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?? How is it related to the interface? It's an AI problem. Most likely, it should check the templates and the brigade number and see how many template divs can be formed with the available forces. It may become a problem when there are many templates which use the same brigades, so templates could have player-assigned priorities, too.

Examples:

1) I have 51 inf brigades and 5 art brigades, the favoured template is 3xINf+1xART and the other template is 3xART. The AI creates five 3xINF+1xART divs and twelve 3xINF divs.

2) I have 51 inf brigades and 5 art brigades and the only template is 3xINf+1xART. The AI creates five 3xINF+1xART divs and adds 12 ARTs to the Needs window.

3) I have 51 inf brigades, 5 art brigades and 3 arm brigades and there are three templates with different priorities. 3xINF+1xART is ranked first, 3xARM+1xAC second and 3xINF third. The AI creates five 3xINF+1xART divs, twelve 3xINF divs and adds 1 AC to the Needs window.

Looks workable with these simple examples, although it could get problematic if the templates are more complicated and you have more units. What if I have many MOT units and I want both tank Divisions with 2xARM+1xMOT+1xSPArt and motorised Divisions with 3xMOT+1xSPArt? I'm not saying that the task is impossible (it's part of the field of operations research), only that it's not trivial.
 
Looks workable with these simple examples, although it could get problematic if the templates are more complicated and you have more units. What if I have many MOT units and I want both tank Divisions with 2xARM+1xMOT+1xSPArt and motorised Divisions with 3xMOT+1xSPArt? I'm not saying that the task is impossible (it's part of the field of operations research), only that it's not trivial.
Sure. I didn't claim that it was easy, either.

Regarding your examples, the problem is that you didn't say how many brigades you have, but I can predict two basic scenarios:

1) You have 12 arms, 40 mots and 10 sparts. 2xARM+1xMOT+1xSPArt is ranked first and 3xMOT+1xSPArt is ranked second. The AI forms six 2xARM+1xMOT+1xSPArt divs, four 3xMOT+1xSPArt divs and adds X to the Needs window.
2) You have 12 arms, 12 mots and 12 sparts. 2xARM+1xMOT+1xSPArt is ranked first and 3xMOT+1xSPArt is ranked second. The AI forms six 2xARM+1xMOT+1xSPArt divs, two 3xMOT+1xSPArt divs and adds Y to the Needs window.

Of course, the system is quite simple, but should be useful in most cases. Keep in mind that the Needs window is for the player's convenience only. If you want to create sth more advanced and polished, then you could allow the the player to specify the desired number of a given template div, e.g. 2xARM+1xMOT+1xSPArt - three, 3xMOT+1xSPArt - ten. The AI would form no more divs of a given type after reaching the desired number.
 
Sure. I didn't claim that it was easy, either.

Regarding your examples, the problem is that you didn't say how many brigades you have, but I can predict two basic scenarios:

1) You have 12 arms, 40 mots and 10 sparts. 2xARM+1xMOT+1xSPArt is ranked first and 3xMOT+1xSPArt is ranked second. The AI forms six 2xARM+1xMOT+1xSPArt divs, four 3xMOT+1xSPArt divs and adds 22 SPArts to the Needs window.
2) You have 12 arms, 12 mots and 12 sparts. 2xARM+1xMOT+1xSPArt is ranked first and 3xMOT+1xSPArt is ranked second. The AI forms six 2xARM+1xMOT+1xSPArt divs, two 3xMOT+1xSPArt divs and adds 8 arms and 4 mots to the Needs window.

Of course, the system is quite simple, but should be useful in most cases. Keep in mind that the Needs window is for the player's convenience only. If you want to create sth more advanced and polished, then you could allow the the player to specify the desired number of a given template divs, e.g. 2xARM+1xMOT+1xSPArt - three, 3xMOT+1xSPArt - ten. The AI would form no more divs of a given type after reaching the desired number.

but how are they reorganized? are all divisions split up and the brigades start to wander around for several month until they are were the belong? what happens to brigades not fitting into the new settup? what happens if the brigades are attacked or out of supply forgetting the orders? what happens without a land connection? what happens when brigades are destroyed during the process?
the engine has enough problems reorganizing OOBs with existing divisions what do you think will happen when it has to reorganize all divisions too?
 
