Kingdom of Jerusalem - Impossible now?

C

CrusaderJoe

Second Lieutenant

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Jul 24, 2012

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #1

Hey all, I thought about asking this in the quick questions thread but it just seemed a little too in-depth for that thread. I haven't played CK2 in a fair bit of time (a little over a year) and I just finished up a game as Venice and decided to go back into the feudal realm.

I remember being able to start as the Kingdom of Jerusalem at the July 15, 1099, start date and be able to barely scrape by against the Muslims. Now it seems like the moment you hit play the entire Muslim world declares war on you instantly and you're woefully unprepared to defeat them. Now, I realize that ruling the real life Kingdom of Jerusalem was no picnic but in the real world Jerusalem had a great deal of support from the West not to mention thousands migrating to the Holy Land as soldiers during the Crusades. Unfortunately, there's no way to adequately represent this in-game so what I want to know is, has the game been patched in some way to make it even more difficult than what I remember? If so, is there any reasonable method to survival against the 50K+ Muslim hordes with your pitiful band of 10K (at best) troops ? I really used to enjoy playing in the Holy Land when it was difficult, but not impossible, to get by and I would like to be able to do so again.

 

LumberKing

Philosopher

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #2

Raise both the Hospitallers and the Templars then you're all good.

 

C

CrusaderJoe

Second Lieutenant

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Jul 24, 2012

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #3

Unfortunately, I can't get the Templars in time. They aren't my vassal and I don't have adequate piety or cash.

 

D

Drake_Hound

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Mar 27, 2014

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #4

You definetly need holy orders to survive there, and carefull for there counter part, cause those are a pain.

Anyway call the Byzantium Empire for help, the west takes way too long to get there.

 

Raineh Daze

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Dec 7, 2013

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #5

CrusaderJoe said:

Unfortunately, I can't get the Templars in time. They aren't my vassal and I don't have adequate piety or cash.

Click to expand...

Isn't there a decision to vassalise them if you hold the Kingdom of Jerusalem?

 

C

CrusaderJoe

Second Lieutenant

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Jul 24, 2012

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #6

That's another issue for me, the Byzantines do not have anyone that I can marry in time to get an alliance (in fact, there are very few women of major countries available at this time). Once the muslims start rolling in the war is over pretty quickly. I can typically hold off either the Shia or the Sunni individually but not both.

 

C

CrusaderJoe

Second Lieutenant

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Jul 24, 2012

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #7

Raineh Daze said:

Isn't there a decision to vassalise them if you hold the Kingdom of Jerusalem?

Click to expand...

Yes, but it requires 500 cash. Another stumblingblock in my path.

 

C

CrusaderJoe

Second Lieutenant

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Jul 24, 2012

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #8

I may have figure out a way, guess I made this thread too soon.

I just borrowed 300 cash from the Jews and the Templars, then vassalized the Templars. Hope this works...

 

D

Drake_Hound

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #9

Well then it is Tyranny (or north korea mode) time and strip off all useless vassals to direct control!
to get more troops, basically just tax people into space so get TAX as high as possible, then revoke the tittle and then install a new mayor for example (the new ones don't suffer from tyranny issue)

Basically a cheap way to hold off, but a good way to increase prestige and power.
thus opening up a way to marry into any empire!
So the higher the levy, the less likely people want to fight you.
Anyway incase of war go full out guerilla, hit those capitals of caliphate, causing rebellions.
Rebellions sometimes get in the way of doomstacks.
Cause mass decandency and hopefully a shaia revolt.

There is no peacefull way if you are out of cash and outnumbered

 

Raineh Daze

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Dec 7, 2013

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #10

This discussions has reminded me of an amusing line in the decision to vassalise--you can't be a heretic. Thus, if the Schism is mended, a Catholic holder of the KoJ cannot vassalise the Holy Orders, as they're a heretic, until Europe flips its religious allignment again.

 

C

CrusaderJoe

Second Lieutenant

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Jul 24, 2012

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #11

Seems like this whole borrow money to acquire troops is working. I have 70% warscores in both Jihads now.

Thanks for all the tips/suggestions, if necessary I may just have to go full North Korea in the Kingdom of Heaven until I get a little stronger.

 

Raineh Daze

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Dec 7, 2013

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #12

CrusaderJoe said:

Seems like this whole borrow money to acquire troops is working. I have 70% warscores in both Jihads now.

Thanks for all the tips/suggestions, if necessary I may just have to go full North Korea in the Kingdom of Heaven until I get a little stronger.

Click to expand...

NK was nerfed.

 

D

Drake_Hound

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #13

It was nerfed like all the levy, but it is useless to have vassals when you need the extra % of troops to survive, sadly NK mode takes longer to achieve but sets your capital of Jerusalem up for the future.

But holy orders are a must in Jerusalem, thats till the muslim comeback with there holyorders.
Basically as long you keep winning Battles as ally, the faster you get points for your retinue's.
To win battles as ally, you definetly need a strong levy, the vassals levy simply cannot keep up with ally wars.

 

U

unmerged(745040)

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May 30, 2013

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #14

can you no longer swear fealty to hre/byz?

 

S

SigurdStormhand

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Dec 9, 2013

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #15

hjkh123 said:

can you no longer swear fealty to hre/byz?

Click to expand...

I can't - I assume because the Empress is Orthodox.

 

LumberKing

Philosopher

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Dec 16, 2013

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #16

SigurdStormhand said:

I can't - I assume because the Empress is Orthodox.

Click to expand...

It's cause you're a king. Kings can only swear fealty to de jure Emperors.

 

Hackworthy

Ze Übermensch!

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #17

I am going to Cyprus... will join me?

 

Artaem

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Apr 15, 2014

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #18

Cool, Jerusalem sounds like a nice and exciting place for the next playthrough

Although i suppose most playthroughs tend to get boring once you're at the empire level.

 

Raeheart_

Major

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May 27, 2013

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #19

Artaem said:

Cool, Jerusalem sounds like a nice and exciting place for the next playthrough

Although i suppose most playthroughs tend to get boring once you're at the empire level.

Click to expand...

Nonsense! If you are bored in CK2, you're not trying hard enough!

 

C

CrusaderJoe

Second Lieutenant

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Jul 24, 2012

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• Jun 7, 2014

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• #20

Well, anybody who is still interested in playing as Jerusalem, all you have to do is borrow 300 coins from both the Jews and the Templars(they pop up after about a month at most) then vassalize the Templars with your newfound gold. Also, i'd recommend marrying the daughter of the Duke of Apulia (de Hauteville). He's relatively close to you and he provided me with about 4K troops. Be sure to set marriage as a goal that way you'll get the piety bonus upon completion.

Then you'll have enough piety to raise both Holy Orders and defeat both the Shia and Sunni invasions.

The only weird thing i've noticed so far is that after borrowing money from the Templars I have no way to pay it back after I vassalize them. Yet, I still have the -10 church opinion modifier. Oh well...