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((Won't this mean the cabinet will have to be reorganised? Will it work with me as Leader AND an Advisor?))
))
1356-1360
Azlanxo Rising
Rise of the Populares: Rise of Atlantis
The Populares, lead by their charasmatic founder Graetius Tauronian, stormed to power and in doing so changed the face of the continent forever. In four short years they managed to do what no one had done before: restore Atlantis to military dominance. In the decades before the overthrow of the aging Atlantean oligarchy, Azlanxo (Atlantean for Atlantis Minor) had been whittled away by the neighboring states. Reduced to a small core of loyal territories, Atlanteans looked to the Populares and their aggressive plan of militarization to restore the great city to its former glory. And no punchers were held back. The soldiers were trained, new troops called up from the hinterlands, banners sewn and flown high above massive, well-trained, and well-armed legions. Before the 1355 election, Azlanxo's armies numbered around 8-10 thousand. By 1360 they number over 20,000. A whole second army group was needed to pacify the newly conquered western lands. By 1358 Osson had been annexed to the Republic and her unmarried men carried off to labor building roads to the many oases that dot the western deserts. They also tilled fields and tended to husbandry in order to feed the growing army as Azlanxo looked to its next target: Heras. The will of the people demanded that Heras too pay for their crimes and raids. It was not long before the banners of Azlanxo flew over the beautiful farmlands of Heras and a the menfolk there forced to work the fields in order to feed the expanding army.
But it was not just the number of the soldiers that increased. Under the Populares' first half-term there was a change in tactics. The Azlanxo Guard, once merely a tool for manning the walls and gates become a force of conquest - a source of pride, even - for the fledgling Republic. It was no surprise then that Atlantis was able to forge the Great Northern Pact, an alliance centered on Azlanxo and consisting of the Four Great Republics (Azlanxo, Arixandos, Korizembe, and Eurpaxo) and the Empire of Borxison. It caused an uneasiness to creep across the rest of the continent, but for the Populares it was a show of commitment to more than just war.
Atlantis in 1360
Death of a Leader
Despite all the success, the great loss during the first half-term was that of Imperatar Graetius Tauronian, who was succeeded by his second in command Auron Desimodius as Acting Imperatar. Tauronian was lost during the initial invasion of Osson. Contemporary writers disagree on how he died. Many suggest it was from an assassin's wound or that he died in battle. Others suggest a number of diseases ranging from the common cold to syphilis. The popular story captured by many was that he died horribly outnumbered by the Urollara, though today this is considered highly unlikely given the rate at which Osson and Heras were subdued. What is commonly agreed on is that despite previous service and experience: as a leader and commander he let his ego drive his decisions and this often led to mistakes. His death, whether caused by a concerned general who sought victory over glory; an assassin paid by dubious enemies, or due to a bug picked up from a street-whore would eventually lead to great changes as the Populares were left under an Acting Imperatar and tried to clearly define the powers of the government.
Vox Pop
During the conquest of the two nomad states, Azlanxo saw a great boom in the so-called Republican Art. Similar to the Renaissance in Europe, the Middle Republican Period, starting soon after the return of democracy to Atlantis, saw great changes in the arts, the sciences and politics. Many flocked to the great city after hearing tales of people going from rags to riches. Once again Atlantis was the great trading portal of the continent, which angered old trade cities and rivals now forced to pay tariffs to the great city. The spirit of the Middle Republican Period spread through the ranks of the people. Their saber rattling and blood lust had been quenched in the sands of Osson and the fields of Heras. Peace was now the many topic, and to these ends the people of Atlantis wanted to build close relations with the Empire of Borxison in hopes that the Monarchy there could be peacefully brought down and the great nation of Ara, once a single power, could be reunited.
Kaioo, once you are ready - PM me with your plans for the next four years! This train is chugging along once again!
