Fixes in the map shape needed for the big Europe patch

[Mic199]

The patch at the end of the year will focus on France, Italy, the Low Countries and the Balkans. Probably we will see a lot of new provinces added, but, with the current focus on bugfixes, I hope the patch will also fix a couple of issues with the actual shape on the map. I wanted to point out some of these issues, starting with the area that is the aim of the patch, and then pointing to some other map shape related issues. Usually, these are not addressed in the patches, and I can understand why. For adding provinces one only need to edit the province map, but for the map shape, one also need to change the heightmap (and possible rivers and trees maps), making it quite some more work. However, I hope the next patch is finally the moment to tackle these problems. And then it would be nice to also tackle the issues outside the Brest-Istanbul line, since they where not fixed in the patches that did cover their respective regions.

NB: for all screenshots, ignore the flags

Areas within the patch aim:

Spoiler: Netherlands

The Netherlands is by far the region in the worst shape, when it comes to the shape of the map. One issue is that there was some land reclaimed from the sea between 1444 and 1821. Since this cannot really be represented in game, the devs will have to pick a date in between to base the map on. Unfortunately, the current setup is the Netherlands between 1930 and 1936, including the Wieringermeerpolder and excluding the Noordooostpolder . For reference, the current map looks like this:

Picking a map to base the game on is, of course, mostly dependent on whether maps of the time period are available. I would suggest using the following map, which shows the Netherlands between 1715 and 1785:

I imagine it is very hard to get all the little details in the game, given the resolution of the eu4 map, but I hope the devs will try to improve the region to the maximum. While the entire country needs an overhaul, I want to point out 3 areas in particular, which definitely need to be improved

Spoiler: Zeeland

The province of Zeeland should be an island province. Historically, to lay claim to Zeeland, fleets have been build and sea battles have been fought. See for example the Battle of Zierikzee. It probably won't fit to place all the island of Zeeland on the map. But, lets have a look at a map of Zeeland to see what is possible:

I would follow the same division as shown here, northern islands (SchouwenDuiveland) (1+2), Walcheren (6) and Beveland (8). I fear including the other islands as well would be a bit too crowded. Looking back at the current setup of the Netherlands, there seem to be 2 peninsulas already, basically corresponding to Beveland and Schouwenduiveland. Adding some sea between these and the Breda province would already be perfect. Walcheren, despite hosting the city of Middelburg (one of the chambers of the Dutch East India Company) is mostly sea in the current setup. No Netherlands thread is complete without reclaiming some land from the sea, and adding the Walcheren Island does exactly that.

Spoiler: North-North Holland (North of the Amsterdam province)

There is no denying the current shape of the Amsterdam province is based on the contemporary province of North Holland, shown below:

Comparing this to the 1715 map I showed, It might be quite easy to change to a look more suited to the EU4 timeline. The main difference is the added land all the way at the top, corresponding to the Wieringmeerpolder I mentioned before. By simply cutting the upper part of the province, using the old map as overlay, the devs can already get that EU4 look.

Spoiler: Wadden islands

The wadden are the islands in the north of the Netherlands. Currently, there are 3 on the map, 2 of which seem to correspond to actual islands. I think it might actually be possible to include all of the islands. But, already adding a few will really change the look of the Netherlands. Since these islands are a very distinct feature of the Netherlands, they can really help making the in-game country look realistic.

Spoiler: Istria

From this thread by @Trytols

A suggestion for a gulf of Venice shape based on HOI 4:

I really don't have much too add to it, other than that I completely agree this needs to be in EU4

Spoiler: Lefkada

In his very nice Balkan thread , @Mingmung proposes to create a province out of Zakynthos, Cephalonia and Lefkada. This would be a very good addition, as it was the final stronghold of the Despotate of Epirus. However, the province would not work as an island, because in-game Lefkada is connected to mainland Greece.

Simply removing 1 or 2 pixels would already solve this and make Lefkada into the island that it actually is.

Spoiler: Venice

Venice.. By, now I am so used to the shape I don't even notice any more how wrong and ugly it really is. I understand why it is presented as an island, and I don't think that should change all that much in the update. But, I hope the devs will consider doing something about that huge zit in the gulf of Venice. Unfortunately, I am unable to come up with a suggestion that both keep the province as an island and clickable, while also making it more realistic. Anyways, here are the maps of EU4 and the picture in reality, as inspiration

Other areas

Spoiler: Pityusic Islands (Ibiza)

Since the 1.28 patch the Pityusic Islands are their own province, represented by Ibiza and Formentera. The problem is that I am having trouble clicking the province. I wonder if Ibiza can get the "Malta treatment", making it a little bit bigger, while retaining, or improving, the shape. Probably, Mallorca and Minorca will have to be scaled as well to not make the map too much out of proportion. This would hopefully also solve the weird format where the harbor of the province is the 3 pixels (yes, I counted ) that represent Formentera.