Those are all AI problems. I can design a feature on paper, but I know nothing about AI programming, so I don't know whether it's feasible to introduce sth like this.

TBH I doubt that many players would use the feature during wartime, as they have frontline to care about and reorganisation is tricky when there is an active frontline nearby. This is a feature that would be most useful for the peacetime period and inactive fronts, when/where the bulk of the organisational efforts are being made. It would encourage planning, too.

For wartime purposes, all I would need is the possibility to "order" a brigade directly from the unit window, e.g. I click on unit X, then click the "Add brigade" button and select the desired brigade, which would be automatically assigned to a given unit in the production tab, like in case of "unit upgrades". If the div is out of reach for some reason, then the brigade would be added to the force pool as normal.
 
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Those are all AI problems. I can design a feature on paper, but I know nothing about AI programming, so I don't know whether it's feasible to introduce sth like this.

TBH I doubt that many players would use the feature during wartime, as they have frontline to care about and reorganisation is tricky when there is an active frontline nearby. This is a feature that would be most useful for the peacetime period and inactive fronts, when the bulk of the organisation efforts is being made. It would encourage planning, too.

sure, it would be a very nice feature. it is just that i see a bunch of problems with it. maybe when it would be possible to make at brigades into aa brigades saving the manpower and just using IC similar to the upgrade feature. if the AI could use that it could work.
 
sure, it would be a very nice feature. it is just that i see a bunch of problems with it. maybe when it would be possible to make at brigades into aa brigades saving the manpower and just using IC similar to the upgrade feature. if the AI could use that it could work.
I don't understand. Are you referring to the second proposed feature? If yes, then I was talking about the possibility of adding an another brigade to a division, which is important when you research Superior Firepower or want to upgrade your division design. Currently it's a hassle, as you have to search for proper units in the force pool or place them in a given province and manually merge them with a given division (which cannot be moving).

Unit upgrading is already in place, although I don't like the way it's balanced. It's a different feature, though.
 
I don't understand. Are you referring to the second proposed feature? If yes, then I was talking about the possibility of adding an another brigade to a division, which is important when you research Superior Firepower or want to upgrade your division design. Unit upgrading is already in place, although I don't like the way it's balanced.

i mean the reorganization to a certain setup. it would simplify things if it would be possible to "upgrade" a briagde into another brigade of a different type. that way you would have less wandering around the map and it might even be easier for the AI.
 
You realise that the player can already do everything I described in previous posts, right? It would only become much, much easier for them as a result of proposed interface improvements and feature additions.

If you want to teach the AI to reorganise their forces properly, then it's an entirely different story and purely related to AI programming. Currently the AI cannot even disband or upgrade units the way the player can...
 
Those are all AI problems. I can design a feature on paper, but I know nothing about AI programming, so I don't know whether it's feasible to introduce sth like this.

TBH I doubt that many players would use the feature during wartime, as they have frontline to care about and reorganisation is tricky when there is an active frontline nearby. This is a feature that would be most useful for the peacetime period and inactive fronts, when/where the bulk of the organisational efforts are being made. It would encourage planning, too.

I didn't think I would raise a storm of discussion. :)

I wouldn't care if such a feature was only available in peace, and it would not matter to me if you could only assign one template at a time, and it affected all valid brigades. (i.e. if your template involves MOT, then all MOT brigades would be reorganized into template X, even if you want some in another template). I wouldn't even care if you could only "re-org" units in the same province. It would be worth it to me to SR the entire theater to the same province, press the magic division re-org button, and get 400 INF brigades and 400 ARTY brigades turned into 200 divisions consisting of 2xINF, 2xARTY.