Azlanxo Rising
Rise of the Populares: Rise of Atlantis
The Populares, lead by their charasmatic founder Graetius Tauronian, stormed to power and in doing so changed the face of the continent forever. In four short years they managed to do what no one had done before: restore Atlantis to military dominance. In the decades before the overthrow of the aging Atlantean oligarchy, Azlanxo (Atlantean for Atlantis Minor) had been whittled away by the neighboring states. Reduced to a small core of loyal territories, Atlanteans looked to the Populares and their aggressive plan of militarization to restore the great city to its former glory. And no punchers were held back. The soldiers were trained, new troops called up from the hinterlands, banners sewn and flown high above massive, well-trained, and well-armed legions. Before the 1355 election, Azlanxo's armies numbered around 8-10 thousand. By 1360 they number over 20,000. A whole second army group was needed to pacify the newly conquered western lands. By 1358 Osson had been annexed to the Republic and her unmarried men carried off to labor building roads to the many oases that dot the western deserts. They also tilled fields and tended to husbandry in order to feed the growing army as Azlanxo looked to its next target: Heras. The will of the people demanded that Heras too pay for their crimes and raids. It was not long before the banners of Azlanxo flew over the beautiful farmlands of Heras and a the menfolk there forced to work the fields in order to feed the expanding army.
But it was not just the number of the soldiers that increased. Under the Populares' first half-term there was a change in tactics. The Azlanxo Guard, once merely a tool for manning the walls and gates become a force of conquest - a source of pride, even - for the fledgling Republic. It was no surprise then that Atlantis was able to forge the Great Northern Pact, an alliance centered on Azlanxo and consisting of the Four Great Republics (Azlanxo, Arixandos, Korizembe, and Eurpaxo) and the Empire of Borxison. It caused an uneasiness to creep across the rest of the continent, but for the Populares it was a show of commitment to more than just war.
Atlantis in 1360
Death of a Leader
Despite all the success, the great loss during the first half-term was that of Imperatar Graetius Tauronian, who was succeeded by his second in command Auron Desimodius as Acting Imperatar. Tauronian was lost during the initial invasion of Osson. Contemporary writers disagree on how he died. Many suggest it was from an assassin's wound or that he died in battle. Others suggest a number of diseases ranging from the common cold to syphilis. The popular story captured by many was that he died horribly outnumbered by the Urollara, though today this is considered highly unlikely given the rate at which Osson and Heras were subdued. What is commonly agreed on is that despite previous service and experience: as a leader and commander he let his ego drive his decisions and this often led to mistakes. His death, whether caused by a concerned general who sought victory over glory; an assassin paid by dubious enemies, or due to a bug picked up from a street-whore would eventually lead to great changes as the Populares were left under an Acting Imperatar and tried to clearly define the powers of the government.
Vox Pop
During the conquest of the two nomad states, Azlanxo saw a great boom in the so-called Republican Art. Similar to the Renaissance in Europe, the Middle Republican Period, starting soon after the return of democracy to Atlantis, saw great changes in the arts, the sciences and politics. Many flocked to the great city after hearing tales of people going from rags to riches. Once again Atlantis was the great trading portal of the continent, which angered old trade cities and rivals now forced to pay tariffs to the great city. The spirit of the Middle Republican Period spread through the ranks of the people. Their saber rattling and blood lust had been quenched in the sands of Osson and the fields of Heras. Peace was now the many topic, and to these ends the people of Atlantis wanted to build close relations with the Empire of Borxison in hopes that the Monarchy there could be peacefully brought down and the great nation of Ara, once a single power, could be reunited.
Kaioo, once you are ready - PM me with your plans for the next four years! This train is chugging along once again!
((Great update! Let's paint the continent blue!))
The wars had been successful, and Vulpis had gained renown and and fame as the bold Legate of the Atlantean legions. However, as the conscripts laid down their arms, and the legionnaires were dispatched, commander by lower ranking, and largely forgettable subordinates, Vulpis' concerns were growing... he had gained esteem and popular opinion, yes, but certainly some in the Senate would not take kindly to another upstart general, even one as independent and largely temperate as him.
He quickly shook those thoughts out of his head, as he, and his personal retinue, returned to Atlantis for the first time in four years; he, like the other Senators and commanders, were eager to see the course plotted by their new leader...
The wars had been successful, and Vulpis had gained renown and and fame as the bold Legate of the Atlantean legions. However, as the conscripts laid down their arms, and the legionnaires were dispatched, commander by lower ranking, and largely forgettable subordinates, Vulpis' concerns were growing... he had gained esteem and popular opinion, yes, but certainly some in the Senate would not take kindly to another upstart general, even one as independent and largely temperate as him.
