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Grandpa Maur

Major
Dec 9, 2002
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Do you guys know who invented it?

I know! Xenophont! :D

I recently read Anabasis and there are two quite interesting fragments.

One is a situation where their big hoplite square has to pass a narrow ravine/pass/passage and it ends in a bit of confusion stampede chaos and losses.

The next day Xenopont says: hey guys let us instead of big formation use locho(ses?), about <500 strong and arrange them in this formation (proceeds to describe in detail what is basically checkerboard arrangement), and so we (or rather their lochomasomething, uh, commanderrs) will be able to move sideways, wait, support each others, etc, etc, basically maniple system.

Hmmm, curious, isn't it? Xenophont in particular seems quite inventive - despite not having reputation of brilliant commander (not sure why). But in general the trek was done by quite good troops.

And it sheds additional light on the perennial myth of hoplite unflexibility...

Not sure if anyone else made the observation. I am not going to copyright it so feel free to use it in your thesis ;)
 
Hm. I annotated Anabasis a while back. I don't really remember this. But then again I wasn't really looking for it.

Given the gazillions of clashes, which one in particular are you referring to? Is this with the Colchians?
 
Hm. I annotated Anabasis a while back. I don't really remember this. But then again I wasn't really looking for it.

Given the gazillions of clashes, which one in particular are you referring to? Is this with the Colchians?
It was pretty early in the katabasis (;) ), so not them, don't think so*. I already returned the book, but let me say this: i'll borrow it next time i'll be there and then will provide more details.
Hm. I annotated Anabasis a while back. I don't really remember this. But then again I wasn't really looking for it.

Given the gazillions of clashes, which one in particular are you referring to? Is this with the Colchians?
*Can't remember Colchians tbh, but it was even before that episode with heavy snowfall, so way before the turn leftward and i think before Armenia.
 
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It was pretty early in the katabasis (;) ), so not them, don't think so*. I already returned the book, but let me say this: i'll borrow it next time i'll be there and then will provide more details.

*Can't remember Colchians tbh, but it was even before that episode with heavy snowfall, so way before the turn leftward and i think before Armenia.

Colchians is the passage in Anabasis 4.8.10. That is after Armenia, on the beginning of the turn left.

The heavy snowfall is earlier, at the Teleboas River. Would your episode be at the Carduchi Mountains then? There'a hints about being organized in separated files in 4.2.11 and 4.3.17 but seems a bit unclear (at least in this translation).

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It's too late today but tomorrow i will try to reborrow the book and find the passages.

Nice map. Had very similar one in mine, though, interestingly, i think the route was slightly different. Also shoudln't Kotyora, Trapezus etc be Estados Griegos too?

Meanwhile let me describe my other impresdion, which while not nearly as edgy, was kind of illuminating. It concerns example of the usual wisdom of military being outgrowth of social envirinment and not abstract need or invention, or, more precisely, kind of dialectic synthesis.

When, very early, they go through one hill after another, there is passage where there is some confusion, the hoplites take losses under skirmisher missilles, and in general there is much sadness.

In the evening, Xenophont comes up with obvious solution (here we have abstract invention) - we need our own, preferably better, missile troops.

And here is the social environment outgrowth - Xenophont says - we have some Rhodians in our troop - they are famous for their sling ability - let them make slings and bullets and act as our skirmishers.

And so they did and it was great success.

Anyway, tomorrow, the book and ”acies triplex” passage.
 
Took a bit longer than i hoped but here it is: book three, chapter four, about 2 pages in, starting with ”Afterwards, Greeks came to the conclusion that square is a bad formation when the enemy is following them”.

What follows is a description of using independent lochoses(?), pentekostyses(?) and enomotiae(wth greek plurals?) to maneuver as tactical needs demand. The description is fairly short but if you actually analyse it it's clear it means mutually supporting maneuver units very unlike to phalanx like line and more alike to how we imagine romans.

I mean, the passages about flanks widening and narrowing, moving units to fill in the centre, and units able to maneuver and support each other when there is a need.

Interestingly, i remembered wrong about it being Xenophont idea, but! Last chapter of book four has Xenophont arguing for, while not necessarily checkered, definitely not line battle formation instead something of a independent lochos system, which is imo significant because it is pitched battle and not fighting retreat.

Btw, the banter between Xenophont and Chejrisophos at the end of chapter six of book four whether Spartans or Athenians are better for stealth operations devolving on musing who are better thieves due to upbringing is truly hilarious :D
 
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