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CK3 Dev Diary #34 - It’s all about appearances

Hello, I’m Nils and I’m the lead character artist on Crusader Kings III. We’ve already touched briefly on a lot of the features of the portrait system but in this Dev Diary I’m going to dive deeper into the intricacies of the system. It might get a bit technical at points - so bear with me. I personally think all this stuff is very cool but I'm also a gigantic nerd when it comes to these things.

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There’s going to be a lot of text in this Dev Diary, but really, when it comes down to it, it’s mostly there as an excuse to show off the art!

Characters are generated dynamically in the game using a DNA system that defines their looks - everything from mouth shape to body height is stored in this DNA. A DNA is made up of a number of genes. Each gene defines a certain feature. Crusader Kings II already does something similar, but in CKIII we have more than 10 times the amount of genes for every character and a lot of added complexity. The system itself is very flexible and it was up to me how to set it up to get as much visual variation out of it as possible.

Our predecessor, CK2, by necessity builds up characters from a limited number of facial features. There are x amount of noses combined with x amount of mouths and x amount of eyes and so on to make up a face. While this works well and gives a good amount of variation it still has some inherent limitations. What we’ve done in CKIII is to have a much more granular approach where we use many parameters to control each feature. So, for example, instead of just picking a nose (you shouldn’t pick your nose kids) out of a selection of pre-defined noses we store values for nose protrusion, nose height, nose length, nose nostril height, nose nostril width, nose ridge profile, nose ridge angle, nose ridge width, nose size, nose tip angle, nose tip protrusion, nose tip width, nose ridge definition and nose tip definition. In other words; if you’re into noses, or any other facial feature, this is the game for you.

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Some of the many faces (and noses!) of Crusader Kings III
As you can imagine, this gives us quite detailed control over the facial features of characters. And they can vary greatly depending on many factors, which I will try to cover here. Let’s start with ethnicity.

Like we’ve shown in other Dev Diaries already, the CKIII map covers a vast area of the world from Ireland in the west to modern day Mongolia in the east and from Arctic Norway in the north to Sub-Saharan Africa in the south. This big area is populated by groups of different ethnicities which we represent in the game. Due to the way that the character generating system is set up, we can use the same base assets for all different ethnicities and just script in different average values for the facial feature parameters. As an example, west african characters have, on average, darker skin, fuller lips and differently shaped noses than their european or asian counterparts, but they still use the exact same base model. This is good news for inheritance, which is the next subject I will discuss.

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A selection of characters of different ethnicities
Due to the fact that all characters use the same base model, we can easily create blends between multiple DNAs. Each character stores two sets of genes that we call dominant and recessive, respectively. (Disclaimer: Please note that the dominant and recessive genes in our system do not work exactly like in real life. We’re still dealing with an approximation of genetics. We haven’t fully replicated real world genetics. Yet.) When a baby is born it will inherit two versions of each gene - both of which will come randomly from either parent. As mentioned one of these genes will end up being dominant and the other one recessive based on a chance value (dominant genes from the parents have a higher chance of being inherited as dominant genes for the baby). The appearance of the newborn character is decided entirely by its dominant gene set. But the recessive genes are still there as a representation of genes carried down the generations. So when this new character gets to make its own babies they will have a chance of inheriting a gene from their grandparents, even though that gene might not have been visible on their parent.

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Inheritance in action. Top row parents and bottom row their children. If you look closely you should be able to spot the inherited features.
I hope you guys are still awake for the continuation of this Dev Diary. What does all this genetics mumbo-jumbo mean for you as a player? It means that inheritance has a much bigger impact on the appearance of a character in CKIII than than it does in CK2. Characters of different ethnicities that get down for the hanky panky will make babies that look like a blend between both parents, with some genes from further back in the family tree thrown into the mix. Of course, there’s still a fair amount of randomness in the system so we won’t get identical siblings unless they are, you know, identical twins.

Now, while we’re on the subject, let’s talk briefly about children and aging. This is the other huge factor in defining the appearance of a character: his or her age. The 3D system that we use gives us the possibility to have seamless aging and there’s a ton of things that are set up to take advantage of this. A newborn child will obviously be very tiny compared to when it’s all grown up. It’s adult facial features will be there already from birth but they are very toned down during early childhood to get gradually more pronounced as the character ages. When a character approaches their 30’s and 40’s their skin will get more rugged, age lines and wrinkles will start appearing in the face, and their hair turns grey. Once they enter old age their body will start sagging, posture will deteriorate, their ears and nose will get bigger and the jaw protrudes as they lose their teeth.

