A Fanatic Materialist country will be humiliated simply because synthetic ascension?

[luanmameili[LM]]

Here the opinion of Holy Guardians towards player is -100

Such warning will be triggered if their opinion is worse than -99.

 

[Cleaving3]

Well, they’re fanatic spiritualists, so they REALLY don’t like robots. This is definitely intentional

 

[A Cat]

Actually Synths don't have an internal world, so their is no humiliation. Its actually a teaching moment to keep other nations from committing mass suicide.

 

[ASGeek2012]

It goes the other way, too. Materialist FEs will declare punishment wars against spiritualist empires. Had it happen to one of my vassals in a recent game.

 

[InvisibleBison]

Well, they’re fanatic spiritualists, so they REALLY don’t like robots. This is definitely intentional

Whether or not it's intentional doesn't change the fact that it's bad design. You shouldn't be forced to accept significant penalties or an unwinnable war by completing your ascension.

 

[HFY]

Hilariously, in a recent game I got that humiliation CB and -- in the same month -- acquired the Head of Zarqlon.

So the exact same FE which just humiliated me is now begging to send fleets to serve me.

There should really be some special code for that situation.

 

[BrokenSky]

Whether or not it's intentional doesn't change the fact that it's bad design. You shouldn't be forced to accept significant penalties or an unwinnable war by completing your ascension.

You could always convert to non-fanatic materialist first, or change your ascension plans when you realise that there's a Spiritualist FE.

If your entire game-plan doesn't have to change based on circumstances after empire creation, arguably that's worse game design, surely?

 

[InvisibleBison]

If your entire game-plan doesn't have to change based on circumstances after empire creation, arguably that's worse game design, surely?

Yeah, that's a good point.

 

[Ramidel]

Yeah. It's no different from being a xenophobe and having the Observers politely ask you to stop the slavery and purging. That's what FEs do.

 

[Incompetent]

It goes the other way, too. Materialist FEs will declare punishment wars against spiritualist empires. Had it happen to one of my vassals in a recent game.

What would provoke the Materialists into attacking?

If you're a Fanatic, an opposite ethic FE will get a -40 modifier against you, but that's not enough for war on its own. It's the specific combination of -40 for ethics, -20 for generic dislike of synth empires and -40 extra Spiritualist FE hatred of synths that pushes you into an endless punishment loop.

The other slightly weird one is the Xenophile FE: they get a -40 against Barbaric Despoilers, whereas they don't have a base opinion modifier against outright genocidal civics as far as I can tell.

 

[ASGeek2012]

What would provoke the Materialists into attacking?

If you're a Fanatic, an opposite ethic FE will get a -40 modifier against you, but that's not enough for war on its own. It's the specific combination of -40 for ethics, -20 for generic dislike of synth empires and -40 extra Spiritualist FE hatred of synths that pushes you into an endless punishment loop.

The other slightly weird one is the Xenophile FE: they get a -40 against Barbaric Despoilers, whereas they don't have a base opinion modifier against outright genocidal civics as far as I can tell.

Honestly? I don't know. Since the war dec was on the vassal and not me, I didn't have that insight. The vassal had not made any claims on FE territory as far as I could tell. It was showing up as a punitive war, so the FE was mad about something. Either that or it's a bug.

 

[Ramidel]

The other slightly weird one is the Xenophile FE: they get a -40 against Barbaric Despoilers, whereas they don't have a base opinion modifier against outright genocidal civics as far as I can tell.

Genocidal civics don't get dinged for having the civic. They get dinged for purging.

Barbaric Despoilers are something of an edge case, by contrast - aside from the "slaving" portion, they also need a ding for the fact that they're stealing pops without being the Observers, and they made the civic the problem (though they probably should have instead made Raiding bombardment carry a penalty, maybe it was easier to penalize the civic).

 

[Bloodbat]

Actually Synths don't have an internal world, so their is no humiliation. Its actually a teaching moment to keep other nations from committing mass suicide.

Synths have happiness values

 

[Nevars]

Honestly? I don't know. Since the war dec was on the vassal and not me, I didn't have that insight. The vassal had not made any claims on FE territory as far as I could tell. It was showing up as a punitive war, so the FE was mad about something. Either that or it's a bug.

Subject, especially the one of player do really have rather high opinion of themself so at some point they will just provoke FE whether through claim or just plain insult because they thought they (means you, the overlord) is strong enough to spank FE.

Spoiler: What player's vassal think