Stellaris: Galaxy Command has Arrived!

[Peter34]

Because, unfortunately, not enough people buy premium games on mobile.

The mobile version of King of Dragon Pass sold well enough that David Dunham not only created a sequel game, but actually planned for 4 additional games after the sequel. The first mobile version of the Sorcery! game sold well enough that Inkle also implemented the other 3.

It's all about daring to be different.

Nobody except Paradox creates high-complexity grand strategy games that appeal only to that small segment of the population that is capable of lifting a heavy cognitive load. You guys used to dare.

But there's nothing daring and there's nothing different about launching a mobile game based on microtransactions.

 

[edwardlego]

Because, unfortunately, not enough people buy premium games on mobile.

The situation may change in the future, with the introduction of cloud gaming services and subscription services we might see viable ways of making non-f2p games work on mobile, but right now that isn't the case.

This is only one game out of our entire catalogue, if it isn't your thing, keep an eye out for the news from PDXCon.

sounds like you should've tried to get into apple's game subscription thing

 

[Gokki]

So let me get this straight, and please address these:

* Is it basically a reskin of Nova Empire with some art assets and stats tweaked?
* Will it have ads?
* Will it have any transactions after buying?
* Will it go on the Apple Arcade and why not?
* Does it have singleplayer?
* Can it be played offline?
* How are you gonna deal with the coming copyright lawsuit for stealing assets from the Halo game series?

In other words, and i know i'm being hostile but it is only to be expected: Why should i bother with this game, is it any good?

 

[Spaceception]

There are a few more of these forum threads we want to open in the coming weeks to go over each of those elements in more detail.

Just as long as it doesn't take the place of dev diaries. Though, I don't see why they would.


So far, I'm not too interested. And as for concerns for mobile players, where you're worried about going to sleep/being inactive, and having all your work torn down; is there any way for that to be disabled when a player is inactive? So you can make diplomatic offers/send gifts/declare war/etc, but you can't actually do anything until they acknowledge it. And if you go to war, it comes to a standstill until both parties are active again. Maybe setting up servers for specific time-zones to mitigate this further.

I don't play these types of games, so maybe you or someone can explain if that's possible or not, and what the devs for this plan to do for that.

 

[Joshuax8]

It's not the dev studio calling the shots.It's the suits upstairs.

Agreed, bad wording on my part. I’m referring to the studio as a company. I have nothing against the devs themselfs.

Okay, this is just confusing. They've created a product you don't like, that's fine. I don't like all of their products either. I don't see how this is a betrayal by them however either, what are they betraying to you in this case? Their integrity? I mean I don't like freemium mobile games either, but it's not like they're holding someone or something hostage over this.

Integrity, exactly. Us giving them money and they spending it to make this!

 

[Metadigital]

I don't think there was a single person at Paradox who didn't expect we'd get strong reactions to a mobile game announcement. Naturally, it's now up to us to respond to the questions. I have no illusion that we'll go to business as usual today.

But yeah. The monetization itself will likely have its own forum thread later. But, as said before, this whole beta deal is also because we want to iron that element out. Get the kind of in-app system for monetization that the players can be comfortable with and the game can be supported by.

The problem you're going to face is, of course, that there's just no way for a persistent online mobile game-as-service to be profitable without preying on those with addiction problems, people with mental illnesses, and children who don't know any better. Those are the people who make these kinds of games successful, and there's no dancing around that. These sorts of games have been around long enough that there's a wealth of data to know what makes them succeed. I've been to the mobile gaming panels. I've seen the GDC talks. I know this, and increasingly, so does the market in general. Especially on PC. The mobile market is only targeted because it's still less savvy about these things.

Here, on a traditional message board about a grand strategy game, we all pretty much know what's going on. You've got a smart fanbase and that's built on smart devs and community managers. We can see this as just damage control. The kind of rhetoric you're using here might backfire. Look at how much controversy the game industry is in right now. That's only going to escalate until something gives. Paradox is looking a little like EA with regards to microtransactions and a little like Blizzard with its pushing of a mobile game made in Asia. I'm not sure that's the safest position to be in even if it is the most short-term profitable.

I don't think this controversy will reach the levels it has with EA or Blizzard. At the same time I don't think it's going to just evaporate overnight. It's going to leave a stain. Be ready for that. I hope people direct their frustration to where it should go and not do what it often does and target all of us caught in the middle.

 

[methegrate]

Ironically, I'm hoping that there is some overlap. I'd love to see half of the ideas you mentioned introduced into the real Stellaris.

 

[Peter34]

People don't understand this, the fact that the mobile market works in a complete different way than the PC market. Clash of Clans, Clash Royale, Angry Birds, etc. All of the successful mobile games were F2P with monetisation or publicity, then you have games like CIV or FF that have very low players in comparison, which is a pity.

But people here are ready with the torches to crucify Paradox just for catering into a market that has a lot of players and that has its own rules.

The first Angry Birds was a legit game. A physics-based puzzle game. The IAP was to become able to bypass levels that you couldn't figure out. I have nothing against that business model. It's not based on frustration. It's based on that which is legitimate game design: Inducing fun in the players.

 

[lovenotwar]

So I have a question, if they are not using resources, why is this here, and why are the devs responding to this and not the ones who made the game?
Seems like there should be another completely different forum for this, and that they should have their own team answering questions.
Because the pdx devs responding means they are not working on the game, which means they are wasting resources on this instead of the much needed fix.
so clearly resources are crossing...

 

[Blob Bleär]

I wouldn't really mind a massive, slow-pace galactic conquest with hundred(s) of players. You have the copy, and there's no micros in the real game.

(I don't really have time to sit down for long sessions due to work)

 

[Alfray Stryke]

* Will it go on the Apple Arcade and why not?

