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Ígneo said:
I think that Switzerland should not only own but also control the province to get the event and that for 1000 population (=much more single people) to appear they must have been gone somewhere else.
An example are events FRA 3128 and HEL 20309 - there protestants leave France and settle in Switzerland.
ConjurerDragon said:
Ok. The event must include a triggering controled province, in this case Bern. I believe 1000 it's a fine number considering only 5,000 new people moved to Geneva at that time (not to mention all those who moved to other cities on those troubled times).
To continue with my change proposals, I paste another swiss discussion:
Witch-Hunting
This are the created events:
Witch-Hunting
This are the created events:
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One more thing. Should I propose similar events for the affected countries (Scotland, Savoy, Dutch Spain and French-Comte, Koln, Strasburg, Lorraine, Milano, Venetia, Austria, Wurttemberg, Mainz, Pfalz, Bayern, Poland, Hungary, Transylvania, Sweden, France)? I think I can simply replace the last part of the description adding specific considerations about witch hunting in those regions, and changing some numbers (in England, for example, there are few numbers [percentage of population], though it may be useful to include it on the list of countries).
Better refine description of these events first. English natives could help us but typos first:
Medieval Inquisition tried a large number of witches, but collective witch-hunting was a exclusive modern phenomena. Individual melleficium was not uncommon in lots of rural areas, but the scholastic demonology science didn't develop until the end of the 14th century, relating witches and conspiracy gatherings that were supervised by Satan himself. This conspiracy paranoia can track its roots as far as the first Jew and Leper massacre of the High Middle Ages, when thousands were slaughtered by crusaders. But it's on the early 15th century when demonological theories become fully accepted by the upper classes. The two Councils of Constanze and Basel are the birth of the first work that directly connects malleficium and demonology. The work of Johannes Nider, the Formicarius, is a masterpiece of scholastic demonology and marks a new era in the witch-hunting period. The work of Heinrich Kramer, the Malleus Maleficarum (the Hammer of the Wicked) is the first work that reaches a widespread attention in the subject, and works as a inquisitorial manual for witch-hunters. But it's not Church who tries the most in Modern Ages. On the contrary, Civil Courts are responsible for 85-90 percent of the executions. Switzerland is home to the first witch-hunting process and an estimate of 5,000-10,000 makes it one of the most affected regions in Europe. Only by the early 18th century, with the Illustration on the doors of Geneva, will the horrible massacre stop producing victims on the western side of the Alps.
melleficicium, malleficium?
EDIT: offset 1500 is better for such events.
Medieval Inquisition tried a large number of witches, but collective witch-hunting was a exclusive modern phenomena. Individual melleficium was not uncommon in lots of rural areas, but the scholastic demonology science didn't develop until the end of the 14th century, relating witches and conspiracy gatherings that were supervised by Satan himself. This conspiracy paranoia can track its roots as far as the first Jew and Leper massacre of the High Middle Ages, when thousands were slaughtered by crusaders. But it's on the early 15th century when demonological theories become fully accepted by the upper classes. The two Councils of Constanze and Basel are the birth of the first work that directly connects malleficium and demonology. The work of Johannes Nider, the Formicarius, is a masterpiece of scholastic demonology and marks a new era in the witch-hunting period. The work of Heinrich Kramer, the Malleus Maleficarum (the Hammer of the Wicked) is the first work that reaches a widespread attention in the subject, and works as a inquisitorial manual for witch-hunters. But it's not Church who tries the most in Modern Ages. On the contrary, Civil Courts are responsible for 85-90 percent of the executions. Switzerland is home to the first witch-hunting process and an estimate of 5,000-10,000 makes it one of the most affected regions in Europe. Only by the early 18th century, with the Illustration on the doors of Geneva, will the horrible massacre stop producing victims on the western side of the Alps.
melleficicium, malleficium?
EDIT: offset 1500 is better for such events.
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OK, I have corrected many mistakes and added some new information (I'm am convinced, don't know why, that the subject will atract some interest). Hope it's OK now. 