The labor savings from having to click/merge/brigade swap hundreds of divisions would be well worth the implementation of such a feature.
 
The labor savings from having to click/merge/brigade swap hundreds of divisions would be well worth the implementation of such a feature.
Yeah, that would be its main purpose. However, I bet that with a bit more effort the devs could make it more advanced and polished, which would make the feature even more useful. I think that we can forget about complex reorganisation during wartime, but everyone who had to deal with the Soviet OOB knows that reorganising the whole army is an exhausting task. It's not fun even in case of the Allied majors. I think that Germany is relatively the easiest, since you build most of your army from scratch, but even in this case reorganising the OOB after Fall Gelb can be annoying.

Combined with all the micromanagement involved in proper leader attachments (thanks the Flying Spaghetti Monster for the new FTM button!), additions of new brigades to existing divisions and manual movements of HQs (why the hell there is no "Keep HQs in range" button?) I often feel that I'm wasting 1/3 of the gaming time micromanaging the organisation of my forces instead of focusing on strategies in themselves. One would think that the player should be able to handle their armies with just several clicks per month, not per week.
 
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Hoi 4?
If at all possible, I would like to see some kinds of sphere of control around the units, a sphere to control presense, one to control artillery distance and one to control detection range.
Infantry, aeroplanes and tanks fights when their presense overlaps with another units presense, artillery and naval units fight others presense within their artillery distance as long as there is a detection sphere also overlapping that unit, of course there would probably be three types of detection, surface, sub and air and two to three types of artillery, surface, aa and (maybe if carriers get simplified) cag.

When you have this the only problem would be the huge provinces in sibiria and africa but controlling them might be more akin to sub warfare anyway.
Also while I'm fairly certain that this isn't a provinceless design it is absolutely a step in that direction, I do even think that a provinceless version of this might imrove the naval system.

But then what do I know maybe I'm just the forum fool or maybe I'm too bad at hoi3 to give suggestions at improvement.

/Zorbeltuss
 
Hoi 4?
If at all possible, I would like to see some kinds of sphere of control around the units, a sphere to control presense, one to control artillery distance...
For that to make even the tiniest bit of sense, you're also going to need a uniform distance grid. There are almost no provinces in the game where artillery commonly used (let's say up to about 200mm) will reach from one side of the province to another anyway.


When you have this the only problem would be the huge provinces in sibiria and africa but controlling them might be more akin to sub warfare anyway.
Having a uniform grid would solve this problem at a stroke of the engine-architect's pen. Part of the point of warfare in those environments would be the difficulty of exerting control over such massive wide open spaces. A 'front line' should take millions of men, basically becoming an impossibility.

Also while I'm fairly certain that this isn't a provinceless design...
It just doesn't work unless it's based on a provinceless design. But then the province based design is a hopeless mess anyway.
 
New concept for a divisions composition- sliders in increment/brigade size movements!

There's been some really great ideas in here the last couple of days, and although I'd like to add to Pier and Gensui Yamato's posts, I'll stick with the current conversation and add this idea I had regarding the composition of land units/divisions, which is so that once you click on a division, you can adjust sliders (in increment/brigade level amounts) on it so that the computer will over a short period of time make all of the adjustments for you. No needing to split a division into multiple brigades, send them individually here there and all over the place and then find them and individual merge them etc. I propose a click and forget concept, where you will have units of each type in a production pool and the desired units will (behind the scenes travel to the division) and add themselves to the division after a week or two of travel. And if there aren't enough units of that type in the production pool, as soon as enough of that type has been formed to create a brigade, they will go to the desired division (and you can send them from the division back to the production pool). How cool would that be...



There will be a national manpower pool

The larger your manpower pool, the more money you get as they are working in the economy.
From this you can set laws regarding drafts which will alter the percentage of men taken from the available manpower pool and after a period of 100 days will turn them into raw recruits.
In addition to the draft percentage you can also set a cap on the minimum/maximum number of men to go to the recruits pool or a minimum/maximum number that the national manpower pool is to stay at.

