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[MOD]Better rebels. No more whack-a-rebel!

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avee said:
These are good ideas. Can you explain exact conditions when you`d like rebel stacks to spawn?
Click to expand...

Hey, sorry about the slow replay. Ok, so after thinking it through, it seems to me like the main factors should be:

  1. The level of rebel activity in the province. Provinces with massive revolts should be more likely to spawn troops than ones with low levels. Ideally, I think any level should be capable of spawning rebels, just to keep players on guard, but it should heavily weighted away from the minor revolts.

  2. The type of modifiers causing the revolt risk. In others words, some province modifiers will be more likely than others to cause a rebel spawn, even if their local_revolt_risk modifier is the same. For example, heretic_stronghold, high_taxes, and incompetent_rule all increase revolt risk by 10%, but I think the heretic_stronghold and high taxes modifiers should be more likely to trigger a spawn than the incompetent rule modifier. This would let you create differences between different sorts of rebel activity.

  3. Whether the lords in the province have raised their levies or not. If none of them have raised any levies, then it will be less likely, if all of them have raised levies, then more likely.

  4. If the owner of the province is at war, and the culture/religion of his enemy. If the owner of the province is at war with a religious enemy of the province (i.e. province is catholic, owner is at war with a muslim), then rebel stacks would be less likely to spawn. If the owner is at war with someone of the same religion/culture of the province, then they'd be more likely. (This would have to have exceptions for if any holdings were already captured by the owner's enemy, or if the enemy is leading troops in the province--that can be based off on the crusader event).

  5. The date/something that captures the difference between peasant revolts in the early part of the game's timeframe (mainly scattered, and best represented by modifiers) and the massive revolts of the late middle ages. I don't know how simple/historically determinative you want to keep this, but one way to represent the late-medieval peasant revolts would be to just use the date as a modifier on the chance of rebel spawns. If you wanted to make the system more nuanced, then perhaps you could tie it to economic tech (to represent the widening gap between rich and poor), whether the plague has hit or not, etc. If the game/a mod using this includes the Franciscans and other similar anti-property religious orders, their presence could also increase the likelihood of a spawn.

I'd be happy to help with the coding, if you want a hand.

Also, I think you saw the UI/council position mod I'm working on. I was thinking it would tie in well with this mod by letting the player use council jobs to interact with the rebels. For example, the chancellor could have a job to negotiate with the rebels, the steward could have a job to bribe rebel leaders, etc. The AI would need to do everything via event/decision, but this could make it more interactive for players. What do you think?
 
Modifiers have been slightly tweaked to refleck changes of the last patch. New version is uploaded.

Jaol said:
Hey, sorry about the slow replay. Ok, so after thinking it through, it seems to me like the main factors should be:

  1. The level of rebel activity in the province. Provinces with massive revolts should be more likely to spawn troops than ones with low levels. Ideally, I think any level should be capable of spawning rebels, just to keep players on guard, but it should heavily weighted away from the minor revolts.

  2. The type of modifiers causing the revolt risk. In others words, some province modifiers will be more likely than others to cause a rebel spawn, even if their local_revolt_risk modifier is the same. For example, heretic_stronghold, high_taxes, and incompetent_rule all increase revolt risk by 10%, but I think the heretic_stronghold and high taxes modifiers should be more likely to trigger a spawn than the incompetent rule modifier. This would let you create differences between different sorts of rebel activity.

  3. Whether the lords in the province have raised their levies or not. If none of them have raised any levies, then it will be less likely, if all of them have raised levies, then more likely.

  4. If the owner of the province is at war, and the culture/religion of his enemy. If the owner of the province is at war with a religious enemy of the province (i.e. province is catholic, owner is at war with a muslim), then rebel stacks would be less likely to spawn. If the owner is at war with someone of the same religion/culture of the province, then they'd be more likely. (This would have to have exceptions for if any holdings were already captured by the owner's enemy, or if the enemy is leading troops in the province--that can be based off on the crusader event).

  5. The date/something that captures the difference between peasant revolts in the early part of the game's timeframe (mainly scattered, and best represented by modifiers) and the massive revolts of the late middle ages. I don't know how simple/historically determinative you want to keep this, but one way to represent the late-medieval peasant revolts would be to just use the date as a modifier on the chance of rebel spawns. If you wanted to make the system more nuanced, then perhaps you could tie it to economic tech (to represent the widening gap between rich and poor), whether the plague has hit or not, etc. If the game/a mod using this includes the Franciscans and other similar anti-property religious orders, their presence could also increase the likelihood of a spawn.

I'd be happy to help with the coding, if you want a hand.
Click to expand...
I really like your ideas, but I would like to keep the system based on modifiers and events. Spawned rebels just dont make any sense - they are boring and add nothing to gameplay. Currently I can`t see any interesting use of spawned rebels - I would prefer to add more interesting events within my modifier system.
Jaol said:
Also, I think you saw the UI/council position mod I'm working on. I was thinking it would tie in well with this mod by letting the player use council jobs to interact with the rebels. For example, the chancellor could have a job to negotiate with the rebels, the steward could have a job to bribe rebel leaders, etc. The AI would need to do everything via event/decision, but this could make it more interactive for players. What do you think?
Click to expand...
Your mod looks promising. However I want a system where AI is equal or almost equal to human - at least, in terms of dealing with rebels. :)
 
Is there a visual cue or an indication somewhere in the ledger for which provinces have rebel problems? As it stands, in a Kingdom or empire, it is difficult to remember which provinces have active rebellions and the lack of a visual indicator or list means you have to check each province manually. I also think that there should be a small chance that the more sever uprisings will also spawn an army.

