Home Trending Latest threads New posts Developer diaries

Late Game Alliances

Jump to latest Follow Reply
  • We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Victoria 2 17560 After Action Reports (AAR)
TheBromgrev

TheBromgrev

Field Marshal
78 Badges
Jan 10, 2010
10.831
539
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • 500k Club
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Victoria 2 Beta
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • BATTLETECH
  • Surviving Mars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • BATTLETECH: Season pass
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • BATTLETECH: Heavy Metal
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • BATTLETECH: Flashpoint
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Hearts of Iron 4: Arms Against Tyranny
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Victoria 2
I'm playing a 1.3 game as the German Empire, having united Germany in 1860, with the additions of Bohemia and all of Denmark. My biggest problem is that no one will ally with me under any circumstances. To the contrary, with the exception of Belgium, Switzerland, and the Netherlands, who are all in my sphere, everyone else is allied together. The result is that every time France tries to regain Alsace-Lorraine, I end up fighting France, the UK, Sweden, Austria, and Russia plus all of their little satellite nations. While I outclass everyone when it comes to techs (I've run out of industry/military techs to research for the moment) and can get a new tech about every 9 months or so, there's no way I can handle the combined might all Europe.

I feel this is a game-breaker, as I don't find any enjoyment on getting picked on by everyone every 5 years, and sometimes load up as the UK (war leader) to stop the bullying. During truce-time I try and get my relations back up to +200, but even then no one will ally with me. In the off-chance I do find an ally, since everyone else has 200 relations with each other and allied with each other, the AI prefers to join its buddies instead of helping me. Is there some fundamental AI function that tells it to go all-out against the player, or am I just making noob mistakes?
 
Is your infamy high? I've found that high infamy makes it unlikely that anyone will ever ally with me outside of my sphere nor provide military access for that matter. In my current Haitian game it has been a terrible problem for me as I'm expanding whenever my infamy permits an acquisition or whenever I get a "free" state CB (rarely truly free as I'm breaking a truce to get it, but infamy significant reduced state CB I suppose.)

The other thing might be that you're score is so high that the rest of the world wants to take a piece of you (and this may exacerbate the effects of high infamy.) I saw this happen to the AI a few times where Europe formed a mega-alliance against the UK and now there are pieces of French England. England has been gimped by this and the French are ascendent and now it is the French that can't seem to maintain an alliance outside of her sphere. I'm not sure if this behavior is somehow built into the AI or if it's just a series of coincidences that I have observed.

I'm fairly certain that the game doesn't pick on you (the player) in particular simply because you are the player. There seems to be several other factors involved that apply to the AI states as well.

Edit: What is your infamy and your score relative to the rest of the world? Have you picked on the other powers previously? Polish acquisitions from Russia? Are you and England battling for the same sphere? I've never had a problem with France as Germany ... but I always concern myself with my military before I bother going crazy with industrialization to keep everyone off of my back.
 
Well, my infamy was fairly high in the beginning, due to grabbing Bohemia and Denmark. France did a war of containment on me, which is how I got Alsace-Lorraine. After grabbing Copenhagen around '58 or so (don't remember, it might've been in the early 60's), I haven't done anything except defend against the European onslaught, white peace ASAP, then prepare for the next round. It's 1875 right now, and I've finally started to colonize, beginning by building the Suez Canal and taking West Morocco (the only region in range). Aside from the Infamy hit by taking the Domyat? concession, my infamy isn't very high, and is certainly below 25. I'm ranked #3 in score at 1,800. The UK has about 2,500 and France has a ridiculous 4,500 due to the insane industrial score it has (3,200). So, I'm definitely not the biggest guy around.