He quickly shook those thoughts out of his head, as he, and his personal retinue, returned to Atlantis for the first time in four years; he, like the other Senators and commanders, were eager to see the course plotted by their new leader...
((Yay update! That was great Mr. Capitalist, but if you don't mind me asking why did you invade Heras?))
Illriyo walks back into the senate for the first time in four years. Pleased to return to its hallowed halls and allow the cogs in his mind to be put to work with a new plans.
He smiles
"Greetings my fellow Senators, it has been far to long."
"Where 'ave you been Illriyo!" a enthused Populare shouted from the eastern wing of the senate."
"Oh where haven't I been, from the Republic of Arixandos to the Empire of Borixson, to Korizembe to Eurpaxo. On the orders of our late Imperatar I have secured us a powerful alliance, one that will soon unite all of Atlantis under a just and glorious government." Speaking of the Great Graetius I was inconsolably saddened by the news of his passing. It was by his sacrifice that this war was won and our Republic was strengthened. Now our new Imperatar Auron Desimondus has done a tremendous job of living up the legacy of the Great Graetius, but there is now a whole for leadership in our party, we are in dire need of a second in command. A diserius is needed, I would like to nominate myself for this position. With Auron and eye at the helm of the republic this nation will no doubt florish and become the rightful ruler of Atlantis once more.
Illriyo walks back into the senate for the first time in four years. Pleased to return to its hallowed halls and allow the cogs in his mind to be put to work with a new plans.
He smiles
"Greetings my fellow Senators, it has been far to long."
"Where 'ave you been Illriyo!" a enthused Populare shouted from the eastern wing of the senate."
"Oh where haven't I been, from the Republic of Arixandos to the Empire of Borixson, to Korizembe to Eurpaxo. On the orders of our late Imperatar I have secured us a powerful alliance, one that will soon unite all of Atlantis under a just and glorious government." Speaking of the Great Graetius I was inconsolably saddened by the news of his passing. It was by his sacrifice that this war was won and our Republic was strengthened. Now our new Imperatar Auron Desimondus has done a tremendous job of living up the legacy of the Great Graetius, but there is now a whole for leadership in our party, we are in dire need of a second in command. A diserius is needed, I would like to nominate myself for this position. With Auron and eye at the helm of the republic this nation will no doubt florish and become the rightful ruler of Atlantis once more.
((Heras was one of the Urollan barbarian states.))
"I am saddened to hear the news that our fair leader Graetius has fallen. These rumours of an assassination trouble me greatly, our land is meant to be one of democracy, not of political assassinations to preserve any power we hold. I do hope these rumours are just that, rumours, and not true. I will do my utmost over the next four years to do Azlanxo proud.-Auron Desimodius
"I am saddened to hear the news that our fair leader Graetius has fallen. These rumours of an assassination trouble me greatly, our land is meant to be one of democracy, not of political assassinations to preserve any power we hold. I do hope these rumours are just that, rumours, and not true. I will do my utmost over the next four years to do Azlanxo proud.-Auron Desimodius
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"I too am saddened by the death of our Imperatar." Solangus says as he walks into the Forum. "I have read many reports on what happened: dying gloriously in battle, making a foolish decision that cost him his life, and finally catching a diseases from a street whore. But this is the first time I have heard someone suggest he was assassinated."
((So are we still having a vote on what death Graetius had?))
((So are we still having a vote on what death Graetius had?))
Noble friends, like yourselves, I have been inundated with anecdotes regarding the death of our Imperator, Graetius Tauronian. Indeed, it seems there as many tales as there are mouths to tell them. In order to assuage the concerns of my fellow Senators, and indeed fulfil my own curiosity, I dispatched a message to Legate Vulpis Aureolis, lieutenant to the late Imperator in the Urollan Campaign. He has informed me thusly:
That Graetius Tauronian died on the battlefield, having overreached himself in a hitherto decisive skirmish against the Urollara hordes. According to this account, the late Imperator charged the flanks of the enemy before total field supremacy had been achieved; he was thus overwhelmed, with his guard at his side, by the sheer number of his foes. It was an ill-conceived and costly blunder, no doubt brought on by Graetius overestimating his own martial aptitude and underestimating the threat posed by the barbarians. Since the Legate was an eyewitness, and is of sound character and mind, I cannot see how anything but his report could be admitted into the public record as the official account of the death of Graetius Tauronian. Let us therefore put these rumours to rest.