Spoiler: ABC islands (Curacao)

I mentioned it already in one of my previous posts, the province that is called Curacao is actually on the island of Aruba. I suggested there to rename the province to Aruba. But since this post is about map changes, I will suggest making Curacao the visually enhanced island of the province, instead of Aruba. The Aruba island can then be replaced by its original shape (can still be found in rivers.bmp ), while the Curacao island is replaced by a bigger version of the island. Please don't use the current generic blob island, but base something of the actual shape of Curacao.

Spoiler: The Rhins of Galloway (Ayrshire Province)

As already pointed out by @gronak in this thread, there seems to be a fantasy island in Scotland. This pretty much corresponds to the Mull of Galloway, expect for the fact that it should not be an island. I was even wandering if it was perhaps an island in the EU4 timeline. But, I have not been able to find anything pointing in that direction. In fact, it one of the landmarks mentioned in Ptolemy's Geography, as "Novantarum Penninsula" (in 150 AD). Restoring the Rhins of Galloway will be very easy, it just needs 2 pixels to merge the island with the mainland.

Spoiler: Chagos

Lastly, I want to show the Chagos Archipelago, which I think is one of the most ugly, generic looking provinces in EU4.

I hope the province can be redone to look like either the Chagos Bank, or some version of the Diago Garcia atoll

@neondt @DDRJake Would it be possible to have some map refinement in 1.29?

 

[Mic199]

Quick edit: adding and improving some pictures

 

[Sanguine Caesar]

I also have some edits for Croatia, specifically the Dalmatian Islands and the shapes of the provinces of Zagreb, Varasd, and Slavonia.

Now in the current version, as has been the case for a while, the shapes of Croatian provinces leaves much to be desired, and are quite out of shape. This is understandable though, as many of them are still the same as in the earliest versions of the game, back when square Memel was a thing. But as the attention to detail has increased over time, I think this should be fixed in a coming patch. I will use the following two images which I've been working on editing as part of my series of Balkan suggestions to explain this. Now some provinces have been split in half (specifically Krain, Lika, and Dalmatia), but that doesn't really affect how those provinces should look all that much, as they are literally just split into two each.

Spoiler: Croatian Provinces in 1.28

Spoiler: Corrected Croatian Provinces

Now what I've done here was bring the Bosnian borders with Dalmatia and Ragusa a bit closer to the water. I've also made the Dalmatian Islands a bit more defined and got rid of that weird triangular sort of peninsula thing that juts out of the province as it is now. I have also fixed the borders of Slavonia, Varasd, and Zagreb to more closely follow the Sava, Drava, and Mur rivers as they do in reality. I have also gotten rid of the part of Varasd which juts out towards Krain, and overall made the borders between Austria and Hungary/Croatia to be a bit more accurate. I have also made the Bay of Kotor a bit more defined over by Ragusa. Also, the city of Rijeka/Fiume should not be part of the Lika province or whichever province you want to put there, as the city was actually under Austrian control for essentially the entirety of the game's time frame.

I mostly based this off of maps of Royal Counties in Croatia and Hungary, as well as maps of the Habsburg Kingdom of Dalmatia, and I'll gladly provide them if it would help to understand me better, but I think the pictures should do a pretty good job I think.

 

[Em Ay Ef]

View attachment 448474

One thing that comes to mind, even though it doesn't do anything to alleviate the eyesore shape of Venice, is that we should have Treviso border Ferrara. That port in Verona makes even less sense than the shape of the island.

 

[Mic199]

One thing that comes to mind, even though it doesn't do anything to alleviate the eyesore shape of Venice, is that we should have Treviso border Ferrara. That port in Verona makes even less sense than the shape of the island.

Very true

 

[Mingmung]

I fully support this.

The Pomeranian islands should be looked at, too.

 

[jrgen3]

I fully support this.

The Pomeranian islands should be looked at, too.

You mean actually making them islands?

 

[jrgen3]

If I may, I have a couple of suggestions as well:

• The Crozon Peninsula in Brittany should be a peninsula, not an island.
• Make the Oslo Fjord more shaped like a swan. It definitely doesn't look like the Oslo Fjord now.
• Make an opening on the north side of the Curonian Spit.
• I would also make an opening in the Vistula Spit, as it had one for most of the game's time frame. The current one was made by a flood some 50-100 years after the game's start, but even before that, the massive amounts of water from the Nogat branch of the Vistula Delta must have gone somewhere. The Vistula Lagoon is not big enough to hold a hundred years' worth of water from a big river.
• More or less all of the lakes in Europe are in the wrong place, or are horribly misshaped (The Caspian Sea looks like it has been drawn in a different map projection than the rest of the map for example).