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Poopfaust

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I was unclear after reading the WIKI on Puppets.
Is it correct that you can NOT transport Resources/Supplies thru Puppets?
Bigger question – Is it correct that when you attack from a Puppet, you get the Territory? In HOI 4, if you did that, the Puppet received the territory.., I believe that is how that worked.

Thanks again
 
Indeed, you cannot transport resources/supplies through a puppet. Your troops in the puppet's territory will be supplied from the puppet's supply network. The amount of supplies used up by your troops will be transferred from your stockpile to your puppet's the next day.
If you take territory, attacking from a puppet's territory, you get ownership. If your puppet's forces take territory, it's also yours. That said, you'll only be able to hold on to this territory if you can supply your troops, or those of your puppet, in this newly gained territory. You have maximum 30 days to bring in supplies, after that your troops will be out of supply, unable to move into hostile territory, able to move only very slowly, or not at all (in case the unit needs fuel).

The supply system in HOI3 is all about having enough bandwidth to send supplies from the capital / port to the troops. In case you're fighting anywhere but western Europe, you may need to improve infrastructure along the way, or deploy lighter units, or both. The Eastern front is especially vulnerable due to the massive number of troops both sides have to deploy, the poor infrastructure in Russia, and the vast distance to Berlin/Moscow. There is a transfer cost, for each province a packet of supplies/fuel goes through a small amount is 'used up', so the further you get form your supply base, the more supplies/fuel you need to pump into the system (production), and the better your infrastructure needs to be, especially close to the point of origin (capital/port). Seaborne supply is significantly more efficient, and setting up convoys from as close to your capital as possible, to deliver supplies as close to the front as possible, even if the territory is contiguous, can help alleviate shortages, and save on production.
 
Hello again Rover53. Maybe I am misreading, but are you saying Supplies do transfer through Puppets. Puppets only introduce a short delay for the Supplies to catch up?

And resources cannot go thru a puppet? So for example, if I had puppeted Yugo and Bulgaria. If I needed Resources from Greece, I would have to use Convoys? They would not move thru Yugo or Bulgaria on land?

Thanks again
 
Poopfaust said:
Hello again Rover53. Maybe I am misreading, but are you saying Supplies do transfer through Puppets. Puppets only introduce a short delay for the Supplies to catch up?

And resources cannot go thru a puppet? So for example, if I had puppeted Yugo and Bulgaria. If I needed Resources from Greece, I would have to use Convoys? They would not move thru Yugo or Bulgaria on land?

Thanks again
Click to expand...
No, neither supplies nor resources go through puppets. What I meant to say is that your troops won't be out of supply in the territory of your puppet because your puppet's network will be supplying them from your puppet's capital. There is no movement of supplies between your network and your puppet's network. The only thing that happens to compensate is that the game deducts the amount of supplies you used in allied territory from your stockpile and adds it to the appropriate ally's stockpile. This happens entirely off-map. (If this wasn't the case it would be easy to exploit the system, posting your whole army inside a puppet's territory during peacetime to save on supply production.)

If you puppet Yugoslavia, and then attack Greece from Yugo, you will have to convoy/fly in supplies before your troops run out. (Each unit has it's own small stockpile. If a unit was fully supplied, for example right before an unopposed amphibious landing, it can go 15 days, with no fighting, before it is entirely out of supplies. (it used to be 30 days in FTM)

It's my pleasure.
 
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The problem with supply via your puppet is that the movement of the supplies is dependent on your puppet's supply techs, not yours. No matter how well you research them, it doesn't affect your units at the front on the other side of that puppet. In previous versions (original game and Semper Fi expansion) your supply network was merged with your puppet's if they were contiguous, so your puppet's army was supplied from your own capital, but the movement of supplied through that puppet was still dependent on their techs, not yours. Not positive, but that merging of supply systems may still be true.

As said, upgrading infrastructure in the East is a priority for Germany, because you can't supply the massive army needed to defeat the Soviets over the long distances involved through the mediocre infrastructure. There is a tech under the Theory research tab to reduce the amount of supply "eaten" by each province along the way, and another tech to increase the amount of supply that can flow through each province, but the largest effect will be the infrastructure of the individual provinces. If I'm playing Germany, I try to build at least 10-20 additional factories (IC) starting in January 1936, because it will boost my Mechanical Practical values to make Infrastructure upgrades faster and a lot more affordable. The cost and production time of the IC in 1936 will be just about exactly offset by the additional production that they allow in 1937-39, so they're essentially "free" in that respect, and then you have them for the rest of the war. Work on upgrading infrastructure "highways" where your supplies are running, rather than spamming infrastructure at random, because the latter is ridiculously expensive for no additional gain.
 
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Kovax said:
The problem with supply via your puppet is that the movement of the supplies is dependent on your puppet's supply techs, not yours. No matter how well you research them, it doesn't affect your units at the front on the other side of that puppet. In previous versions (original game and Semper Fi expansion) your supply network was merged with your puppet's if they were contiguous, so your puppet's army was supplied from your own capital, but the movement of supplied through that puppet was still dependent on their techs, not yours. Not positive, but that merging of supply systems may still be true.
Click to expand...
I was wrong. You're right. I opened the game to check, and it's still like this in TFH. Supplies in a puppet are different from supplies in an allied nation (which is a system that was fresher in my mind), I assumed it was similar. The puppet is essentially part of your supply system, but you can't improve infrastructure, and the throughput per infra-level and supply tax depend on your puppet's techs, not yours. It's still a bad deal supply-wise and it's not advisable to have a sizeable force operating on the other side of a puppet with no alternative avenue of supplies.

I apologise for this oversight.
 
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