Other than that, great mod.
 
How does the current version handle 1.05?

I just tried loading with the mod disabled and crashed. I'm worried about playing my game with it enabled for fear of corrupting saves or overriding patch changes in other aspects. Also, the patch seems like it might have addressed some of the rebel problems by reducing the frequency of revolts and allowing vassal AI to fight them instead.

EDIT: Game crashed when loading my old save regardless of whether I enable the mod or not. Anyone else having this problem?
 
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I would assume copy and pasting the new applicable commons files into a mod folder, then copy and pasting the Better rebels bits [the very bottom bit] into the new files and using those in the mod would make it work with the new patch but i aint tested it yet
 
Arachnyd said:
How does the current version handle 1.05?

I just tried loading with the mod disabled and crashed. I'm worried about playing my game with it enabled for fear of corrupting saves or overriding patch changes in other aspects. Also, the patch seems like it might have addressed some of the rebel problems by reducing the frequency of revolts and allowing vassal AI to fight them instead.

EDIT: Game crashed when loading my old save regardless of whether I enable the mod or not. Anyone else having this problem?
Click to expand...
After patch event modifiers are stored in special folder, not in a single file like before. It causes oldd-style modifiers not to be loaded.
Try this version (I just changed modifiers location, not tested yet): View attachment Better rebels v0.6.rar
 
Orinsul said:
What would need to be done to 1.06 this?
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Does it need to be 1.06'ed? I haven't tested yet, but Better Rebels 0.6 (not the link in the OP, the one in the post two above yours) worked fine on 1.05; I doubt they'd change the game around again in such a way as to break it, although with such a large patch and new DLC it's certainly possible.
 
Sniggles said:
Does it need to be 1.06'ed? I haven't tested yet, but Better Rebels 0.6 (not the link in the OP, the one in the post two above yours) worked fine on 1.05; I doubt they'd change the game around again in such a way as to break it, although with such a large patch and new DLC it's certainly possible.
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It`s not entirely compatible. I`ll try to make a new version today.
 
I tried, and it seemed to work but then rebels starting popping up like without it. So maybe there are new rebel events or moslems use different rebel events.
However, i just read in the CAT mod that the replace function might not be working at the moment so if a mod changes an event that already exists the game might still be loading the unchanged one. If thats how that makes sense.
So that could be the problem in which theres nought to do but wait.

avee said:
It`s not entirely compatible. I`ll try to make a new version today.
Click to expand...

Awesome thanks
 
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Orinsul said:
I tried, and it seemed to work but then rebels starting popping up like without it. So maybe there are new rebel events or moslems use different rebel events.
However, i just read in the CAT mod that the replace function might not be working at the moment so if a mod changes an event that already exists the game might still be loading the unchanged one. If thats how that makes sense.
So that could be the problem in which theres nought to do but wait.



Awesome thanks
Click to expand...
I have uploaded 1.06-compatible version.

Minor changes:
- revolt suppressing event is now properly shown in tooltip for marshal`s mission
- tweaked marshal`s martial modifiers for suppressing revolts

Sniggles said:
Thanks! This mod seriously decides whether I play CK2 or not, I hate the way rebels function without it.
Click to expand...
Hm. I believe, CK2 has a nice Better Rebels implementation.
 
Ah, excellent. This mod is always brilliant to have, and it's compatible with so much!

By the way, I've been experimenting a little bit with some 1.06 on_actions, and I don't think you need to override the entire 00_on_actions.txt.

You could have a better_rebel_on_action.txt in that folder with just
Code: 
# When rebels appear
on_rebel_revolt = {
	events = {
		1000025000 #600
	}
}
in it, and it would override the default. At the very least it works for combat pulses to make battle more killy.
 
Ijtzoi said:
Ah, excellent. This mod is always brilliant to have, and it's compatible with so much!

By the way, I've been experimenting a little bit with some 1.06 on_actions, and I don't think you need to override the entire 00_on_actions.txt.

You could have a better_rebel_on_action.txt in that folder with just
Code: 
# When rebels appear
on_rebel_revolt = {
	events = {
		1000025000 #600
	}
}
in it, and it would override the default. At the very least it works for combat pulses to make battle more killy.
Click to expand...
Thank you for info. New version is up. :)
Do you know, does it also with other files like opinion_modifiers etc? It seems to be a vast compatibility improvement.
 
It should. Making it possible to never have to edit the vanilla files was the point of the whole ordeal.
That's why all the vanilla files are called "00_whatever", instead of "whatever". To ensure they're read first and the vanilla code is overwritten by mod-changes and not the other way around.

Oh, and I never congratulated you for that mod. Rebel hunting is the most annoying chore in every Paradox-game, so this mod is brilliant. Thank you for that.
 
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