extract yourself from. The blobbing of Rome is ominous - as you appear a far more likely target than Egypt for them at this stage.

Looking forward to hearing about part 2 of the war!

Well, I think I can handle Egypt (although it is costly). As noted above I don't fear Rome going after me directly, but would certainly be happier if they decided to accept an alliance offer.

The great showdown is nearing between Rome and Egypt, they now only need to eliminate that small desert country that is between them ... can you relocate your capital to Greece?

Only by suffering a civil war and losing Barca. And the capital could end up in Sabratha or something. And wouldn't really be Cyrenaica anymore if I did that, am barely Cyrenaica as it is, only having one of the Cyrenaican provinces.

Ah crap. I was very impressed with you fighting the Egyptians to a standstill and getting peace for 200 gold. I should've realized the Egyptians would be back as soon as the truce expired. They probably used some of the money they extorted from you to rebuild their army...

If you manage to survive the current war without getting torn to shreds, I'd suggest beating up on the pitiful remnants of Carthage, while your Egyptian truce lasts. Although, to be honest, at this point I think Cyrenaica is screwed - either Egypt will get you, or the Romans (sweet mercy Rome is humongous). Now that the Seleucids have imploded, there's really no threat to Egypt short of Rome itself.

Since I've never really gotten the hang of the AUC calendar Rome uses, can you tell me how many years remain in the game?

Slightly more then 100 years remain as the game ends sometime around 730 AUC.

 

[Lofman]

Between A Rock and a Hard Place
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I find this lack of screenshots disturbing​

As you might recall we ended in a war and things weren't looking that good with no manpower and Egyptian hordes moving in from all sides. Well after beating them up some more we got away with just paying 50 gold. Their manpower wasn't doing too well (but they still had decent reserves) and at the time we did occupy their holdings in Greece. So then it is time to recover our manpower. Get the event to pick between big and small ships, decide to go big, not entirely clear on the exact effects it will have, but hopefully some of it will be stronger ships so that we can deal with the massive (roughly 250 ships later in this update which is a bit more then our just over 50 ships).

The Egyptians decide to go after the Seleucids next. Pontus decides that it also wants to wage war (as they are allied with both Egypt and the Seleucids they are not involved in that war) so declare war against the Bosporan Kingdom. And they then asks us and Macedonia to join which we do while the Bosporans get mighty Crete on their side. In the end Pontus conquers Panticapaeum while Macedonia takes the western blob that Crete had. After two years the Seleucids have had enough and cedes Damascus, Pergamon and Coele-Syria, but Egypt is still at war with Macedonia, Bosporan Kingdom and Crete, and have had their manpower drained so I decide to smear the reputation of the Egyptian king Charias.

After doing that for a bit I decide to actually attack. Hopefully I will be able to deal with them now that I have some manpower and they don't. I even bring in my army from Greece as it is pretty quiet there and the local Egyptian provinces are occupied by Macedonia. However I do act too aggressively and almost lose that army (due to a large Armenian army near Alexandria) and as it recovers my manpower is looking nowhere near as impressive as at the beginning of the war.

I have however occupied Cyrene and Cyrenaica and after destroying a few Egyptian armies (that were in a really poor shape) I begin pushing towards Alexandria. Unfortunately the Egyptians have managed to gather an army of 72,000 men, which is more then I expected to find in one place. I cause considerable losses, but my armies are in no shape to fight anymore as they retreat as quickly as they can so I frantically try to get peace. Eventually the Egyptians agree to let me pay 100 gold. Three years, lots of dead, and I think I might have stood a chance had I not been as aggressive as I was with the Greek army. Anyway this is the world late in 610 AUC.

​

Rome has been beating up Carthage and Numidia, while Crete is reduced to one province (which would be tempting if I a) had an army in shape to fight and b) they had not drained their population with their silly colonization). Macedonia and Egypt have both grown and are still at war, with both having drained their manpower and Macedonia currently occupying the provinces Egypt took from Crete. The Seleucid Empire is collapsing (Arabia declared itself independent) and Parthia have been expanding into Mesopotamia.

 

[Seelmeister]

Great update, although the second war against Egypt has the feeling of a missed opportunity, you still officially beat them which was good to see. It's almost a shame that Mesopotamis is so fractured, a strong power emerging there would certainly be a useful counterweight to Egypt. Perhaps Parthia will grow into this role? Hopefully Egyptian aggression continues to be directed not only against you but into Mesopotamia, Asia Minor and Greece as well, this should allow you another opportunity to strike.

 

[Stuyvesant]

Ah, it's a shame you still had to pay to get the Egyptians off your back, after your promising start (but I must admit that they held the important cards, with that 72,000-strong army). Good to see Egypt and Macedonia still continuing their war - hopefully this will keep the Egyptians occupied for many years to come. Maybe next time you can strike and regain some of your rightful territory?

 

[loki100]

must confess I found your situation at the end of the first update rather grim, but having read the second it looks a lot more hopeful. I think the key is that Macedonian-Egypt war, don't think either can win big so its hopefully going to weaken them both. Guess over time Egypt can afford mercenaries while Macedon risks falling apart but it may keep them focussed on each other.

still think this is almost the only Rome AAR I've seen where the player must be cussing the implosion of the Seleucids, as opposed to actively working to try and weaken them.