Anyway, I put that game on hold due to frustration and started a Sardinia game to try something different. I haven't run into the super-alliance problem yet, but France always seems to break alliances with me during peacetime. France will ask for an alliance during a war, I agree and honor it, then France breaks it later. The only reason I manged to unite Italy was because Russia actually honored my alliance and oddly didn't become the war leader, so I got everything I wanted plus rewarded a few other helpers. That said, I'm also starting to see the same pattern I mentioned earlier happen this time around too, as the Europeans are just now beginning to form their super-alliance against the NGF, so maybe the AI is just really scared of Germany for some reason :)
 
Alliances are rather broken -- at least those outside of your sphere. You'll sometimes find yourself in a spin-cycle with alliance partners. You'll agree to an alliance and two weeks later they'll dissolve the alliance and two weeks later they're begging you for an alliance. This can go on so long as the power has the diplomatic points to spare. It's especially annoying if you're in a position where you really need that alliance.

If you're playing Sardinian Piedmont I'd avoid using Cavour's Diplomacy decision. Perhaps there have been some tweaks in 1.3 of which I am unaware but in previous versions I've found the French to be entirely unreliable. I'll use Cavour's Diplomacy only as a BB dump to take lands more valuable than those I'm giving the French. My very first Sardinia Piedmont game in 1.2 I wound up reloading ten times in the hopes that the French would honour the alliance as I went to war with the Austrians. They never did and I had to tag-switch to get them to accept. I believe there is a BB reduction of 10 and that is all that I see it reliably providing.

As for as your earlier game ... I recently came across "threat" in a save file that I was attempting to fix. I have no solid factual knowledge of what this does ... but I'm wondering if aggressive tendencies modify this any. Perhaps someone with a stronger working knowledge of the files could enlighten us there.
 
Well, the only ways to stop these wars is:
a. Expand your military score since it is a major determinant of whether or not France will attack you (when you gain the ability to build dreadnoughts, start constructing hordes of them).
b. Drop your infamy WAY below the 25 limit. Liberate Denmark and Bohemia. This will instantly reduce it by 10.
c. If nothing else works, give up Alsace Lorraine.
 
Some things to keep in mind with alliances.

1) Infamy is a big factor. Even if you are below the legal limit (25), infamy will still make GPs reluctant to ally with you. Basically, if your infamy is higher than 4-5, it is very unlikely that GPs will ally with you.

2) If you can get your infamy to almost zero, and get relations up past 100, at least one GP should want to ally with you. Whether its a useful GP or not is a different question. :)

3) With GPs, you can raise relations up to 200 as insurance against aggression. Unless the GP has cores, it is unlikely that a GP with 200 relations will go to war with you. The cost in infamy and prestige is too high. They might still honor an alliance with another power (France in your case), but if they like you more than France, and your infamy is low, then there is a decent chance they will tell them to go to Hell.

4) A high military score can deter aggression; however, if you military score is that high, then you probably have nothing to worry about with a war breaking out between you and all the other GPs anyway.

5) If cores are involved in conflicts between GPs, expect to fight multiple wars. France/Germany are the best examples of this, but the Ottomans/Egypt are another, as is the USA/CSA if the CSA manages to white peace. Basically, expect to keep fighting the Franco-Prussian War over and over again until you dwarf France's military score or you annex enough of France to cripple her.

7) Even if I am allied with another GP, I would never call them in an offensive war. The AI is notorious for refusing offensive wars. But if you never bother calling them, then they can't say no and break the alliance. :D

In most of my games, I tend to end up with only one GP that is really my friend, if even that. Because of rivalries and colonial conflicts between all GPs, it is really hard to build a late 19th century alliance system in Vic2. The GPs have too many reasons to hate and fight one another to form cohesive alliance blocks for very long. Also, since I am usually close to the infamy limit (I budget infamy very carefully), I scare away potential allies. However, don't be fooled. It is possible to ally with GPs. In my last game as the Netherlands, I even managed to ally with the UK late in the game. For about 20 years, the Netherlands and the UK basically ruled the ocean together, carving up Asia between us and laughing at the French and Austrians with their pitiful African colonies.

Oh, and just for fun, the UK didn't mind when I snagged some pieces of continental France. Why should they? I let them annex half of China. :D
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom
Back