Yes. With arcade mode you need to have an uninterupted line to the supply source. This can be land, sea, or a combination of both.
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Yes. With arcade mode you need to have an uninterupted line to the supply source. This can be land, sea, or a combination of both.
I would like someone to describe supply to me also. This is what I assume is right.
As I see it right now supply works as follows: Each unit can "hold" so many days of supply. This is set to 30 days for units after they do an invasion. To me it seems it uses only one port/capital in an area for supply, which we have little to no control over which port it is in Automtic. From this port all supply is drawn. So the number of ports you take is of little importance as long as you have 1. Ive tried to change the port manually to my largest port, but as soon as I set it back to automatic it changes the route back to the orginal port or another most of the time. If I am on an Allies land, they bbecome the supplier and I can do nothing to help the situation unless I have a port in the same area where I can draw supply from. Then my supplies are then transfered to my units. but it is still from 1 port/ capital. Only one port has a supply dump for your nation in a given area. unless there are places unreachable in the same area, like the ports are split because of enemy cut your supply lines or zero infrastructure between the ports or something like that. But either way, we have very little control of how supply works. Unless someone has some other explanation of how the supply system works.
A good example of how the supply system works is the Phillipines. Your single army unit in there works okay but if you add many more you will have supply problems, even if you use your ships based out of these islands, you can actually put yourself out of supply. You are totally at the mercy of the Phillipine government for supplies. You can not give supplies to the Phillipines, but if you could sell them (if they could afford them) you can have a partial control. (I see no reason why USA can't give supplies to the Phillipine Government) Now lets say we change "owner" and "Controler" via changing the save game file of a port, lets say, "Aparri" Once this is done Any unit in the Phillipines that is Under USA control will be supplied from Aparri. The USA can increase supply availiable by increasing the size of the port in Aparri. With having just this one port, USA can supply a LARGE army in the Philipines, now lets say we didn't do this. Lets say we tried to take back some of the Phillipines after Japan has taken half of the mainland of the phillipines but the Phillipeans has not surrendered. When I start taking back the phillipines the lands and ports I take back from the Japanese will convert back to the Phillipines since they have not surrendered. Furthermore since it is not under USA control any port I take back will NOT support me if the phillipine government can't supply it. I will have the 30 days for the invasion but after that I will run out of supply. Now if I wait for the surrender of the Phillipines when I land the USA will have control of the lands. Now if the Phillipines decides to fight on...they will get the land back immediately since they never got annex. SO is this right on how supply works? We also can not make a naval supply route to an Allied port, only to a port we control.
As I see it right now supply works as follows: Each unit can "hold" so many days of supply. This is set to 30 days for units after they do an invasion. To me it seems it uses only one port/capital in an area for supply, which we have little to no control over which port it is in Automtic. From this port all supply is drawn. So the number of ports you take is of little importance as long as you have 1. Ive tried to change the port manually to my largest port, but as soon as I set it back to automatic it changes the route back to the orginal port or another most of the time. If I am on an Allies land, they bbecome the supplier and I can do nothing to help the situation unless I have a port in the same area where I can draw supply from. Then my supplies are then transfered to my units. but it is still from 1 port/ capital. Only one port has a supply dump for your nation in a given area. unless there are places unreachable in the same area, like the ports are split because of enemy cut your supply lines or zero infrastructure between the ports or something like that. But either way, we have very little control of how supply works. Unless someone has some other explanation of how the supply system works.