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Chieftain Somatu of Kevrola, from age 0 to 99

In addition to genetics and age, lifestyle choices and changes also impact a character’s appearance. Body types vary greatly from alarmingly thin victims of starvation to truly impressive bulks of some high nobility gluttons. Different levels of muscularity and fitness are also represented and tied to the “prowess” value in the game.

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Examples of different body types


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Like, every Christmas Holiday, ever


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I got ripped in five seconds!

There are a number of traits and conditions, genetic or otherwise, that have visual impact on the character portrait. Some examples of non-genetic ones are pregnancy, wounds, scars, lost arms, blindness and disfigurement. And some notable examples of genetic conditions are dwarfism, gigantism, albinism and hunchback.

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Genetic traits

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Dragoman

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You know how some people have names that just feel “right” for them?



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“You should see the other guy”

We have already discussed clothes in previous Dev Diaries so I won’t go into great detail about them. But I would like to show something I don’t think we’ve shown before. That is the barbershop feature which allows you to change clothes, head wear and hairstyle for your character:

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Barbershop
Even though the vast majority of characters have randomly generated appearances, there are some notable exceptions. The detailed setup of the DNA system allows us to design quite specific appearances where we want to. There are some historical starting characters in the game whose looks were based on how they are described in historical sources. For example William the Conqueror and Harold Godwineson of England. Of course, medieval sources are not always... perfectly reliable and the portraiture from the time not the most accurate (to put it mildly!) so we did have to do some guesswork and use a lot of artistic license. There are also a whole bunch of developer characters with appearances that match their real life counterparts. They’re lurking around various courts in the game. If you want to find some, a pro tip is to browse through the characters in modern day Sweden…

It is perfectly possible to mod DNAs as well as adding new ones, so if you feel like adding your own likeness or a medieval Abraham Lincoln to the game it is fairly easy to do so.

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Historical characters from the “Fate of England” in the 1066 start date. Guess who is who!
And finally, to end this on a more gruesome note, the last thing I’d like to show you is some diseases. As you all know, the middle ages were a time of ravaging epidemics and quick unexpected death from disease. And the game reflects that in quite a graphical way.

And if you don’t enjoy being disgusted - don’t worry - we have an option to turn off the worst looking diseases and replace them with something less nightmare-inducing.

WARNING: The following spoiler tags contain images that some viewers might find disturbing. Viewer discretion is advised.

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Don’t say I didn’t warn you
 
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This is what I thought you meant with "Sims" look. I didn't even know there was a Sims Medieval version and tbh the general style at least for the faces is fairly close.
....
Very different presentation though. Like if you look back at early DD's and take a look at how much they've improved on the backgrounds + scene lighting to make all the different regions stand out it's amazing. I'd personally love something grittier and more real but frankly it doesn't look bad to me.
Yes, the presentation is a little bit different than the Sims, fortunately. :)

Well, "Like the Sims," that's one thing. There's obviously a familiarity there, otherwise we wouldn't be making these comparisons. The question is whether they go above and beyond in realism. The shaders, lightning, sculpting... Everything about CK3's models look so more much realistic than what vanilla Sims games to date have offered that it's hard to concede that the difference is "marginal". You say, "If you compare them with similar lighting," etc, but that's just the point. Lighting, texturing, sculpting, all of that is a part of the process of 3D graphics work. All of it comes together to make the final piece. Take the lightning model from Sims 4 and apply it to CK3, and CK3's portraits would look much less real. However the same would be true if you did it for The Witcher.

(Also, which Sims game are these caps from? This doesn't look like Medieval's lighting, but those don't look like Sims 4 clothes. Not vanilla, at any rate. I want those clothes in my Sims 4 game...)

EDIT: You little sneak, those are Bannerlord caps, aren't they!
The images were taken from the Sims Medieval, the Sims 4 went to more simplified form which doesn't resemble CK3 much. But, well, it's still Sims. ;)
Although I agree that lighting, texturing, etc. have a direct impact at the final results, the point is how are these made. For example, you can have perfectly realistic lighting, perfectly realistic textures, realistic materials, etc. but with cartoon-style models the results will never be realistic. It's a sum of all the elements. In the case of CK3, the textures seems to be better (more towards the realism, to be precise), the lighting is different and more toned down, modelling is inclining towards the realism too (except hair, beards), but yet the result still has a cartoon-like feeling. That is what I was trying to illustrate on the comparison image - bringing the lighting and saturation to the, let's say, more realistic CK3 tone and compare it with the Sims characters. Just changing one element and keep the rest untouched.
I am not saying it's wrong, certainly not (as I have mentioned a few times before), just that there are similarities between CK3 and Sims (Medieval) portraits players are pointing to. Rightfully, in my opinion. If it's wrong or not... well, I will keep that on everybody's personal decision. :)