Instead of being formed by a number of brigades, a division shall have slider bars indicating how many men and weapon/tank allocations you would like to allocate to that division. (however a max of 4 tank destroyer/armoured brigades per division). NOTE though that you can only move the slider as per in the increments shown, Eg you can only add/subtract 30 AT guns at a ime, NOT able to pick a specific number like 4 or 22 etc. One movement/increment would be considered a brigade.

Eg
Men-------------------5,000….10,000…..15,000
Light AT---------------0…………30………...60
Heavy AT--------------0…………30……..….60
AA--------------------0……….…30………..60
Artillery----------------0…………30………..60
Self propelled artillery---0…....…30.........60
Light tank destroyers---0……....50……....100……150
Heavy tank destroyers--0……....50……....100…..150
Light armour------------0…...…50……....100…..150
Medium armour---------0……....50……....100……150
Heavy armour----------0……....50……....100……150

Transport
Motorised ? / (?) / (?%)
Halftracks ? / (?) / (?%)

Pioneers/Engineers ? / (?) / (?%)

There will be a tick box indicating whether or not you would like the division to be motorised or mechanised (halftracks)
If you are building or updating the composition of the division the first number displayed in the transport row will be how many trucks/halftracks the division requires. Which will be automatically calculated and based on the amount of manpower and support weapons (AT/AA guns etc) ‘allocated’ to the division.
If building the division from scratch, this number will automatically and immediately be deducted from your truck/halftrack pool.


If you are editing this division and you change the manpower/support weapon levels then the second number will show the decrease or increase to/from your truck/halftrack pool. It will take 10 days for the number of brigades in the division and its divisional speed & fighting capability changes to take effect on the unit, and the percentage multiplier will let you know approximately how its progressing/how long to go. Until the percentage multiplier reaches 100% the division will fight exactly as it was before the changes occurred. No percentage increase/decrease can take affect while the division is fighting. Being motorised will double the speed of the entire division, selecting halftracks will also double the speed of the division, but also increase the fighting value of the manpower brigades (especially offensive/toughness stats). Having transports will also increase the organisational regain rate for the division.


If you untick the motorised or halftrack box, then all the divisions vehicles will do the 10 day trip again, and after the progress reaches 100%, they will all be sent back to their respective motor pools, and then the division will become like standard infantry (with lower defense/attacking/speed stats).

The number of Pioneers/Engineers needed are based on the divisions size and are added/subtracted in the same manner as trucks. Engineers are created in the same manner as officers (with leadership points), and will auto deduct from a Engineer pool.

Engineers are created in the same manner as Officers, though for every one made, 2 supply points will be immediately deducted from your supply total to simulate the need for barbed wire, mines, flamethrowers, bridging equipment etc. Engineers will perform the same functions as in HoI3, however because the number needed for each unit will be based on the size of the division, their bonuses will apply as a fixed percentage across the division and will NOT be divided by the number of battalions/brigades in the division. Eg 33% river attack efficiency for every unit in the division.


Reinforcements will automatically be sent from your production pools to the division to try and get each brigade up to full strength.

When soldiers are taken away from a division they can either be split and form new divisions/brigades as currently in HoI3, or sent back to the raw recruit pool.

Because the men have already been trained, there won’t be a massive amount of time to create the division. It’s more about allocating the men into a cohesive unit and allocating/getting them acquired with their equipment etc. It may take 4 months to turn men from the manpower pool into raw recruits, and then one week to create a division with 0% experience. However for every 5% experience you would like to give a unit, it could take an additional month, up to a maximum of 20% (additional 4 months training) for newly created divisions.