A good example of how the supply system works is the Phillipines. Your single army unit in there works okay but if you add many more you will have supply problems, even if you use your ships based out of these islands, you can actually put yourself out of supply. You are totally at the mercy of the Phillipine government for supplies. You can not give supplies to the Phillipines, but if you could sell them (if they could afford them) you can have a partial control. (I see no reason why USA can't give supplies to the Phillipine Government) Now lets say we change "owner" and "Controler" via changing the save game file of a port, lets say, "Aparri" Once this is done Any unit in the Phillipines that is Under USA control will be supplied from Aparri. The USA can increase supply availiable by increasing the size of the port in Aparri. With having just this one port, USA can supply a LARGE army in the Philipines, now lets say we didn't do this. Lets say we tried to take back some of the Phillipines after Japan has taken half of the mainland of the phillipines but the Phillipeans has not surrendered. When I start taking back the phillipines the lands and ports I take back from the Japanese will convert back to the Phillipines since they have not surrendered. Furthermore since it is not under USA control any port I take back will NOT support me if the phillipine government can't supply it. I will have the 30 days for the invasion but after that I will run out of supply. Now if I wait for the surrender of the Phillipines when I land the USA will have control of the lands. Now if the Phillipines decides to fight on...they will get the land back immediately since they never got annex. SO is this right on how supply works? We also can not make a naval supply route to an Allied port, only to a port we control.
Hi Xerjin,
as you can see on the pics, there was no unit around.
With the new beta-patch 3.06, there were some changes in supply alone for tooltips, and I will check the situation again.
Afaik we can see now the max available throughput in the beta patch. But still, f.e. I don't know why a prov then is able to receive more then the max throughput in the past..
Unfortunately I have not much time atm to do proper testing. Thats so sad, as we have the new nice console commands in the beta patch.
So it would be good if some other can check it.
Cheers,
Chromos
Hi Xerjin,
as you can see on the pics, there was no unit around.
With the new beta-patch 3.06, there were some changes in supply alone for tooltips, and I will check the situation again.
Afaik we can see now the max available throughput in the beta patch. But still, f.e. I don't know why a prov then is able to receive more then the max throughput in the past..
Unfortunately I have not much time atm to do proper testing. Thats so sad, as we have the new nice console commands in the beta patch.
So it would be good if some other can check it.
Cheers,
Chromos
A province can receive more supply than max because there is no restriction on supply going BACK toward the supply source. That is one of the things that makes reading the supply map so difficult; we don't know what amount is going forward and backward.
here's a question;
For example I have 5 Units in a straight line. One Unit (Division of 3 Infantry Regiments) in each province.
To my front there are 5 Enemy Units in a straight line facing each of my units.
To the rear are my Provinces, my own territory.
How is Supply traced from the Capital? Through a Straight line of Provinces to each Province or a mish mash of draws, pulls and back flow along multiple Provinces? How does the AI determine which route to Take for the best Supply Route?
In the past I've noticed even when I build my Super Autobahn, the Ai still choose Old Farmer's Pig Road instead of my spanky new 20 lane Express lane with road side Drive throughs.
(let's not give Port Examples yet...simple Overland first)
For example I have 5 Units in a straight line. One Unit (Division of 3 Infantry Regiments) in each province.
To my front there are 5 Enemy Units in a straight line facing each of my units.
To the rear are my Provinces, my own territory.
How is Supply traced from the Capital? Through a Straight line of Provinces to each Province or a mish mash of draws, pulls and back flow along multiple Provinces? How does the AI determine which route to Take for the best Supply Route?
In the past I've noticed even when I build my Super Autobahn, the Ai still choose Old Farmer's Pig Road instead of my spanky new 20 lane Express lane with road side Drive throughs.
(let's not give Port Examples yet...simple Overland first)
I thought the supply system was like a webfrom the center capital it pushes supply out to each adjacent province. The max amount of supply determined by the infrastructure. then it does the next province "ring" getting supply from what ever provinces from the last area that was adjacent and so on until it reaches the edges. The next round the supply from the edges goes backwards, while the next supply goes forward asit goes forward and back to the edges from the capital. But this is how I would do it...not sure that is how it is done.
supply routes are least number of proviences to the nearest unit in that direction, with no regard to infra (as far as i can see) priotising north over south, so the shortest route the furthest north ALWAYS gets used first.
the best way to lay INFRA is to place a unit in the target direction and use the supply map to plan where the infra goes
the best way to lay INFRA is to place a unit in the target direction and use the supply map to plan where the infra goes
Do northern units get supplied first then? So southern units wil not get enough supplies due to this if you are get supplies from a port(s)? Didn't HOI2 have a box for every unit to say weither to prioritize supply to a unit? Does this make it easier to attack from the south?