It can't be on Apple Arcade as there are microtransactions. - https://www.macworld.com/article/3385024/apple-arcade-faq-games-price-compatibility.html#toc-5

We'll figure something out, one day. I see an opportunity to have a premium gaming experience on mobile through cloud gaming, either directly through that, or through it reducing the costs of porting to make premium mobile itself more viable. Little early to really explore that though, kind of need the cloud gaming services to actually launch to give us some data.

I disagree with the perspective that mobile devices aren't powerful, because as mentioned modern iPhones and iPads are more than powerful enough, though budget Android devices might not be powerful enough. Apple also allows developers to build the same app for Mac OS and iPadOS (https://developer.apple.com/mac-catalyst/) which should imply that development time can be shared between different platforms for the same titles?

 

[LeSingeAffame]

Because, unfortunately, not enough people buy premium games on mobile.

The situation may change in the future, with the introduction of cloud gaming services and subscription services we might see viable ways of making non-f2p games work on mobile, but right now that isn't the case.

This is only one game out of our entire catalogue, if it isn't your thing, keep an eye out for the news from PDXCon.

With CK2 Paradox made a gamble to see if they could maintain games and bring new content to them for more than 7 years. This wasn't unique in the world of pc gaming, but still very unusual. And we can safely say it has been a huge success.
So, like, try something new. The pc games are known for their quality, and we know when we buy a game that it will be cherished, expanded, and maintain for years.

I'm sure you know this, and the rest of the team who worked on the game already had this discussion, but chose to take the safe path and follow the predatory p2w road. Still disappointing.

 

[GnoSIS]

I think we can both agree at this point that words can only take us so far. There is an extended beta period ahead of us and this will be a major part of it. Once tweaks start happening, we'll be able to see where we take monetization.

As for the premium cost. @Dnote talked about this better than I could.

But Harlot, by posting this anouncement here, you expect us to be your new customers? You do understand that this is crazy, if anything, you can see people are angry/dissapointed.
I'd be cool if you took this anouncement to another platform, but here? in the PC/Console hardcore audience? Didn't you guys learned anything from diablo Immortal? We don't care about this, even if you would also give us a new stellaris DLC.

 

[Harlot]

So I have a question, if they are not using resources, why is this here, and why are the devs responding to this and not the ones who made the game?
Seems like there should be another completely different forum for this, and that they should have their own team answering questions.
Because the pdx devs responding means they are not working on the game, which means they are wasting resources on this instead of the much needed fix.
so clearly resources are crossing...

You are correct on this front. After this post, we'll most likely be posting them natively to an integrated community app in the game and maybe sharing them here.

Just for the record, neither me nor Dnote are devs.

EDIT: As for why here? I imagine there are many reasons. We don't want you to think we sneak around. We want to be able to talk about what's in the game also with our players. And while it's likely not to appeal to many PC players, this is still a Stellaris game and I do think that once some people start playing, they'll see it has some cool stuff in it.

 

[Ethereld]

The first Angry Birds was a legit game. A physics-based puzzle game. The IAP was to become able to bypass levels that you couldn't figure out. I have nothing against that business model. It's not based on frustration. It's based on that which is legitimate game design: Inducing fun in the players.

The thing it's that mobile games with Microtransactions can be done in a good way or become a cash grab that benefits on the player weakness. But the point is that if a mobile game wants to compete in the big leagues it has to be addictive, something you can play in small windows of time and most importantly, it has to be F2P. A premium game may have some success, but not even close to the F2P.

So I have a question, if they are not using resources, why is this here, and why are the devs responding to this and not the ones who made the game?

Not a single Stellaris Dev has answered in this thread, only a community am ambassador which I guess it's kinda a community manager and a product manager that it's a guy in a suit.

 

[oblevdorohmsic]

A mobile game developed by a company from my motherland? This is hard to say...
You'd better show us something really good at PDXCON, dear.

 

[lovenotwar]

You are correct on this front. After this post, we'll most likely be posting them natively to an integrated community app in the game and maybe sharing them here.

Just for the record, neither me nor Dnote are devs.

EDIT: As for why here? I imagine there are many reasons. We don't want you to think we sneak around. We want to be able to talk about what's in the game also with our players. And while it's likely not to appeal to many PC players, this is still a Stellaris game and I do think that once some people start playing, they'll see it has some cool stuff in it.

i dont think it would have been seen as sneaky.
PDX did something like I suggested with the console version, and it was way more well received because of it, there was even a console forum long before the release, so clearly that way is far more successful than this. even blizzcon showed not to do exactly what you guys are doing.

i think you just dropped the ball on this game, not just with the timing, but with the way you released it, there are other way to do it, that are much better, that PDX has done in the past.

 

[endolex]

What's it like ripping off Nova Empire AND Halo all at once. You can literally see the UNSC logo on the tank.

Can you provide a source to that screenshot? Is it from the beta?

 

[Sitoutumaton]

Will this game be designed to adhere to GDPR from the ground up?

 

[Dnote]

If anyone here is going to be at PDXCon, I'm quite happy to make time to talk about these things.

 

[SanguiniusStyle]

A risky movement after Diablo Immortal.

Of course mobile market is huge and can give you profits, but I think most of us are +25 and we don't lose time playing games in our smartphones. If we want to play after work and have a rest we have our PC's,

Microtransactions are killing game industry.

Have a nice day.

 

[DahLliA]

Well. At least you didn't announce on stage as the next big thing
But why hype this shit so much? Been seeing it on Facebook for days now. Just announce it as an afterthought after giving some real news.
I honestly don't think the venn diagram of people who enjoy mobile games and people who play grand strategy has that much overlap.

Anyway. Maybe the influx of addiction money can help fix the late game performance at least.