Medieval Inquisition tried a large number of witches, but collective witch-hunting was an exclusive modern phenomena. Individual maleficium (latin for witchcraft) was not uncommon in many rural areas, but it wasn't until scholastic demonology related witches and Sabbaths (night meetings with strong conspiracy elements, including canibalism, orgies and a sacred oath of loyalty to Satan himself) that societies started to get obssesed with the matter. This conspiracy paranoia can track its roots as far as to the first Jew and Leper massacres in the High Middle Ages, when thousands were slaughtered by defeated crusaders and angry countrymen. But it's on the early 15th century when demonological theories will become fully accepted by the upper classes. Both Councils, Constance and Basel are considered to be the first public space in which this concepts, maleficium and Sabbath were publicly related. The work of Johannes Nider (1380-1438), The Formicarius (The Anthill), is a masterpiece of scholastic demonology and marks a new era in witch-hunting. The work of Heinrich Kramer (1430-1505), Malleus Maleficarum (Hammer of the Wicked) is the first work that reaches widespread attention, and works as a inquisitorial manual for witch-hunters. But it's not Church who tries the most in Modern Ages. On the contrary, Civil Courts are responsible for 85-90 percent of executions. Switzerland is home to the first witch-hunting process and an estimate of 5,000-10,000 burned witches makes it one of the most affected regions in Europe. Only by the early 18th century, with Illustration at the doors of Geneva, will the horrible massacre stop producing victims on the western side of the Alps.
Medieval Inquisition tried a large number of witches, but collective witch-hunting was an exclusive modern phenomena. Individual maleficium (latin for witchcraft) was not uncommon in many rural areas, but it wasn't until scholastic demonology related witches and Sabbaths (night meetings with strong conspiracy elements, including canibalism, orgies and a sacred oath of loyalty to Satan himself) that societies started to get obssesed with the matter. This conspiracy paranoia can track its roots as far as to the first Jew and Leper massacres in the High Middle Ages, when thousands were slaughtered by defeated crusaders and angry countrymen. But it's on the early 15th century when demonological theories will become fully accepted by the upper classes. Both Councils, Constance and Basel are considered to be the first public space in which this concepts, maleficium and Sabbath were publicly related. The work of Johannes Nider (1380-1438), The Formicarius (The Anthill), is a masterpiece of scholastic demonology and marks a new era in witch-hunting. The work of Heinrich Kramer (1430-1505), Malleus Maleficarum (Hammer of the Wicked) is the first work that reaches widespread attention, and works as a inquisitorial manual for witch-hunters. But it's not Church who tries the most in Modern Ages. On the contrary, Civil Courts are responsible for 85-90 percent of executions. Switzerland is home to the first witch-hunting process and an estimate of 5,000-10,000 burned witches makes it one of the most affected regions in Europe. Only by the early 18th century, with Illustration at the doors of Geneva, will the horrible massacre stop producing victims on the western side of the Alps.
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About post #93, another question is why Switzerland should own Savoie (405) as a whole?Ígneo said:
Why not test if HEL_20307 "13 Cantons" happened instead?
I agree ownership and control of Bern (388) is mandatory.
EDIT: we have the same problem with ownership of Savoie in HEL_184020 and HEL_184069. Do we really want Switerland to gain Savoie province?
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YodaMaster said:
Currently - yes. Because the northern half of the EU2 province of Savoy is the Vaud/Geneva which Switzerland conquers. That´s why they get a core on the province in HEL 184069 however only after they have conquered it.
Is there a difference in the new map for the area of Geneva?
But isn't HEL_20307 "13 Cantons" the representation of the gain of Vaud and Geneva for current map, without Savoie fully conquered by HEL?
See here for the new map. Geneva will be an independent province.
See here for the new map. Geneva will be an independent province.
I don't know how the new map works, but it's true that Northern Savoy (Pais d'Vaud) was controlled by the Swiss confederation. So I agree with ConjurerDragon. Being so, I don't know if all Savoy adopted protestantism. I guess this is all about percentages...what percentage of population did adopt protestantism and what percentange remained catholic.
I have made new additions to the event and it's desciption.
I have made new additions to the event and it's desciption.
Ownership and control of Bern (388) is mandatory. Savoie is still a problem.
