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CK3 Dev Diary #38 - Legacy Showcase

Greetings! It’s been a while since the Dev Diary about Dynasties, and we’re thinking that you might be interested in what the other Dynasty Legacies have in store. That way you have some time to plan which Legacies you’d like to play with first, and perhaps even theorycraft a bit!

As mentioned in the Dynasty Dev Diary, you have to carefully choose between using your powers as Dynast or saving up for Legacies (or strike a careful balance). Unlocking Legacies are a very long-term goal, but can radically alter the way you play the game. Because Legacies are permanent, the bonuses they convery are generally not as powerful as those you get from Lifestyles - on the other hand you can count on them for the rest of the game! And they apply to every member of your dynasty.

Depending on how you play, you’ll unlock varying amounts of Legacies each game. If you carefully plan every child’s marriage it’s possible to complete several tracks - but even so, the first one you choose is usually the one that will truly define your Dynasty, as you struggle your way to the top!

The cost of Legacies is static, and each step in a track gets progressively more expensive. The first step costs 1000 renown, and the last one costs 5000. While most tend to unlock one full track before moving on (as the bonuses get progressively more powerful) it’s a legitimate strategy to pick up some of the cheaper ones first.

Let’s briefly go through each track.

Warfare
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The Warfare legacies mold your Dynasty members into competent knights and powerful commanders. The ideal choice for a true warmonger, or someone who wants to stalwartly defend their rightful lands.

Personally, I find that the Warfare Legacy track does really well when playing in an area where you’re likely to get attacked, such as when playing Tribal, or in the crossroads between India and the Middle East.

The first Legacy, House of Warriors, makes every Dynasty member have additional +2 Prowess skill, as well as increasing the effectiveness of Knights by 15% for landed members. A very powerful early-game Legacy, and the only one that objectively increases your military might.

Generational Belligerence reduces the cost of going to war by 20%, primarily making conquest and third-party Claim wars easier to declare (warring for your own Claims is always cheap, but declaring wars for someone else’s is expensive). A good Legacy for those that want to grow their realm early.

Squire Traditions makes all members gain 10% more Martial lifestyle experience. You’ll see similar bonuses in other trees for other Lifestyles. All of these are generally great to have, and stack with the bonuses you get from education.

Inherited Tactics is a fantastic Legacy for winning wars, as it gives your dynasty members +5 Advantage while leading armies. As you’ll eventually experience, Advantage is the main deciding factor in wars. Having an extra +5 is truly huge, but of course - your enemies could always recruit your family members and use them as commanders against you…

Finally, the Private Army Legacy unlocks an additional slot for Men-at-Arms. This is not to be underestimated, as there are no other sources of additional Men-at-Arms slots except for increasing your tier. Additionally, it also gives you access to the ‘House Guard’ regiment - a special regiment of Heavy Infantry MaA that is free, but takes up one MaA slot and can’t have its size increased. This makes even a lowly Count of your Dynasty able to field quite a formidable force, while you as a mighty Emperor might instead opt to use the extra MaA slot for an additional unit of Armored Horsemen!

Law
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The Law legacies focus on stability and consolidation, making members of your Dynasty exceptionally good vassals and reducing the chance of revolts.

I personally enjoy using these Legacies when running a larger realm, especially one containing multiple Cultures. I usually go for it when playing a vassal in the Holy Roman Empire or the Seljuk Empire, as the subjects you have are quite diverse.

The first Legacy, Mostly Fair, increases popular opinion in your domain by 5. This is quite powerful, and even offsets the entire penalty for being the wrong culture in the same culture group. A great Legacy to have if your domain is mostly made up of other cultures or faiths.

Faithful Magistrates increases passive Control Growth by 0.2/month in your entire Domain. Getting control up after conquest or revocation is a challenge, and your Marshal can only be assigned to one County at a time. This also makes your Dynasty members excellent vassal candidates for newly conquered lands.

Power and Prosperity boosts Stewardship lifestyle experience by 10%.

