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Stellaris Dev Diary #127 - Trade Value and Trade Routes

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today we're going to continue talking about the 2.2 'Le Guin' update, on the topic of Trade Value and Trade Routes. As said before, we're not yet ready to reveal anything about when Le Guin is coming out, only that it's a long time away and we have many more topics to cover before then. Also as said before, screenshots will contain placeholder art and interfaces and non-final numbers.

Trade Value
Trade Value is a new value that's being added in the Le Guin update for non-Gestalt empires, representing the civilian and private-sector economies of these empires. All Pops generate a small amount of Trade Value based on their living standards, with higher living standard Pops generating more trade value, and is also produced by a number of different jobs such as Clerks and Merchants. Additionally, Trade Value can be found as deposits in space, representing various resources that don't have a direct industrial application but might still be desirable to your population (for a real-life example, think of things like as precious stones used in jewelry). Trade Value has no inherent purpose, but can be turned into other resources by being exploited, representing taxation and tariffs imposed on the civilian economy by an empire that has the necessary infrastructure in place to benefit from it.
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In order for Trade Value to count as exploited, it has to fulfill two conditions:

1) There must be an upgraded Starbase in range from the system to collect the Trade Value. By default, upgraded Starbases can only collect inside their own system, but their collection range can be extended by constructing additional Trade Hub modules, with each module extending the collection range by a single system up to a maximum of 6 hyperlane jumps away. You do not need to build an orbital station to collect trade value from planets - this is done automatically if it is in range of a collecting Starbase.

2) Once collected, Trade Value needs to be sent to your capital system. This will be done automatically if the Starbase collecting is located in said capital system, but otherwise the Starbase must be connected to the capital through a Trade Route (more on that below).

Trade Value that is successfully exploited will be converted into other resources (currently, trade value is turned into energy credits at a 1:1 conversion rate, but which exact resources it becomes is fully scriptable and may differ depending on your empire type) and added to your monthly income.
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Trade Routes
Trade Routes are paths are that used to connect remote Starbases to your capital in order to exploit the trade value collected there. Each upgraded Starbase can support a single Trade Route by connecting to another Starbase, which is where the first Starbase will send all of its collected trade value. For example, an empire might have a remote Starbase (we'll call it starbase A), which is sending trade value to another Starbase closer to the capital (starbase B), which in turn sends on both its collected trade and all trade sent to it by starbase A on to the capital. The player has full control over which Starbase sends its value where, and can redraw routes, though there may be an efficiency loss on a newly drawn route for a time.

This means that if starbase A collects a value of 10 from the systems around it, and starbase B collects 15, 10 value will be sent from A to B and all 25 combined value is then sent on to C (the capital) and is successfully exploited. Any trade value that fails to reach the capital, either because of lack of collection, lack of a route, or piracy (more on that below) is wasted - the empire gets no benefits from it - so it'll be especially important to ensure any populous colonies that are generating a lot of trade value are properly connected via trade routes to your capital.

Trades routes will have a special map filter showing routes, protection and piracy, and is also planned to be visualized inside the systems, but more on that later.
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(Ignore any weird visuals such as sector borders, it's just a bug)

Piracy and Trade Defense
Of course, all that lucrative merchandise being moved through space won't exactly go unnoticed by the less savory elements of your empire. Over time, piracy will begin to accumulate along trade routes, especially routes with a high degree of trade value moving through them. For each system with piracy that the trade route passes through, a certain amount of the trade value will be lost. To combat piracy, an empire can make use of a combination of Starbases and fleet Patrols. All upgraded Starbases will have a trade protection value, that is essentially a minimum amount of trade value that will always make it through any system under their protection, regardless of the level of piracy (representing heavily escorted merchant convoys). By default, this trade protection is only for the system they are located in, but can be extended to additional systems by building defensive modules such as Hangar Bays.
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Additionally, any military fleet can be given orders to patrol a route between two Starbases to actively eliminate pirates and reduce the amount of piracy in the systems. The old system of spawning pirate ships in empty systems adjacent to your empire will also change - instead, pirate fleets may spawn in systems where a large amount of trade value is being lost to pirates. Overall, pirate fleets is something you will experience less often and can actively work to prevent, but will be more of an actual threat when they do spawn. We will most likely keep some sort of penalty for having a sprawling empire with a lot of unprotected connections, possibly by simply raising the amount of piracy experienced along your trade routes, or some sort of efficiency penalty. We may also have a system similar to the old pirates for Gestalts, since they do not have access to Trade Value or Trade Routes.
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(Yes, we know the grammar/spelling is wrong, no need to point it out - the icons are also placeholders)

That's all for today! Next week we're continuing to talk about the Le Guin update, on the topic of Decisions and Planetary Bombardment

EDIT: Since it keeps being asked, at this point we are not ready to talk about how trade trades/trade agreements with other empires will work, only that they will exist in some form.
 
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Would it be possible to take the trade value that reaches your capital divided by the total trade value of all your planets, and apply the resultant value as a global bonus/malus to resource production (bonus to production if it's high, malus if it's low)?
 
Will it be possible to draw trade routes through other, friendly, empire's space? Or will it just be restricted to your own space?

You can draw trade through other empires so long as you have open borders.
 
