Breaking Badboy limit, how strong should you be?

[Zorro]

I've never gone over the 25 infamy limit before but I recently did as the UK when I gambled that I could justify a war cheaply. I was the number 1 military leader in the world at the time, I think I was around 500 score at the time. Russia went to war with me and later France as well. I'm wondering just how strong do you have to be to make the AI not go to war over the badboy limit?

 

[WingedLion14]

about 2x the 2nd is definitely the surest way to avoid it, in my experience. another way may be to just have a massive number of brigades. in a Germany game I went over the infamy limit, I had more brigades than the rest of Europe put together (like 750 in standing army, could mobilize 1000+), and nobody went to war with me over the infamy limit (and Britain was 2nd military power - only like 300 behind me - due to her massive amount of dreadnoughts). another thing is that once the first wave of infamy wars are over, if you've won them all, they tend to not happen again, b/c the AI realizes you can't be beat

 

[Jorlaan]

The easiest answer is that you should feel confidant that you can fight every other GP and their allies simultaneously and win.
If you think you're tough enough to do this than feel free to go over 25.
If you don't think you're tough enough to do this then don't.

 

[l3ol3o]

When I went over the infamy limit as Germany I was dowed right away by France I think. Russia dowed a few months later followed by the Ottomans. Your war score doesn't need to be that high to make peace so I made peace with Russia just by destroying a few armies. I did the same a few weeks later with the Ottomans and then grabbed 2 states from the French. After that the UK declared war a year or two later. After that I've only had 1 other containment war. Keep in mind I've been playing like Picasso this game so I have a huge military now.

They key is getting through the first wars. Get quick victories and make peace quickly and it won't be a problem. I would wait to go over the limit until your military is around 2x 2nd place like WingedLion said. Your almost guaranteed to be fighting on multiple fronts against multiple GP's.

 

[Zorro]

another thing is that once the first wave of infamy wars are over, if you've won them all, they tend to not happen again, b/c the AI realizes you can't be beat

That is good to know, thank you

When I went over the infamy limit as Germany I was dowed right away by France I think. Russia dowed a few months later followed by the Ottomans. Your war score doesn't need to be that high to make peace so I made peace with Russia just by destroying a few armies. I did the same a few weeks later with the Ottomans and then grabbed 2 states from the French. After that the UK declared war a year or two later. After that I've only had 1 other containment war. Keep in mind I've been playing like Picasso this game so I have a huge military now.

They key is getting through the first wars. Get quick victories and make peace quickly and it won't be a problem. I would wait to go over the limit until your military is around 2x 2nd place like WingedLion said. Your almost guaranteed to be fighting on multiple fronts against multiple GP's.

I'll have to start paying attention to other GPs warscore. Will it matter that a large chunk of my score is from the fleet?

I got pretty lucky in my wars. France and Russia were allied the entire game to suddenly breaking the alliance just before Russia declared war on me and I was able to fight them separately.

 

[l3ol3o]

That is good to know, thank you

I'll have to start paying attention to other GPs warscore. Will it matter that a large chunk of my score is from the fleet?

I got pretty lucky in my wars. France and Russia were allied the entire game to suddenly breaking the alliance just before Russia declared war on me and I was able to fight them separately.

Once you go over the limit you will probably lose all your allies. Fleet doesn't matter much except for fighting the UK. I made the mistake of going of the Infamy limit without a fleet that could take the UK and had to wait years until I could invade England.

You really just need more troops. Fight in your territory. Let them come to you and gang up on them. Again peace comes pretty easily. All you really have to do is win a few battles. You don't have to occupy half of Russia or anything like that. If you mobilize you should have more then enough troops to fight on multiple fronts.

 

[unmerged(391327)]

Strong enough to defend yourself, I guess.

I wouldn't say "strong enough to beat every great power", because that's not always necessary. If you're Germany, you probably want to be strong enough to take on France, Russia, AH, Britain, etc. (all the great powers), because you're in the midst of all the great powers. But, if you're Argentina, you only need to be able to muster enough force to beat the countries in your region, then defend yourself against the powers that would attack you from a distance (which is basically the UK, and offhand chance of France or US). It's just a matter of you being able to secure yourself in the event of wars of containment - make sure you can win your wars of containment, not just win wars against the great powers.

 

[tului]

One pain the the keister is once Africa is colonized. If you've colonized, you've got anyone you declared war with coming from possibly any direction. You'll want to have large armies near each border of grouped major powers. France and the UK tend to have size 60+ stacks that'll come out of their territories. It's especially important to have them stationed there already if you lack the fleet to control the seas. Losing all of Africa won't kill you, but it hurts quite a bit and is a drag on war score.

 

[brycef]

Just played a game as US where I went over the Infamy limit and didn't look back after about 1905. A few thoughts and discoveries...

First be aware that going over the limit will leave you with NO friends. All allies desert you and you will never get military alliances or military access with anyone who is not a Satellite or Puppet country (perhaps Dominions?). So don't even think about allies ever again. I usually fight all my post-Infamy threshold games for conquests or for making countries puppets if it serves my purposes. I sphere where can but if they break away because of a revolution I occupy them and make them a puppet or take states or conquer them.

Second have at least enough brigades and fleet to defend yourself. If you're an island nation like the UK or US for most of your cores, you can fend off the pathetic amphibious invasions from the AI pretty easily since the AI doesn't build very many transports for big invasion waves. Just keep your navy near port and sortie out when you see an invasion fleet. If they land, send your forces (about 100k is all you need) to beat them down. They'll rarely invade with more than a 60k stack at a time. However if you are fighting several powers at once then you need to be like Napoleon and use interior lines to kill each in turn. Build railroads, you'll need them for rapid transportation. Remember, as Frederick the Great said "He who defends everything defends nothing!" so don't try to take on each invasion at the same time, kill each in detail. Eventually they will develop weariness if you keep killing off their armies and peace out. If you are a land power like Germany, then have a big enough army to delay all but one of your enemies while you crush one at a time. This probably means as big a standing army as everyone on your borders has combined.

Another trick is if you know they will attack you and have a border with you, mobilize first before going over the limit. It might just be enough to intimate them. Otherwise it gives you the power to take the war to them sooner than they can fully mobilize. They probably will when you do though.

Once you beat back the invasions the attacking powers will eventually peace out. Don't let them off until you get something from them! In HoD you get very little Jingoism to demand goals during wars, so take advantage of each war to demand something from them for messing with you. Remember the goal is to make you strong and your enemies weak, so take a state or colony from them in each war.

After the containment wars are done then go to town. CB all the small countries without alliances first, especially the uncivilized ones before the civilized ones, then take on the nations that have GP allies. By taking care you can fight wars with one GP at a time and wear them all down. I also found that if you still have upticking jingoism you can add goals continuously and declare CBs and fight new wars while still fighting the old ones. Just declare war after you are allowed to add a war goal in your current war, then start a new CB. This way you can stay at war for a long time racking up lots of war goals if you have beaten down and occupied your enemies. Once you cross the Infamy threshold, you really have no reason to stop.