Delegated Authority increases your Powerful Vassal’s opinion of you by 5, which isn’t insignificant seeing how hard they can be to please. Especially when you’re an Emperor, and simply can’t have all of your Powerful Vassals on the Council…

Finally, Home Estates increases your Domain Limit by 1, which is a fantastic bonus to have - especially if you’re not playing a line of high-stewardship characters. This means that it’s easier to preserve your domain throughout the generations.

Guile
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The Guile Legacies are optimal for those that want to rule as dreaded tyrants, and/or murder their way to the top.

If I know that keeping my realm together peacefully isn’t an option, then this is what I’d pick. The increase in Dread gain is invaluable when starting off, especially if I need to get my plans going quickly. In Spain, for example, there’s just no time to waste in uniting the lands, so ruling through fear while removing my brothers one-by-one is a legitimately good way to play. Generally, I’d avoid picking these Legacies if I was planning to have a lot of Dynastic vassals, as some legacies can be double-edged...

The first Legacy, Ominous Reputation, increases Dread gain by 20%, a fantastic starting Legacy when you want to rule through fear throughout the generations.

Long Reach increases Hostile Scheme Success Chance by 10%, which is excellent as it applies not only to murders, but to Hook Fabrication, Abduction and all other hostile schemes too. It is a double edged sword though, if your kinsmen want to see you dead…

Natural Schemers boosts Intrigue lifestyle experience by 10%.

Venial makes Tyranny decay 20% faster, which is great in combination with Dread for quickly reorganizing your realm through revocations and retractions.

Finally, the Family Connections legacy gives each Dynasty member a major chance of avoiding one successful murder scheme targeting them. When playing as a Dreadful ruler, being murdered is really the only constant threat hanging above your head. It’s calming to know that you have at least some protection, but remember, your devious brother will have the same...

Blood
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The Blood legacies were briefly covered in the previous Dev Diary, and remain my personal favorites. They affect the inheritance of traits, and can even make your Dynasty known for showing certain traits!

This legacy track is optimal for those wanting to play the breeding game, trying to get the best possible rulers to succeed them.

Noble Veins has two bonuses; firstly it improves the chance of inheriting good congenital traits by 30%, and then it adds 30% to the (admittedly small) chance for new good genetic traits to randomly appear. Quite a good starting Legacy, allowing you to kickstart the breeding game.

Convergent Blood increases the chance of reinforcing genetic traits by 30%. This means that the offspring of a character with the first level strength genetic trait would have that much more chance of getting the second level genetic strength trait, and so on. Naturally, this chance is still mostly dependent on both parents having the traits.

Resilient Bloodline is much like Noble Veins, but it reduces the chance of bad genetic traits appearing randomly or propagating, also by 30%.

Architected Ancestry allows you to select one of the following traits to more commonly appear among your Dynasty Members: Beauty (Tier 1), Physique (Tier 1), Intelligence (Tier 1), Fecund (50% more fertility), Giant, Dwarf, Scaly or Albino. This one is fantastic for roleplaying, as having a dynasty of, for example, Giants makes for a very interesting story. Historically there were definitely families known for sharing a specific ‘trait’, flattering or not, this legacy represents that. The chance for each newborn child to get the trait is roughly ~2%, so you’ll still have to put in some work if you want the trait to be truly common.

Octogenarians increase Life Expectancy by 5 years. Unlike a flat health boost, this also makes women able to carry children for 5 more years, and makes character portraits visually age slower.

Erudition
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The Erudition legacies are more powerful than they might seem at a glance, with a strong focus on piety and the clergy - but the final legacy is possibly the strongest of them all, if you keep a skilled council.

I personally enjoy the Erudition legacies when playing in the middle of a vast Feudal sphere, such as the HRE or anywhere in India, as the guests you get are much more vital to your expansion than in Clan/Tribal areas like the Middle East or Africa.

Vibrant Court increases your Court and Guest opinion by +10, and makes your Court attract better Guests. The opinion is very useful, as it makes your court less likely to scheme against you, but the true power of this legacy lies in the attraction of better guests. When choosing where to travel, Claimants and exceptionally good commanders/knights are significantly more likely to visit you, should you be within their range. If you plan to expand early using foreign Claimants, this is the legacy for you.