I personally really like the portraits. Yes the hair looks a bit unrealistic, but the faces and the clothes are indeed very realistic to me. For me the most important part of the game is genetics and portraits. I k ow for sure that paradox will improve the portraits, but they already look really good. Also wanted to add that medieval wasn’t as dirty and gray as it’s often portrayed. People actually tried to wear really bright clothes to look good and impress others, so the clothes in the game are realistic. Also the way those characters are portrayed makes them look alive, which adds a lot of fun to the gameplay in my opinion.
P.s. I think that paradox is avoiding the ruler designer topic, because it won’t be in the base game, however it will be in the first dlc or a flavor pack, and they don’t want to break the intrigue yet, and I guess they will only announce it, when they announce the dlcs. I think they already planned and started making some dlcs, as we will get them if we preorder ck3 royal edition on steam.
For me, it's not very realistic, and not just because of hair. But, I do like the portraits, too, so I do not consider it as a negative thing. But I admit if there is something that should be changed, it will be hair and beard style to less cartoony. :)
 
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I think this is an image of a greek duke but I could be wrong. It came up in a thread mostly annoyed at the orthodox bishop sharing the catholic look. It's possible it's not finished stuff so they wouldn't want to show it together with all the other ones.

Also if you missed this info you can thank the guy who used the "Saw this image" title to the thread which must be like the most reverse clickbait ever.
Ok thanks man yeah they totally need to change that look for the bishop, and the soldiers with the armor looks somewhat good. The armor has the Eastern Roman look
 
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Yes, the presentation is a little bit different than the Sims, fortunately. :)


The images were taken from the Sims Medieval, the Sims 4 went to more simplified form which doesn't resemble CK3 much. But, well, it's still Sims. ;)
Although I agree that lighting, texturing, etc. have a direct impact at the final results, the point is how are these made. For example, you can have perfectly realistic lighting, perfectly realistic textures, realistic materials, etc. but with cartoon-style models the results will never be realistic. It's a sum of all the elements. In the case of CK3, the textures seems to be better (more towards the realism, to be precise), the lighting is different and more toned down, modelling is inclining towards the realism too (except hair, beards), but yet the result still has a cartoon-like feeling. That is what I was trying to illustrate on the comparison image - bringing the lighting and saturation to the, let's say, more realistic CK3 tone and compare it with the Sims characters. Just changing one element and keep the rest untouched.
I am not saying it's wrong, certainly not (as I have mentioned a few times before), just that there are similarities between CK3 and Sims (Medieval) portraits players are pointing to. Rightfully, in my opinion. If it's wrong or not... well, I will keep that on everybody's personal decision. :)


For me, it's not very realistic, and not just because of hair. But, I do like the portraits, too, so I do not consider it as a negative thing. But I admit if there is something that should be changed, it will be hair and beard style to less cartoony. :)

I think you're right in that it's a matter of opinion. Everyone has a different stance on aesthetic matters. Personally, I see a difference between photorealism and lifelike representation. To have the latter, I don't feel as though you necessarily need the former. Certainly no one would look at a CK3 portrait and mistake it for a photo, but as this was a deliberate stylistic choice, it comes across well. It's a bit different than say Skyrim or a Sims photoskin mod, both of which aim for a photorealistic image and fall short (granted, Skyrim does so due to graphical limitations of its time).

The difference is quite obvious side by side:

CK3...
1595715369741.png

... deliberately chooses to walk the line between realism (asymmetry, imperfection, blemishes, creases, etc.) and style ("cartoonish", as many of us word it) and thus has a concrete middle ground it aims for. It comes out well as a result.

Skyrim...
1595715487828.png

... attempted to be highly realistic, but lacked the technology to do so. The result is quite blocky and has an obvious digital surreality to it. You look at this and know its from gameplay, whereas the CK3 face above looks like it could've come from an animated movie or some such at a glance.

Photoskinning...
1595715577576.png

... attempts to be highly realistic, but does so by simply laying a real world facial texture over the model. The result is extremely doll-like and doesn't react dynamically to light, making it look uncanny and quite frankly disturbing. The method is unable to overcome the fact that the model and lighting system in the game isn't intended for realism.
 
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Out of all the characters we have seen she seems to have the best complexion and possibly symmetrical face, does she perhaps have the attractive/fair trait?
 