Another thing that will affect manpower will be fortification and building projects. The more projects underway will decrease this pool, which will decrease your money (or just make it cost money). An idea could be to make it so that if you have a unit in a coastal province, then perhaps there can be a tick box on the division when selected, where the unit assists with fortification building and half the amount of manpower in the division is subtracted from the amount of manpower taken out of the national pool to do the works (set a maximum % capable of being done by army divisions though, to prevent super stacking units going from province to province building Forts in no time). This would save on costs, but as a result, perhaps the division will only remain at 70% of its fully maxed current organisation level, until it finishes/ is stopped, and then increases organisation back to full strength as per normal. Coastal fortifications will provide half of the bonus if attacked from an adjacent land province (to prevent, landing next to a coastal fort and then attacking it without any penalty what so ever, as land mines and trenches etc would still be there).
 
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Rummy while ideas like this are precisely what are needed, I would not agree with a division based slider system. This comes from three main reasons;

1. What of the people who enjoy composing armies from base units?
Obviously if your a macro player, who's not actually that bothered about the composition, just that it is 'effective' in the general sense. i.e. your general [3xINF 1xART] divisions. Then a slider system is perfect, because it allows them to throw some of everything into a division to give it effect.

However it doesn't give much satisfaction to a player having a division on the front who only needs to up the AT slider, or AA slider when it comes under attack from the respective opponants equipment.

It doesn't reward strategic planning or putting the right units into place. It only benefits the macro-player with the RTS 'spam this' mentality. Whereby victory is a result of spamming the counter to whatever your opponent is spamming, and swapping through the 'rock-paper-scissos' unit list faster than your opponent can.

As a long time RTS player, I don't play HoI for RTS similarity on a massive scale.


2. Runs the risk of the 'ultimate ratio' combination

By limiting the number of brigades of different types within a division, it is impossible to create a division that can excel in all areas. Because of this, tactical play is greatly awarded by looking at what is on the field and finding the weakness presented.

With a ratio format, I can tell you with certainty that you could mathematically construct an 'ultimate ratio' between all the groups. Once you've worked that out (even by trial and error) your not going to go back to 'inferior' ratios.

For MP, the game turns into who has the MP and IC and the better front line. For SP you win all battles with 'equal' nations.

3. It's actually quite complicated; steep learning curve
Anybody can understand “Pick any 4 from this list”, and after that they can start to experiment with combinations. This gives replay value in itself, as there are n! Different combinations of troops where n is the number of different troop types in the list.

While a slider has the capacity for near infinite numbers of different combinations, it's not intuitive. There is too many different combinations, where do you start? 80:20? 5:5:5:75? 1:2:3:4:5:6:7?

This also ties into the back end of how the game would work. The introduction of a slider in that sense for each division means not only keeping track of the divisions constituents, but also how it should be precisely filling those constituent requirements.

While in itself that's not too taxing a problem, but when scaled up to keep track of litterally millions of game day updates it could end up requiring far too much processor time.

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Opinion: The merit of sliders is in operational actions
Assigning air and naval missions are tedious. The units are constantly in motion across a large map, there is no 'front' that you can jump to and the unit could be anywhere requiring a search for it first.

Then there is the fact that the missions you assign are very short term. A campaign for a land division lasts for months as it crawls across the map. Your stance, attacking/defending only needs to be updated fairly infrequently. This is because that is the strategic aspect of the game.

Aircraft and Naval units represent tactical assets.

Because of that their uses change continually. With many of them it becomes impractical to control. If you were to, it would take up your entire game experience assigning missions, pulling them back, rebasing and in general micromanaging your army.

The strategy in tactical assets is the missions they take on.

So by setting priorities for the forms of missions they take on you gain the strategic aspect of tactical assets. For example, air superiority is needed when an airbase gets attacked. It would be pointless to create a strategy where the plans stay on the ground to get bombed while the pilots rest between bombing missions. Therefore while your priority is bombing missions, your airfields still take on key missions when needed.