Ordained Rulership increases your Piety gain by 10%, providing one of the few sources of unconditional Piety increase in the game. This is obviously a great legacy if you’re aiming for creating your own Faith, or just want the Pope to love your Dynasty.

Treasured Knowledge boosts learning lifestyle experience by 10%.

True Believers give your Dynasty a +5 Clergy opinion, which will help you earn the favor of both realm priest and Head of Faith. If you’re of a faith with no Clergy, you will instead gain a +3 flat increase in opinion for characters of your faith.

Bureaucrats increase the base progress and impact from Councillor skill on Council Tasks by 10%. Yes, this means that every single Council task is 10% faster. Of course, this effect is more useful the more skilled your council is - but with the better guests attracted by Vibrant Court you’ll rarely find yourself without suitable candidates!

Glory
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The Glory legacies are all about the name of your dynasty, and how far you can get it to travel across the known world. Prestige and opinion, fame and glory!

Naturally, this is a great track for those in need of prestige - which includes all Tribal rulers. This is not to say that the legacies aren’t useful for others, as they make it easier to arrange beneficial marriages and get the aid you need.

Desirable Match increases marriage acceptance by 30. Now, how much is that really? There are many factors that determine the acceptance of a marriage, but having an extra 30 essentially means that you’re able to marry one step above your current position (marrying the child of a Duke as a Count, for example). Now, this truly shines when combined with the Gallantry Lifestyle Tree Perk, for a total of 80 extra acceptance… Essentially a must-have for anyone planning to play an extended marriage game.

Renowned Name increases Prestige gain by 10%, providing one of the few sources of unconditional Prestige increase in the game. You can never have too much prestige, as it helps both with increasing your Level of Fame (opinion) and as a resource for declaring war!

Earning Respect boosts diplomacy lifestyle experience by 10%.

Assertive Rulers reduces the Short Reign penalty by 20%, providing a much needed boost to stability on succession.

Righteousness increases general opinion by 10, yes, that’s with everyone. A massively helpful legacy for keeping your realm faction-free! Essentially, a Dynasty with a completed Glory legacy track will have no troubles keeping even large realms together.

Kin
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Finally, the Kin legacies are tailored for those that want a truly vast Dynasty, where members help each other and rarely quarrel.

Now, there’s no better legacy for those that want a big realm where most vassals are of your own Dynasty. Your kin will tend to be well educated, and keeping the peace is easier when you can use schemes such as Sway or Befriend (or even Seduce…) against your kin with ease. I really enjoy this legacy track when playing a polygamous faith, for example when playing as a Clan ruler in the Middle East, as then you’re motivated to keep a large dynasty regardless.

Bounteous Loins increase fertility by 10% for your entire Dynasty, this means that it’s much easier to get over the early-game ‘hump’ where you’re establishing your dynasty, as well as make your dynasty larger in the long run.

Studious Youth makes it much more likely for members of your dynasty to get good Education traits, offsetting the need for finding a high-learning guardian.

Constant Care increases spousal opinion by +10, and lowers the chance of complications during pregnancy. Again, in the long run this means that your Dynasty will grow much larger than those without these legacies.

Close Bonds gives a Dynasty opinion bonus of +5, which means that everyone in the entire dynasty likes each other much more than they already do (essentially doubling the bonus). It also provides one of the most fun bonuses of any legacy; 30% increased success chance of Personal Schemes against Dynasty Members. This means every personal scheme, from Sway to Elope. Use with care...

Graceful Aging makes it so that your Dynasty members do NOT lose prowess with age. Normally, older characters lose prowess with time, making a once-great knight easily bestable by a young upstart in personal combat. It also gives Dynasty members a chance to randomly gain skills when growing older, making the elder members of the dynasty truly wise, and very useful as commanders, knights and councillors!

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That’s it for this Dev Diary! I hope you have fun figuring out what you want to go for first!
 
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I don't see any enjoyment here. If you want to have a dynasty of strong genius ubermensch, it's more rewarding to do that with marriage and not by getting a boost after clicking on an icon. As for someone who find enjoyment in cheat, I don't judge but it's better to not impose it to everyone.

That's why the best thing is to disable it for those who don't want that.