Still, I am concerned by the allegation of assassination. Let the public record note that I have always opposed and despised assassination as an aristocratic vice, for only those without public favour would resort to such a despicable act. An assault on any citizen of the Republic is treason - but an assault on the commander of our legions in a time of war is especially unconscionable, dangerous and depraved. I have been clear in my views towards the late Graetius Tauronian, who - lest we forget - abused his office to threaten this sacred body with bloodshed, brought disrepute upon himself by a reputation for debauchery and managed to mishandle the Urollan Campaign to the extent that his own life was forfeit as result of his errors. But I have always stated my intention to depose him by democratic, and not murderous, means.
Senator Desimodius, however, is right. There has been an assassination as of late. But it was not the body of the late Graetius that was pierced by assassin's daggers, but the body politic. The people of the Republic elected Graetius Tauronian as Imperator. They did not elect Auron Desimodius. The latter was selected as his successor by an internal vote of the Populares; the people were never consulted, and their interests were not represented in the imperial succession. The 'Acting Imperator' has no electoral mandate; he does not possess the popular will. He has faced no election in order to obtain his current position. Without a constitution regarding the succession of imperium, his usurpation of the post of Imperator is yet of dubious legality.
Even now, his supporters conspire to enact legislation that would empower him to dissolve the Curia at will, veto laws passed by majority vote for second reading, assume unchallenged command of our legions and enjoy exemption from all legal oversight and prosecution. Ominously, the Senator himself has proposed a constitution that would preserve an Imperator who lacked a parliamentary majority from being deposed by restricting a vote of no confidence to a majority of two-thirds instead of a simple majority. The Populares grant greater and greater powers to their leader while undermining his accountability to the Curia, the people and the Republic. The late Graetius Tauronian threatened to purge the Curia of his political opponents; his successor would enfeeble its institutions and so render it subservient to an all-powerful Imperator. Shall the will of the people be dismissed only four years into our new republic? We have overthrown an oligarchy merely to see it supplanted by a monarchy.
The successor regime is without constitutional legitimacy or popular support. Therefore, it is faced with a choice. It may announce new elections, and so achieve legitimacy through popular vote. Or it may continue as it stands, as a mockery of the Republic and its democratic character.
I vote against the Powers Bill. I would put it to the Senate that, this document essentially being constitutional in character, as it ascribes and defines the powers of the institutions of the Republic and of the Imperator, it is necessary that there be an absolute two-thirds majority for the proposal to be passed into law. Moreover, as it incorporates the constitution proposed by Senator Desimodius, which restricts motions of no confidence to a two-thirds majority vote, the bill itself would require the support of two-thirds of the Senate in order to become legal.
- Caesennia Caprica
(( @ Chlorna: It seems there are to be multiple accounts of Graetius' death, so that no one actually knows what really happened and any one can support whichever account is most politically convenient.))
That Graetius Tauronian died on the battlefield, having overreached himself in a hitherto decisive skirmish against the Urollara hordes. According to this account, the late Imperator charged the flanks of the enemy before total field supremacy had been achieved; he was thus overwhelmed, with his guard at his side, by the sheer number of his foes. It was an ill-conceived and costly blunder, no doubt brought on by Graetius overestimating his own martial aptitude and underestimating the threat posed by the barbarians. Since the Legate was an eyewitness, and is of sound character and mind, I cannot see how anything but his report could be admitted into the public record as the official account of the death of Graetius Tauronian. Let us therefore put these rumours to rest.
Still, I am concerned by the allegation of assassination. Let the public record note that I have always opposed and despised assassination as an aristocratic vice, for only those without public favour would resort to such a despicable act. An assault on any citizen of the Republic is treason - but an assault on the commander of our legions in a time of war is especially unconscionable, dangerous and depraved. I have been clear in my views towards the late Graetius Tauronian, who - lest we forget - abused his office to threaten this sacred body with bloodshed, brought disrepute upon himself by a reputation for debauchery and managed to mishandle the Urollan Campaign to the extent that his own life was forfeit as result of his errors. But I have always stated my intention to depose him by democratic, and not murderous, means.
