Machine Age and Ascension paths

[garyriley1982]

Hi all.

With the upcoming release of Machine Age, and there essentially being three new ascension paths for Machine Empires, I have a few questions:

1) With the new Meta, what are the benefits of playing a regular Bio empire and say, going Genetic or Psionic over synthetic?
2) Are there any benefits as a Bio empire going synthetic and then taking one of the three new ascension paths, or is it a wasted ascension slot, or are you locked to just synthetic ascension?
3) What exactly is the cybernetic ascension path getting to compete with the three new machine ascension paths?
4) Will machines be able to go Cybernetic as well?

 

[Twogs]

The new ascension paths are only for Machine Empires (i.e. those that start as machines), not synth. They are also the only options for MEs.

This should answer all your questions as neither Bio, Psy nor Cyborg compete with the new ascensions

 

[Incompetent]

On the Gestalt side you're still talking about a totally different civics list, different origins available etc. Many pros and cons for Hive versus Machine Intelligence, but generally speaking Hives beat everyone else on quantity of pops (and possibly sprawl efficiency as well, in terms of the things you own directly).

For non-Gestalts, there are fewer differences between organics and machines; your government options will be broadly similar (apart from advanced authorities). The main benefits of an organic start are that your own species will grow naturally, and you can assimilate and upgrade other organic pops, which will still typically be most pops you find in the galaxy (whereas presumably, machine ascensions won't let you turn organic pops into machines in order to upgrade them). I'm guessing that machine pops will be higher-quality but more difficult to mass.

Synth ascension makes your pops Mechanical, but it's still an organic-assimilation-based ascension. Bio ascension is an ascension focused on pop quantity, it's not clear any of the machine ascensions will compete with it on that front. Cybernetic is getting some changes, we'll have to see how good the traits and other bonuses are overall. Psionic isn't really like any machine ascension, although there could be some similarities with Nanotech in the way that you progressively bolt on various extras at a colony/empire level, rather than focusing on more/better pops.

The new ascension paths are only for Machine Empires (i.e. those that start as machines), not synth. They are also the only options for MEs.

I expect Driven Assimilators will still be able to take Cybernetic ascension, maybe with some unique advanced authorities, but that's the only exception.

 

[Exasperation]

I didn't see any mention of arcology project being made available to machines, so it looks like that might still be an advantage of synthetic ascension over starting as a machine (although the new buffs to machine worlds mean it's not as large of an advantage as it used to be).

 

[aadf97799c]

only non gestalt can take dark matter civic

hope that change eventually

 

[Calvax]

I didn't see any mention of arcology project being made available to machines, so it looks like that might still be an advantage of synthetic ascension over starting as a machine (although the new buffs to machine worlds mean it's not as large of an advantage as it used to be).

Going by the streams we've seen you can take arcology as IM, you can't take machine world.

 

[dawedqafdAD]

psionic is still god tier as it always was. genetic still sucks like it always has. and synthetic ascensions look to be a good mix. honestly not much has changed in terms of meta.

 

[dulahan]

I still wonder what the best Ascension for Rogue Ervitors will be.

 

[Incompetent]

Going by the streams we've seen you can take arcology as IM, you can't take machine world.

With Nanotech ascension you can also make and live on Nanite Worlds, which look they could be a weak version of Machine/Hive Worlds (plus nanite income).

I still wonder what the best Ascension for Rogue Ervitors will be.

Rogue Servitor Virtuality Ecumenopolises/Ringworlds are going to be pretty spectacular, even if you can only run a limited number of them efficiently. I suppose it becomes bad again if you're trying to pamper thousands of Bio-Trophies and are forced to spread them out over many colonies, but you don't really need to play like that, given that vassals are an option.

Other than that, Modularity would allow you to play RS the same as now, but better. Nanotech would be the weakest I suspect, as it doesn't play to RS's strengths, and I'm guessing Bio-Trophies can't live on a Nanite World.

 

[NeverUsedID]

So you can pick the new ascension perks like virtual also with gestalt?

 

[Seaghauwn]

I still wonder what the best Ascension for Rogue Ervitors will be.

I like virtuality for rogue servitors, adding the bonus of the bio trophies to the virtuality it is quite nice makes ecu worlds spicey

 

[SupremeMorpheus]

Going by the streams we've seen you can take arcology as IM, you can't take machine world.

Oh. Well that's very good news indeed

 

[jedavis]

Other than that, Modularity would allow you to play RS the same as now, but better. Nanotech would be the weakest I suspect, as it doesn't play to RS's strengths, and I'm guessing Bio-Trophies can't live on a Nanite World.

I'm seeing some surprising habitability numbers for organics on nanite worlds; both my bio-trophies and my presapients are showing 25% base (higher if it was their homeworld!)

(edit: on reflection, might be from the +5% habitability techs and a 0% base...)

 

[Hansatron]

Modularity is like synthetic ascension only far better. I don’t know how some of the numbers made it to release.

You get a multiplicative 1.5x assembly speed bonus, and you get advanced machine traits. You still get all leaders tagged with the synth trait too. Even setting the most broken advanced trait aside, the analogues to robust, fertile, nerve stapled, and erudite are all good too.

Virtuality and nanotech have nothing on this. Genetic and synth don’t have growth rates like this. You produce pops too fast.

 

[dulahan]

Virtuality looks so edge case. I can see doing it with a Relic or Gaia world Rogue Servitors. But my current broken ring game? I have 3 relic worlds in my starting expansion (and I might still get the one from the one event for the relic i am spacing out the name of too), and 4 other worlds... Virtual would just harm me then! Guess this game will have to be Modular.

Interesting that Nanite might still be viable too.