Help needed for forming Italy
Nice! How will the lien affect you when/if you leave the Empire?
See below
This must have changed since MMP2 then. Good for you. Tuscany is now in a pretty comfortable position. And it is only 1577, not bad.
Thanks, yes I'm very satisfied with my luck and performance thus far.
Indeed, there must have been some changes in MMU. Now that I play it, I see Venice's land is outside HRE, but this mechanism is new to me. So actually, you got away with land-grabbing. Poore Venice, it being outside HRE puts it in a precarious position; although in my now second MMU game I see La Serenissima not only surviving but doing well (late 1500s).
I wonder if the wars of religion will break out. I love the feature but too often I see them to peter out.
The outcome of the Iberian Peninsula war has a potential to reshape Europe almost as much as the arrive of Tuscany. France seems strong even though it hasn't consolidated yet.
France has had Lorraine and Hainaut as vassals for a long time as well. It refuses to kick England out of Morbihan, Normandy and Gascogne though.
Help Needed for forming Italy
Well, I can probably conquer Italy without your help, but I need some suggestions for exactly what should be required.
I hadn't actually played in Italy in MMU and was basing my knowledge of forming Italy on the MM Manual, but apparently the Iron Crown decisions were taken out between MMP2 and MMU. The only way to form Italy in MMU as it now stands is the Italian Nation decision, which requires owning Rome, Genoa, Naples, Venice, and Milan, having a core in Rome, having a core in Genoa OR Venice, and having a core in Milan OR Naples. This decision immediately removes all provinces from the Empire (meaning you have to leave the Empire), moves the capital to Rome (I want to stay in Florence) and gives cores on all provinces in Italy region (which includes all Italian cultures plus Savoie, Trent, Malta, and Istria)
Here's the thing: At this point (now 1615) I now own the majority of Italy, but taking Venice is next to impossible as I just don't have the fleet necessary to get there.
Here's my beefs with this new decision:
1) I don't think having all 5 of those cities should be necessary. Historically, Sardinia-Piedmont > Italy became Italy without Rome or Venice. Granted, that was a nationalist movement and this will be more of a dynastical claim to Italy the region.
2) I don't think forming Italy should,
necessarily, remove you from the Empire.
3) I don't think you should have to move capital to Rome, but have an option (decision) to do so once you form it.
So I need help coming up with a new 'Take the Iron Crown' and 'Granted the Iron Crown' decisions, the primary difference being one takes you out of the Empire; the other keeps you in it.
What I've come up with (Latin culture group, not PAP, etc are givens):
Take the Iron Crown:
- Own (or own through vassal) Milan (where the Iron Crown is)
- Own (or own through vassals) [1/2, 2/3?] of [Italy region/Latin culture?] provinces
Effects:
- Kicks Italy out of the Empire, if in it.
- Infamy, bad relations and CBs for Pope, HRE, Italian states, etc. pretty much everyone will hate your Napoleonic ambitions
- Cores on all Latin provinces (not Trent, Savoie, Malta,
maybe Istria)
Granted the Iron Crown
- Imperial member state and/or HR Emperor
- Own and [core or 'Imperial recognition of de-facto possesion'] on all Lombard and Ligurian provinces (includes Milan)
- +195 relations with Emperor or are Emperor
Effects:
- Keeps Italy in the Empire (or joins if non-member Emperor?)
- Cores on all Latin provinces in HRE region (all Lombard, Ligurian, Venetian, Tuscan provinces, plus Savoie? not Trent and Istria)
- bad relations with other Italian states, less infamy than taking it
Suggestions? Criticisms? Comments? All welcome. I'm not really looking to make it easier, per se, but I find the current requirements too restrictive.