i'm fairly sure it sends supply to the closet unit in that direction and then tries to extend form there, unless there is a shorter route from the capital.
if there is a shorter route from the capital it just does he most northern route for that. just replace captial with port if you are using them.
this is why i want placeable supply caches on the strat map
i'm fairly sure it sends supply to the closet unit in that direction and then tries to extend form there, unless there is a shorter route from the capital.
if there is a shorter route from the capital it just does he most northern route for that. just replace captial with port if you are using them.
this is why i want placeable supply caches on the strat map
I think most people do nimrod123...lol
So regardless if I understand this correctly, Supply traces the shortest route regardless of Infrastructure. Could someone from Paradox actually confirm this? Can't this be patched with an if/or command or something smart that takes into account infrastructure builds? or heck..give us out supply depots already : p
i could be completly wrong but i'm fairly sure it was podcat (a dev) or blue emu (one of the crazy community researchers) that posted my above.
the supply depot stuff is unlikely as the AI dosn't understand it (its apparently been tried at least small scale) but i forget how long ago i heard that
A clarification:
I think that it traces the line of supply via the shortest route, BUT the network can move supplies from one adjacent province to another. This means that a neighboring province will notice some draw and send supply. If you are sucking a ton of supply somewhere, some of the other provinces should get in on the action. But there's only so much they can do can do.
I've noticed that when I build infra pipes as the Soviets, it really helps, even though plenty of units are not on them directly.
I think that it traces the line of supply via the shortest route, BUT the network can move supplies from one adjacent province to another. This means that a neighboring province will notice some draw and send supply. If you are sucking a ton of supply somewhere, some of the other provinces should get in on the action. But there's only so much they can do can do.
I've noticed that when I build infra pipes as the Soviets, it really helps, even though plenty of units are not on them directly.
I'm afraid that it's true, i.e. it's not the most efficient route that matters, it's the shortest route with highest throughput. IMO it's best to build infra along the most commonly used routes (you can check them in the supply map mode) unless you expect the frontline to change dramatically.
I'm not really following this thread, but to the screenshots by chromos recently, if you had 3.06 installed for that save game you'd know that the provinces after those hatchings are where the "capital buff" zone ends. Obviously there will be hatching there. A really easy work around would be to make the capital buffer a moddable value somewhere. An air bridge from berlin out past that buffer could help with supply frustrations, but people already know I sell airbridge strategy every time I run into a supply thread Best way to get around supply problems is to bypass them thru the air! It bypasses RR, bypasses weather, bypasses supply transfer costs, and bypasses mixed supply networks, thats just too good to not use!
Best way to get around supply problems is to bypass them thru the air! It bypasses RR, bypasses weather, bypasses supply transfer costs, and bypasses mixed supply networks, thats just too good to not use!@Chromos: a clarification on the color scheme (w/3.06).
1. Grey is a province with no supply, but it can have a demand on it.
1. Grey is a province with no supply, but it can have a demand on it.
Anyone knows why I can't supply my armies in Nationalist Spain? I can't build a convoy to Cádiz, and I can't establish an "air supply route". Also my armies lose organisation and refuse to attack Gibraltar ...
No actually that would be any other color. Grey is a province that does not have any supply transfers neighboring it whatsoever in the direction of the province. There are situations with a newly creating demand line where provinces that are grey will eventually become part of a demand and as each day progresses you will slowly see the line turn from grey to red to brown, red being the province that is being requested that has 0 local supply. This is the only time technically grey could have any way of signifying supply but the day before it Actually has demand in it it will be red not grey. The supply system acts very similar to a game of telephone, so technically in that game of telephone when it first begins the other end are a bunch of players who are grey, but as they recieve the message(supply request) they will go red as they recieve and then change to a proper color as they relay depending on their throughput and the demand.
good thread thought to post, maybe move to FAQ, as a lot of its still valid
Actually, if some brave soul wants to update the wiki, I can just close this thread and be done with it. I'm not so sure I want this thread archived in the FAQ since it has not been cleaned up.