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Burning and tanning are not mutually exclusive.
Fair skinned people burn much faster than they tan, but they still tan albeit at a smaller rate and extent.

Often those who claim "they don't tan and just burn" either got burned so bad that they avoided the sun for the next couple of weeks or are downplaying their not as noticeable tan in face of the far more noticeable burn.

But everyone with Melanocytes (which is basically everyone) has the ability to tan to some extent.
It's entirely possible to repeatedly get so badly burned you peel and never acquire a tan from that.
 
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I think you're right in that it's a matter of opinion. Everyone has a different stance on aesthetic matters. Personally, I see a difference between photorealism and lifelike representation. To have the latter, I don't feel as though you necessarily need the former. Certainly no one would look at a CK3 portrait and mistake it for a photo, but as this was a deliberate stylistic choice, it comes across well. It's a bit different than say Skyrim or a Sims photoskin mod, both of which aim for a photorealistic image and fall short (granted, Skyrim does so due to graphical limitations of its time).

The difference is quite obvious side by side:

CK3...
View attachment 602865
... deliberately chooses to walk the line between realism (asymmetry, imperfection, blemishes, creases, etc.) and style ("cartoonish", as many of us word it) and thus has a concrete middle ground it aims for. It comes out well as a result.

Skyrim...
View attachment 602866
... attempted to be highly realistic, but lacked the technology to do so. The result is quite blocky and has an obvious digital surreality to it. You look at this and know its from gameplay, whereas the CK3 face above looks like it could've come from an animated movie or some such at a glance.

Photoskinning...
View attachment 602869
... attempts to be highly realistic, but does so by simply laying a real world facial texture over the model. The result is extremely doll-like and doesn't react dynamically to light, making it look uncanny and quite frankly disturbing. The method is unable to overcome the fact that the model and lighting system in the game isn't intended for realism.
Well, a very good, in my opinion, attempt at photorealism is the characters in Detroit: Become Human. But of course DBH is a graphic adventure bordering with an interactive movie, and each of the characters you interact with is without any doubt designed individually, not procedurally generated.

Q5SHHPXYem9NgLw5xTn6vwk5guttoL1yXuWBYpovhqIZQo4dSnnNntSAj70_f8n_CznF6_C0oE5ORpJNYZlbuOnKHya-xBoFlr5ZBs8DizBpKGy_MvgiCjampYT5B_fFNggU1TRiiOBlMyv3Uwpf4FUWvDWYliw8TXMVG-UeC1XkgLPBgXW_IWVduswVcHOceIpFYWmv56M7BRF58xzx99PEDYNllBtLyEWk


Obviously, reproducing something of this kind at the scale of CK3 is, with the current state of technology, impossible.
 
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In my opinion, after simple portraits of CK II, even the Sims Medieval level looks cool! The only thing I didn't like was that the bodies were too unnaturally athletic, but maybe, since it's about genetics, there are other types of bodies.
 
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Well, a very good, in my opinion, attempt at photorealism is the characters in Detroit: Become Human. But of course DBH is a graphic adventure bordering with an interactive movie, and each of the characters you interact with is without any doubt designed individually, not procedurally generated.

Q5SHHPXYem9NgLw5xTn6vwk5guttoL1yXuWBYpovhqIZQo4dSnnNntSAj70_f8n_CznF6_C0oE5ORpJNYZlbuOnKHya-xBoFlr5ZBs8DizBpKGy_MvgiCjampYT5B_fFNggU1TRiiOBlMyv3Uwpf4FUWvDWYliw8TXMVG-UeC1XkgLPBgXW_IWVduswVcHOceIpFYWmv56M7BRF58xzx99PEDYNllBtLyEWk


Obviously, reproducing something of this kind at the scale of CK3 is, with the current state of technology, impossible.

Absolutely agree with that. Photorealism can absolutely look good, and often does. My point was more that it only looks good if it's the intent, the hardware is there to support it, and the developer skills are there to bring it to life. Let's not forget engine as well! Some game engines are built to support photorealism, such as Frostbite. Others... Not so much.

Likewise, when a studio aims for compromise, the result can look better than aiming for photorealism without those tools would look.
 
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Yes, precisely! I remember some fellows on Steam complaining how the game was too bright and colorful for the middle ages, without realizing that this was an era when the interior walls of castles were deliberately covered in vibrant frescoes. Sometimes it's almost as though movies have taught us that light behave differently in the middle ages, or the sun didn't exist...

Not only that, but many, if not all castles would have had their exterior walls White Washed so they would have been bright beacons as you approached from the distance.
 