Maybe just boost the amount of trade value collected per starbase bypassed? Like in EU IV

That would lead to some exceptionally stupidly drawn routes to maximize value.
 
Looks very promising!

@Wiz
Have you considered making the exchange rate of trade value dependent on civics / policy? For example allowing a fraction of the trade value to be collected as other basic resources or special resources?
 
Looks very promising!

@Wiz
Have you considered making the exchange rate of trade value dependent on civics / policy? For example allowing a fraction of the trade value to be collected as other basic resources or special resources?

That's precisely what I meant by how resources from trade might vary by empire. I think I'd like if you could turn some of it into consumer goods, for example, to have high living standard empires rely more on trade.
 
So the "trade points" can be stolen by pirats but food points still magically transported

all resources in the game atm "magically" get trasported . trade points are private goods, going around .
all other resource are of the state . you don't go and steal state resources with 1 space-car and 2 drunk friends .

when they become rich with stealing goods, they become a real treath that try to take state resources ( stations) .
 
Could you make it that you can build special modules that add to the trade value. For example if I build a space jeweller, it adds 10% trade value to the incoming. This would give you a reason to build even more infrastructure. You could even have it be something like a station in a wormhole having the exotic trait, giving +x%. Alternatively could you have trade routes passively increase growth and development. Also could yoy have traderoutes directly increase infrastructure?
 
You can draw trade through other empires so long as you have open borders.

Assume you can also do this through unclaimed space as well; and if so is there a punative piracy penalty for routing a trade route through territoryno-one owns, and likewise is there a "tax" for routing a trade route through another Empires space? The collary of this being if another empire routes a trade route through your territory will you gain a bit of value from it.
 
We're considering the ability to add additional collection points, but we don't want to make this easy as then there would be no need for long trade routes ever.

Just something I thought of that may help here but maybe a planetary building that allows collection but for every planet with one overall collection gets less efficient (maybe with a soft cap that can be raised by a few techs). It could also be rather expensive to set up, and if the trade value gets too high they would want to become your capital and be upset if they aren’t.
 
what about trade value generated on the capital? is it always utilized straight away?

We're considering the ability to add additional collection points, but we don't want to make this easy as then there would be no need for long trade routes ever.
Mmaybe give planets developed above some threshold ability to exploit some limited amount of trade value?

For example, add a specific expensive building which can only be built if infra > X and allows to utilize up to 30 trade value. As long as planet trade value + incoming routes from nearby system is at 30 or below you get it all exploited. If total trade value exceeds 30 your either have to send excess trade value further down the road of it will be wasted.

Upgrading the building would be available at infra > Y and would allow to utilize up to 50 trade value, and so on.

This would allow construction of complex flow networks with multiple sources and limited capacity sinks. Proper application could help lower expenses for protection/starbases and make the whole trade system more robust in case part of the network is affected by hostiles.
 
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Wiz,

Can empires that doesn't have a galactic market lock certain strategic resources so other empires can't get it?
Or will it automatically open up for everyone once found?
 
Could you make it that you can build special modules that add to the trade value. For example if I build a space jeweller, it adds 10% trade value to the incoming. This would give you a reason to build even more infrastructure. You could even have it be something like a station in a wormhole having the exotic trait, giving +x%. Alternatively could you have trade routes passively increase growth and development. Also could yoy have traderoutes directly increase infrastructure?

I'm pretty certain the problem with stations/modules/whatever that multiply trade value is that you will get players exploiting them to stack multipliers to completely ridiculous levels that make no sense.
 
@Wiz The DD mentioned trade routes being 'wasted' when they aren't connected to the capital. Could potentially sectors collect this trade revenue instead, for their own internal use? This could indirectly represent decentralisation of the state, allowing sectors to collect revenue where the state cannot. Not sure if this would require 'capitals' for sectors.
 
Love the system, with all the other stuff this will just add to the feeling that our empires have actual economies. Also, I’m still so surprised by the size of this update and we don’t officially know what the paid part will be! As much as I desperately want it now, I can wait since I know you guys are working hard on this. Can’t wait to enjoy that hard work!
 
Wiz, thank you for sneaking new and fun fleet gameplay into an update/DLC that's supposed to be about something else altogether. As happy as I am about the tile system being replaced and trade becoming a thing and all that, knowing that I'll finally have a good reason to maintain cruiser divisions and sending warships out in peacetime will no longer be a pointless drain of resources, but achieve something...

I think you just made my Stellaris day.

Also, depending on how trade between empires works, please consider making it possible for empires to protect trade beyond their borders, assuming they get access, and allow them to gain opinion bonuses with other empires that way. Maybe? It sounds like a fun idea to me that allows for the use of fleet power as a means of diplomacy. That is, after all, one of the most important roles modern navies fulfil in peacetime.

I'll refrain from formally suggesting freedom of navigation missions, that allow warships to purposely breach closed borders for a system or two in exchange for a casus belli and an opinion penalty for the offended party, at this point. See? I didn't say anything about that. :p
 
@Wiz The DD mentioned trade routes being 'wasted' when they aren't connected to the capital. Could potentially sectors collect this trade revenue instead, for their own internal use? This could indirectly represent decentralisation of the state, allowing sectors to collect revenue where the state cannot. Not sure if this would require 'capitals' for sectors.

He mentioined adding additional collection points, but sector capitals would make the idea system to centralize around.