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Seelensturm

Lt. General
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Jan 30, 2007
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I recently switched from EU4 and I am still playing my very first game in CK2. I already noticed some things which feel a bit gamey and I am not sure if they are intended this way. I developed for EU4 a bunch of house rules because otherwise the game becomes far too easy and it destroys immersion if you do crazy things no other country/character is capable of. As a basic rule: if the AI doesn't do it, I won't do it.

One thing I noticed in CK2 are how the education traits are handled. If you switch the guardian just before the ward turns 16, you can determine the education trait independently from the other stats. If you use a level 4 guardian for this, 80% of the wards will get level 3 or 4 of the same trait. I am pretty sure the AI doesn't do it and it leads to a micromanagement hell where you have to remember when the children are coming of age to switch the guardian in time.

The other feature I just became aware of is inviting characters to court. You can land them and push their claims. This seems to be one of the easiest ways for expansion without the need to bother much with the marriage game to gain claims. Or just invite characters with good stats for the council. First question again: does the AI invite characters for these purposes? From a gameplay and immersion point it almost looks to easy, too. Look at this guy:

f8t99faz.png


He has a positive opinion of his liege (his brother) and only a slighter higher one of me (a complete stranger). He has a spouse and an employment as marshal. He has the right religion, culture and lives with his kin. But just because he can't push his claim he is willing to leave everything behind and follow an invitation to a foreign place he doesn't know at all? No promise needed that his claim will actually be pushed and no bag of gold to convince him?

I don't really know yet what the AI is capable of in this game. I would be glad if you could give me an overview which gamey tactics to avoid.
 
Both of those things is actually pretty complicated and not as easy as you're thinking it is. I think it's fine to do what you're doing -- in fact, it's part of the fun. People will often refuse to come to your court even if they have claims, and there's no super convenient way to search for people with high stats and claims that you specifically can press.

I'm sensitive to "gameyness," but these are obviously fine, although I don't know much about education.
 
Both of those things is actually pretty complicated and not as easy as you're thinking it is. I think it's fine to do what you're doing -- in fact, it's part of the fun. People will often refuse to come to your court even if they have claims, and there's no super convenient way to search for people with high stats and claims that you specifically can press.

I'm sensitive to "gameyness," but these are obviously fine, although I don't know much about education.

Actually there is. In the find character sort by same religious group, not a ruler, male, and by whatever base stat you want for your council and it's pretty easy to find a new councillor in the 15-20+ range. There's even a little crown in the corner of courtiers that have claims that are more likely to join your court.

And if you're looking for claimants to a specific Duchy or Kingdom, there's the convenient claimants tab whenever you select a title, so if there are any viable claimants you'd like to land and press their claim it's pretty easy to find out.
 
house rule: avoid gaming besides stack baits.

if my ruler is an imbecile with god awful stats, by god, we'll have my nation crash and burn til thety die.

is my character an imbecile with a great martial stat? Then by god is he going ot charge his army and lose me a war right on into the superior force, also giving me a better ruler
 
Actually there is. In the find character sort by same religious group, not a ruler, male, and by whatever base stat you want for your council and it's pretty easy to find a new councillor in the 15-20+ range. There's even a little crown in the corner of courtiers that have claims that are more likely to join your court.
The crown doesn't suggest they're claims you're interested in, right? I'm pretty sure it just means they have claims.

Whether you'll be well placed enough to press them (from their perspective) is not really guaranteed.

And if you're looking for claimants to a specific Duchy or Kingdom, there's the convenient claimants tab whenever you select a title, so if there are any viable claimants you'd like to land and press their claim it's pretty easy to find out.
Yes, that part itself is not terribly hard, but again -- just the fact that someone is a claimant isn't enough for them to want to come to your court. Moreover, it's not always super easy to stay in control of them after you press their claim, as you need to be related or their de jure liege.

I don't think any of this is as easy as you guys are making it out to be.
 
I don't really know yet what the AI is capable of in this game. I would be glad if you could give me an overview which gamey tactics to avoid.

One I can think of is that the AI doesnt use any succession laws except Gavelkind and Primogeniture. It will never willingly change to elective, seniority or ultimogeniture. This means you can 'game' the system by changing to ultimogeniture or elective yourself and never raising crown law to High, meaning your vassals are stuck to gavelkind for eternity while you reap the benefits of your heir inheriting all titles.

So, to keep it 'fair' I guess, you'd have to force yourself to never move succession law except to Primogeniture.
 
One I can think of is that the AI doesnt use any succession laws except Gavelkind and Primogeniture.

Good point.
Other gamey / AI fail things I noticed so far:

- just as in EU4 AI never seems to retreat from unfavorable battle before morale is broken (what the fuck is wrong with you Paradox, they did in EU3?)
- (repeatedly) imprison characters just to farm them for ransom e.g. after excommunicating them
- switching religion just for gameplay advantages e.g. holy war on everyone or the possibility of a papal vassal
- make vassals rebel on purpose e.g. by keeping their levies raised