Senator Desimodius, however, is right. There has been an assassination as of late. But it was not the body of the late Graetius that was pierced by assassin's daggers, but the body politic. The people of the Republic elected Graetius Tauronian as Imperator. They did not elect Auron Desimodius. The latter was selected as his successor by an internal vote of the Populares; the people were never consulted, and their interests were not represented in the imperial succession. The 'Acting Imperator' has no electoral mandate; he does not possess the popular will. He has faced no election in order to obtain his current position. Without a constitution regarding the succession of imperium, his usurpation of the post of Imperator is yet of dubious legality.
Even now, his supporters conspire to enact legislation that would empower him to dissolve the Curia at will, veto laws passed by majority vote for second reading, assume unchallenged command of our legions and enjoy exemption from all legal oversight and prosecution. Ominously, the Senator himself has proposed a constitution that would preserve an Imperator who lacked a parliamentary majority from being deposed by restricting a vote of no confidence to a majority of two-thirds instead of a simple majority. The Populares grant greater and greater powers to their leader while undermining his accountability to the Curia, the people and the Republic. The late Graetius Tauronian threatened to purge the Curia of his political opponents; his successor would enfeeble its institutions and so render it subservient to an all-powerful Imperator. Shall the will of the people be dismissed only four years into our new republic? We have overthrown an oligarchy merely to see it supplanted by a monarchy.
The successor regime is without constitutional legitimacy or popular support. Therefore, it is faced with a choice. It may announce new elections, and so achieve legitimacy through popular vote. Or it may continue as it stands, as a mockery of the Republic and its democratic character.
I vote against the Powers Bill. I would put it to the Senate that, this document essentially being constitutional in character, as it ascribes and defines the powers of the institutions of the Republic and of the Imperator, it is necessary that there be an absolute two-thirds majority for the proposal to be passed into law. Moreover, as it incorporates the constitution proposed by Senator Desimodius, which restricts motions of no confidence to a two-thirds majority vote, the bill itself would require the support of two-thirds of the Senate in order to become legal.
- Caesennia Caprica
(( @ Chlorna: It seems there are to be multiple accounts of Graetius' death, so that no one actually knows what really happened and any one can support whichever account is most politically convenient.))
Vulpis arrived, just as Senator Caprica was finishing his dispatch to her regarding Graetius' death... as the she continued to speak, some of the less interested Senators turned their gaze to the Legate; as Caprica finished her address, an elder Senator, known for his staunch support of the late Imperator, sprinted to the podium, his long beard swaying wildly with each rushed step... catching his breath, he glared at Vulpis, and demanded
Is this... this dispatch you sent to Senator Caprica... true, Legate? Our great Imperator has been dead for nearly... two years, and rumours have been wildly popping up!
Vulpis, quickly scanning the room, seeing how the other Senators, particularly the more radical Populares, stared at him, Vulpis quickly read the dispatch, then cleared his throat...
Let me begin by saying that I too fear these rumours of assassination could have come true, had not our noble Imperator been slain in battle; and that some would some deviant or scoundrels would, especially in the situation stated by the good Senator Caprica, would be of immense concern, and would go far in destabilizing the Republic.
With each word, Vulpis stepped closer to the front of the Senate Hall, before reaching the podium; there, he paused, and turned to face the Senate.
However, Senators, it is true; our great leader, Graetius Tauronian, bravely led a charge with one hundred of his finest men, into the Urollan positions. He and his men fought valiantly and were slain in the defence of Atlantis and her people. The Imperator, seeing both the opportunity and the necessity to charge the Urollan flank, rushed in personally to hold back the Urollans, whilst my men marched to reinforce the battle line; sadly, the Urollans had hidden reserves which none of us saw, and their charge, brutal and lightning-quick, with hooping and hollering and other uncivilized actions, and Graetius and his guard were enveloped. His sacrifice bought us the time to reorganize and push back the then exhausted Urollans...
