Hope for religious population mechanics in EU5/CK3

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VKW

First Lieutenant
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Apr 11, 2014
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Hey all,

So some thoughts I had about the way religious populations are handled in CK2 and EU4, where each province's religion is a binary. CK2's feels somewhat more immersive because converting a province is based on RNG, however EU4's fixed times to convert, while making expansion easier for what is is essentially a map painter still feels unrealistic compared to the actual uncertainty and mixed results that converting conquered territories has had.

I think that both Stellaris and HOI4 have mechanics that can hopefully be implemented into future GSGs, in the form of the new planetary population rework and the government party popularity.

Allowing a non-binary way of representing a province's religion (and more importantly, reflecting the religious diversity within them) would be a much more organic way of converting provinces, and the rate at which people are converted could scale inversely with the population (i.e. converting the first 10% of a province to your religion could take much faster than the last 10%, if you are even able to get them to convert at all). One could even go a step further and allow RNG to play a role instead of having conversion progress with a deterministic formula. It would also allow for some civil unrest mechanics to occur if you have a lot of mixed-religious nations and don't have the appropriate cultural/tolerance tech advancements or in periods of turmoil.

In an ideal world I'd love to see this kind of mechanic incorporated into EU4 and CK2, especially since Stellaris was bold enough to completely overhaul their system, but given how much more entrenched EU4 and CK2 are and the amount of additional content they have that might not be feasible, but I hope that this is something that is included in eventual future iterations.
 
I've also wanted the Paradox Devs to make a more streamlined version of the DG mod for a while now, it'd really help Eu4 and CK2

Yeah, DG has some great content, even if, as I understand, the code is really clunky as it was built prior to many of the tools EUIV modders now have. Even if PDox don't want to go the whole hog and track actual populations, at least tracking the proportion of the population that follows each religion, as DG does, would allow for much more interesting and immersive gameplay with regards religion.
 
Lack of actual population mechanics is one of the more apparent deficiencies in both games.

This might sound controversial, but seeing how much the introduction of POPs (pops not bound to tiles, that is) is about to improve Stellaris, I'm starting to think that every Paradox Grand Strategy game could benefit from POPs.
 
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The Dei Gratia mod is a mod for EU3 and 4. It has been incorporated in many of the main mods for both of those games (Meiou, Magna Mundu, etc). It is a brilliant mod that not only adds in several religions and hundreds of religious events but also adds a system of religious minorities and partial religious conversion using provincial modifiers.

For example one province might be majority/have a plurality of Hindus and a large Sunni minority and a small Shia minority and a tiny Jain minority. If your Protestant country converts the province it will result in that province having only a small minority of Protestants. You'll have to do it at least two or maybe even three more times before conversion is complete (and even then you'll still have large minorities of other religions running around). Conversion between same group faiths is faster though, mind you
 
CK3 definitely needs a mechanic for minority groups, both religious and cultural. This could either be a rudimentary pop system or else just a kind of province modifier saying "this province has a Jewish community, that province has still has pagans out in the country" etc. CK2 has a huge problem with religions and cultures just disappearing entirely, when they really should just become minority groups. Your preacher could create a minority population of your religion, and with time turn turn the minority into a majority, but removing the old religion entirely takes centuries and/or an Inquisition.

I don't think having actual percentages makes sense, though. (Only talking CK, as I don't know EU at all.) It's good to have a natural "stopping point" where you can say your conversion mission has succeeded and move your preacher elsewhere. In the current system that's just when the province converts, under a pop system it might be when the heathens have only one pop left, and in the simpler "minority group exists" system it would just be when your religion is now the majority one. Under a numerical system, you see 10% and go...well, maybe if I leave him there a while it'll hit 9%. I think it's just frustrating, and there shouldn't be much gameplay consequence at that point anyway.
 
Hopefully with and from Imperator the pop system will be base of their future games especially EU5... And with a pop system we will have a much more better religious system as well. It doesnt need to be as deep as Victoria's. Imperator's system will do.