Typos:
Jean Chauvin or Calvin was a Picard bourgeois favoured by the bishop of Noyon. His father worked in the city government before losing the favour of the local Church. After spending some years in Paris, Calvin became interested in Lutheran teachings, and subsequently converted to Protestantism. The Affair of the Placards, which involved a direct attack to the King of France, forced him to escape from Paris as no Protestant was safe there after that event occurred. He went to Geneva, but the population expelled him. He returned in 1541 and settled there until his death, working in the Consistory. Calvin, unlike Luther, was a one-book-man. His three editions of the monumental Institutio Christianae Religionis are a masterpiece of theological Protestantism, and one of the most important books of the century, highly influential for Dutch, Scottish and English reformed Protestants. Calvin also planned a severe reform of customs and ancient practices, and in his war with local nobility, he prosecuted and expelled many of his opponents. Geneva was to be a model city, a city "fearful of God", tidy, clean, and with no vagabonds or idle people. Consequences for both Geneva and Switzerland were extremely important, because a ferocious moral regime was started to supervise any practices that looked dangerous to both Church and Government. Also, many foreigners were attracted by the opportunity to freely practice Protestant Eucharist and Baptism (the basis of Lutheran and reformed rituals), therefore adding more than 5,000 inhabitants to city as Geneva, Bern and Zurich.
But English is not my mother language. Description could be improved.
Typos:
Jean Chauvin or Calvin was a Picard bourgeois favoured by the bishop of Noyon. His father worked in the city government before losing the favour of the local Church. After spending some years in Paris, Calvin became interested in Lutheran teachings, and subsequently converted to Protestantism. The Affair of the Placards, which involved a direct attack to the King of France, forced him to escape from Paris as no Protestant was safe there after that event occurred. He went to Geneva, but the population expelled him. He returned in 1541 and settled there until his death, working in the Consistory. Calvin, unlike Luther, was a one-book-man. His three editions of the monumental Institutio Christianae Religionis are a masterpiece of theological Protestantism, and one of the most important books of the century, highly influential for Dutch, Scottish and English reformed Protestants. Calvin also planned a severe reform of customs and ancient practices, and in his war with local nobility, he prosecuted and expelled many of his opponents. Geneva was to be a model city, a city "fearful of God", tidy, clean, and with no vagabonds or idle people. Consequences for both Geneva and Switzerland were extremely important, because a ferocious moral regime was started to supervise any practices that looked dangerous to both Church and Government. Also, many foreigners were attracted by the opportunity to freely practice Protestant Eucharist and Baptism (the basis of Lutheran and reformed rituals), therefore adding more than 5,000 inhabitants to city as Geneva, Bern and Zurich.
But English is not my mother language. Description could be improved.
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Yeah, I always thought it was a contradiction that french and spanish speakers had to communicate in english to understand each other.
Ígneo said:
And german speakers. Don´t forget the german native speakers.
The advantage of communicating in english is that I´m able to understand it. Most of it anyway.
It you would try to explain something to me in french or spanish I would not understand more than one word here or there...
YodaMaster said:
Then in the new map we have no problem at all - Switzerland gains a core on and has to conquer Geneva province. Then the 13 cantons event needs to give less goodies as Switzerland has gained Geneva as a real province and not a virtual increase in population.
In the current map where Geneva is part of Savoy province it´s more difficult. The 13 cantons grants them the goodies of gaining Geneva without owning it on the map - so if they take Savoy in addition they have a double advantage.
However as Switzerland has no core on Savoy the AI will have not intention to capture it - and if a human player captures Savoy he deserves the core. No need for change IMO.
I will check ASAP. Core on Savoie should then only be granted if Savoy (the country) doesn't own Savoie (the province) and HEL_20307 did'nt fire. EDIT: checked and confirmation: no need of this.ConjurerDragon said:
Anyway, owning Savoie for Calvin event should not be mandatory, we need a OR condition for Savoie ownership or HEL_20307 (that represents the gain of Geneva).
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About post #104, same remark as in Savoy thread for ownership and control of Bern and offset (5,000 will be sufficient).
I agree. You can rewrite AGCEEP with all the mod's we have agreed. Both ownership and control of main province as seen in http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?t=332386 .