Many of us have issue with this new Imperator of ours, Auron Desimodius. I, for one, have an immense respect for the man as a level headed and judicious leader. However, since he came to power in an undefined way according to our laws, I wish to present a bill that would help in these situations, if one should ever happen again. I hope it will alleviate the concerns of this great body, and provide legitimacy to our new leader.
I would also like to say, before I go to my seat, on Powers Bill, it seems that the key issue is the provision that the Imperator can dissolve the Senate and force elections, along with a fear that the office could have too much power. I would suggest to my friend Senator Smight that it would certainly be more prudent to remove that proviso and to trim the power of the Imperator somewhat. I too have lingering concerns relating to this bill.
Is this... this dispatch you sent to Senator Caprica... true, Legate? Our great Imperator has been dead for nearly... two years, and rumours have been wildly popping up!
Vulpis, quickly scanning the room, seeing how the other Senators, particularly the more radical Populares, stared at him, Vulpis quickly read the dispatch, then cleared his throat...
Let me begin by saying that I too fear these rumours of assassination could have come true, had not our noble Imperator been slain in battle; and that some would some deviant or scoundrels would, especially in the situation stated by the good Senator Caprica, would be of immense concern, and would go far in destabilizing the Republic.
With each word, Vulpis stepped closer to the front of the Senate Hall, before reaching the podium; there, he paused, and turned to face the Senate.
However, Senators, it is true; our great leader, Graetius Tauronian, bravely led a charge with one hundred of his finest men, into the Urollan positions. He and his men fought valiantly and were slain in the defence of Atlantis and her people. The Imperator, seeing both the opportunity and the necessity to charge the Urollan flank, rushed in personally to hold back the Urollans, whilst my men marched to reinforce the battle line; sadly, the Urollans had hidden reserves which none of us saw, and their charge, brutal and lightning-quick, with hooping and hollering and other uncivilized actions, and Graetius and his guard were enveloped. His sacrifice bought us the time to reorganize and push back the then exhausted Urollans...
Many of us have issue with this new Imperator of ours, Auron Desimodius. I, for one, have an immense respect for the man as a level headed and judicious leader. However, since he came to power in an undefined way according to our laws, I wish to present a bill that would help in these situations, if one should ever happen again. I hope it will alleviate the concerns of this great body, and provide legitimacy to our new leader.
I would also like to say, before I go to my seat, on Powers Bill, it seems that the key issue is the provision that the Imperator can dissolve the Senate and force elections, along with a fear that the office could have too much power. I would suggest to my friend Senator Smight that it would certainly be more prudent to remove that proviso and to trim the power of the Imperator somewhat. I too have lingering concerns relating to this bill.
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I will not stand for this slander of our Imperatar's memory! If you read the Legates actual account you will see the Great Graetius died heroically on the battlefield, and that he was taken off-guard by hidden reserves, These are all febal attempts for the Mercators to tarnish the memory of the Imperatar.
I can't support this bill enough this is a fair and level-headed solution to the death of Imperatars.
Also your own testimony seems to place our Imperatar in a much more heroic light then the Mercators are painting him in.
Thank you for your support, Senator Moruterrar; in those tragic events, we need to have a system in place to ensure a stable and organized succession.
And to hopefully find some middle ground between you two fine Senators, I would say that the Imperator was somewhat vainglorious. However, some might say that he had every right to be; he had seized Atlantis with ease, been elected Imperator with high popularity, and had been successful in the campaign up until that point. Did he charge in, foolishly expecting to seize the day? Perhaps, perhaps not; I do not claim to know his mind. But I can say that, regardless of his reasons, his death gave us the chance to strike down the last army of the Urollans; that day, they were broken, and from then on, we marched freely across Atlantean lands by right and conquest.
And to hopefully find some middle ground between you two fine Senators, I would say that the Imperator was somewhat vainglorious. However, some might say that he had every right to be; he had seized Atlantis with ease, been elected Imperator with high popularity, and had been successful in the campaign up until that point. Did he charge in, foolishly expecting to seize the day? Perhaps, perhaps not; I do not claim to know his mind. But I can say that, regardless of his reasons, his death gave us the chance to strike down the last army of the Urollans; that day, they were broken, and from then on, we marched freely across Atlantean lands by right and conquest.
