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Rajas of india

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Trashed said:
India? Screw that poo. That place had little to no interaction with Europe and the ME (apart from the trade routes that aren't even simulated) in the period. Of all the things they could do to make a game about the crusades, heresies, knights and peasants more interesting they simply expand the map to encompass more territory without any historical relevance.

Then again, after the Aztecs I was constantly worried they would just say screw it and throw all pretense into the wind.
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You have no idea how wrong you are...

Seriously, it hurts.

No interaction? Quite the opposite, tremendous interaction. Islamic traders and invasions both maritime and overland. Cultural exchanges. And the simple fact pressure from Indian Powers changes how the Islamic powers have to act.

You call for historical relevance? Gaining a new part of the world that had any real effect at all, even just ripples, is a tremendous boon to realism.
 
Trashed said:
That place had little to no interaction with Europe and the ME (apart from the trade routes that aren't even simulated) in the period.
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Not true. Particularly when it comes to the middle east.
 
dulahan said:
You have no idea how wrong you are...

Seriously, it hurts.

No interaction? Quite the opposite, tremendous interaction. Islamic traders and invasions both maritime and overland. Cultural exchanges. And the simple fact pressure from Indian Powers changes how the Islamic powers have to act.

You call for historical relevance? Gaining a new part of the world that had any real effect at all, even just ripples, is a tremendous boon to realism.
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I think he, (like myself) may mainly play Catholic rulers, who would not have had much interaction with India. (Given that they had to go through Islamic nations who weren't wild about such things.)
 
Sebor13 said:
I'm really excited for this.

Just imagine unifying India, overtaking the Middle East and Europe, and then conquering Britain before they can conquer India.

Also, for those angrily demanding polish to what they already have, they said that would be the main focus on the second phase of DLC (which started with Sons of Abraham) so I assume that they're going to spend the rest of phase two on polishing what they already have (if it's as long as phase one, that's three more DLC).

And then phase three could be East Asia which would be pretty amazing, if they don't include the land the Mongols came from (so that the Hordes are still guaranteed to happen).

Japan, China, and northern mainland Southeast Asia (Vietnam, Laos, Thailand, Cambodia, and Burma) would be great for phase three. And then a few DLC to expand on those places and flesh them out more.

As far as boats go, I think they'll be making two different areas for oceans (three if they do East Asia) with no way of getting in between. I'm fine with that. In reality, they had no way of getting across that land.

The only thing I'm concerned about is what will they do with missionaries? Will you have to be a certain distance away to send one or will they add travel times? I doubt they'd make the religions of India reformed. but they might be (I actually kind of hope they don't so that the player can reform them themselves).

And something I'm really excited about, the idea of crusading for land in India.

I usually play as the Slavic and Norse Pagans (I prefer the Russian Norse when playing as them) so that would mean I'd have to go through Persia first, but still.

EDIT: Also, trade (or the lack there of) could be an issue too. Europe wasn't very big on trade but the Middle East and certainly India was. I hope they find a way to add it to the game (possibly the next DLC?).
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They should not stop until the Pa-pus are in the game, you just know that the Pa-pus forming a massive maritime empire in medieval tmes is just meant to happen. :wub:
 
Jakalak said:
alright, let's just strip the analogy for right now.

what's actually happening? in all likelihood, paradox is developing a DLC that will include India, and the map expansion itself will be included in a patch, so regardless of whether you want India, you're getting India. You're also getting whatever half-baked mechanics and bugs that come along with it (if, in fact, it comes with them). this also means development probably isn't happening for more depth in the game as we know it now.

So, returning to the analogy, Paradox is selling a coffee machine in the car you already have. This coffee machine is located on the dashboard and is liable to just explore and smear you all over and give you third-degree burns. Don't like it? Never use the car ever again, or at least until the coffee machine is fixed, because as it is, it's a death trap.

--
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Where did you find that the map extension will be included in the patch? Instead of bashing the Indian DLC, why don't just ask PDS to not include India in the patch. In fact, I believe PDS is more than happy to exclude feature from a free patch.
 
Chevaresqye said:
Where did you find that the map extension will be included in the patch? Instead of bashing the Indian DLC, why don't just ask PDS to not include India in the patch. In fact, I believe PDS is more than happy to exclude feature from a free patch.
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That is how the Paradox DLCs work now. They put the content in the patch, and then unlock it for you in game depending on which DLCs you have.
 