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The larger your manpower pool, the more money you get as they are working in the economy.
From this you can set laws regarding drafts which will alter the percentage of men taken from the available manpower pool and after a period of 100 days will turn them into raw recruits.

This. Mostly. Rather I would prefer to see leadership be your MP multiplier by your level of education, plus any centres of academic excellence (read cities/urban terrain resource). Now perhaps this is the way it currently works, perhaps not. But to me often leadership has appeared rather arbitrary across the nations in Ho3.

Money doesn't necessarily increase with number of people in the nation, as those same people cost the government. Rather the more 'communist' you are, the less money you get (more social spending or not taxing workers), the more libertarian, the more money should be generated off trade, and fascism should improve resource gathering rather money due to 'autarktic principles' that often come with fascism. Tax rate should be a politics option. Communism gains an IC bonus politics at lower unity levels etc. to offset not having a monetary boon. After all Communism wasn't about generating wealth, more about insuring it was evenly spread.


[tl;dr] In my opinion money generation should be a function of politics, not population.
 
I sort of agree with Gensui Yamamoto. As cool as the feature sounds, it would be almost impossible to balance and it could easily become micromanagement hell. Also, most likely the AI would find itself outgunned even more than it is now.

I agree that aircraft management needs to become easier somehow. I hate the micromanagement involved in assigning missions.
 
Divisions slider settings - Sliders to adjust composition

That’s some good points Gensui, I had thought about these sorts of issues though didn’t want to create a wall of text posting it all.

Just to clarify, I am only suggesting sliders for land divisions, NOT air and naval units and I have just edited my above post to reflect that the slider movements would be brigade sized level increments (Eg you can only add/subtract 30 AT guns at a time, NOT 3 or 22 etc). Combat losses would now be specific and mention the amount of men, at guns, tanks etc lost. And the computer would automatically use units in the deployment/completed production pool to reinforce your divisions up to the increment/brigade size level as indicated on the slider. Eg if you have 2 infantry and 2 Panther brigades in a division, and lose 110 men and 4 Panthers then the computer will begin reinforcing those exact items from the recruit/production units and get the brigades back up to full strength.

For point 1 and rewarding players for forward thinking/strategic movement, and not being able to counter sudden enemy attacks… that’s why I think that any slider changes should have a 10-15 day delay, and any progress towards the 10-15 days should be paused if the unit is in combat. And any new brigades being deployed at a division because of a slider movement, would have 0% organisation. The purpose of the sliders should not be to give a player an advantage over what we currently do which is splitting and merging divisions (individually). But just a tool to ease micromanagement, of something that a player can do anyway. (Please note that the ability to adjust through sliders should only be possible if a country has a direct land connection to their capital city. If not the sliders should be greyed out, though the brigades can still detach/merge just like they currently do).

For point 2, what will limit a player from being able to achieve the ideal division is ‘production’, no one will be able to have a full complement of AT guns, AA, artillery etc in every division. If the guns/tanks are not in your completed production pool then the division still won’t have those particular units. Besides at the moment, any player can have 2 divisions of any type they want at the front lines and complement each other with the desired mix of AT, artillery, tanks etc. A slider system would simply allow people to merge all of those together into one division (causing less micromanagement) and or do as they currently do and have two smaller divisions with the same mix of units. Perhaps there could be a limit to the total number of brigades in each division, say 4 or 5 (just like we currently have) as one alternative.

For point 3, with the now mentioned increment size adjusments, this could also further be solved by restricting the number of brigades in a division as in HoI3, so there is no difference, though sliders just makes it so much easier to both micro and macro manage.


What I also like about sliders is that it gives you the potential to add trucks into the game. They can be produced and added to a ‘pool’ and then dispersed to units when requested (again, with a time delay). The trick though, is that most divisions will require a different amount of trucks due to the number of brigades, and some brigades requiring a different amount of trucks compared to others etc.


