YouTube recommendations?

[stevieji]

I usually watch videos by Arumba, Shenryyr2, DDRJake, Greenfors, Chimpeh, and sometimes Quill18.

I like Arumba's presentation - I mean he explains what he's doing really well - but he's probably not much better than me really - and he can get a bit cheesy at times - saw him use an exploit where you can apparently lose all your AE by releasing a vassal - just not cricket IMO.
Chimpeh I had a look at today and I thought his presentation was not so good, but I'll give his Nepal campaign another look - I'm interested to see how anyone makes that work - just not enough money to maintain an army - this is the kind of stuff I need help with.

 

[Heatth]

I like Arumba's presentation - I mean he explains what he's doing really well - but he's probably not much better than me really - and he can get a bit cheesy at times - saw him use an exploit where you can apparently lose all your AE by releasing a vassal - just not cricket IMO.

He did it once to show it off but he is refraining to do it again. In the same campaign he got a lot of AE again, but passed on an opportunity to do the same trick.

Of course, he can be quite cheese when he wants. His current Austrian campaign is entirely based on cheesing the HRE formation mechanics.

 

[queermobile]

Shenryyr2 is the only one I can sit down and watch multiple videos of, and he's also a pretty good player. I actually learned how to play the game from watching his Byzantine series.

 

[stevieji]

Ryukyu is always my main circus exhibition of exploits. If you want some straight-up weak starts play without exploitation (at least until I'm fairly powerful) then I would recommend Nagaur, Mogadishu, Mongolia or Navarra.

In the end though, I enjoy finding and displaying exploits in this game. For my exploits magnum opus, I recommend Minghals

Hey there Jake - I'll certainly give Nagaur etc a look.

 

[lolada]

Since mostly youtubers won't recommend themselves here, I will also mention TheMeInTeam. He's active here on the forums and has lots of quality information. Most of popular mentioned youtubers by other people so far are quite casual actually.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Since mostly youtubers won't recommend themselves here, I will also mention TheMeInTeam. He's active here on the forums and has lots of quality information. Most of popular mentioned youtubers by other people so far are quite casual actually.

I appreciate it, wasn't sure what OP is looking for. I'm a strong player but not DDRJake strong, I feel like I'm a few steps behind guys like Path and Ikkiks also. Even at this late date in my #hours played I feel like I'm better at the end of a campaign than the start lol, probably why I've been playing this so long. That said, I will also mention my dual-streamer ParadogsGamer as he's very active also.

Ultimately it's just a matter of finding someone whose commentary you enjoy. Most of the youtubers will use exploits on occasion and I'm not an exception there, which is the other part of the reason I hesitated to advertise myself here. I generally won't do anything too earth-shattering if it takes lots of micro, my old civ IV audience knows I'm not about the micro .

 

[solidprice]

Look at who i am a fanboy of.
those 4 are awesome.

 

[oblio-]

Question for op:
What exactly is cheese?
For example:
1. Is vassal feeding cheese?
2. Is using knowledge of history cheese?
3. Is using a mechanic the AI doesn't use cheese?
4. Is reading game files/remembering details from past playthroughs cheese (order of idea groups for countries, events, etc)?

I doubt there's any streamer that doesn't use one of 1-4.

 

[BarrosRodrigues]

What I'm looking for is advanced level gameplay, but straight-up, no exploits, no nonsense .

Sorry but "advanced" level gameplay in EU IV without cheese? You do realize that this game is as simple as it gets so there is barely any room for "advanced" gameplay without being gamey? :laugh: PU oriented gameplay seems to be an exception but you still need luck in-game and for finding it on YouTube.

 

[stevieji]

Question for op:
What exactly is cheese?
For example:
1. Is vassal feeding cheese?
2. Is using knowledge of history cheese?
3. Is using a mechanic the AI doesn't use cheese?
4. Is reading game files/remembering details from past playthroughs cheese (order of idea groups for countries, events, etc)?

I doubt there's any streamer that doesn't use one of 1-4.

1. No
2. No
3. Quite possibly, but depends
4. No (obviously).

 

[stevieji]

Sorry but "advanced" level gameplay in EU IV without cheese? You do realize that this game is as simple as it gets so there is barely any room for "advanced" gameplay without being gamey? :laugh: PU oriented gameplay seems to be an exception but you still need luck in-game and for finding it on YouTube.

Whaaaaaaaat? Simple as what gets? It's certainly the most complex game I've encountered - but I'm obviously not blessed with the towering intellect of some people on this forum. What I mean by "advanced" is simply starting from a very weak position and making it work without resorting to exploits. I've just been looking at DDRJake's Navarra game - and in many respects I'm extremely impressed, but he starts with the relatively minor 'trick' of rushing relationship improvement with Portugal by repetitively sending and recalling his ambassador. For me, this is tedious micro-management, skews the game from the very beginning and just isn't how I want to play. Simple as that, really.

