The sad tale of Protestantism

[crazy sam10]

Something I've noticed has been going on since the base game, is that Protestantism has been getting more and more redundant. Firstly Reformed got that update to allow it use a fervor system, and became an interesting mechanic to trade focused nations like Netherlands, and the buffs were generally quite nice to any other country that didn't want to be Catholic for whatever reason. Now with the release of 1.8 Catholicism got its huge update so that the Pope can grant many boons for the right price, making it not only an interesting system, but a greatly beneficial one. However between these two religions, it feels a lot like Protestantism has been left out. Given England has Church of England, and Bohemia has a lot of in-game events to push it to becoming one of the early Protestantism nations, it feels a bit upsetting that it lacks any kind of "special feature" like many of the other religions have. I sort of feel as if Protestantism should be the target of the next update to make it something worth converting to, because right now it honestly lacks any real incentive to do so.

Now looking up Protestantism, I think something could be added to the game to reflect the "Five solae". Now, I don't know too much regarding Religion, nor the Protestant faith, so that's about as much idea I have for them, my research into the faith just showed them as one of the main parts of the reformation, and I thought there would be a way for them to be incorporated.

 

[AchedTeacher]

Doesn't protestantism get the best flat-out bonus out of all three? Like +5% production efficiency?

 

[crazy sam10]

Doesn't protestantism get the best flat-out bonus out of all three? Like +5% production efficiency?

Nothing happens to Production, the bonuses are:
Nation Tax Modifier +10%
Idea Cost -10%

 

[Labrynian Rebel]

Well it's kind of hard since Lutheranism and Anglicanism are so different that any in-game religion that encompasses both is bound to feel generic.

 

[Clownie]

Doesn't protestantism get the best flat-out bonus out of all three? Like +5% production efficiency?

Not sure if serious? They get -10% idea cost and +10% tax.

It's a pretty good bonus, but I don't see a clear advantage over catholicism anymore with the revamped curia.

 

[Deuterium Dawn]

Don't think that there was one before. If you were/were going to become a Catholic blob cardinal/curia controller bonuses were pretty amazing. But at any rate, I don't think he's complaining about the bonuses, which are pretty good, but about the lack of interaction, especially compared to other religions. I don't know about buddhist or confucian, but every other major religion has something.

 

[superZAKTAN]

Maybe a sort of piety bar should be added

 

[Galu]

Well for now protestants got quite nice base bonuses, and is one of two religions able to seize HRE Throne forever so that`s quite a lot, but you`re right, some love to protestants would be nice.

 

[Heretic]

what about the hokey income bonus when you switch over?
or did they nerf that?

 

[Deuterium Dawn]

what about the hokey income bonus when you switch over?
or did they nerf that?

Fairly certain you still get it. I haven't converted in 1.8 though.

 

[crazy sam10]

what about the hokey income bonus when you switch over?
or did they nerf that?

It's sort of a short term bonus, and in hindsight, the trade buffs from reformed give more long term financial aid, and as I recall you can now ask the Pope for money as much as you like (assuming you have the points).

 

[Santoes]

Coptic says hi.

 

[crazy sam10]

Coptic says hi.

In fairness, Coptic is a unique starting religion, like Animalist or Shamanist, not something you convert to. Also, while I'm not sure if it's spread in 1.8, but I'm certain that it's only available to 1 or 2 countries at game start.

 

[Deuterium Dawn]

It's sort of a short term bonus, and in hindsight, the trade buffs from reformed give more long term financial aid, and as I recall you can now ask the Pope for money as much as you like (assuming you have the points).

Eh. Long term, the monarch points are far far more valuable than the money. I only go reformed if i'm playing a merchant republic or the Netherlands, and mostly for flavor.

 

[Santoes]

In fairness, Coptic is a unique starting religion, like Animalist or Shamanist, not something you convert to. Also, while I'm not sure if it's spread in 1.8, but I'm certain that it's only available to 1 or 2 countries at game start.

So true, no one converts to coptic. (that was a coptic joke)

 

[TheDecider]

So what could happen to Protestantism? An active component like piety bar, something more like fully fleshed out pope mechanics?

Should inspiration be drawn from stereotypical views and say it should be about worker ethics and productivity? We had a thread a long time ago where this notion was challenged, but I didn't get any response from the self-proclaimed experts what the religion should "be about" instead, only naysayers who didn't like the abstractions presented.

If that road is taken, you could have a piety bar affecting your relation to worker Unions giving you more tradegoods production and production efficiency :rofl:

If it's already consider too good, only pointless bonuses like tolerance could be given, or even more useless vassal income(feels like a smack in the face everytime I see it), at which point its better to just leave it as is for now.

 

[Denkt]

Maybe you should be able to pick something similar to the hindu diety thing which could represent the greater control of the church offered by protestantism.

 

[victimizer]

Perhaps reformed and protestant should confer a 5 % tech cost reduction,

 

[Sobisonator]

Maybe you should be able to pick something similar to the hindu diety thing which could represent the greater control of the church offered by protestantism.

You could summon Martin Luther manifested as a many headed elephant to crush your enemies!

On a more serious note, I think Church of England should give a flat legitimacy boost since the monarch is the head of the church.

Also, protestantism could benefit from extra colonists because so many protestants were sent out of Europe to settle in areas which wouldn't prosecute them, such as North America.

 

[crazy sam10]

Repose to TheDecider:

I'm more or less throwing ideas around here, so don't question how some things may work, since it's pretty crude right now. But looking up Prot had the section about the Five solae, so I was thinking it could revolve around them. At first I was thinking they could work like factions, but looking over it, they look like they all "co-exist" so having certain ones be higher than the others may not work. So another idea is perhaps they might work as a sort of hybrid between the Tribe idea system, and the new Cardinal system, so ideally what this would mean is each of the solae have certain boons in them, each of which needing a different thing to unlock them for your nation. Now admittedly I know very little about Prot, so these Five solae may not be as central as I believe they are.