Firstly, I believe it is important to have a mechanism to dissolve a parliament that cannot work with itself. That power cannot rest with congress, so logically it should go to the Imperator. The safeguard is that the Imperator will also have to face an election should they dissolve the senate, meaning it will be an option of last resort in a disfunctional parliament. Furthermore, I do not believe that the extension of powers given to the Imperator is that great, for example, the partial veto does not give the Imperator powers to block a bill, only to delay it.
Secondly, I was not aware that constitutional changes required a "supermajority". I would be surprised if this were so, especially given that we are still in the process of forming a constitution for the republic.
((We shouldn't really change the rules during a vote, but, Mr Capitalist, can you confirm whether or not consitutional changes in the future will require 2/3rds or only a majority?))
Senator Krispin cautiously walks back into the Senate chambers with his followers, he sits and speaks with one of his aides:
"So the message did not get to Graetius in time?"
"No sire, I am afraid not..."
"Thats too bad, continue with the plans though..."
"As you wish"
The aide stands and leaves immediatly.
"So the message did not get to Graetius in time?"
"No sire, I am afraid not..."
"Thats too bad, continue with the plans though..."
"As you wish"
The aide stands and leaves immediatly.
It is a given that a constitution, and subsequently a constitutional amendment, must have an absolute majority of two-thirds in order to be legal. A constitution, after all, is supposed to provide a lasting settlement for the institutional imperium of the Republic. If a constitution can be accepted without a majority of two-thirds, it could then be overturned by simple majority: and so would fail to establish a permanent basis for the Republic. Instead of enjoying stability, Azlanxo would simply see a new constitution introduced and overruled with every shift of political dominance in the Curia. If this constitution is to provide for the entire Republic, and for so long as it may exist, then it must be embraced by an absolute majority of the Curia, and not just the ruling party.
As aforementioned, the Powers Bill incorporates the proposed constitution introduced by Senator Desimodius. In the text regarding motions of no confidence, the proposed constitution would restrict such motions to a majority of two-thirds in order to succeed. As such, it is only natural that this alone should require the approval of two-thirds of the Curia in order to be passed into law. Otherwise, we set the precedent whereby any Senator may introduce a bill, attach a clause stating that it cannot be revoked without the support of ninety per cent of the Curia, and then pass it into law by a simple majority. What aspiring autocrat might propose legislation empowering the Imperator to issue laws by decree, unless ninety-nine per cent of the Curia expressed disapproval, and then have it passed by their parliamentary allies?
The Curia asserts to the Appellate Court that the majority of two-thirds is necessary for this constitution to enjoy the force of law, and to protect democracy.
- Caesennia Caprica
As aforementioned, the Powers Bill incorporates the proposed constitution introduced by Senator Desimodius. In the text regarding motions of no confidence, the proposed constitution would restrict such motions to a majority of two-thirds in order to succeed. As such, it is only natural that this alone should require the approval of two-thirds of the Curia in order to be passed into law. Otherwise, we set the precedent whereby any Senator may introduce a bill, attach a clause stating that it cannot be revoked without the support of ninety per cent of the Curia, and then pass it into law by a simple majority. What aspiring autocrat might propose legislation empowering the Imperator to issue laws by decree, unless ninety-nine per cent of the Curia expressed disapproval, and then have it passed by their parliamentary allies?
The Curia asserts to the Appellate Court that the majority of two-thirds is necessary for this constitution to enjoy the force of law, and to protect democracy.
- Caesennia Caprica
((I agree but it's a bit unfair to change the rules during a vote, and as such the two thirds should only apply in future...Maybe there should be a bill that stipulates such and covers what happens to unconstitutional laws, but it wouldn't come into effect after the current round of voting))
I wish to table a motion, that, in recognition of his military leadership and his work for the republic, it is the opinion of this house that Graetius Tauronian should receive a posthumous tribute.
I wish to table a motion, that, in recognition of his military leadership and his work for the republic, it is the opinion of this house that Graetius Tauronian should receive a posthumous tribute.
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Unio Libertatis
Vires per Libertatem
Union of Freedom
Strength through Liberty
The Union of Freedom is built on moderatism; it’s goal is to unify Atlantis and her people, not through divisive politics, but through compromise. We seek to bridge the divide between the Mercators and the Populares to ensure our great nation can grow and prosper in stability. It was formed in the wake of the first election and made of those who rejected the blantant populism of the populares, but were loath to accept a transition to a country controlled by the merchants, not the people. It stands for justice, liberty and freedom throughout Atlantis.