How is it cheating if it's a core game mechanic? Honestly don't understand your point at all?

Besides, if you don't want to use them then don't no one is going to force you to use them.
 
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Or you can just don't use this legacy. You can play with 6 others legacies.

Sure but if it's better if disabled for psychological reasons. I don't want to be tempted to click on it (even if I know it's wrong) and I don't want to feel myself left behind because of this abstention.

If Paradox keeps it for everyone, it's okay but I'm sure it will reduce enjoyment for some players.
 
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Guys, after playing in CKII with some artifacts, books, weapons, etc, you are not satisfied with such low bonuses in legacies? About "Blood" legacy. In real life, rich and powerful people have more beatiful spouses, than a average people. Theirs kids are also beatiful and so on... what are you talking about... its genetics.
 
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I'd make a meme including Pepe the frog, swastikas and a trojan horse to explain this best, I guess. It's a bad idea, the end.

The notion that two tall people are more likely to produce a tall child isn't exactly Hitler-levels of eugenics, it's the most basic of genetics knowledge.
 
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Sure but if it's better if disabled for psychological reasons. I don't want to be tempted to click on it (even if I know it's wrong) and I don't want to feel myself left behind because of this abstention.

This sounds like a you problem rather than a problem the Devs have to solve...

Sorry I don't mean to be rude but it's simple self control. Also even if you do use it, you might enjoy it!
 
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About "Blood" legacy. In real life, rich and powerful people have more beatiful spouses, than a average people. Theirs kids are also beatiful and so on... what are you talking about... its genetics.

That's not the point. The point is that a person with the right legacy is more likely to pass on a beneficial trait than someone without that legacy, even with the same spouse. This is in fact the opposite of real-world genetics, because the genes you pass on are based on your DNA and not the reputation of your extended family. :D
 
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I don't see any enjoyment here. If you want to have a dynasty of strong genius ubermensch, it's more rewarding to do that with marriage and not by getting a boost after clicking on an icon.

I think you may have misunderstood how the legacy works. It doesn't give you any traits - you can't click on an icon and become smarter. :D What it does is make it more likely to pass on beneficial traits. You still have to impregnate a woman with a congenital trait (or have it yourself). What the legacy does is increase the chance of it being passed along, that's all.
 
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That's not the point. The point is that a person with the right legacy is more likely to pass on a beneficial trait than someone without that legacy, even with the same spouse. This is in fact the opposite of real-world genetics, because the genes you pass on are based on your DNA and not the reputation of your extended family. :D
Maybe we can think about this like a "Selection". If someone knows the history of his beatiful girlfriends families health issues... for example, that in her family a lot of her relatives had cancer, or in the family of that someone the history of heart failures... Do they need to get married and have children, or think about breaking up and find another person.
 
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I think you may have misunderstood how the legacy works. It doesn't give you any traits - you can't click on an icon and become smarter. :D What it does is make it more likely to pass on beneficial traits. You still have to impregnate a woman with a congenital trait (or have it yourself). What the legacy does is increase the chance of it being passed along, that's all.

It does also increase the chances of a trait appearing randomly as well.

Noble Veins has two bonuses; firstly it improves the chance of inheriting good congenital traits by 30%, and then it adds 30% to the (admittedly small) chance for new good genetic traits to randomly appear. Quite a good starting Legacy, allowing you to kickstart the breeding game.
 
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Maybe we can think about this like a "Selection". If someone knows the history of his beatiful girlfriends families health issues... for example, that in her family a lot of her relatives had cancer, or in the family of that someone the history of heart failures... Do they need to get married and have children, or think about breaking up and find another person.

You're still focusing on persons. That doesn't work, because this legacy works the same for all persons. It is not in any way tied to your partner, or partner choice.
 
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It does also increase the chances of a trait appearing randomly as well.

It does, yet the same thing applies there: it is universal for all your partners, and so has nothing to do with partner selection. :)
 
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Okay, then i will say it straight. I do not mind it, even if it some kind of artificial. I think, that it can be done in the game like CKIII. It is genetics, and not all is discovered in this area.
 
