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Introduction & What I Want To See In CIM2/CIM3

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M4J3FFR135 said:
You're quite right about cities in modern times not rushing to build metro lines, however living near London I struggle to walk 100 yards without seeing an underground station. I'm used to using an extensive underground metro system, so that reflects in my gameplay on CIM2. We also have the DLR and the Croydon Tramlink, mixed with bus systems and even boats on the Thames. I try to use every transport system in the game, because in real life that's how it is here. Each to their own.
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I think I came across the wrong the way. I use all forms of transport and also like building metro systems myself, but I guess I see it more of as if a modern city was building a system from scratch today. To build a system like NYC or London would be prohibitively expensive if built today, so I don't find it realistic to have a subway line down every street like NYC or London. However, I do see if that if you want that feel of those 2 cities, then I think it's great. For me I would do it just to pretend that metro system has been in place for a 100 years. Overall though, when it comes to playing the game with money, subways are way too cheap in the game.

I'm just going by what I see screenshots in the community. I could deal with an London type system, but 4 track Subways every 30 yards and 8 track tramways on streets seem unrealistic and cheap to me. You wouldn't be showing you are a good transport planner, just someone who can blow through any challenge with subways.
 
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C40LFR said:
I think I came across the wrong the way. I use all forms of transport and also like building metro systems myself, but I guess I see it more of as if a modern city was building a system from scratch today. To build a system like NYC or London would be prohibitively expensive if built today, so I don't find it realistic to have a subway line down every street like NYC or London. However, I do see if that if you want that feel of those 2 cities, then I think it's great. For me I would do it just to pretend that metro system has been in place for a 100 years. Overall though, when it comes to playing the game with money, subways are way too cheap in the game.

I'm just going by what I see screenshots in the community. I could deal with an London type system, but 4 track Subways every 30 yards and 8 track tramways on streets seem unrealistic and cheap to me. You wouldn't be showing you are a good transport planner, just someone who can blow through any challenge with subways.
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That's fair enough, everyone likes to do their own thing. 4 track subways can be useful if used properly (not that I think my way is best), and sometimes I have an express tram down the middle of avenues and a secondary line in the outside lanes for a more "local" service to compliment the method I use with metros. My thing is to have lots of vehicles running with lots of interchanges, using 4 track metro with trams, buses and trolleys connecting.
 
Metro lines have to be cheap if the game is to work as originally conceived; that's with a commercial transport company.

The idea of a company building a metro system in a city on a commercial basis is totally unrealistic. Very few cities expects it transport system to even break even on it's operating costs, let alone financing the construction of even light rail lines!
The new Crossrail line through central London is costing over five billion pounds, the interest on a loan of that size could never be paid out of revenue.

So should CIM3 abandon the commercial model entirely?

Perhaps the TfL (Transport for London) model would make a better basis for the game? TfL is not only responsible for public transport, it is also responsible for maintaining the entire London road network, including traffic management.
 
M4J3FFR135 said:
I thought Crossrail was costing £15 Billion? Might be the whole project rather than just the main railway link though.
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Sorry, my error it is 15 billion. That re-reinforces my point about the games model.

There is one other feature that I neglected to mention in my last post. That is CIM2's model for car journeys. Wouldn't it be wonderful if we could drive somewhere and have your car beam-up Startrek like when you arrive, then beam-down again when you wish to return, having to worry about parking. Unfortunately real life is not like that!
So CIM3 ought to have a more realistic way of dealing with cars! They should need to be parked somewhere when they arrive at their destination and also when they return home. So, lack of parking places would limit the amount of car commuting, as it does in reality. Likewise 'park and ride' would become an important feature in the game.
 
Norfolk_Chris said:
There is one other feature that I neglected to mention in my last post. That is CIM2's model for car journeys. Wouldn't it be wonderful if we could drive somewhere and have your car beam-up Startrek like when you arrive, then beam-down again when you wish to return, having to worry about parking. Unfortunately real life is not like that!
So CIM3 ought to have a more realistic way of dealing with cars! They should need to be parked somewhere when they arrive at their destination and also when they return home. So, lack of parking places would limit the amount of car commuting, as it does in reality. Likewise 'park and ride' would become an important feature in the game.
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Park & Rides would be an amazing addition to the series. Then you can build transport hubs around the park & rides and that would certainly reduce traffic in your city centres! The way cars just disappear is so unrealistic, as is the way they can teleport from streets to metro/monorail platforms, so I'd like that to be fixed too for CIM3.
 
Norfolk_Chris said:
Metro lines have to be cheap if the game is to work as originally conceived; that's with a commercial transport company.

The idea of a company building a metro system in a city on a commercial basis is totally unrealistic. Very few cities expects it transport system to even break even on it's operating costs, let alone financing the construction of even light rail lines!
The new Crossrail line through central London is costing over five billion pounds, the interest on a loan of that size could never be paid out of revenue.

So should CIM3 abandon the commercial model entirely?
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Is CiM2 based on a purely commercial transport company, though? How many purely commercial transport companies can build/demolish reconfigure roads as they see fit?
 
slornie said:
Is CiM2 based on a purely commercial transport company, though? How many purely commercial transport companies can build/demolish reconfigure roads as they see fit?
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Correct.

The player in this game has as much power as any County Metropolitan Transportation Authority here in the US, which handles funding for both transit and highway projects, while providing directly operate bus and Metro rail services. This why I always play on unlimited money, but build political and realistically. Not sure what the hierarchy is in Europe though. So it's realistic in that sense, but yes, no commercial company would have that kind of power.

Norfolk, subway costs should be WAY higher. If the player isn't play on unlimited money, the city should give a grant that can pay for a certain length of subway. Perhaps influence by the in game economy graph. A city would definitely be less willing to fork over the cash for a subway in a recession.
 
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slornie said:
Is CiM2 based on a purely commercial transport company, though? How many purely commercial transport companies can build/demolish reconfigure roads as they see fit?
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As an aside. One of the daftest things in CIM2 is that you have to demolish and rebuild an entire road just to add, or remove a bus lane!

In CIM3 need to be able to be added and removed in the same way as tram tracks.
 
Norfolk_Chris said:
As an aside. One of the daftest things in CIM2 is that you have to demolish and rebuild an entire road just to add, or remove a bus lane!

In CIM3 need to be able to be added and removed in the same way as tram tracks.
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That would be a perfect solution to one of my biggest problems, especially when the road has a bus/tram stop already built on it.

Another thing I think could be better is lopsided roads. Roads with 2 lanes in one direction and 3 in the other. Or even better, that layout that changes depending on the time of day, so commuters don't cause too much traffic and so your vehicles can keep moving. To my knowledge, that system isn't too common in the UK, but I'm sure it's a well used thing in the US. That would be really useful in the city I'm currently working on that's for sure!
 
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