Like the Mercators, we agree in a free market, and oppose most governmental control over the market; however, we do see the need to control trade slightly, if only to ensure that our laws are kept and to provide a degree of oversight. We also stand with them on the size of government, believing that giving regions more control will more effectively bring them into our nation, though we feel that the state should have a greater deal of authority than many Mercators. We support a plutocratic society, crafted through merit not blood, but we don't accept some of the radical sentiments of the Mercators.
Like the Populares, we believe that our people should be free and, through that freedom, our nation is kept strong and continually rejuvenated. We stand firmly in opposition to any attempt to enchain the free people of Atlantis. We support expanding our nation across the continent, both by militaristic and diplomatic means. We support an offensive doctrine to ensure that our men are always ready to fight.
The policies of the Unio Libertatis are thus:
(+1) Centralised/Decentralised.
(+3) Aristocracy/Plutocracy.
(+5) Serfdom/Free Subjects.
(-3) Innovative/Narrowminded.
(+4) Mercantilism/Free Trade.
(-4) Offensive/Defensive.
(0) Land/Naval.
(-3) Quality/Quantity.
(+3) Isolationism/Expansionism
(0) Secularism/Theocracy
The Petitor, who represents the union in the elections for Imperator, is elected from within the union before an election. The Praetor and Sub Praetor oversee the union and are elected following a general election.
Petitor (Candidate):
Vacant
Agens Praetor (Acting-Chairman): Vulpis Aureolis
Sub Praetor (Vice-Chairman):
Vacant
Membership (Commonly known as Liberators):Vulpis Aureolis
Marcellus Smigt
Erodel Krispin
Marcellus Smigt
Erodel Krispin
Unio Libertatis will bring freedom, justice and liberty to Atlantis and her People.
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I vote yes on this motion let us honor our fallen leader in the proper way.
This certainly makes things....interesting
Unio Libertatis
Vires per Libertatem
Union of Freedom
Strength through Liberty
The Union of Freedom is built on moderatism; it’s goal is to unify Atlantis and her people, not through divisive politics, but through compromise. We seek to bridge the divide between the Mercators and the Populares to ensure our great nation can grow and prosper in stability. It was formed in the wake of the first election and made of those who rejected the blantant populism of the populares, but were loath to accept a transition to a country controlled by the merchants, not the people. It stands for justice, liberty and freedom throughout Atlantis.
Like the Mercators, we agree in a free market, and oppose most governmental control over the market; however, we do see the need to control trade slightly, if only to ensure that our laws are kept and to provide a degree of oversight. We also stand with them on the size of government, believing that giving regions more control will more effectively bring them into our nation, though we feel that the state should have a greater deal of authority than many Mercators. We support a plutocratic society, crafted through merit not blood, but we don't accept some of the radical sentiments of the Mercators.
Like the Populares, we believe that our people should be free and, through that freedom, our nation is kept strong and continually rejuvenated. We stand firmly in opposition to any attempt to enchain the free people of Atlantis. We support expanding our nation across the continent, both by militaristic and diplomatic means. We support an offensive doctrine to ensure that our men are always ready to fight.
The policies of the Unio Libertatis are thus:
(+1) Centralised/Decentralised.(+3) Aristocracy/Plutocracy.(+5) Serfdom/Free Subjects.(-3) Innovative/Narrowminded.(+4) Mercantilism/Free Trade.(-4) Offensive/Defensive.(0) Land/Naval.(-3) Quality/Quantity.(+3) Isolationism/Expansionism(0) Secularism/Theocracy
The Petitor, who represents the union in the elections for Imperator, is elected from within the union before an election. The Praetor and Sub Praetor oversee the union and are elected following a general election.
Petitor (Candidate):VacantAgens Praetor (Acting-Chairman):Vulpis AureolisSub Praetor (Vice-Chairman):
VacantMembership (Commonly known as Liberators):Vulpis Aureolis
Marcellus Smigt
Unio Libertatis will bring freedom, justice and liberty to Atlantis and her People.
- Status