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Not only that, but many, if not all castles would have had their exterior walls White Washed so they would have been bright beacons as you approached from the distance.
Was it romanticism that fell in love with old ruins? I also think the aesthetic of the unpainted statues left its mark even though we now know they looked very different. So today I think we have too high expectations on a darker and dirtier medieval times but it's not only that people think that's how it was but I also think that's what they enjoy.

At the time bright and vibrant colors were rare and valuable but today it feels like christmans decorations or candy isles. I'd love to see a game or just about any media approach that kind of visual and fully imagine it but I fear it'd be a lot of work for something people might not enjoy that much.

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Was it romanticism that fell in love with old ruins? I also think the aesthetic of the unpainted statues left its mark even though we now know they looked very different. So today I think we have too high expectations on a darker and dirtier medieval times but it's not only that people think that's how it was but I also think that's what they enjoy.

At the time bright and vibrant colors were rare and valuable but today it feels like christmans decorations or candy isles. I'd love to see a game or just about any media approach that kind of visual and fully imagine it but I fear it'd be a lot of work for something people might not enjoy that much.

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Love that image!

Maybe the Common Folk didn't get to dress up colorfully. But we won't be playing those anyway. We won't even be playing Barons. we'll be playing Counts, Dukes, Kings, and Emperors. So I say when it comes to color, and fancy fabrics, the sky should be the limit!
 
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This all looks really excellent. One question, though -- to what extent will the aspects of physical appearance be modelled on real-life recessiveness/dominance of associated genes? To touch on what I mean, I noticed that one of the sample images for "Inheritance in action" featured a dark-haired Altaic/Central Asian man with a blonde-haired European wife, and two of their children also had blond hair. This isn't impossible genetically, depending on the man's ancestry (the Eurasian steppe was/is a pretty diverse place, after all) and other factors, but blond hair especially is notorious for being a recessive trait that doesn't express itself in first-generation mixes between different racial backgrounds. Please pardon me if this is an unfounded observation, given that I'm commenting based on only one shown image without any additional context like the Altaic man's own parentage and grandparents, but it does give the impression that blond hair and potentially other traits will be treated like a 50/50 in terms of inheritance.

I have no complaints if this is the case and it ends up with Sims-esque outcomes for kids, but it would be interesting to know to what extent these traits actually will be following recessive/dominant tendencies of inheritance.

I agree. I don't know if it'll be exactly 50/50, but for sure, they've said the inheritance modeling (specifically for recessive traits) isn't quite what real life presents. I can't say for sure, but I wouldn't be surprised if we get a roughly 50/50 spread, with a little accounting for grandparents' hair colors.
 
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I agree. I don't know if it'll be exactly 50/50, but for sure, they've said the inheritance modeling (specifically for recessive traits) isn't quite what real life presents. I can't say for sure, but I wouldn't be surprised if we get a roughly 50/50 spread, with a little accounting for grandparents' hair colors.
Please bear in mind that the type of computer program capable of modelling real genetic inheritance might not even have been invented yet. The best we can hope for in this game would be a roughly 50/50 split, with a little taken from the grandparents too

Perfect genetic modelling is certainly beyond the modeling capacity of even the most advanced game...
 
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Please bear in mind that the type of computer program capable of modelling real genetic inheritance might not even have been invented yet. The best we can hope for in this game would be a roughly 50/50 split, with a little taken from the grandparents too

Perfect genetic modelling is certainly beyond the modeling capacity of even the most advanced game...

Really it doesn't take perfect genetic modeling.
You can make a fairly decent "5th grade biology class" model by just give people two allels and then only the dominant is expressed.

In this situation, all the children would have black hair, unless the Altaic man had a blonde parent himself, then he would have a 50% chance of having blonde children with a blonde partner.

And in situations of Co-dominance, make
the resulting phenotype be somewhere in the middle ground of the two parents (example: skin colour, the offspring of a fair skinned person and a dark skinned person would have a skin tone that would be randomly decided, but never darker than the dark parent and never fairer than the fair parent).
 
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Love that image!

Maybe the Common Folk didn't get to dress up colorfully. But we won't be playing those anyway. We won't even be playing Barons. we'll be playing Counts, Dukes, Kings, and Emperors. So I say when it comes to color, and fancy fabrics, the sky should be the limit!
Some of the brightest colours can potentially be obtained from common ingredients available to even the peasants. However, they weren't always stable, and so might require redying

A sober black (especially a lasting one) on the other hand was difficult, expensive, and not something most people would have access to, although very dark versions of other colours could substitute for it.
 
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