 

[BarrosRodrigues]

Whaaaaaaaat? Simple as what gets? It's certainly the most complex game I've encountered - but I'm obviously not blessed with the towering intellect of some people on this forum. What I mean by "advanced" is simply starting from a very weak position and making it work without resorting to exploits. I've just been looking at DDRJake's Navarra game - and in many respects I'm extremely impressed, but he starts with the relatively minor 'trick' of rushing relationship improvement with Portugal by repetitively sending and recalling his ambassador. For me, this is tedious micro-management, skews the game from the very beginning and just isn't how I want to play. Simple as that, really.

By comparison with their previous major releases this game is indeed the simplest. No brainer tech "three", very simple economy, very simple combat, only 3 types of land units, no supply system, etc. etc. Try HOI III and you'll see the difference once you truly understand it.

he starts with the relatively minor 'trick' of rushing relationship improvement with Portugal by repetitively sending and recalling his ambassador. For me, this is tedious micro-management, skews the game from the very beginning and just isn't how I want to play. Simple as that, really.

That is efficient play which usually requires more micro (...) you’ll learn much more with players that pay attention to details and min max a lot and might use gamey strategies than with the ones that don´t bother to min-max and usually play at speeds 4-5 no matter how "sweet" their commentary might be.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

The problem is, low speed micromanagement is good for learning, but not casual watching unless it cuts slow parts often or is heavily edited. I find the send/recall rather distasteful to execute, but don't have a conceptual problem with it and will use it if I feel like I need it. I don't think it's fun viewing material to watch someone spend their first 30 minutes on send-recall improvement to tons of nations at once as say an Italian minor, or to watch someone perfect-micro their colonists via send/recall spam as a native council because 10 growth per colonist >> settler chance at low travel times (and god help you if you get 100% envoy travel time reduction and want to micro colonies, it'll be the entire gameplay for a long time).

So, anybody doing a video has to strike some kind of balance. OP's comments rub me the wrong way similarly in some ways, but I can understand if someone who wants to play the game casualty wishes to see rundowns of other more experienced players similarly limiting themselves.

The implementation of this game is uneven enough that wrt a given choice people are going to draw lines on different sides of it often. I find that debate, or even bothering to distinguish between "exploit" and "strong tactic" when both fall inside the bounds of rules, to be pointless. OP should IMO just go down the list of names he's seen here and see if there's a commentary style he likes. Years of annoying finger pointing wrt exploits in Madden, Civ, and elsewhere in addition to here have shown me that no good comes of people coughing up arbitrary and almost always self-inconsistent definitions of "exploit" that turn into moving targets week to week. Usage of that term suggests naivety at BEST.

Higher speeds or force speeds are definitely costly though. Running Bosnia alongside Paradogs on Ethiopia in MP mostly at speed 3 (we went down to 2 in the end which helped notably with progress rate) I was pathetically behind what I did with Orissa when I could pause/plan/stop even though I also streamed the latter, which is still worse than low-speed micromanagement with more focus. Sure, had I been a bit luckier with my mid-game alliance pick I could have maybe conquered all of Europe rather than leaving a small chunk of France, Scandinavia, and an intact Russia, but it would never have been an elite game even then. Part of that is due to my skill limitation, but losing time while thinking of what to do next is very damaging also and really delays the snowball.

 

[oblio-]

Whaaaaaaaat? Simple as what gets? It's certainly the most complex game I've encountered - but I'm obviously not blessed with the towering intellect of some people on this forum. What I mean by "advanced" is simply starting from a very weak position and making it work without resorting to exploits. I've just been looking at DDRJake's Navarra game - and in many respects I'm extremely impressed, but he starts with the relatively minor 'trick' of rushing relationship improvement with Portugal by repetitively sending and recalling his ambassador. For me, this is tedious micro-management, skews the game from the very beginning and just isn't how I want to play. Simple as that, really.

Once you understand the game's mechanics I'd argue that this is a game more about patience and planning than anything else. Only 1 or 2 achievements in the game can't be done using the 4 things I've listed. And funnily enough, world conquest (actually domination) isn't one of them.

I think that you should watch several videos by someone like DDRJake and then start trying nations somewhere in the rest of the world (ROTW aka non-Europe). Then play some European minors in tough spots like Theodoro or Riga.