The other thing I like about it, is that I think some units should not be upgraded (eg Panzer 3’s should not be able to become Panzer 4’s once the research has been completed). And when you de/attach each brigade in the slider bar, perhaps a little box pops up the right and you can quickly select what type of unit you want added. Eg for heavy tank destroyers, a list could come up saying Jagdpanzer 4, JagdPanther or JagdTigers and supposing you have enough units in the production/deployment pool to form a brigade for that type of unit, you can specify what type of unit is to go to/leave the division, and it just makes it that little bit easier to try and keep the units of the same type together if desired. As opposed to say looking for JagdTigers and going through every division you have, and say nope, that division has JagdPanthers, so does this one, this division doesn’t have any, none, none, oh yep this division does, so now deselect, head to this location, and then try to remember once it gets there to find the two units and merge them together.

Though yeah I agree in that there shouldn’t be a tactical or strategic benefit to a player for having sliders to form divisions (and there are plenty of ways to make it not so) but just as a way to ease micro management, especially for those occasions your transferring troops to another front and trying to get them into some sort of battle order line, which is probably what I spend half of my time doing…
Eg As the Germans moving divisions from a defeated France to line up in the manner I want against Russia, this will literally take me hours to get right… instead now all I have to do is move the divisions to where I want, go through each division and change the slider, and then allow a couple of weeks for the changes to take effect, bang done!




I too like your thoughts on the manpower and income from the general population and think the calculations behind the scenes should differ for Democratic, Fascist and Communist countries, and then your selected political laws within each country can also further impact that. It should be so very easy to implement, and be very realistic (well almost anything would over the current IC setup)


PS I will also in the next couple of days attach a big post about how I think production could be redone (and a great one for research), which would help flow into some of this discussion and make more sense as a whole because I've tried to think about the effects and every possible change anything would make, and how it flows through.
 
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Just to clarify, I am only suggesting sliders for land divisions, NOT air and naval units

See here I think we have a fundermental disagreement in opinion. While I'm not against sliders, or even seeing a slider aspect for cav/mot/mec/log brigades representing trucks and the general level of mechanisation throughout the armed forces (which I do like), on brigade composition I don't believe it acuratly reflects the nature of the structure of warfare of the era.



To me, it sounds like you want a priority system, but still keep brigades as the core 'unit' that gets moved from A ---> B.

Setting INF high, gives you 2xINF brigades in your division, but ENG that is only just above zero is trapped out of its brigade joining the division because the ARM and SP ART sliders are just a bit higher on the slider scale. The division still being limited to four brigades can't fit the last one in.

This sounds to be frank a mechanic that would cause far more frustration than simplification. Joe Newbie is going to look at his ENG slider, see that its almost the same as the ARM and SP ART and start raging as to why his divisions not got no engineers.

A simmilar senario could be you know you've built a load of HARM brigades, but where of a suddern have they all gone? The AI in the slider having shipped them off to the Pacific Theater because your slider priorities were left a little higher with your divisions fighting through the pacific isles. Rage quit as you manually have to cycle through everything to find them and deprioritise division...then wait for the AI to sort it all out with TP.

This doesn't leave point 2. solved. If anything it gives less control, if you want to use a continious input device to control discrete allocation of resources.


For your expanding of point 1. since when could AT guns up in Siberia, be redeployed to Berlin in 10-15-30 days...?

That aspect alone doesn't make sense. Futhermore lets assume we put in a calculator to work out how long it should take, would it not be far simplier just to use the movement mechanics to do the exact same thing? Also what happens if the Turks suddernly land in the Crimea. Sorry we can't redeploy the guns because they are en route to Berlin! *Palm faces*

Do you kind of get my point here? I don't think you could make such an implimentation work without leading to sticking points where the 'manual' option is by far the simplest. With a much improved UI for your OOB, I think simplicity could be built in there, rather than at the divisional level.

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Sliders for mechanisation & reserves

Let's look at where I think the merits of sliders are in operational actions. What you would like to see is a system where you could macromanage changing the disposition of your divisions at the operational level.