Chevaresqye said:
Where did you find that the map extension will be included in the patch? Instead of bashing the Indian DLC, why don't just ask PDS to not include India in the patch. In fact, I believe PDS is more than happy to exclude feature from a free patch.
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alright:

paradox, please leave the map extension out of the patch

i feel a whole lot better, now. do you?

i'm sure they'll just completely swerve away from the prior map extension precedent because i asked them on an internet forum
 
This is one of the few really out-there expansion concepts with which I have no problem. If nothing else it can be justified that, unlike many cultures (such as Greeks) already present in CK2, the Indians had a feudal system that was fairly similar to what existed in Europe and Japan. However, I don't see how this isn't going to bring the game to a crawl by 1300 with all those characters to remember.
 
Chevaresqye said:
Where did you find that the map extension will be included in the patch? Instead of bashing the Indian DLC, why don't just ask PDS to not include India in the patch. In fact, I believe PDS is more than happy to exclude feature from a free patch.
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This is likely not possible, I think. It's very likely the whole new map is in the patch and only playable Hindus, Buddhists etc. are in the DLC. It could be different... But that's the most likely thing at the moment.


But we should wait... eventually Paradox found a way to make the game faster...? Wait..
 
I'm a little excited about the effects India will have on the eastern side of the map.

I'm a lot excited - maybe wrongly - about the implication that at some point in the future we might see a CKII map that allows us to choose anywhere in Europe, Asia, or Africa to play in as early as 867 AD. Just daydreaming about a convert-file to EUIV from a medieval game like that is almost as much fun as playing one, to me.

I'm a little disappointed because, daydreaming scenarios aside, I'd rather see the game made deeper than the map made wider.

I'm a lot disappointed because I doubt my computer will be able to handle it. Not everybody else's problem, I'm aware - but it's certainly one that matters to me.

I suppose my greatest hope for the future is that they can somehow find a way to massively increase the scale of the game, and still reduce lag. You may say I'm a dreamer.
 
Jakalak said:
i'm sure they'll just completely swerve away from the prior map extension precedent because i asked them on an internet forum
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Well, that does rather make the whole point of endless pages of rage and bile irrelevant as well.
 
Thure said:
This is likely not possible, I think. It's very likely the whole new map is in the patch and only playable Hindus, Buddhists etc. are in the DLC. It could be different... But that's the most likely thing at the moment.
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Where does that guess come from?
 
Arakhor said:
Well, that does rather make the whole point of endless pages of rage and bile irrelevant as well.
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to the extent that it makes all the praise, yeah.

(i think forums are passé anyway, we should just have the newsboard, no comments)

Chevaresqye said:
Where does that guess come from?
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from the first map expansion dlc, as well as their dlc system in general
 
Well I think many complaints can be stopped if they would atleast reveal some information about it. A lot of problems are caused by the fact that we just know one sentence of the whole deal.

We don't know anything about a special feudal system that might be introduced for india (I am quite sure they will), how they are planning on making the game still play properly with +300 extra provinces thus making the game slower. Other fixes and features.. There is alot to be said and I think that once we know that that it's fine to complain, as some people are just complaining on what if scenario's, just wait till some information is known to us and you might just like it or not, but don't complain about "nothing" as we know nothing currently besides that india is being introduced.

And I am quite happy with it, will spice up the ck II games alot for me.
 
timed said:
That's not Steam's fault, however. Even if the patches were not distributed via Steam, if Paradox added India in the patches, you would still have to have it even if you just want the other fixes/features..
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I know it's not Steam's fault alright. Steam just happens to be the platform that distributes the updates. That's why I brought it up.

The ideal decision would be that the map extension would be included in the expansion, not in the patch.

Zylathas said:
Well I think many complaints can be stopped if they would atleast reveal some information about it. A lot of problems are caused by the fact that we just know one sentence of the whole deal.
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Yeah, maybe it's just my prejudice that originates from SoA being kinda half-assed in some aspects. I really hope they don't rush with this one.
However, I wish they could also address some of the shortages in the base game (theocracies, land republics, trade in general, insta-travel, just to name a few) in the upcoming expansion or patch, as I personally see them more important than, say, new provinces, cultures and religions.
 
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I am utterly amazed at the amount of rage I am seeing. =o Usually, the forums are filled with well articulated differences of opinion, but today, it's full of sheer rage and disgust. Is it because it's India? I mean, what is this? They are expanding the scope of the game, what's so bad about that?
 
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