If you'll do this, you'll be an "advanced" EU4 player. Whatever that is

 

[josh127]

Whaaaaaaaat? Simple as what gets? It's certainly the most complex game I've encountered - but I'm obviously not blessed with the towering intellect of some people on this forum. What I mean by "advanced" is simply starting from a very weak position and making it work without resorting to exploits. I've just been looking at DDRJake's Navarra game - and in many respects I'm extremely impressed, but he starts with the relatively minor 'trick' of rushing relationship improvement with Portugal by repetitively sending and recalling his ambassador. For me, this is tedious micro-management, skews the game from the very beginning and just isn't how I want to play. Simple as that, really.

I'd suggest you just don't do the micro intensive part you don't feel would be entertaining. You don't need it for most starts, and if you're happy enough with your results, then don't do it. Uber strategies that require tons of micro tend to be ones I avoid. I do keep them in mid though, because there might be a time I feel the need to employ something more efficient (probably when I find a start I really want to do but fail miserably 10-20 times first).

 

[stevieji]

The problem is, low speed micromanagement is good for learning, but not casual watching unless it cuts slow parts often or is heavily edited. I find the send/recall rather distasteful to execute, but don't have a conceptual problem with it and will use it if I feel like I need it. I don't think it's fun viewing material to watch someone spend their first 30 minutes on send-recall improvement to tons of nations at once as say an Italian minor, or to watch someone perfect-micro their colonists via send/recall spam as a native council because 10 growth per colonist >> settler chance at low travel times (and god help you if you get 100% envoy travel time reduction and want to micro colonies, it'll be the entire gameplay for a long time).

So, anybody doing a video has to strike some kind of balance. OP's comments rub me the wrong way similarly in some ways, but I can understand if someone who wants to play the game casualty wishes to see rundowns of other more experienced players similarly limiting themselves.

The implementation of this game is uneven enough that wrt a given choice people are going to draw lines on different sides of it often. I find that debate, or even bothering to distinguish between "exploit" and "strong tactic" when both fall inside the bounds of rules, to be pointless. OP should IMO just go down the list of names he's seen here and see if there's a commentary style he likes. Years of annoying finger pointing wrt exploits in Madden, Civ, and elsewhere in addition to here have shown me that no good comes of people coughing up arbitrary and almost always self-inconsistent definitions of "exploit" that turn into moving targets week to week. Usage of that term suggests naivety at BEST.

Higher speeds or force speeds are definitely costly though. Running Bosnia alongside Paradogs on Ethiopia in MP mostly at speed 3 (we went down to 2 in the end which helped notably with progress rate) I was pathetically behind what I did with Orissa when I could pause/plan/stop even though I also streamed the latter, which is still worse than low-speed micromanagement with more focus. Sure, had I been a bit luckier with my mid-game alliance pick I could have maybe conquered all of Europe rather than leaving a small chunk of France, Scandinavia, and an intact Russia, but it would never have been an elite game even then. Part of that is due to my skill limitation, but losing time while thinking of what to do next is very damaging also and really delays the snowball.

You know, it wasn't me who started the nit-picking over what constitutes an 'exploit' - and I have absolutely no desire to continue it. I asked for recommendations - and I got some - so thank you to everyone who made a positive contribution. It would be nice to be able to ask a fairly straightforward question - and to state a preference - without getting a load of patronising negativity, but I guess everyone has their own agenda - and their own preference regarding the way they play the game - which is obviously fine.

 

[Victory5]

DDRJake still the GOAT

 

[tyler45455]

Arumba ftw

 

[stevieji]

DDRJake still the GOAT

No doubt.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

You know, it wasn't me who started the nit-picking over what constitutes an 'exploit' - and I have absolutely no desire to continue it. I asked for recommendations - and I got some - so thank you to everyone who made a positive contribution. It would be nice to be able to ask a fairly straightforward question - and to state a preference - without getting a load of patronising negativity, but I guess everyone has their own agenda - and their own preference regarding the way they play the game - which is obviously fine.

What I'm looking for is advanced level gameplay, but straight-up, no exploits, no nonsense - just someone who really knows how to play the game without breaking it.

What is or isn't is irrelevant. When you say things like that, especially alongside "straight-up" and "no nonsense", there is a negative connotation. It's dismissive towards the players who use things you consider to be exploits. Even if I rarely use things that meet your criteria (and I might not-so-rarely), it's dismissive of any of the YouTubers who use an arbitrary and forever ill-defined set of options that somehow make their content less desirable. That's fine, people should watch what they enjoy, but at the same time you're asking a question and can't even define what it is you're asking for in that regard, while casting actions in impressive games in a negative light based on no known consistent criteria whatsoever.

There's enough inherent negativity there that it's odd to then act surprised when some of the reactions are negative, especially when a majority were less negative than the OP .