EU4 - Development Diary - 27th of October 2020

[fleetothemoon]

What happens if you expand infrastructure in your capital? Since that has -100% local gov cap use.

Groogy already said that GC from expand infrastructure is unaffected by local gov modifier. It's flat 200, end of story.

snip

Would we be able to expand infrastructure for our subjects?

 

[Groogy]

Useless at the end of the game when we own 50% of the world (or more)

It's by design not viable for you if you own 50% of the world
People seem to have a weird concept of playing tall

 

[Erfar]

Being able to build a courthouse in every single state without it even being a question wouldn't be very interesting gameplay imo. Might as well just make a level of admin tech that reduces all province GC costs by the amount a courthouse would at that point.

it's more question about "how to get rid of that many useless temples and shipyards at the late game"

 

[IndigoRage]

It's by design not viable for you if you own 50% of the world
People seem to have a weird concept of playing tall

Playing tall is when it's 1700 and you are only 2/3 of the way to WC, ig.

 

[Groogy]

Would we be able to expand infrastructure for our subjects?

Right now no because you could seriously harm them by doing it, so I'd have to think about how it should work if it is even possible to make it work.

 

[bly08]

200 lol

 

[HeyIAmInfinity]

Being able to build a courthouse in every single state without it even being a question wouldn't be very interesting gameplay imo. Might as well just make a level of admin tech that reduces all province GC costs by the amount a courthouse would at that point.

Its not about being it being an interesting mechanics, it’s about solving the micro issue that gov cap added to the game, someone above already mentioned it in detail so I’m not going to write it again.

 

[Beagá]

200 lol

I know right, should be 300 specially in Sparta

 

[ImAdrian]

I have a small feature request, since you're working on the UI, @Groogy: When you are in the new states overview menu, could you make the name of the states clickable? (ie clicking on a state will move the map to its location). Would be very useful!

 

[petertju]

Playing tall is when it's 1700 and you are only 2/3 of the way to WC, ig.

No, just no.

Playing tall is just having the Netherlands or Great Britian.

 

[IndigoRage]

Its not about being it being an interesting mechanics, it’s about solving the micro issue that gov cap added to the game, someone above already mentioned it in detail so I’m not going to write it again.

idk, having to pick between a manufactory and a courthouse in some states with high dev provinces isn't that much of an issue to me. It's a more interesting tradeoff than some of the others in the game, that's for sure. Though I guess for people who take in a lot of states fast, it could be a bigger issue. It's not even the worst micro in the game tbh.

 

[IndigoRage]

No, just no.

Playing tall is just having the Netherlands or Great Britian.

Was a joke about someone saying you couldn't do this when you owned half of the world when the whole point of the mechanic is to give tall players a bonus of some kind.

 

[Katrex]

I think everyone here has really missed in what manner this is broken. What if I said the number could be 1000000000 gov capacity and it wouldn’t matter?

At what stage in the game do you run out of buildings slash things to spend gold on? Just fire your advisors and do this as many times as possible in every single province possible.

and accept that you will never core another province again. Not that you would need to. Build another couple of soldiers houses in every single province. Giving you another few million manpower.

Basically you do this after developing gets too expensive. Basically 30-50 dev in every province and as such the extra mana from advisors becomes less important than the extra manpower. If it only works on production buildings it’s eh good for a meme seeing how high you can get a trade node.

 

[Zak Preston]

I... CAN'T... BELIEVE... MY... EYES!!!!

Are you buffing TALL gameplay? SERIOUSLY?

THANK YOU!


P.S. @Groogy, @Johan Can we have some more tall mechanics, please (in fact, not "some", but rather "much more")?

 

[Pale Blue]

From what I can tell this is specifically designed to be impossible to use when you're blobbing all over the world, so I don't see what the problem really is for assessment of it for late game. This suggestion goes well outside the intent, from a one-off bonus for one specific place to some economic bonus you just put in good provinces all over the map late game. It's specifically designed for players who aren't blobbing to stay at least in the remote ballpark of economically competitive. It obviously won't amount to all that much, but the intent isn't to be for standard blob all over the map behavior.

Even for tall play it is useless. As a duchy you start with 200gov cap. The gov cap of tech allows you to maybe get another 200 every 50ish years. That's not counting the gov cap you need for deving your provinces, which is a much much better use of gov cap. So even as a tall player you use this new feature 2 maybe 3 times?
If it were affected by gov cap reduction you could at least use it in your capital state, maybe even in some other provinces if you stack statehouse and town hall, but that requires a previous investment in money and building slots I am not sure you will ever get back before the game ends.

 

[IndigoRage]

I... CAN'T... BELIEVE... MY... EYES!!!!

Are you buffing TALL gameplay? SERIOUSLY?

THANK YOU!


P.S. @Groogy, @Johan Can we have some more tall mechanics, please (in fact, not "some", but rather "much more")?

Would also have the benefit of eternally blobbing not being the only viable playstyle (though global empire should still logically be stronger than switzerland). Maybe adding mechanics specifically for staying small will eventually warm people up to the idea that not every single thing has to be balanced around conquering the whole world.

 

[IndigoRage]

Even for tall play it is useless. As a duchy you start with 200gov cap. The gov cap of tech allows you to maybe get another 200 every 50ish years. That's not counting the gov cap you need for deving your provinces, which is a much much better use of gov cap. So even as a tall player you use this new feature 2 maybe 3 times?
If it were affected by gov cap reduction you could at least use it in your capital state, maybe even in some other provinces if you stack statehouse and town hall, but that requires a previous investment in money and building slots I am not sure you will ever get back before the game ends.

Never said it was particularly useful in its current iteration. Only that it was specifically designed not to be doable as a blob. I don't figure I'd ever use it more than once, maybe twice max if at all if I were playing tall though. (I suspect its final implementation may have an attached achievement) Not sure how I feel about it atm. I just like the spirit behind adding "tall" things. Maybe this is the start of tall countries getting a good mechanic even if it's useless atm.

 

[priamossz]

@Groogy with all do respect I would not click on that button even if I would play as a 1 province Ulm sandwiched between an austria that owns all of western europe and an Ottomans that owns all the balkans and reaches all the way down to Arabia. The reason is because the powerspike that this button gives me would not be enough to be a meaningful help in the situation even if I would not be in such a ridicilous position and just have a normal Ulm campaign. On the other hand 200 gov is a ridicilous investment that will hurt me till the rest of the game even if i manage to expand. Spending the gov is simply not worth it unless you literally planning on not expanding at all in the entire game which no player would do.

 

[Piotrzeci]

Infrastructure is a bad idea.

1. It costs way too much. 200 is what a Kingdom rank gives.
2. It will be very annoying to deal with when a province with it is conquered from AI.
3. The benefit doesn't make sense. Adding extra governing capacity means a province will need a court house... which takes a building slot... that it gives. It's pointless.

 

[Sapa Inca]

I think that a flat 200 government capacity cost is a good number to start balancing around because as I understood reading this dev diary, the objective is make this mechanic only viable for tall play, if you deliberately are not expanding and have just one or few provinces your government capacity will naturally increase throughout the game and you can dump the excess of government capacity points investing in infrastructure, this is good and make tall play more rewarding.

If you are not playing tall this flat 200 government capacity cost is better spent in other things, but I think that this is intentional by design, one of main challanges of create mechanics for make tall play better is have certain that wide play will not be stronger using the same mechanic, I think that a flat 200 goverment capacity cost solve this problem.