Rome looks scary and you still look blocked in. A Macedonian collapse may offer space in Greece, but of course that in turn would free up Egypt again.

Great AAR and it looks like a really fun game

 

[Surt]

Isn't that little green speck there an Elephant province, maybe the Carthaginian doesn't need it anymore?

 

[Lofman]

Great update, although the second war against Egypt has the feeling of a missed opportunity, you still officially beat them which was good to see. It's almost a shame that Mesopotamis is so fractured, a strong power emerging there would certainly be a useful counterweight to Egypt. Perhaps Parthia will grow into this role? Hopefully Egyptian aggression continues to be directed not only against you but into Mesopotamia, Asia Minor and Greece as well, this should allow you another opportunity to strike.

Well I paid 100 gold so officially I lost.

Ah, it's a shame you still had to pay to get the Egyptians off your back, after your promising start (but I must admit that they held the important cards, with that 72,000-strong army). Good to see Egypt and Macedonia still continuing their war - hopefully this will keep the Egyptians occupied for many years to come. Maybe next time you can strike and regain some of your rightful territory?

One can always hope. The only bad thing about the Egyptian-Macedonian war is that Rome could decide that Macedonia is weak enough to attack, which would not be good for my diplomatic situation.

must confess I found your situation at the end of the first update rather grim, but having read the second it looks a lot more hopeful. I think the key is that Macedonian-Egypt war, don't think either can win big so its hopefully going to weaken them both. Guess over time Egypt can afford mercenaries while Macedon risks falling apart but it may keep them focussed on each other.

still think this is almost the only Rome AAR I've seen where the player must be cussing the implosion of the Seleucids, as opposed to actively working to try and weaken them.

Rome looks scary and you still look blocked in. A Macedonian collapse may offer space in Greece, but of course that in turn would free up Egypt again.

Great AAR and it looks like a really fun game

While a Macedonian collapse would open up some territory in Greece, but as you noted it would also be good for Egypt, and then the Romans would certainly get involved. It could be interesting to see how that would affect things, but for now they are holding up.

Isn't that little green speck there an Elephant province, maybe the Carthaginian doesn't need it anymore?

Yeah, there is an elephant province there. And while Elephants aren't cost-effective (they are way too expensive for that) it is not like I am poor and can't afford them, so it might be interesting to try to get access to them if possible.

 

[Lofman]

Between A Rock and a Hard Place
​

Reconquest would be nice​

Last time Cyrenaica wasn't in what you would call a good shape. Armies nearly gone and no manpower, but at least we managed to get an acceptable peace with the Ptolemies. The first half of the decade is pretty quiet. The army recovers and more ships are constructed because I can (and as Egypt have their massive fleet I feel it is needed). Road networks are constructed in our coastal provinces (doesn't really care about the inland) but then as seven years have passed since the last war and while our manpower reserves aren't that impressive, the Egyptians have been fighting the Macedonians for all this time and not been able to recover at all. I decide to go for it. Our 30,000 men march across the borders, divided into two armies to both siege more then one province and more importantly avoid unnecessary attrition.

The Egyptians themselves are no problem, although an Armenian army equaling mine in size appears, and while I do beat them in a couple of battles I don't like the losses (both from the battles and from attrition as I had to gather my armies together). However I manage to pay them off while transporting the greek army to help. As for naval matters I avoid their main fleet but happily picks of small fleets trying to blockade Macedonian ports, can't completely avoid naval battles with their main fleet, but suffer no losses (sadly causes none either). With Egypt open I get to fight a small army the Egyptians managed to scrape together. It fails to defeat me, but the year is 620 AUC so it is time to see the state of the world.

The Romans have smashed the Numidians and taken yet another province from Carthage (the one with elephants) although Carthage did fight reasonably well when I looked so good for them. The war between Macedonia and Egypt still rages as does mine war with the fould Egyptians. In fact I simply can't end now, I simply must see how this war ends. So I play some more and there simply isn't much fight left in the Egyptians. Rather then wait until I have occupied more of Egypt proper then just Alexandria they accept my offer of peace late in the year 621 AUC. Cyrene and the province named Cyrenaica are now both part of Cyrenaica again.

A great achievement for king Ameinias. Once again things are looking bright for the future of Cyrenaica, but who knows what will happen.

 

[Stuyvesant]

Good to see you reclaim your namesake homeland! Now, there's the nagging voice at the back of my head that wonders if you could've pushed the Egyptians further, perhaps claim some more provinces, perhaps push up their war exhaustion and create some rebellions... But then again, who knows when they'll make peace with the Macedonians and direct their full fury at you?

The absolute worst that could happen (as far as Egypt is concerned) is that the Egyptians make peace with Macedon, rebuild their armies and come at you with a vengeance. But even if that happens, you're still in a better position now than you were before Cyrene and Cyrenaica were welcomed back into the loving embrace of your state.

 

[Belgiumruler]

Good job!

 

[loki100]

well done, so good to see Cyrenicia back in Cyrenicia.

this AAR really does showcase just how much good fun is to had with Rome

 

[Malurous]

Nicely done, good to see the starting provinces are all back! Hopefully that Macedon conflict lasts even longer so that you'd get the chance to bring them down a peg still.

 

[spartasmaximus]

How do you guys take those pictures with the black edges where it shows the updated nations?

 

[Surt]

Damn Romans they took your Elephants, well the Egyptians still got some you can take.