So why not allow at the army or corps level of HQ you allow 'reserve*' brigades to be attached. When a brigade is set to 'reserve' the HQ automatically assigns it into divisions without their full compliments of brigades, as an when, the division is lacking against the force it is up against. The 'reserve brigade' being pulled back from the division after the division has been out of combat for some extended lenght of time. (The brigade has to move from the HQ to the division at the front across the map normally.)

This gets round a large number of issues, primarly those highlighted above. But it also aids in how you plan to fight a war. A slow rolling front would be enhanced by many rear brigades being rotated into and out of combat as an when they are needed. A blitzkrieg style would not want to be assigning tactical assets to the rear etc. therefore it ties into play style strongly allowing players to decide on their level and style of troop management.

* Note: different from your normal reserve forces, just lacking the correct term of the top of my head.



I think a 'mechanisation slider' could be a step in the right direction. In the same manner that escorts and trade transports are built, allow you to build 'trucks', but on the tech tree allow you are able to deploy a small number of different types. A global slider for 'logistics infrastruture' in that aspect could be utlised for how many trucks, supply caravans, Transports, Escorts you are building to supply the frontlines. Improving the rate of strategic redeployment and throughput on supply. However keep the 'repair rate of infrastruture' on a different slider. Thus you need roads, ports and vehicles.

This would allow you in essence to have two production tabs, one for combat units, another for mobile transport.

It's an idea...
 
To me, it sounds like you want a priority system, but still keep brigades as the core 'unit' that gets moved from A ---> B.

Setting INF high, gives you 2xINF brigades in your division, but ENG that is only just above zero is trapped out of its brigade joining the division because the ARM and SP ART sliders are just a bit higher on the slider scale. The division still being limited to four brigades can't fit the last one in.

A simmilar senario could be you know you've built a load of HARM brigades, but where of a suddern have they all gone? The AI in the slider having shipped them off to the Pacific Theater because your slider priorities were left a little higher with your divisions fighting through the pacific isles.
No its definately NOT a 'priority' system. If you dont have the sufficient amount of men/tanks/at guns in the production pool (enough to create a brigade) then the ability to allocate that particular item will be be greyed out/unselectable. As you cannot allocate something you dont have and it will NOT take units from anywhere but the production pool to get the brigade you want attached to a unit. However, I wouldn't mind an option where the slider/options change the view slightly so that you know there isn't enough of this particular unit type in the production pool to allocate a brigade to, 'though' once there is enough in the pool (either through production or being sent back from a division that doesnt need that brigade anymore), a brigade will be allocate to this division you want.

The amount of engineers/trucks needed to attach to a division will differ depending on the number and type of brigades in a division, but as mentioned in my first post about it, it will tell you how many trucks/engineers the division currently has, as well as how many more or less you will need for the allocation changes you are about to make. and you can take a quick look at your engineer or truck pool to see how many you currently have.
 
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A lot of what has been suggested would mean that the average computer & IP would not be able to run the game. Extra animation, movement, etc would slow it to a crawl. Additionally, there's already a lot to keep track of. The game should be made a little simpler, not more complex.
 
What i wnat to see

I would like to buy land off other countries and be able to play from ww2 to cold or even the modern day wars. I loved the strategic resources in For The Motherland and would like to see it expanded even more.I think every country should have a special strategic resource but that's just me. I also would like some kind of cheat to make it so puppets like North Korea can be an independent country.Hearts of Iron 4 needs some good cheats. It would be nice to add more countries and have the diplomacy expanded, where you can sell technology and weapons such as tanks,planes,etc, unlike in hoi3 where you got to build the tanks at the cost of your industrial capacity.They should only cost you manpower and money when you buy off other countries. --------------------------------------I didn't like the technology decay, i thought that was sort of a pain to keep track of, rather it gone. It would be nice to add a center of trade or more buildings like schools that improve manpower and research ,just came to me.
 
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