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Okay, then i will say it straight. I do not mind it, even if it some kind of artificial. I think, that it can be done in the game like CKIII.
I agree 100%. I really like these legacies and will probably enjoy playing with them, as I loved the bloodline game in CK2 and imagine I will love the breeding game in CK3 as well. Realism be damned, I'll happily trade some of it for such an enjoyable mechanic! :)


It is genetics, and not all is discovered in this area.
I think we can say that we have discovered that the reputation of our extended family does not affect which genes we pass on, heh. :)

But really, who cares? I don't. I see the legacies as an explanation of how people in the world see the members of a dynasty, and not as factual scientific explanations of cause and effect. If a legacy increases congenital traits, then people in the world see members of that dynasty as on average more well-formed and intelligent than others. They do not know why, and will never be able to know why. That's not the most important part anyway. :)
 
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How is it cheating if it's a core game mechanic? Honestly don't understand your point at all?

I don't think that @Trinita132 was calling the legacies cheats, I think he was trying to make a point. Sort of like "I'm not opposed to powerful things, in fact I'm so ok with them that I sometimes enjoy cheating, so my objection is based on reasoned deliberation and not some irrational reaction."
 
Let me explain the difference- the way it works, one is not building up a reputation for being a specially pretty (etc.) dynasty.
By the way the legacy works, granting a higher chance to pass down genetic traits, one is effectively not building a reputation, but researching techniques to selectively pass down gene material.

I see the legacies as an explanation of how people in the world see the members of a dynasty
This is not the case with blood, regardless: You don't get an opinion bonus for being of a famously pretty family only, you get a higher chance to be pretty- which will affect the way people look at you, not the reputation (this is included in various other legacies granting opinion boni for tis and tat).

In real life, rich and powerful people have more beatiful spouses, than a average people
And better plastic surgeons- on a more serious note I refer to what I said above about a difference between selective breeding (known to men for ages) and selectively passing down recessive genes (we're still working on it in the lab, so to say)
 
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Let me explain the difference- the way it works, one is not building up a reputation for being a specially pretty (etc.) dynasty.
By the way the legacy works, granting a higher chance to pass down genetic traits, one is effectively not building a reputation, but researching techniques to selectively pass down gene material.


This is not the case with blood, regardless: You don't get an opinion bonus for being of a famously pretty family only, you get a higher chance to be pretty- which will affect the way people look at you, not the reputation (this is included in various other legacies granting opinion boni for tis and tat).

I'm aware. If you go back a bit in this thread you'll find a number of posts by me arguing this very same point. :) I was just spitballing on how people in the world would see the dynasty. For example, I once had a co-worker who had a family where everyone was tall. His 13 year old daughter was well over six feet. I thought of them as a family of tall people.

I did think about including a "disclaimer" in my post that you replied to where I explained that I wasn't talking about legacies in actual game-technical terms, or any game-technical effects like opinion bonuses and so on. I decided not to, but perhaps that was an unwise decision I made. :)
 
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Will there be culture dependent legacies in the future or the ability to add them by mods? It would be great to have hibrid legacies or legacies specific to things that cultures considered great or were common to their dinasties, like giving more relevance to their own women even if their culture doesn't allow that to common women (think Ermessenda of Carcassone (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ermesinde_of_Carcassonne), or a special khanate bloodline where the family decides who is the family head?
 
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Will there be culture dependent legacies in the future or the ability to add them by mods? It would be great to have hibrid legacies or legacies specific to things that cultures considered great or were common to their dinasties, like giving more relevance to their own women even if their culture doesn't allow that to common women (think Ermessenda of Carcassone (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ermesinde_of_Carcassonne), or a special khanate bloodline where the family decides who is the family head?

I do want their to be a system similar to LB where specific actions can result in specific perks. It was a ton of fun trying to accomplish those. It was like a Steam achievement but with an in-game reward. But I don't think they will engage in cultural legacies. I think culture is its own separate system - for example culture does seem to have an impact on your technology tree.
 
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Does anyone know if the player can see the dynastic legacies or other AI dynasties?

If so, that ups the eugenics game a bit if you can concentrate marriages on dynasties that have taken the blood legacies.
 
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